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Ron Paul slams Boston police. Has he gone too far?
Yahoo! News ^ | 04/30/2013 | Peter Grier

Posted on 04/30/2013 4:15:04 PM PDT by E. Pluribus Unum

Ron Paul, in a posting on the website of a libertarian activist, accused US law enforcement of 'a military-style occupation of an American city' in its response to the Boston bombing. Former GOP presidential candidate Ron Paul has slammed US law enforcement for responding to the Boston Marathon bombing with “police state tactics.” In a post on the website of libertarian activist Lew Rockwell, Mr. Paul said Monday that the governmental reaction to the tragic explosions was worse than the attack itself...

(Excerpt) Read more at news.yahoo.com ...


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Crime/Corruption; Government; News/Current Events; US: Massachusetts
KEYWORDS: boston; bostonbombing; bostonpd; leo; ronpaul
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Comment #1 Removed by Moderator

To: E. Pluribus Unum

The comments overwhelmingly support Ron Paul — and question Yahoo’s headline bias.


2 posted on 04/30/2013 4:16:30 PM PDT by BenLurkin (This is not a statement of fact. It is either opinion or satire; or both)
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To: E. Pluribus Unum

What is his solution?


3 posted on 04/30/2013 4:16:43 PM PDT by cripplecreek (REMEMBER THE RIVER RAISIN!)
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To: E. Pluribus Unum

He’s absolutely right.


4 posted on 04/30/2013 4:17:14 PM PDT by Mr Ramsbotham (Laws against sodomy are honored in the breech.)
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To: E. Pluribus Unum

My little country town in Upstate NY now has a SWAT team and an armored vehicle, courtesy of DHS dropping tons on of cash on every police force in the country to arm-up.

That, and the fact that every Gov’t agency now seems to have its own paramilitary force and all of are bidding up ammunition to keep it out of private hands is quite concerning indeed.


5 posted on 04/30/2013 4:18:13 PM PDT by PGR88
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To: cripplecreek

“What is his solution?”

A well armed citizenry?


6 posted on 04/30/2013 4:18:15 PM PDT by EQAndyBuzz (The reason we own guns is to protect ourselves from those wanting to take our guns from us.)
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To: cripplecreek
What is his solution?

His solution is to obey the constitution.

I take it your solution is to abolish the constitution when a couple of dweebs with a pressure cooker kill a few people?

7 posted on 04/30/2013 4:19:18 PM PDT by E. Pluribus Unum (Islam is a religion of peace, and Moslems reserve the right to behead anyone who says otherwise.)
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To: E. Pluribus Unum

no he has not gone too far


8 posted on 04/30/2013 4:21:23 PM PDT by yldstrk (My heroes have always been cowboys)
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To: EQAndyBuzz
A well armed citizenry?

That is the antithesis of what our current fascist government wants. Which is all the more reason why we should not let it happen.

9 posted on 04/30/2013 4:21:33 PM PDT by South40 (I Love The "New & Improved" Free Republic!)
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To: E. Pluribus Unum

So Mr Constitution, how would you have handled it?

Saying you would obey the constitution is a cop out. You could do nothing and remain in compliance with the constitution.


10 posted on 04/30/2013 4:22:16 PM PDT by cripplecreek (REMEMBER THE RIVER RAISIN!)
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To: E. Pluribus Unum

yes, he’s gone too far! Throw him in jail!

Yahoo idiots.


11 posted on 04/30/2013 4:23:46 PM PDT by Third Person (Welcome to Gaymerica.)
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To: cripplecreek
So Mr Constitution, how would you have handled it?

Well, Mr. Alinsky, I wouldn't have frog-marched innocent people out of their houses at gunpoint.

I sincerely hope you get to experience it someday soon.

12 posted on 04/30/2013 4:27:24 PM PDT by E. Pluribus Unum (Islam is a religion of peace, and Moslems reserve the right to behead anyone who says otherwise.)
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To: E. Pluribus Unum

I’m not a big Ron Paul fan, but he’s not far off-base with this comment. I was appalled at the military show-of-force of the police (and it was not just the Boston PD) in their lock-down of an entire city, and the way they strong-armed and harrassed citizens who were sitting peacefully in their homes. And to add insult to injury, a citizen copped the perp AFTER the police lifted the lockdown and issued what amounted to an “All’s well” statement.


13 posted on 04/30/2013 4:30:23 PM PDT by ought-six ( Multiculturalism is national suicide, and political correctness is the cyanide capsule.)
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To: E. Pluribus Unum
Pretty much agree with Dr.Paul.....Police tactics seemed excessive. With all the rounds of ammo fired by police which missed their target one can't help but wonder just what in hell they unintentionally shot full of holes.
14 posted on 04/30/2013 4:30:57 PM PDT by True Grit
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To: E. Pluribus Unum

Warrantless searches are the actions of a criminal government.


15 posted on 04/30/2013 4:32:28 PM PDT by freedomfiter2 (Brutal acts of commission and yawning acts of omission both strengthen the hand of the devil.)
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To: South40

Personally I think less cops and more citizen involvement would be better. Naturally people should have the option of being armed. However its important to remember that in the days of the posse, the constitution was often trampled far more than what happened in Boston at the hands of police.

I think I would have strongly suggested that people avoid traveling if possible and I would warn them that there are a lot of nervous and potentially dangerous police on the street.

When it comes right down to it, its just a symptom of the government imposed disease that imports our enemies and strips us of rights as a result.


16 posted on 04/30/2013 4:34:45 PM PDT by cripplecreek (REMEMBER THE RIVER RAISIN!)
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To: E. Pluribus Unum

Yeah I kinda figured you didn’t have an answer.


17 posted on 04/30/2013 4:35:40 PM PDT by cripplecreek (REMEMBER THE RIVER RAISIN!)
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To: cripplecreek
What is his solution?

Indefinite curfew is never the answer.

18 posted on 04/30/2013 4:36:04 PM PDT by jimfree (In November 2016 my 12 y/o granddaughter will have more quality exec experience than Barack Obama)
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To: cripplecreek

citizen’s arrest works way better than those thugs and their over the top freak show


19 posted on 04/30/2013 4:36:47 PM PDT by yldstrk (My heroes have always been cowboys)
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To: cripplecreek

hee bee jee bee cripple creek have you lost your ever lovin mind?


20 posted on 04/30/2013 4:37:32 PM PDT by yldstrk (My heroes have always been cowboys)
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To: freedomfiter2

it is a criminal government drunk with power


21 posted on 04/30/2013 4:38:23 PM PDT by yldstrk (My heroes have always been cowboys)
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To: E. Pluribus Unum

If I was Ron Paul, I’d wonder what they mean by “too far” and exactly what are the ramifications of such a trespass.


22 posted on 04/30/2013 4:41:37 PM PDT by JimSEA
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To: cripplecreek

Not really true that the posse or commitees of vigilance trampled the constitution. That is indeed the revisionist meme in todays hit western movies, but the facts of frontier America simply do not bear it out. Quite the opposite is normally true.


23 posted on 04/30/2013 4:42:43 PM PDT by DesertRhino (I was standing with a rifle, waiting for soviet paratroopers, but communists just ran for office.)
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To: freedomfiter2

Warrantless searches are the actions of a criminal government.

“The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated...”

Were searches reasonable? Was anyone arrested because of something the police saw as they were searching the homes?

I agree with people saying the police seemed pretty rough about it.


24 posted on 04/30/2013 4:43:40 PM PDT by Owl558 (Those who remember George Satayana and doomed to repeat him)
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To: yldstrk
citizen’s arrest works way better than those thugs and their over the top freak show

The old timers tell me the story their parents told them about the last lynching in these parts. Seems they burned down at least 3 different barns before finding the guy they were after. Then they hung him before the sheriff arrived.

From my historical reading, that kind of thing was pretty common among posses. They didn't worry too much about search warrants or destruction of property in those days.
25 posted on 04/30/2013 4:44:32 PM PDT by cripplecreek (REMEMBER THE RIVER RAISIN!)
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To: E. Pluribus Unum

Makes me wonder what would have happened if someone refused to leave their home. Buttstroke him in front of his kids? Arrest him?


26 posted on 04/30/2013 4:46:29 PM PDT by Gefreiter
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To: E. Pluribus Unum

Did the Boston police and the FBI go to far? This is the question.

What did Ron Paul do?


27 posted on 04/30/2013 4:46:48 PM PDT by dforest (I have now entered the Twilight Zone.)
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To: E. Pluribus Unum

Ron Paul, you anti-American hack! The force was necessary so that the terrorist was caught. The government must do this to protect the population. Hacks like Ron Paul make big fuss over our law enforcing heroes saving lives by putting themselves in danger. Do I need a sarcasm?


28 posted on 04/30/2013 4:49:16 PM PDT by sagar
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To: cripplecreek
S'ok. Cops in Cali shot up a pickup that only Stevie Wonder could confuse with the perp truck and shot up an innocent woman.

I'm not seeing much difference in your scenarios, except with the cops, we're paying for it. With vigilence commitees, they paid for it.

And after it was all over with, in Boston, it wasn't the cops that found the guy. It was a citizen. So yes, doing nothing is a valid option.

/johnny

29 posted on 04/30/2013 4:49:39 PM PDT by JRandomFreeper (Gone Galt)
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To: cripplecreek

Mob justice vs jack booted thugs. Surely there is a constitutional middle ground?


30 posted on 04/30/2013 4:49:39 PM PDT by JimSEA
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To: Gefreiter
I wouldn't have left. Local constabulary understands they need a warrant on this property.

They can, of course, just kill me, but they can only do that once.

/johnny

31 posted on 04/30/2013 4:51:40 PM PDT by JRandomFreeper (Gone Galt)
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To: cripplecreek

Additionally, the Boston police, while good in some ways, showed an astounding lack of skill in some huge ways. The first shootout caught on youtube sounded like a protracted firefight. But they were facing one pistol.
This resulted in no kill on one till he was run over, and the other escaping. For contrast, witness the shootout in Texas when the cops there stopped the guy who was on the run for escaping the murder of the prison warden. It ended right there, because the shooting was up to par.

Then they began a search of every building, treating innocent people disrespectfully. They acted like they were scared, playing army.
The low quality of their search was revealed when a homeowner found the bad guy after the search ended. (as he could have much more quickly had there been no 10,000 cop police state)

Then when Boston PD moved in again, they unleashed another horrendous fulisade that was caught on youtube. But the terrorist was unarmed.

They do indeed need some corrective criticism. But there are probably limits on how good an east coast department can be. They simply do not shoot as a lifestyle like people in Texas or New Mexico do.


32 posted on 04/30/2013 4:53:46 PM PDT by DesertRhino (I was standing with a rifle, waiting for soviet paratroopers, but communists just ran for office.)
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To: cripplecreek

I’ve noticed no one has a solution for a better way for Law Enforcement to have approached the hunt for two murderous terrorist thugs.


33 posted on 04/30/2013 4:53:53 PM PDT by SoldierDad (Proud dad of an Army Soldier who has survived 24 months of Combat deployment.)
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To: E. Pluribus Unum

Actually what Paul said to that nutcase Rockwell was that the actions of the police while protecting the people were worse than the actions of the terrorists who precipitated those actions.

Outrageous and disgusting.

Reminds me of when he called the IDF soldiers who were protecting their country “pirates.”


34 posted on 04/30/2013 4:54:05 PM PDT by EternalVigilance (Life, liberty, property, family, RKBA, sovereignty, security, borders, independence, the oath.)
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To: E. Pluribus Unum

Thomas Lucente: American liberty died in Boston where it was born

http://freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/3013387/posts


35 posted on 04/30/2013 4:56:10 PM PDT by Deadeye Division
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To: JimSEA
Surely there is a constitutional middle ground?

That's all I'm suggesting and it won't be perfect. If you've got good strong local law enforcement leadership with a firm constitutional streak, a posse of trusted folks would be good. In this case I don't think it would have taken much to convince people to stay off the street. Even easier if they can be armed in their homes. Just go door to door and ask if they've seen anything. If the folks answer the door armed, its a safe bet that the perp isn't there.

The feds are a whole different issue.
36 posted on 04/30/2013 4:58:56 PM PDT by cripplecreek (REMEMBER THE RIVER RAISIN!)
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To: E. Pluribus Unum

Next time there is a terrorist attack call 1-800-RON-PAUL.


37 posted on 04/30/2013 5:00:03 PM PDT by windsorknot
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To: SoldierDad
Cops and governments can't fix all problems. Sometimes leaving problems alone and letting a constitutional rule of law work is the best solution.

Demands to "DO SOMETHING! NOW!" are a sure way to trample freedoms.

/johnny

38 posted on 04/30/2013 5:00:45 PM PDT by JRandomFreeper (Gone Galt)
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To: Owl558
Were searches reasonable?

That takes a citizen or a group of citizens filling a lawsuit. If nobody files, then there is no claim they weren't....

39 posted on 04/30/2013 5:01:15 PM PDT by EVO X
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To: windsorknot
I don't call when there are problems. I call when cleanup is required. The reflex to call on government to fix problems is where freedom got lost.

/johnny

40 posted on 04/30/2013 5:03:29 PM PDT by JRandomFreeper (Gone Galt)
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To: EVO X
That takes a citizen or a group of citizens filling a lawsuit. If nobody files, then there is no claim they weren't....

Really? Today's citizenry? They probably have no idea their rights were violated they are so used to being told what to do.

41 posted on 04/30/2013 5:07:43 PM PDT by raybbr (People who still support Obama are either a Marxist or a moron. No, they are both.)
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To: SoldierDad

“I’ve noticed no one has a solution for a better way for Law Enforcement,,,,”

You’re kidding, right? Yes, there were better ways. Plenty of them.
First, when they were identified as terrorists and placed on the watchlist last year, law enforcment (FBI) failed in their responsibility.
Next, after the bombing, they had clear photos of those two DAYS before the first shootout. They showed them to the media, but not to us. Had they done so, someone would have known them. They likely could have been rolled up and stopped before the murder of the MIT cop, and the carjacking.

Again, when they had the first shootout at the traffic stop, they could have won the shootout, and preveted either from leaving. But say they screwed THAT up and one got away. With the effort commonly used to find a burglar or car theif, they should have apprehended him quickly.

The tactic of sealing off a mid size city, telling everyone to stay indoors, and searching in the manner they did is an option that reveals an utter lack of skill and intelligence.

They FBI and FBI blew numerous chances to do good policing, then when it was a full crisis, they argue that they had no choice other than to re-enact D-day in Boston. This is a red herring.

PS,,for extra fun, remember how he was in the backyard, in a boat, clearly visible on FLIR? Theres a hint there. NO matter how you slice it, that was low skill policing on display.


42 posted on 04/30/2013 5:09:09 PM PDT by DesertRhino (I was standing with a rifle, waiting for soviet paratroopers, but communists just ran for office.)
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To: SoldierDad

That’s my point. Sure there were problems but screeching about them doesn’t solve anything. We’ve got to find solutions and implement them.

One of my neighbors is a former Detroit cop. He suggests that neighbors get to know each other and find some trusted locals to go door to door asking to look around with the understanding that all they report is whether they did or didn’t find the perp.


43 posted on 04/30/2013 5:09:33 PM PDT by cripplecreek (REMEMBER THE RIVER RAISIN!)
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To: JRandomFreeper
Did I miss something? We are not speaking about a noise complaint, are we? What occurred in Boston didn't have anything to do with a barking dog that was being left unattended, right? There was an actual criminal act perpetrated by islamic jihadis bent on killing and maiming as many civilians as they possibly could, right? That, in your opinion, is a problem which should have been left to take care of itself?

Wow!

44 posted on 04/30/2013 5:09:40 PM PDT by SoldierDad (Proud dad of an Army Soldier who has survived 24 months of Combat deployment.)
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To: EVO X

None resisted the lawless home searches.
Too frightened or too eager to please their master and find Johar.


45 posted on 04/30/2013 5:09:48 PM PDT by omega4179
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To: DesertRhino

They turned Boston into an episode of “The Running Man.”


46 posted on 04/30/2013 5:12:02 PM PDT by ez (Muslims do not play well with others.)
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To: SoldierDad
What the cops did, that didn't fix the problem, did it?

The problem was resolved.

Only problem is that what the cops did violated the Constitution.

I've got issues with that.

/johnny

47 posted on 04/30/2013 5:22:06 PM PDT by JRandomFreeper (Gone Galt)
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To: DesertRhino
First, when they were identified as terrorists and placed on the watchlist last year, law enforcment (FBI) failed in their responsibility.

Hindsight is always 20/20. Unfortunately, it doesn't address a problem that was allowed to occur by the feds, and doesn't answer the question regarding a better way for law enforcement to have reacted after the fact

Next, after the bombing, they had clear photos of those two DAYS before the first shootout.

Would showing photos to the general public have guaranteed the two islamists would have surrendered without any further violence?

The tactic of sealing off a mid size city, telling everyone to stay indoors, and searching in the manner they did is an option that reveals an utter lack of skill and intelligence.

Actually, this is a tactic that has been utilized in a number of cities where law enforcement had to hunt down and locate dangerous individuals. What was done is not extraordinary.

PS,,for extra fun, remember how he was in the backyard, in a boat, clearly visible on FLIR? Theres a hint there. NO matter how you slice it, that was low skill policing on display.

Yes, he was visible on FLIR, AFTER the resident contacted police AFTER finding the individual was hiding in the resident's boat. Is there a point here?

Arguing that the feds failed before the fact (before these two islamists carried out their attack) is pointless when discussing the after the fact response of local law enforcement in looking for the perps. Given that Obozo cares not a wit about stopping islamists, it is not surprising the feds failed. Expect more attacks in the future. Could law enforcement have done a better job in hunting these two perps? Of course. That could be said about almost every incident where law enforcement has had to hunt down dangerous suspects. There is also the added component of how badly the media failed, given they did everything possible to attempt to shift attention away from anyone not white, male, and conservative tea party members.

48 posted on 04/30/2013 5:22:14 PM PDT by SoldierDad (Proud dad of an Army Soldier who has survived 24 months of Combat deployment.)
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To: SoldierDad
All that Constitution trampling, and they still didn't catch their man.

A civilian did.

/johnny

49 posted on 04/30/2013 5:23:13 PM PDT by JRandomFreeper (Gone Galt)
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To: EVO X

Maybe we will learn more as time goes on and the lawsuits start flying, but emergency cerfews are not unconstitutional. Tell me how the searches were unreasonable - that is the Constitutional standard. As far as I could tell, they were contained, focused on the suspect, and nobody was arrested for anything the police may have seen in their houses during these searches?


50 posted on 04/30/2013 5:23:23 PM PDT by Owl558 (Those who remember George Satayana and doomed to repeat him)
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