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Tucson gun store owner halts purchase of semiautomatic rifle by Kelly
Arizona Daily Star ^ | Carmen Duarte

Posted on 03/26/2013 6:16:04 AM PDT by SandRat

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To: roofgoat
...debate all you want about legality and intentions. I could [not] care less the legal aspect.

And that's perfectly fine. I think he did it for political purposes, also. But he didn't violate the law, and those who disagree with his political purposes shouldn't claim he did.

51 posted on 03/26/2013 8:04:06 AM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: 1rudeboy; All
From Breitbart News Network, link below:

Diamondback Police Supply owner Douglas MacKinlay has halted Mark Kelly's attempted purchase of an AR-15 over concerns that Kelly was not in fact buying the gun for himself, and therefore could not have passed question 11a of the NICS background check form 4473.

Breitbart News

Seems he didn't answer truthfully when filling out the form for the background check...

52 posted on 03/26/2013 8:07:32 AM PDT by CAluvdubya (Molon Labe)
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To: CAluvdubya

I get that, too . . . but the authorities did not give Mr. Kelley the money to buy the firearm.


53 posted on 03/26/2013 8:12:48 AM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: 1rudeboy

rude, I don’t think it was political, he wanted the guns.

Didn’t he keep the handgun that he purchased the same day as he tried to buy the AR?

Wasn’t his wife shot with a handgun? And an AR has to do with what. And he bought a used AR so he had to wait.

Whole lot of bs from this guy. He got caught and his handlers came up with a weak excuse.


54 posted on 03/26/2013 8:16:01 AM PDT by roofgoat
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To: SandRat; All
What I have read of the instructions for the actual buyer question say that if I go in to legally buy a gun with my own money, but plan on giving it to my son or someone else, then I can answer "yes" that I am the actual buyer.

Not specified in the instructions is the implicit assumption that the person you are giving the gun to must be legally able to receive a gun. In other words, you can't gift a gun to a felon or a Mexican drug cartel.

55 posted on 03/26/2013 8:20:28 AM PDT by Sender (It's never too late to be who you could have been.)
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To: SandRat; mickie; flaglady47; oswegodeee
All the pious trigger words thrown around by Kelly's spokes-shill....like "contribution", "donation", "gift", blah, blah.....can't hide the fact he was caught with a hypocritical lemon on his hands and now he's desperately trying to make some "charitable" lemonade out of it.

He's looking to continue Gabby's tenure at the public trough as a senator....slurping up power, fame and fortune for six years...and he knows that to win he has to insure that all lemons in his resume must be quickly re-packaged as Minute Maid's finest summer refresher.

Kelly is an oily, lying weasel, just like his patron saint in the White House (said saint who just sanctioned naming a naval warship after Kelly's wife).

I'm so sick of DC political power marriages.......Gabby and Kelly, Barry and Moochelle, Hill and Bill, Joe and Jill, Bradlee and Sally, Nancy and Harry, McCain and Grahmnesty.......

Leni

56 posted on 03/26/2013 8:23:58 AM PDT by MinuteGal
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To: 1rudeboy
He still misrepresented his intent on the form and was too vocal during the 20 day waiting period. This is the reason given by the gun shop owner in canceling the order. It is not just my opinion

What do you think is the consequence if one lies on the background form? (Which is what Kelly would've done if he followed through with giving the gun to the PD)

57 posted on 03/26/2013 8:23:59 AM PDT by CAluvdubya (Molon Labe)
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To: Sender

Sender, that may be 100% correct. But let me play around with this if I may.

A distant friend of the family, Uncle Vito, who has done “favors” for me or my family over the last few years comes to me and says “Goat, do me a favor and as a gift for my birthday nexy week, I’d like an AR, Rock River arms is cool”.

Now I’m no LE agent, and who am I to pry into Vito’s history, so I do what Mark Kelly did and I guy an AR for my Uncle; afterall its a B Day gift.


58 posted on 03/26/2013 8:26:49 AM PDT by roofgoat
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To: 1rudeboy

It’s right there in black and white. Certainly you know how to read.


59 posted on 03/26/2013 8:38:05 AM PDT by meatloaf (Support Senate S 1863 & House Bill 1380 to eliminate oil slavery.)
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To: CAluvdubya
This is the reason given by the gun shop owner in canceling the order.

Yes, but did he violate the law? Those who argue that the government is not prosecuting him because he is a member of the protected class (apart from arguing that he should be prosecuted for political purposes) disregard the fact that any self-respecting defense attorney could drive a bus through the government's case.

60 posted on 03/26/2013 8:46:29 AM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: roofgoat
A distant friend of the family, Uncle Vito, who has done “favors” for me or my family over the last few years comes to me and says “Goat, do me a favor and as a gift for my birthday nexy week, I’d like an AR, Rock River arms is cool”.

I am not LE either so don't follow my advice, but my sense is that if Uncle Vito goes out and shoots up a theater, the cops are going to look real hard at who he got the gun from. If I had *any* doubt about someone or didn't know them in great detail, there is *no way* that I would buy a gun for them.

61 posted on 03/26/2013 8:47:25 AM PDT by Sender (It's never too late to be who you could have been.)
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To: roofgoat

Let me go further and say that I would not buy a gun for anyone outside of my immediate family.


62 posted on 03/26/2013 8:49:34 AM PDT by Sender (It's never too late to be who you could have been.)
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To: Sender

Sender, I was taking the gift argument to the extreme and just saying how the ATF would look if I gave “Uncle Vito” an AR as a gift.


63 posted on 03/26/2013 8:55:43 AM PDT by roofgoat
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To: coloradan
Sounds like a “yes”. “Are you the ultimate recipient of the gun?” Lying on the 4473 is a felony - at least when us peasants do it.

When you're doing the bidding of tyrannical government you get the David Gregory exemption.

64 posted on 03/26/2013 8:56:27 AM PDT by Moonman62 (The US has become a government with a country, rather than a country with a government.)
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To: 1rudeboy
Yes, but did he violate the law? Those who argue that the government is not prosecuting him because he is a member of the protected class (apart from arguing that he should be prosecuted for political purposes) disregard the fact that any self-respecting defense attorney could drive a bus through the government's case.

I really don't know. Lying is not necessarily against the law but there is that pesky background check that he signed (and living in CA, I have signed several of these forms). Is that considered a contract of sorts?

It seemed to be enough of a question that the gun shop owner didn't want to risk bringing trouble on himself/his business.

This might be an excellent debate for law students.

65 posted on 03/26/2013 10:41:24 AM PDT by CAluvdubya (Molon Labe)
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To: MinuteGal

“I’m so sick of DC political power marriages.......Gabby and Kelly, Barry and Moochelle, Hill and Bill, Joe and Jill, Bradlee and Sally, Nancy and Harry, McCain and Grahmnesty.......”

Liked the last one, heh, heh....


66 posted on 03/26/2013 10:45:20 AM PDT by flaglady47 (When the gov't fears the people, liberty; When the people fear the gov't, tyranny.)
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To: Sender; roofgoat
What I have read of the instructions for the actual buyer question say that if I go in to legally buy a gun with my own money, but plan on giving it to my (non prohibited) son or someone else, then I can answer "yes" that I am the actual buyer.

Technically, as I have modified your statement, you are correct, but remember, for serfs, the law means what the prosecutor says it means.

Most Federal prosecutors have found that they can get convictions for "gifts" to anyone outside the immediate family but not for children or spouses (unless prohibited).

Discussion of a firearms gift with a friend ahead of purchase will get you convicted easily, whereas a gift certificate, check or cash to the same party screws the prosecutor because you don't fill out the forms or receive the firearm.

The Feds and ATF are not about obeying the spirit of the law, they are about money, citizen control, tyranny, convictions and perception.

Never make the mistake of believing they are about observance of the law.

67 posted on 03/26/2013 10:52:10 AM PDT by Navy Patriot (Join the Democrats, it's not Fascism when WE do it, and the Constitution and law mean what WE say.)
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To: Don Corleone

Texas Rangers & Arizona Rangers.


68 posted on 03/26/2013 12:23:09 PM PDT by SandRat (Duty - Honor - Country! What else needs said?)
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To: SandRat

I thought Arizona was the Diamondbacks.


69 posted on 03/26/2013 12:23:51 PM PDT by dfwgator
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To: dfwgator

Diamondbaks paly baseball the Arizona Rangers are like the Texas Rangers, they are LOE.


70 posted on 03/26/2013 12:27:17 PM PDT by SandRat (Duty - Honor - Country! What else needs said?)
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