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Smaller classes not at top of Sandovalís education agenda (Nevada)
Las Vegas Sun ^ | 03/24/2013 | By Anjeanette Damon (contact)

Posted on 03/24/2013 7:34:35 AM PDT by redreno

CARSON CITY —

Gov. Brian Sandoval has said his administration has two top priorities: education and economic development.

When it comes to education, Sandoval has used both the bully pulpit of his office and his budget to call for school choice, ending social promotion, expanding full-day kindergarten and improving funding for programs targeting English-language learners.

But Sandoval and his administration have been largely silent on one key issue important to education advocates, school districts and Democrats: reining in class sizes.

That’s not to say he’s ignoring it completely.

(Excerpt) Read more at lasvegassun.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Government; US: Nevada
KEYWORDS: carsoncity; classes; education; learning; nevada; schools; teachers; teaching

1 posted on 03/24/2013 7:34:35 AM PDT by redreno
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To: redreno

> Gov. Brian Sandoval has said his administration has two top
> priorities: education and economic development.

Neither of these is within the auspices of a valid, constitutional government.

The government can establish policies that foster economic development, and it can promote a better educated populace through things like achievement awards, but to advance these interests using the coercive force of the state reduces the people to serfs.

In fact, the more the government gets involved with the compass and content of education, the more expensive and the less effective it becomes, and the more government gets involved with the economy, the more they damage it.


2 posted on 03/24/2013 7:49:48 AM PDT by Westbrook (Children do not divide your love, they multiply it.)
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To: redreno

Class room sizes were NOT an issue when I was in school back in the 60’s. Sometimes we had up to 40 kids in one class with no behavioral problems.

But, I must say, in today’s world, our American society is so screwed up and so many kids have single mom’s or live-in boyfriends or “whatever” - that, whether you talking about private school or public school, behaviors by kids today are unbelievable, and today, teachers do not have the authority that they did 40 to 60 years ago.

I remember back in 1967, a geology teacher I had in 8th grade (he was an ex-Marine). A kid didn’t like him and flipped him the bird while he was writing on the blackboard - unfortunately for the kid, the teacher saw him do it.

The teacher never said a word, but he picked up the kid, desk and all, and literally threw him out in the hall way and apparently dragged the kid all the way down to the principal’s office. I never saw that kid back in school again. Also, the teacher was gone for at least 20 minutes and we were left alone in the classroom - no one moved because we were scared we would be next. I had no problem with what that teacher did, but if he did that today he would be arrested and his career finished.

The teacher came back and resumed class as though nothing had ever happened. Needles to say, no one ever “tested” him again.

My point is that in our society today, I think that smaller class sizes are necessary if for no other reason than just the ability to manage the behavior of the class because the behavior of kids (not all, but a significant size) is very tough to deal with. “Parents” today are far more likely to blame the teacher and the school for their child’s problem and do not consistently support the teacher in trying to maintain discipline in the classroom.

To those public school haters, I’m not defending public schools, I’m just relating on what happens with any large group of kids today whether at public school, private school, scouts, Sunday school, etc. So, please don’t dump on me about supporting the “marxist, collectivist, indoctrination camps”, etc. That’s not the issue at hand.


3 posted on 03/24/2013 7:59:57 AM PDT by rusty schucklefurd
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To: redreno

Well, I’ve been a middle school teacher for 9 years now and I can tell you: class size is important but the real factor is children’s behavior. I have an RSP class of 28 and I have an Honors class of 40. That class of 40 runs like a beautiful machine. We read books, have discussions, act out scenes... That class of RSP kids is a nightmare, a constant struggle for control, a wasteland where I get almost nothing done, and if I turn my back someone immediately lashes out at someone else. On conference night, I meet the parents of at least half of my Honors class. I meet the parents of maybe 2 RSP kids. And there you have it.


4 posted on 03/24/2013 8:08:47 AM PDT by A_perfect_lady
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To: Westbrook

Exactly, and so-called economic development is just a Soviet 5-year plan with a Chamber of Commerce face. It is government management of the economy, picking winners and losers in business, and using our money to take lavish trips to schmooz with business people. It should be illegal.

The only thing that will improve education in this country is for government to get out completely. Privatize, and see real change. It is not likely to happen, because the sheeple still believe in public education. There has not been any real innovation or progress in education in 100 years or more.


5 posted on 03/24/2013 8:22:09 AM PDT by Pining_4_TX (All those who were appointed to eternal life believed. Acts 13:48)
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To: redreno

Apparently, their state law requires class sizes of 15 students on average. They’ve never met that goal.

As a kid who grew up in the 60s and 70s, I don’t recall ever being in a class under 20. I’d guess my average class had 30+.

I tried student teaching in Utah in 1980...I had one class of 22, and the others were 30+ - one was 37 (with 35 seats!).

It isn’t numbers. It is discipline. Allow physical punishment, and allow repeat offenders to be expelled for months at a time, and you won’t need a class size of 15 to teach!


6 posted on 03/24/2013 8:30:08 AM PDT by Mr Rogers (America is becoming California, and California is becoming Detroit. Detroit is already hell.)
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To: redreno

This is another attack piece from the
Democrat stronghold here in Nevada called Las Vegas.

The hidden part of ‘education’ in Nevada is that the number of k-12 school children has gone down. Drastically down. IF the illegals were kicked out of Clark County and sent back south of the border, it would decline even more.

With the collapse of the economy, most people who were occupying those foreclosed houses had children. Nedvada has had the highest number of foreclosed houses for the past 5 years. They are now-—2nd highest!!!

They lost their houses without enough work, and many just walked away. Their children went with them.

Where I live, it is a small rural valley. There are SEPARATE busses for;
Grade school kids
Middle school kids
High school kids
‘Special’ kids.

NONE of these busses is full-—NONE OF THEM!!!!

IF I were running this system, there would be half the busses & a ‘chaperone’ riding on the bus—instead of a separate bus with a separate driver, maintenance, fuel, insurance, etc.

Separate the kids front & back if you must—and kep the chaperone in the middle.

EVERY ONE of the busses I am describing is a full size 60+ occupancy bus.

Every time I see them go up and down my street on every weekday, I get disgusted.

Have tried to talk to county officials about this, but have gotten nowhere.

Average allocation for standard students per year is about $7000.

BUT—’special’ students get over $28,000 dumped into the school system.

It behooves the ‘school system’ to declare more and more students SPECIAL.

This is totally out of control.


7 posted on 03/24/2013 9:37:55 AM PDT by ridesthemiles
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To: Pining_4_TX

> so-called economic development is just a Soviet 5-year plan with a Chamber of Commerce
> face. It is government management of the economy, picking winners and losers in business,
> and using our money to take lavish trips to schmooz with business people. It should be
> illegal.

I don’t know if I’ve ever seen it stated better. I will try to memorize this, if you don’t mind.

> The only thing that will improve education in this country is for government to get out
> completely. Privatize, and see real change.

Once again, most eloquently stated.

> It is not likely to happen, because the sheeple still believe in public education.
> There has not been any real innovation or progress in education in 100 years or more.

More and more people are beginning to leave the sheeple fold and are coming to realize the truth of your above statements.


8 posted on 03/24/2013 10:42:35 AM PDT by Westbrook (Children do not divide your love, they multiply it.)
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To: Westbrook

In Oregon, liberals use the class size argument. However when more funds are provided, they are used to fund teacher raises. Teacher greed is the most powerful force in America.


9 posted on 03/24/2013 5:05:33 PM PDT by aimhigh ( Guns do not kill people. Abortion kills people.)
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To: Westbrook

Thank you for the kind words. The worst thing that ever happened to this county was government involvement in education. Sometimes I like to imagine what education would be like if it had never happened. *sigh*

I have a pet theory that government schools destroyed cities. When people were more or less forced to send their kids to local government schools in cities, the middle class left for the suburbs. That left only the very rich, who could afford private schools, and the poor, who could not afford to escape. This is why cities are dying.


10 posted on 03/28/2013 6:02:54 AM PDT by Pining_4_TX (All those who were appointed to eternal life believed. Acts 13:48)
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To: Mr Rogers

How about using real men for teachers? Most trouble is from rambunctious boys who need a little direction in life and higher expectations. The average teacher is a female liberal. They get to class with an anti-male attitude before the boy even has a chance to fulfill it.


11 posted on 03/30/2013 10:09:54 AM PDT by 1010RD (First, Do No Harm)
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To: 1010RD

I think that is why my brother-in-law does so well. The students respond differently to HIM than to the mostly female teachers in the school. But there aren’t many men’s men who can stand to put up with the teacher ed classes. He taught for years in South Africa before they returned to the states. He didn’t get a teaching degree until some years after he was teaching.


12 posted on 03/30/2013 10:54:50 AM PDT by Mr Rogers (America is becoming California, and California is becoming Detroit. Detroit is already hell.)
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