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And How Many Bullets Do You Need?
American Thinker ^ | 04/20/2013 | Jim Yardley

Posted on 04/21/2013 6:42:25 AM PDT by SeekAndFind

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To: SeekAndFind

To followed the intended meaning of the 2nd Amendment, a citizen has the rights to the same weapons/ammo as the government is willing to use against them otherwise the 2nd Amendment is completely meaningless.

If the government is willing to use superior fire power against its own citizens and prevent the citizens from arming themselves to an equal extent then again the 2nd becomes meaningless.

This is what needs to be thrown back at any liberal who uses the Saul Alinsky deceptive debate tactic of mocking us by saying so Americans can have the atomic bomb? Ha, Ha, Ha.

No, even as off the rails as our federal government has become I don’t think for a nano-second they would use a nuke against us but they sure will use a lot of automatic weapons with 100’s of rounds.


51 posted on 04/21/2013 7:59:03 AM PDT by Wurlitzer (Nothing says "ignorance" like Islam!)
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To: Paladin2

29 posts before someone stated the obvious.

They didnt kill either one by shooting them.


52 posted on 04/21/2013 8:00:18 AM PDT by ez (Muslims do not play well with others.)
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To: SeekAndFind

See my tagline.


53 posted on 04/21/2013 8:01:57 AM PDT by SW6906 (6 things you can't have too much of: sex, money, firewood, horsepower, guns and ammunition.)
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To: faucetman

The point is, we as citizens face the same threats as do the police. If the police arive with a M-4 with 6 thirty round magazines to deal with what ever the call may be. Then I should have been so equipped also.
If we are not face with the same threats then what are the police for.


54 posted on 04/21/2013 8:02:24 AM PDT by DeWalt
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To: OCMike
These dummy rounds certainly made Swiss cheese out of the boat that the goat humper was hiding in. The owner's wife is on record stating that it was destroyed by bullet holes. Have any authorities ever spoken the whole truth? In the past 25 years... I can't remember anything but lies coming from government officials... they spill enough truth in the soup to make it taste real.

LLS

55 posted on 04/21/2013 8:03:11 AM PDT by LibLieSlayer (FROM MY COLD, DEAD HANDS!)
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To: OCMike
These dummy rounds certainly made Swiss cheese out of the boat that the goat humper was hiding in. The owner's wife is on record stating that it was destroyed by bullet holes. Have any authorities ever spoken the whole truth? In the past 25 years... I can't remember anything but lies coming from government officials... they spill enough truth in the soup to make it taste real.

LLS

56 posted on 04/21/2013 8:03:36 AM PDT by LibLieSlayer (FROM MY COLD, DEAD HANDS!)
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To: LibLieSlayer
’d say these tacticool warriors that you cite... need MORE time punching paper at the range.

Yep.


57 posted on 04/21/2013 8:06:45 AM PDT by null and void (Republicans create the tools of oppression and Democrats use them. Gun confiscation enables tyranny.)
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To: RKV
What’s worse, is spray and pray is policy in many departments, which is why so many rounds go down range in these events (see the recent situation in Los Angeles where two women were shot in their pickup truck by Torrance PD officers)

Umm, the cops were shooting AT their truck. They were not victims of rounds going down-range. They were victims of cops mistakenly (and really, really stupidly) misidentifying their vehicle.

58 posted on 04/21/2013 8:06:55 AM PDT by Sherman Logan
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To: Wurlitzer

“A free people ought not only to be armed and disciplined, but they should have sufficient arms and ammunition to maintain a status of independence from any who might attempt to abuse them, which would include their own government.” — George Washington


59 posted on 04/21/2013 8:07:18 AM PDT by LibLieSlayer (FROM MY COLD, DEAD HANDS!)
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To: null and void

Thanks you! Yep... have seen those before! WAKE UP AMERICA!

LLS


60 posted on 04/21/2013 8:09:56 AM PDT by LibLieSlayer (FROM MY COLD, DEAD HANDS!)
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To: SeekAndFind

A couple thousand per firearm, per year. Depends on what type of shooting I’m doing, how often i can make it to the range, and if i’m practicing for a competition.

Right now, prices are still outside of my budget and reloading components are scarce...

Not a happy camper.


61 posted on 04/21/2013 8:10:06 AM PDT by Dead Corpse (I will not comply.)
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To: UCANSEE2

If those were not live rounds fired at the suspect/boat, I would suggest the volume of blank fire, or live fire off target, was “INTIMIDATION”, i.e. this is what you face if you resist.


62 posted on 04/21/2013 8:13:04 AM PDT by LZ_Bayonet ( I AM THE TEA PARTY LEADER !)
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To: Ajnin

The facts say otherwise.


63 posted on 04/21/2013 8:14:22 AM PDT by RKV (He who has the guns makes the rules)
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To: LibLieSlayer
The finest weapon in the world becomes nothing more than a hi-tech club when it fails to go bang.

I did jury duty on a murder trail many years ago. The 'hi-tech' club was used first. It was a Ruger in 9mm caliber. It left an imprint of the magazine on the victims skull. The impact released the full magazine, which was found at the scene. The perp then shot the victims once with the still chambered round. I said 'victims' because the bullet exited victim #1, who died, and struck victim #2 in his leg.

Finding witnesses was difficult, as all 100 or so patrons of the bar claimed to be in the phone booth at the time.

We the jury found him guilty of murder in the 2nd degree. He's a career criminal so is still in prison.

64 posted on 04/21/2013 8:15:40 AM PDT by ASA Vet (Don't assume Shahanshah Obama will allow another election.)
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To: LibLieSlayer
“A free people ought not only to be armed and disciplined, but they should have sufficient arms and ammunition to maintain a status of independence from any who might attempt to abuse them, which would include their own government.” — George Washington

Bogus and altered quote. Actual quote is from GW's first annual message to Congress, and referenced defense of the nation, not defense of the people against their own government.

"A free people ought not only to be armed, but disciplined; to which end a Uniform and well digested plan is requisite: And their safety and interest require that they should promote such manufactories, as tend to render them independent others, for essential, particularly for military supplies."

http://gwpapers.virginia.edu/documents/union/state1.html

The cause of 2A is not well served by invented quotations.

65 posted on 04/21/2013 8:16:22 AM PDT by Sherman Logan
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To: SeekAndFind

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vHPPYNYOy-I


66 posted on 04/21/2013 8:23:07 AM PDT by boknows
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To: SeekAndFind

If Joe Biden had been there, he’d have taken out that perp with a blast of his shotgun.


67 posted on 04/21/2013 8:28:58 AM PDT by USMCPOP (Father of LCpl. Karl Linn, KIA 1/26/2005 Al Haqlaniyah, Iraq)
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To: mountainlion

You don’t know how many rounds you need until it’s over, and that’s assuming you have some left.


68 posted on 04/21/2013 8:29:41 AM PDT by MV=PY (The Magic Question: Who's paying for it)
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To: MV=PY

You don’t know how many rounds you need until it’s over, and that’s assuming you have some left.

Things could be over with your last round. Backup gun(s) would be a good idea. A gun could fail.


69 posted on 04/21/2013 8:36:09 AM PDT by mountainlion (Live well for those that did not make it back.)
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To: null and void

Have you noticed the pictures are all Caucasian people?

If you look at the DOJ statistics they need to revise the pictures.


70 posted on 04/21/2013 8:36:49 AM PDT by OldMissileer
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To: OldMissileer
In all fairness, a couple of them could be Jews.
71 posted on 04/21/2013 8:39:08 AM PDT by null and void (Republicans create the tools of oppression and Democrats use them. Gun confiscation enables tyranny.)
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To: SeekAndFind

The video feed from the scene of #2s capture shows the police firing uncontrollably with their supervisors yelling in the background to “cease fire, cease fire!”

The shots they fired were of apparently no effect and given that the suspect was in a readily observable small boat in a driveway.....amazingly so.......

The whole scenario makes the left’s gun control argument for “more than “XX” round magazines why would you need them???” look foolish.....

The police, at least in this particular spot looked very unprofessional.


72 posted on 04/21/2013 8:40:24 AM PDT by Forty-Niner (A Strong Man Armed who guards his home, lives in peace.)
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To: mountainlion
You don’t know how many rounds you need

I know I'll never need more than seven.

My betters told me so.

73 posted on 04/21/2013 8:40:36 AM PDT by null and void (Republicans create the tools of oppression and Democrats use them. Gun confiscation enables tyranny.)
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To: csmusaret
And when they had the young one surrounded passed out in the boat just what were they shooting at, and why does the media call that an “exchange” of gunfire?

Any shots fired there were not intended to hit the terrorist. Whether he fired back or not is hard to tell from video and audio that has been made available to the public. Looking at where the boat was relative to LEOs, any one of them could have hit the terrorist in the boat without much effort.

It would have been logical to try to drain out his ammo supply and see if he was in any condition to be firing back by some well placed harassing fire.

74 posted on 04/21/2013 8:41:03 AM PDT by freeandfreezing
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To: LibLieSlayer

Anyone know what the current US military bandoleer load is? a bandoleer is usually considered the typical load out for an individual soldier’s single day in combat....(could be multiple bandoleers in today’s rock n roll culture) In WWII the load out was 80 rounds...(ten 8 round en-bloc clips)


75 posted on 04/21/2013 8:48:32 AM PDT by Forty-Niner (A Strong Man Armed who guards his home, lives in peace.)
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To: mountainlion
"Things could be over with your last round. "

True. But I always try to plan for leftovers. ;-)

76 posted on 04/21/2013 8:50:40 AM PDT by MV=PY (The Magic Question: Who's paying for it)
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To: SeekAndFind

[[And How Many Bullets Do You Need?... It took a dozen or more cops, who are trained professionals, who practice on at least a weekly basis with their firearms, to fire 200 rounds before he finally died. ]]

Excellent aerticle- shoudl forward this to al lthsoe damn republicans that broguht the gun bill to the floor for a vote and tell them “You don’t get to tell us how many bullets we need- we get to decide that for ourselves as it’s an inalienable RIGHT to own firearms for self protection and if erven our trained officers are allowed, AND USE more than 7 rounds per clip and have to fire several hundred bullets at ONLY TWO PEOPLE- then you folksi n washington do NOT get to dictate to we citizens what we will need for self defense


77 posted on 04/21/2013 8:54:01 AM PDT by CottShop (Scientific belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge)
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To: LibLieSlayer
More than a few bullet holes in that boat. Sorry


78 posted on 04/21/2013 9:10:49 AM PDT by Freedom_Is_Not_Free (Free goodies for all -- Freedom for none.)
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To: null and void
http://i276.photobucket.com/albums/kk13/mr_speedvision/9CE06D06-B557-4323-A52A-EA8403448721-21611-0000062CCD5ED5D7.jpg
79 posted on 04/21/2013 9:15:04 AM PDT by Freedom_Is_Not_Free (Free goodies for all -- Freedom for none.)
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To: null and void

80 posted on 04/21/2013 9:15:38 AM PDT by Freedom_Is_Not_Free (Free goodies for all -- Freedom for none.)
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To: Forty-Niner
"Anyone know what the current US military bandoleer load is?"

A couple decades ago, it was sometimes six extra 30-round magazines for some specialties, many more for others. About the same in 20-rounders for a couple decades before that. 20s are better in the field for those very few who know how to most effectively use low cover.

It's all too much for civilian surroundings, as about one out of 40 of us knows (the other 39 or so easily taken by hysteria and unable to hit the side of a barn). Outlawing higher capacities is not the answer, though. The real answer is that bullies don't like to put much effort into training for long.


81 posted on 04/21/2013 9:16:14 AM PDT by familyop (We Baby Boomers are croaking in an avalanche of rotten politics smelled around the planet.)
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To: Freedom_Is_Not_Free

When the war on drugs was declared.


82 posted on 04/21/2013 9:20:15 AM PDT by DeWalt
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To: duffee
"You never have too many guns or enough ammo."

Yep, just like sex...too much still ain't enough!

Scouts Out! Cavalry Ho!

83 posted on 04/21/2013 9:27:21 AM PDT by wku man (We are the 53%! www.7161.com/streamer.cfm?dt_track_id=21356)
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To: freeandfreezing

Riiiiighht. That’s why the boat is riddled with bullet holes. The only reason the punk survived is he was shielded by the engine.


84 posted on 04/21/2013 9:39:51 AM PDT by csmusaret (America is more divided today , not because of the problems we face but because of Obama's solutions)
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To: SeekAndFind

I’ve been to two ranges that kick the local PD out because they shot up the whole place... Trash cans, roof, range building, and all.


85 posted on 04/21/2013 10:00:41 AM PDT by El Laton Caliente (NRA Life Member & www.Gunsnet.net Moderator)
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To: Ajnin; RKV
Spray and pray isn’t policy anywhere.

No they call it rapid fire until the "perp" goes down. The end result of poor marksmanship and that policy results in Spray and Pray.

86 posted on 04/21/2013 10:05:53 AM PDT by El Laton Caliente (NRA Life Member & www.Gunsnet.net Moderator)
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To: RKV
The facts say otherwise.

Really. Then it should be quite easy for you to post the firearms policy of the department that has a policy of "spray and pray"

87 posted on 04/21/2013 10:24:32 AM PDT by Ajnin (Neca eos omnes. Deus suos agnocet!)
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To: Travis McGee

LMAO! OMG!


88 posted on 04/21/2013 10:32:22 AM PDT by SgtHooper (The last thing I want to do is hurt you. But it's still on the list.)
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To: OCMike

Actually, that would be a great idea to keep him alive for subsequent waterboarding. But am I sure the police bought right into that? hmmm.


89 posted on 04/21/2013 10:34:35 AM PDT by SgtHooper (The last thing I want to do is hurt you. But it's still on the list.)
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To: LibLieSlayer

They may be great shots at the range, they may be great shots in daylight - I don’t really know. I have two points of recent reference, at least in seeing results. The first is the blue truck/SUV/minivan in California those cops mistook for the bad guy in a black truck (I think) with the multiple holes in it everywhere and the relatively unharmed passengers.

The second point of reference here is with this event. I’m guessing they knew ‘about’ where he was and just did the old “spray and pray”....if you think about it, they’d cleared the range (I am assuming); it was just so many downrange shots until they hit the paper..


90 posted on 04/21/2013 10:40:05 AM PDT by Gaffer
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To: LibLieSlayer

Basic Combat Load (absolute minimum to get out the gate) is 210 rds (7 each 30-round mags). Most will carry as much as they can, and then some.


91 posted on 04/21/2013 10:54:15 AM PDT by castlebrew (Gun Control means hitting where you're aiming!))
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To: SeekAndFind
Think about that for just a moment. It took a dozen or more cops, who are trained professionals, who practice on at least a weekly basis with their firearms, to fire 200 rounds before he finally died.

OMG, that's the funniest thing I've read all day. Thanks!

92 posted on 04/21/2013 10:58:52 AM PDT by zeugma (Those of us who work for a living are outnumbered by those who vote for a living.)
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To: SeekAndFind

Anyone notice there has been no mention of the firearms used by the Boston Bomber.

Otherwise, after the smoke clears, I would like to have a full 30 rd magazine in reserve.


93 posted on 04/21/2013 11:18:33 AM PDT by Ruy Dias de Bivar (Do we now register our pressure cookers?)
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To: Ajnin

If you had a member of the farce (17 years in) in your family like I do you’d know there is policy and there is policy. Second follow LAPD shootings for a while. You will be able to count the number of rounds down range per engagement for yourself.


94 posted on 04/21/2013 11:21:07 AM PDT by RKV (He who has the guns makes the rules)
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To: csmusaret
Actually "wrong". Take a look at the boat as the FBI forensic team goes over it in the photos in the Daily Mail UK article here and in particular this image from the article

Look closely at the boat. It is not riddled with bullet holes is it? And there aren't many indications of bullet damage in the boat, are there?

Now look also at the location of the boat relative to the driveway and the fence and driveway next door. The article shows LEOs at the front of the house, no doubt many more were present there once they were all in place. The area behind the garage was cleared of officers early in the action to allow fire from the front of the boat. Clearly firing on the boat from both sides was possible, and even fire through the wood fence next to the boat from a concealed position, or even an armored vehicle in the neighbor's driveway.

And yet you are suggesting nobody from FBI HRT, or any other SWAT team present could hit the terrorist because he was behind the engine? Not really. It looks like they carefully fired a few rounds into the boat, maybe even with low penetration ammo. Even the bullet holes present do not seem to be matched with exit holes on the far side. I'm willing to bet that a standard 5.56mm round will go right through a fiberglass boat and its wood trim.

The search operation may have been poorly planned and a failure, but the final capture operation was very well done.

95 posted on 04/21/2013 1:51:23 PM PDT by freeandfreezing
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To: SeekAndFind
o fire 200 rounds before he finally died

And apparently it took his brother running over him to kill him.

96 posted on 04/21/2013 2:02:07 PM PDT by arthurus (Read Hazlitt's Economics In One Lesson ONLINE www.fee.org/library/books/economics-in-one-lesson)
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To: freeandfreezing

Several threads here have comments about how the boat was riddled with bullet holes and speculation about who was going to buy him a new one. You can hold any opinion you want. I don’t care one way or the other what you think. My opinion is a bunch of trigger happy cowboys with frayed nerves (justifiably so) were shooting at something they hoped was the bad guy. Carefully fired a few rounds? “I don’t care who you are that’s funny right there.” I still haven’t seen or heard any evidence that the suspect fired a single shot. I am doubting the use of the words “exchange of gunfire”. I don’t think their was any exchange. By the way, I’m still laughing about “a few carefully fired rounds”. Enjoy your fantasies.


97 posted on 04/21/2013 2:19:51 PM PDT by csmusaret (America is more divided today , not because of the problems we face but because of Obama's solutions)
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To: faucetman

“You might need 200 bullets to kill a terrorist. “

200 rounds and a Mercedes SUV.


98 posted on 04/21/2013 3:14:19 PM PDT by PLMerite (Shut the Beyotch Down! Burn, baby, burn!)
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To: csmusaret

Did you bother to look at the pictures of the boat?


99 posted on 04/21/2013 3:48:35 PM PDT by freeandfreezing
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To: Paladin2

Yup, from his family’s viewpoint, death by friendly tire.


100 posted on 04/21/2013 4:04:39 PM PDT by JohnBovenmyer (Obama been Liberal. Hope Change!)
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