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Verizon scandal: Barack Obama's national security state is now beyond democratic control
The London Telegraph ^ | June 6, 2013 | Dr. Tim Stanley

Posted on 06/06/2013 1:03:39 PM PDT by 2ndDivisionVet

Those crazy American conspiracy theorists who live up trees with guns and drink their own pee don’t seem quite so crazy anymore. It turns out that a “secret court order” has empowered the US government to collect the phone records of millions of users of Verizon, one of the most popular telephone providers – a massive domestic surveillance programme and a shocking intrusion into the lives of others. For the first time in history, being an AT&T customer doesn’t seem such a bad thing after all.

Of course, it isn't the first time that a US administration has spied on its own people. The origins of this particular order lie first in the 1978 Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act and then in Section 215 of the Patriot Act, backed by George W Bush and passed by Congress after 9/11. Normally, domestic surveillance only targets suspicious individuals, not the entire population, but in 2006 it was discovered that a similarly wide database of cellular records was being collected from customers of Verizon, AT&T and BellSouth. There was plenty of outrage and plenty of lawsuits, but the National Security Agency never confirmed that the programme had been shut down. It would appear that it’s still in rude health: the latest court order for collecting data runs from April 25 to July 19.

A few observations. First, America is so conscious and proud of its history as a beacon of liberty that it often overlooks the tyranny that occurs on its own shores in the name of safeguarding democracy. The national security state has expanded to the point whereby it now functions outside of democratic control and with clear disregard for the Constitution.....

(Excerpt) Read more at blogs.telegraph.co.uk ...


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Editorial; Foreign Affairs; Government; War on Terror
KEYWORDS: 4thamendment; nsa; obama; spies; spy; verizon; wiretapping
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1 posted on 06/06/2013 1:03:39 PM PDT by 2ndDivisionVet
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

I want to be angry at the Telegraph for pointing out our hubris, but I just can’t. I want to point fingers at the Left for this, but I can’t even do that. So all I can do is eat my rage and frustration that this happened and most of the “citizenry” doesn’t even know much less care. “Land of the free home of the brave” indeed. My ulcers amd acid reflex are getting worse.


2 posted on 06/06/2013 1:07:43 PM PDT by mrsmel (One Who Can See)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Great piece! I read this paper, instead of American ones. Also the Daily Mail. Our MSM is a closed shop.


3 posted on 06/06/2013 1:07:46 PM PDT by stephenjohnbanker
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Just listening to Mark Levin on Neil Cavuto .
...he is very upset about this. .


4 posted on 06/06/2013 1:08:38 PM PDT by SE Mom (Proud mom of an Iraq war combat vet)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

They’re spot on. It is alarming.


5 posted on 06/06/2013 1:10:48 PM PDT by b4its2late (A Liberal is a person who will give away everything he doesn't own.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

1984 was published 64 years ago today.


6 posted on 06/06/2013 1:13:16 PM PDT by SE Mom (Proud mom of an Iraq war combat vet)
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To: SE Mom
If Levin's on TV, he's PO'd.

7 posted on 06/06/2013 1:13:30 PM PDT by b4its2late (A Liberal is a person who will give away everything he doesn't own.)
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To: b4its2late

Even the Obama-loving NYTIMES is running with these reports today. Wonder if the TIMES and WAPOST are beginning to see that by ignoring big stories that impact negatively on Obama in the past...may well have enabled him to do even more damage to the Constitution?

Nah...they don’t get it.


8 posted on 06/06/2013 1:14:11 PM PDT by kjo (+)
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To: kjo

You got that right.


9 posted on 06/06/2013 1:15:23 PM PDT by b4its2late (A Liberal is a person who will give away everything he doesn't own.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

10 posted on 06/06/2013 1:15:29 PM PDT by RC one
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To: b4its2late

Its just a pool of information(data&voice trans),we don’t monitor it,its just there incase we NEED to listen then we can”....

No F’en way shut this shit down


11 posted on 06/06/2013 1:16:01 PM PDT by CGASMIA68
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To: SE Mom

We should all be very upset about this.

The war on terror is over and Al-queada defeated....why then does the NSA want the phone records of millions of innocent Americans. It is becoming less and less necessary to get that roll of aluminum foil these days, especially in light of the IRS/tea party scandal.

Confidential communication by Americans it seems must now take place via snail mail ( at leas you can tell if they opened your letter) or smoke signals.


12 posted on 06/06/2013 1:16:23 PM PDT by longfellowsmuse (last of the living nomads)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
The origins of this particular order lie first in the 1978 Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act and then in Section 215 of the Patriot Act, backed by George W Bush...

If by "order" the author intends the court order that dropped the dragnet on a broad segment of the population who have nothing to do with terror, then it is a BS article.

As someone has argued elsewhere, this is a massive invasion into "being secure in their papers", etc.

Now the IRS is able to indentify and intimidate every American who may have contacted any of the various Tea Party groups. Or any other political group who might resist a totalitarian government.

13 posted on 06/06/2013 1:18:48 PM PDT by frog in a pot ("To each according to his need..." This from a guy who never had a real job and his family starved.)
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To: b4its2late

Exactly!!!


14 posted on 06/06/2013 1:20:06 PM PDT by SE Mom (Proud mom of an Iraq war combat vet)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

I doubt its limited to Verizon, in fact there have been numerous reports of all the carriers being involved with this.


15 posted on 06/06/2013 1:20:25 PM PDT by driftdiver (I could eat it raw, but why do that when I have a fire.)
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To: driftdiver

Goodbye Free America...we loved you.


16 posted on 06/06/2013 1:21:57 PM PDT by hal ogen (First Amendment or Reeducation Camp?)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

1. There is NO way that Verizon is the only company involved.

2. Do not forget the 80,000,000 medical records from CA, again we only know of these records.

3. Reporters phone records.

4. Tea Party IRS 501 (c) debacle.

What we are seeing is only the tip of the iceberg, we have already lost our liberty, we are all slaves to the collective, little worker bee’s having our earnings stolen from us to feed the fascist machine.


17 posted on 06/06/2013 1:22:49 PM PDT by stockpirate (F. Douglass, "A man's rights rest in three boxes: ballot box, jury box, and ammo box)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
Interesting, isn't it, how we can be living in 1984, the novel, and 1930's Germany at the same time?

All thanks to a narcissistic media selected-boy-king wannabe.

18 posted on 06/06/2013 1:25:47 PM PDT by jeffc (The U.S. media are our enemy)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet; null and void

Why, this sounds like some sort of nut-job conspiracy!

We’ll have to report you to the mods!

Drudge: “What Big Ears You Have”

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jun/06/nsa-phone-records-verizon-court-order

Drudge never misses an opportunity. No wonder he was a friend of Breitbart.

Read the comments at the article.


19 posted on 06/06/2013 1:26:26 PM PDT by F15Eagle (1Jn4:15;5:4-5,11-13;Mt27:50-54;Mk15:33-34;Jn3:17-18,6:69,11:25,14:6,20:31;Ro10:8-11;1Tm2:5-6;Ti3:4-7)
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To: stockpirate

No, as you said, it would not be just Verizon.


20 posted on 06/06/2013 1:27:27 PM PDT by F15Eagle (1Jn4:15;5:4-5,11-13;Mt27:50-54;Mk15:33-34;Jn3:17-18,6:69,11:25,14:6,20:31;Ro10:8-11;1Tm2:5-6;Ti3:4-7)
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To: stockpirate; All

So are we all just going to talk about it or are we going to do something about the new american police state?


21 posted on 06/06/2013 1:28:29 PM PDT by seeker41 (Take back your country before it is too late-STOP islamic expansion in the USA remove zero)
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To: longfellowsmuse

I’m really shocked. Not surprised though. I didn’t even love it when GWB did it but I think his scope was narrower too.

From what I gathered today this has been going on for seven years. My question is. .has this SPECIFIC program been that long? Have they had Verizon (and/or Sprint, AT&T) records that long?


22 posted on 06/06/2013 1:28:55 PM PDT by SE Mom (Proud mom of an Iraq war combat vet)
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To: SE Mom

I heard about it 10-12 years ago


23 posted on 06/06/2013 1:31:25 PM PDT by F15Eagle (1Jn4:15;5:4-5,11-13;Mt27:50-54;Mk15:33-34;Jn3:17-18,6:69,11:25,14:6,20:31;Ro10:8-11;1Tm2:5-6;Ti3:4-7)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

“Comments?”

Maybe this is why Obama wants a war with Syria so as to keep us distracted from what he’s doing at home.

‘Wag the Dog’.


24 posted on 06/06/2013 1:31:27 PM PDT by MeganC (You can take my gun when you can grab it with your cold, dead fingers.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Obama doesn’t need much more in his plan than a mustache and some shiny jackboots.


25 posted on 06/06/2013 1:32:14 PM PDT by SWAMPSNIPER (The Second Amendment, a Matter of Fact, Not a Matter of Opinion)
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To: mrsmel
So all I can do is eat my rage and frustration that this happened and most of the “citizenry” doesn’t even know much less care.

The founding fathers understood that an intelligent, informed and moral populace was needed for our Republic to succeed. And succeed it did for well over 200 years. But success comes at a price. Success breeds immorality, laziness and selfishness. World War 2 was the last event in our nation's history that required moral backbone, sacrifice and bravery in the face of hardship. Hurricane Katrina exposed the soft underbelly of America. We have lost our way.

The average American has no idea what has happened and what lies ahead. All we can do at this point is do our best to prepare our children and grandchildren to survive the horrors the future will bring.

I miss my freedom and pray I will have the strength of my convictions when duty calls.

26 posted on 06/06/2013 1:35:59 PM PDT by Senator_Blutarski
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To: seeker41

I would guess we are all waiting for the same thing.


27 posted on 06/06/2013 1:36:30 PM PDT by stockpirate (F. Douglass, "A man's rights rest in three boxes: ballot box, jury box, and ammo box)
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To: F15Eagle

This one - where they get millions of AMERICANS phone records? I knew we could go after foreigners ..and some specific #’s of Americans ..but I don’t think it was this sweeping.


28 posted on 06/06/2013 1:37:50 PM PDT by SE Mom (Proud mom of an Iraq war combat vet)
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To: SWAMPSNIPER

Don’t forget the snappy uniforms.


29 posted on 06/06/2013 1:38:53 PM PDT by F15Eagle (1Jn4:15;5:4-5,11-13;Mt27:50-54;Mk15:33-34;Jn3:17-18,6:69,11:25,14:6,20:31;Ro10:8-11;1Tm2:5-6;Ti3:4-7)
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To: MeganC

“‘Wag the Dog’.”

When the MSM runs with it you know it was planted by the administration.

They want everything off the front pages except for this. Then they can say Bush did it too so no big deal.

They are also pulling an Alinsky on congress. They are overloading them with scandals that will go absolutely no where.

Wake up Issa. All you have to do tomorrow morning is go on national television and announce that some of the phone records match up with Tea Party groups and Republican donors. Tell them it was given to him by someone in the administration.

Whether true or not, it’s time to play by liberal rules.


30 posted on 06/06/2013 1:40:36 PM PDT by EQAndyBuzz (The reason we own guns is to protect ourselves from those wanting to take our guns from us.)
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To: stockpirate

I suppose we are, lol

Where is a leader who will consolidate us like minded folks. Does one exist?


31 posted on 06/06/2013 1:40:39 PM PDT by seeker41 (Take back your country before it is too late-STOP islamic expansion in the USA remove zero)
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To: SE Mom
Yep. A lot of folks were discussing it. It's not just records of who called who. Listen, we caught Ramzi Yousef ordering a pizza, in Pakistan, I think. From his voice print that he was (thank God) stupid enough to leave from a pay phone bragging about the 1993 WTC attack before he left the country.

Warning: small amount of bad language but these days this would be PG-13.

watch the very end if this 1997 movie - but don't jump ahead - watch the whole thing
32 posted on 06/06/2013 1:43:29 PM PDT by F15Eagle (1Jn4:15;5:4-5,11-13;Mt27:50-54;Mk15:33-34;Jn3:17-18,6:69,11:25,14:6,20:31;Ro10:8-11;1Tm2:5-6;Ti3:4-7)
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To: EQAndyBuzz

I think it is more likely that they want all the folks who have the goods on this admin that they know who they are and where they are and know all about who they love and who they would not want dead. It is a threat. Just like all the things this admin does. They are evil to the core. And paranoid to the core.


33 posted on 06/06/2013 1:43:53 PM PDT by petitfour
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Verizon provides phone service to government. Therefore both cell and land phones of Congress, SCOTUS , Pentagon , CIA were included in the blanket surveillance !


34 posted on 06/06/2013 1:51:44 PM PDT by hoosiermama (Obama: "Born in Kenya" Lying now or then!)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

The Founders formed Committees of Correspondence to spread the word without alerting the Redcoats.

Do we have anything similar today — secure communications? If not, we’re going to have one hell of a tough time opposing Tyranny in the years ahead.


35 posted on 06/06/2013 1:52:24 PM PDT by DNME (Tired of being polite? Bring back the Sons of Liberty!)
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To: driftdiver

Verizon was subject to a subpoena. Likely some of the other carriers gave this up even without the subpoena.


36 posted on 06/06/2013 1:58:20 PM PDT by Buckeye McFrog
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To: jeffc

With a touch of Brave New World as well. Everybody’s on their Soma. Pills for depression, anxiety, sleeping, ADHD, etc.


37 posted on 06/06/2013 2:05:07 PM PDT by EEGator
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To: SE Mom

“1984 was published 64 years ago today.”

We are so in that book now. Add no privacy on the phone now - calls are monitored by Holder and fellow devils.


38 posted on 06/06/2013 2:05:24 PM PDT by Marcella (Prepping can save your life today. I am a Christian, not a Muslim.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Revolt is coming.


39 posted on 06/06/2013 2:06:20 PM PDT by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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To: mrsmel

Now it’s land of the free stuff and home of the depraved.


40 posted on 06/06/2013 2:07:16 PM PDT by SVTCobra03 (You can never have enough friends, horsepower or ammunition.)
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To: Senator_Blutarski

Revolt is coming.


41 posted on 06/06/2013 2:07:55 PM PDT by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Heck, the comments at the bottom of the piece are better than anything we can write here...gotta love the Brits, at least the Conservative ones.


42 posted on 06/06/2013 2:08:38 PM PDT by Timber Rattler (Just say NO! to RINOS and the GOP-E)
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To: F15Eagle

Yes. .I remember that. Yousef is a terrorist I have NO problem with that or possibly some Americans after showing cause. I do NOT remember a discussion about millions of Americans phone records being taken as a matter of national security.


43 posted on 06/06/2013 2:13:51 PM PDT by SE Mom (Proud mom of an Iraq war combat vet)
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To: SVTCobra03

Sadly but well said.


44 posted on 06/06/2013 2:29:10 PM PDT by mrsmel (One Who Can See)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Great article. As has been asked numerous times, why does a British paper always have the good stories? We all know.

But at the end, when the author listed the scandals, he forgot one: Fast & Furious. Has that been relegated to the trash heap of history?


45 posted on 06/06/2013 2:46:50 PM PDT by qaz123
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

We need to minimize DOJ funding, NSA funding, and IRS funding, down to the bare bones. We need to have many, many officials of these agencies referred for prosecution, including Holder and Holder’s boss.


46 posted on 06/06/2013 2:47:16 PM PDT by TBP (Obama lies, Granny dies.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

How much longer?


47 posted on 06/06/2013 2:53:47 PM PDT by Old Yeller
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To: seeker41
Where is a leader who will consolidate us like minded folks. Does one exist?

Yep. But Karl Rove hates her guts. So we can't do that, we have to wait on Big Karl, and Big Karl says 'no'.

I'm going to laugh my ass off when Rove has to catch a garbage scow to the Cayman Islands one step ahead of the scrubbed, reformed IRS.

48 posted on 06/06/2013 3:41:00 PM PDT by lentulusgracchus
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To: frog in a pot
Now the IRS is able to indentify and intimidate every American who may have contacted any of the various Tea Party groups. Or any other political group who might resist a totalitarian government.

Exactly.

"So Mr. Frog, our records indicate you made two calls to a local "tea party" group last month. Before we start going over your allowable deductions, would you mind explaining to us exactly what it was you were talking about?"

 

49 posted on 06/06/2013 6:08:48 PM PDT by zeugma (Those of us who work for a living are outnumbered by those who vote for a living.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

His comments that we conservatives applauded Bush’s totalitarianism is just out and out wrong. We were complaining to high heaven about it, but our representatives were doing nothing about it. Not all republicans are conservative...need we discuss that on this site? NO! There are fewer and fewer of them all the time until recently, as Sarah Palin has been helping to find some great people to run for office. Otherwise, it was a good article. Honestly, the “people” (sheeple) are doing exactly what the democrats have been leading them to do. Entertain themselves to death and send their kids off to the public school for totalitarian indoctrination. It’s working! Now we get American Idol for the presidency instead of a vetted, true-blooded American. Yes, it is our fault. We love our way of life so much that we sit back and enjoy all our forms of entertainment and let someone else fight for our country. Not working out so well, is it? Still praying that America wakes up, but even with all the crap going down, how many will truly (if they are able) do anything, participate in rallies, write letters demanding change, etc.? I’m afraid it is too few, to be honest. Obama laughs this off. He knows he is going to finish his term.


50 posted on 06/06/2013 8:41:09 PM PDT by Shery (in APO Land)
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