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The United West ^ | 5/10/2013 | RACEBANNON

Posted on 05/10/2013 2:47:40 AM PDT by RaceBannon

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To: butterdezillion; A Navy Vet

The US military has had to acknowledge when terrorist Afghanistanis have infiltrated and perpetrated attacks. For them to fail to check out who slipped in these other 7 Afghanistanis at the last minute suggests they were WILLFULLY BLIND, as opposed to other times when they were willing to say that the attack was perpetrated by infiltrators. That says to me that this attack was different.

Allowing the imam to gloat afterwards also says that this was different. I couldn’t hear real clearly but I thought they were saying that the imam was there because they hadn’t yet identified which bodies were the Afghanistanis, who had to be flown back to the US to be identified. So some of the coffins had American flags draped over them and some had AFghanistani flags draped over them, even though they said they had no way of knowing which bodies were Afghans. The one mom was incensed that her son may have come home to the US with an Afghan flag draping the coffin.

If they had investigated and found that the 7 Afghanistanis who went on that mission were part of the infiltration that killed our men, I wonder if they would have allowed an imam to gloat over the dead bodies. Being willfully blind about what really happened there may be central to the Muslims getting to have their gloat over the men who had allegedly killed Osama Bin Laden. The Afghanistanis who had been assigned to go on that flight would have still been around there, and SOMEBODY surely knew there was something screwy going on because those guys were still there when they were supposedly on the helo.

21 posted on 05/10/2013 9:48:01 AM PDT by butterdezillion (,)
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To: butterdezillion
I acknowledged much of what you assert above. My bottom-line point is I don't think this was an Obama let-them-get-even for killing bin Laden.

I still think it was a poorly executed rescue mission (remember Carter's failed attempt to rescue the hostages?) by a less than stellar field operational commander. Sh*t happens, even with the best of planning and I actually cried the day I heard all those warriors and fellow Shipmates went down.

However, I don't think anything other than some insurgent intell made it happen, and we just can't know everything the bad guys were planning. I just think it was some grand conspiracy with our own Fedgov to kill so many of SEAL Team 6.

Don't have it readily available, but somewhere on this site is a list atrocities by Koranimals since 9/11/01 all over the World. There is also a list of how many of the efforts have been thwarted. Again: We need to be right 100% of the time; they need to be successful 1%.

That's why I say it's time to teach these barbarians a lesson and send them back to the their beloved 7th century. I'm ready to make some examples, starting with Iran.

22 posted on 05/10/2013 10:50:35 AM PDT by A Navy Vet (An Oath is Forever)
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To: butterdezillion
"Something else. It was pitch-black. 2am. It wasn’t stated what kind of weapon hit the Chinook - whether it was a Manpad, a heat-seeking missile, RPG, etc. But the hit was deadly accurate in the pitch dark in the middle of the night."

Here's something for you to think about: Not only are all kinds of weapons sold to or traded by the bad guys, but they also have access to night vision equipment.

Please understand that I'm not making excuses for the poor tactical operation, which is where I place the blame. I'm just not seeing any grand conspiracy. We have enough with the Benghazi debacle, not to mention the "Fast and Furious" gun-running operation.

23 posted on 05/10/2013 10:59:09 AM PDT by A Navy Vet (An Oath is Forever)
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To: A Navy Vet

I just [don’t] think...

24 posted on 05/10/2013 11:01:08 AM PDT by A Navy Vet (An Oath is Forever)
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To: A Navy Vet
May god rest those courageous souls. Again, getting choked up having known the likes of them. Spec Ops are our best warriors. They even now have a site where they are coming out against Obambi and his un-Constitutional and anti-American ways.

It was a poorly executed tactical rescue operation. The field commander should be held accountable. Do you know his name? Sure it's somewhere in this thread. He has probably already been relieved of his command authority.

If he doesn't step forward, then that may support your assertions and others' idea of conspiracy. We'll see.

25 posted on 05/10/2013 11:10:05 AM PDT by A Navy Vet (An Oath is Forever)
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To: A Navy Vet

Why the cover-up? Why the refusal to investigate and the lies to the parents?

The stuff that happened that night was beyond poor execution. Substitutions were made without the manifest reflecting the changes. Nobody found out who authorized the change or why. There was no radar. They didn’t look for the black box. Bodies were cremated against the wishes of the men and their families and excuses were made for that which are demonstrably false. An imam was allowed to gloat over the dead infidels, and the copies of the service where it happened were not given to the families, which is ALWAYS done.

This wasn’t just a one-night SNAFU. This was a concerted effort over 2 years, to hide and lie about what really happened.

It’s just like Benghazi (and Fast & Furious, for that matter). They are covering up a bunch of stuff and the question needs to be answered: Why?

We’ve got 3 “incidents” where deaths happened, and there has been a big cover-up. Once is an accident, twice is coincidence, but 3 times is deliberate. What the heck is going on with this lawless regime? (And that’s not even getting into Bin Laden’s son Hamza being figuratively high-fived by Michelle Obama in the hospital after he was tackled at the Boston marathon finish line and classified as a “known terrorist”. Nor is it getting into the eligibility issue, where we know that forgery, perjury, and fraud were committed not only by Obama but by LOTS of people within the system. So we’ve got more like FIVE cover-ups by this regime).

And there’s more too, regarding the Bin Laden revenge: the informant who allowed us to get Bin Laden has been thrown under the bus by the Obama regime - first by revealing who it was and then by leaving him to be captured and abused by the Taliban. It was like this regime did everything necessary for the Taliban to get revenge on EVERYBODY involved in that Bin Laden raid. Not just the SEALS. The informant too.

And that wasn’t the only casualty either. Special Ops Speaks pointed out that Obama’s immediate announcement and the information that was disclosed compromised our ability to exploit the intel we acquired and also allowed the enemy to know our methods of gaining intel so that they could circumvent those methods in the future. That is right out in the open for anybody to see. We don’t even have to make a conspiracy out of this; it’s just plain common knowledge.

We had an investigation over who accidentally disclosed that Valerie Plame was a CIA operative. Her husband, Joe Wilson, actually disclosed that publicly and got in no trouble for it. But we ended up with Scooter Libby jailed because of that, which cost no lives and put no operations in jeopardy.

Yet in this case, where the lives of our SEALS and our informants were at stake as well as our ongoing ability to conduct operations - and yet JOE BIDEN gave up operational details that allowed not only the SEALS but the doctor who cooperated with intel necessary to do the Bin Laden raid being targeted by AQ and/or the Taliban. And nothing has been done in response to the VICE PRESIDENT and PRESIDENT leaking the very details necessary to put these people and our counter-terrorism efforts at great risk.

With “friends” like the supposed CINC and his supposed VP, who needs enemies? It is without question that their actions put our guys and our anti-terrorism efforts at risk. Our men died in part because of the KNOWN public statements by these 2 guys. And the people who cooperated with us were deserted regarding the Bin Laden raid, just like Mubarak and Ghadaffi - our greatest allies in the war on terror in the Middle East - were deserted by this regime and replaced with the Muslim Brotherhood which is now releasing known terrorists, arming them, and instituting sharia including the persecution and executions of non-Muslims.

There are WAY too many patterns, and CONSISTENT patterns, by this Obama regime for it all to be explained by either incompetence or accident. WAY too much.

26 posted on 05/10/2013 11:58:42 AM PDT by butterdezillion (,)
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To: butterdezillion
Who could have foreseen the Boston Marathon terrorist explosions? Although we hear every day about the FBI/CIA and other intell orgs thwarting some terrorist plans, unless we go Soviet style, there is no way our intell agencies can foresee and stop everything psycopath. Even the Russians couldn't foresee the atrocity of the Beslan school, supposedly in the name of Allah (piss be upon him).

We live in a different World now. Get used to it. The bad guys (mostly Koranimals) have the silent hand and they know it. Like I said, kill them all or continue to allow them to kill us for the sake of political correctness and diversity.

Here's my bottom line and I don't care who reads it: Islam has become a bigger sore on this rock than it ever was through history. I don't trust a frigging one of them. Being an agnostic, I just want me and mine to live in peace and have the opportunity to prosper. They want all to bow down to their sh*t ass moon god. I despise Islam and all it stands for.

Does anyone need to be reminded what occurs around the world on almost a daily basis? If so, here ya go:
Forced marriages including children;
Forced sex;
Forced hiding of women's bodies. And why is that? It's not about the Islam claim to modesty; it's about the ruthless rapist that Muslim men are;
Forced conversion to their religion or pay a toll as stipulated in the Koran. OR get deaded.
Forced destruction of all other historic religious artifacts;
Forced children in their teaching to hate anything Israel or Western civilization;
And the best of their culture, FORCED circumcision of female genitalia. Gotta love that one. BTW, where are the hags from NOW?
Oh another best, the so-called palestinians who cut their own heads and those of their children for some obscure cause for Allah.

Islam is a sick non-civil rights culture. And for those of you on the Dummies forums and reading this from your safe (guess again) university tablet, it is NOT a peaceful religion.

It is a politically inspired theology. What you Dummies don't get, is that even the Koran talks about Abraham and admires him and sons until it gets into jihad and especially the "Hadiths". The Koran claims the same lineology of the Bible, but veers off into a cult. You poor brain-washed students just don't know what works for a civilized society and what doesn't work.

Come get me Mohammedsh*ts. Please make me a martyr that you so relish and watch what happens when some nobody Navy veteran in Orange County gets deaded for your crap religion. Come cowardly pieces of sh*t. I'm here every day. I know you can find me from your big mosque and resources. No? You don't want to upset your image lies?

Well, here's more: Mohammed sucked pig d*ck. Now try me.

27 posted on 05/10/2013 12:09:33 PM PDT by A Navy Vet (An Oath is Forever)
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To: A Navy Vet

We have night vision equipment as well. Why didn’t we have anybody there who could have laid down protective cover? They could have seen who was armed and where they were. It could have been an armed drone and the camera-man could have found where the armed elements were and had the drone fire specifically at those armed elements in the area. This was after 3.5 hours of firefights. We knew there were armed terrorists there, including a high-value target. Why send our people in totally defenseless, knowing that the enemy has the capability of night vision?

That’s not a tactical mistake. That is suicide. Except the person who ordered it was not who was sent into certain death so instead of suicide it’s actually more like murder.

28 posted on 05/10/2013 12:15:10 PM PDT by butterdezillion (,)
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To: A Navy Vet

I can’t argue with anything you said about Islam there.

If we can have Russia, Syria, and our own intel give so many screaming red flags about Tsarnaev, and we STILL gave him welfare allowing him to plan and execute this attack - and we can catch Bin Laden’s son Hamza red-handed at the finish line when the explosions happened and still remove his “known terrorist” classification and let him go back to Saudi Arabia after he got a figurative high-five from Michelle Obama herself at the hospital..... then we will never EVER be able to stop known terrorists.

Not because we don’t know about them or their plans, but because we aid and abet the very people we KNOW are conspiring or (on the part of Hamza) have ALREADY conspired to kill innocent Americans.

The Obama regime - including Michelle Obama herself - are on the side of the terrorists. They have helped them at every turn. When that photo of Michelle Obama visiting Alhamdi (Bin Laden’s son Hamza) was published in the Muslim world, do you think those people didn’t know who Michelle was visiting? This guy was given a coming-out party in Iran with the video available for viewing. He was groomed as the guy who would avenge his father’s death and take over the jihad operations. What does it mean when you have the Muslim media trumpeting the visit by Michelle Obama of the guy they all know (but won’t say out loud) is Bin Laden’s son - and photos of him grinning broadly? Why do you think he was grinning broadly? Could it be because Michelle Obama knew this guy had killed Americans and yet she figuratively spread her legs for him in view of the Muslim world, knowing full well who he was and that he had just planned and executed the killing of innocent Americans including an 8-year-old boy waiting for his dad to cross the finish line?

The Muslim world knows what they bought and paid for, and Michelle demonstrated loudly and clearly that Obama will always bow to his true owners. LIke a big old middle-finger salute to this entire nation, including you and all others who have served our country and those who died to try to preserve this country.

I feel your passion, and I have the same passion for freedom and truth. I hope and pray that those things will prevail and will do everything in my power to see them prevail.

29 posted on 05/10/2013 12:32:20 PM PDT by butterdezillion (,)
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To: butterdezillion
"We have night vision equipment as well. Why didn’t we have anybody there who could have laid down protective cover? They could have seen who was armed and where they were. It could have been an armed drone and the camera-man could have found where the armed elements were and had the drone fire specifically at those armed elements in the area."

Coulda, woulda, shoulda. Sorry, but being a simple aviation boatswains mate, I don't have the answers. What I do know from talking to various Marine, Army, and others, is that there is no perfect plan in a war zone. Sh*t happens.

Also remember that our assets can't be everywhere every moment. Don't know what else to say, other than if the commander of the rescue operation had air support to back up the Chinook and didn't use it by his own decision, he should pay dearly. If he didn't have such air support, than no fault of his for some once in a lifetime shoot down of all those SpecOps guys.

30 posted on 05/10/2013 12:33:14 PM PDT by A Navy Vet (An Oath is Forever)
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To: A Navy Vet

Obama argued in one of the debates that we didn’t need a large defense budget for equipment because we have this new technology called drones. If we didn’t have ANYTHING that this commander could have sent in with firepower (after 3.5 hours of firefight already) then why would he even think we had the ability to kill/capture this supposed high-value target? Better to do surveillance, follow where this target went, and get him when we actually had some firepower to get him with.

They went right then because they were told they had a high-value target they HAD to get then. This is about like saying that we’ve got Al Capone and his whole mob in a shoot-out at their lair so we have to quick send in an unarmed Little Bo-Peep to capture him. It makes absolutely NO sense. Especially when you decide to send in every Little Bo-Peep you’ve got, all at once, unarmed, to the big bad, VERY ARMED mob of Al Capone.

31 posted on 05/10/2013 12:43:42 PM PDT by butterdezillion (,)
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To: butterdezillion
"This wasn’t just a one-night SNAFU."

Guess what? Even in the most professional institutions in the world, SNAFU's occur.

Still, if there was malfeasance or dereliction of duty, then those responsible should pay according to the Uniform Code of Military Justice (USMJ).

If these families can prove such malfeasance or dereliction, I stand with them. I didn't see it in the parts of the video. I think that people now want their spot light. Once again, crap happens in the fog of war, even with the best commanders. Not to say he was...just making a point.

32 posted on 05/10/2013 12:47:03 PM PDT by A Navy Vet (An Oath is Forever)
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To: A Navy Vet

Of course stuff happens in the fog of war. But compare this, for instance, to Black Hawk Down, which was a situation gone bad and people having to improvise their response as they were able. The middle of a fire-fight, the middle of the night, you know there are a lot of armed people. Mogadishu is awake and made as a hornet’s nest already.

And THEN you decide you have to go get a “high value target” and send them into the city aflame with armed enemies who have been shooting at your people for 3.5 hours already.... with no radar to watch what is happening to them and with no fire-power. You send your whole frickin’ team in that condition, to make a supposed capture or kill of one terrorist amongst a whole city full of them.

At this press conference it was said that the report the families received gave no information on who this supposed “high value target” was or what evidence they had that he was even there. If they did an investigation into whether the operation itself was justifiable that’s pretty critical information they didn’t have any interest in documenting.

I agree with you that whoever made that decision should be sitting in the hot seat. Part of the families’ fury is that none of that stuff was sorted out. No reasons were given. It was like the investigation itself echoed Hillary Clinton: What difference at this point does it make?

It does make a difference. It makes a huge difference, whether leadership will do the Biblical David-and-Uriah routine where inconvenient soldiers are sent into situations where it is intended for them to be “accidentally” killed. Just like it makes a huge difference if the military and the entire system decides to abandon the principle of “Never leave a man behind.” Lotta guys depending on that promise of faithfulness, and if you take that away it is - as Joe Biden would say - a “big f-ing deal”.

33 posted on 05/10/2013 12:57:46 PM PDT by butterdezillion (,)
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To: RaceBannon

See also:

Navy SEAL Team VI Families Reveal Government’s Culpability in Death of Their Sons at National Press Club

34 posted on 05/10/2013 10:30:44 PM PDT by Altariel ("Curse your sudden but inevitable betrayal!")
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To: sneakers

Bump again to bookmark

35 posted on 05/12/2013 4:33:28 AM PDT by sneakers (Go Sheriff Joe!)
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