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Experts: 'Treason' a Tough Sell in Edward Snowden Case
politico.com ^ | 6/13/13 | LEIGH MUNSIL

Posted on 06/13/2013 5:05:24 AM PDT by BarnacleCenturion

Edward Snowden has been called a “traitor” and accused of “treason” for his leaks of some of the nation’s top secrets.

But is there a case for the T-words?

Treason is a crime so old that it’s the only one specifically defined in the U.S. Constitution, but legal experts suggest it’s a charge that Snowden will most likely never face. And “traitor” seems to fit better in the world of Benedict Arnold and dueling pistols than in today’s sea of electronic surveillance and top secret security clearances.

Constitutionally, treason is defined as “whoever, owing allegiance to the United States, levies war against them or adheres to their enemies, giving them aid and comfort within the United States or elsewhere.”

That’s a tough sell in Snowden’s case, legal experts say. “I do not believe it is treason,” said George Washington University law professor Jonathan Turley. “There is nothing to suggest that his motivation was to assist our enemies or a foreign power.”

(Excerpt) Read more at politico.com ...


TOPICS: Front Page News; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS:
It's not surprising at all that the same morons who ignore the fourth amendment also ignore the constitutional definition of treason.
1 posted on 06/13/2013 5:05:24 AM PDT by BarnacleCenturion
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To: BarnacleCenturion

So when do we charge Leaky Leahy with treason? He actually told the enemy something he didn’t know.


2 posted on 06/13/2013 5:08:11 AM PDT by cripplecreek (REMEMBER THE RIVER RAISIN!)
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To: BarnacleCenturion
It's not surprising at all that the same morons who ignore the fourth amendment also ignore the constitutional definition of treason.

I guess the Founders were also guilty of treason then. If a government gets out of control, it is the DUTY of the People to resist it. Like the guy or hate him - he points out a government that oversteps.

3 posted on 06/13/2013 5:14:31 AM PDT by trebb (Where in the the hell has my country gone?)
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To: BarnacleCenturion
-"Constitutionally, treason is defined as “whoever, owing allegiance to the United States, levies war against them or adheres to their enemies, giving them aid and comfort within the United States or elsewhere.

So. Did Feinstein or Obama defined this to Major Nidal Malik Hasan

4 posted on 06/13/2013 5:18:13 AM PDT by LibFreeUSA
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To: LibFreeUSA

Work place violence don’t you know!

Let me see, whom are we at war with right now? There is no terror war, we won according to the Pansy in Chief. I bet he is tieing himself into a prezel trying to worm his wormy way around that one.


5 posted on 06/13/2013 5:22:46 AM PDT by Mouton (108th MI Group.....68-71)
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To: BarnacleCenturion

This administration charging anyone outside of it with treason is a joke; I would counter-sue.


6 posted on 06/13/2013 5:23:13 AM PDT by NRA1995 (I'd rather be a living "gun culture" member than a dead anti-gun candy-ass.)
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To: trebb

The saddest part is that so many usually smart people have gone full stupid on this issue.

Michelle Malkin was just jabbering about how the NSA is protecting us from terrorism. She knows its crap because we have a wide open border and a pro muslim immigration policies.


7 posted on 06/13/2013 5:24:12 AM PDT by cripplecreek (REMEMBER THE RIVER RAISIN!)
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To: cripplecreek

> That’s a tough sell in Snowden’s case, legal experts say. “I do not believe it is treason,” said George Washington University law professor Jonathan Turley. “There is nothing to suggest that his motivation was to assist our enemies or a foreign power.”

Because his motive had nothing to do with treason. He was trying to wake the American people up to what’s happening to their freedom and liberties.
As predicted we knew there’d be spin control. No, we don’t spy on the American people like “that”. We don’t monitor your phone calls, texts, emails, or credit transactions unless you get flagged for some reason. Right. Thats not what numerous articles and news reports have said about the Bluffdale facility. We knew they’d paint Snowden as a traitor and say he divulged national secrets to our enemies. You know I keep hearing this BS and they have never said what secrets or to which enemy. It’s BS; mindless political phrasing and posturing to paint him as an uneducated rogue element that intends to do harm to the federal government. If he’s so uneducated, why’d you hire him in the first place. Maybe because he had a pencil talent or gift that they could exploit and use to their benefit. BTW it doesnt appear that so many of the college educated are any more intelligent than their counterparts; they just have a hell of a large student loan to pay back nd no one will hire them. Meanwhile there are hackers that never attended college that can run circles around them on an intellectual level...


8 posted on 06/13/2013 5:26:16 AM PDT by jsanders2001
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To: BarnacleCenturion

Something is not right about the Snowden affair.

But, when the MSM, the Dems and the GOPelite are all on the same page — calling Snowden a traitor, etc. — that stinks even more.

Regarding the Dems/GOPe, I get the impression that they are afraid, for personal reasons — perhaps offshore bank accounts, etc. — of what Snowden might release.

Throw a rock over a fence into a pig pen and the pig that squeals the loudest is the one who got hit.

There is a lot of squealing going on in Washington regard what Snowden might have.


9 posted on 06/13/2013 5:27:58 AM PDT by TomGuy (.)
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To: jsanders2001

Because his motive had nothing to do with treason. He was trying to wake the American people up to what’s happening to their freedom and liberties.
As predicted we knew there’d be spin control. No, we don’t spy on the American people like “that”. We don’t monitor your phone calls, texts, emails, or credit transactions unless you get flagged for some reason. Right. Thats not what numerous articles and news reports have said about the Bluffdale facility. We knew they’d paint Snowden as a traitor and say he divulged national secrets to our enemies. You know I keep hearing this BS and they have never said what secrets or to which enemy. It’s BS; mindless political phrasing and posturing to paint him as an uneducated rogue element that intends to do harm to the federal government. If he’s so uneducated, why’d you hire him in the first place? Maybe because he had a particular talent or gift that they could exploit and use to their benefit? BTW it doesnt appear that so many of the college educated are any more intelligent than their counterparts; they just have a hell of a large student loan to pay back nd no one will hire them. Meanwhile there are hackers that never attended college that can run circles around them on an intellectual level...


10 posted on 06/13/2013 5:28:17 AM PDT by jsanders2001
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To: BarnacleCenturion
Strange, they use Snowden and treason together like bread and butter while Zippy is supplying arms and money to al Qaeda.

But, we all know Christian American citzens are the "real" enemy.

11 posted on 06/13/2013 5:41:44 AM PDT by BerryDingle (I know how to deal with communists, I still wear their scars on my back from Hollywood-Ronald Reagan)
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To: BarnacleCenturion

Well he is now divulging spying on China and hacking operations and claims to have evidence he can release. No need to worry about legalities. Hire someone to find him and take him out.


12 posted on 06/13/2013 5:51:17 AM PDT by plain talk
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To: TomGuy

These same MF people who just approved John Kerry Secretary of State have the gall to call anyone a Traitor.

This same garbage that wants to give our country to illegals call someone else a traitor?

The tree of liberty needs watering.


13 posted on 06/13/2013 5:56:46 AM PDT by Venturer
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To: cripplecreek
Michelle Malkin was just jabbering about how the NSA is protecting us from terrorism. She knows its crap because we have a wide open border and a pro muslim immigration policies

We're talking about an agency that is most likely recording and storing almost every phone conversation, text and email for review and use at anytime. Do you seriously think a lot of these people have not already been "enlisted" to subtly spin this story in a certain direction? Anyone who goes too far off script gets a stiff jerk on their chain to get them to heel. You think it was a coincidence that limbaugh got into legal trouble for oxys just days after he had dick cheney on his shoe and told him he was wrong on amnesty? You think it was a coincidence that he ran into the viagra at the airport problem not long after complainin on air that he was made to carry water for people who didn't desrve it right after the 2006 elections? The big media guys are the establishments bitches. Well paid bitches, but bitches nonetheless.

14 posted on 06/13/2013 5:57:14 AM PDT by Orangedog (An optimist is someone who tells you to 'cheer up' when things are going his way)
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To: Orangedog
Anyone who goes too far off script gets a stiff jerk on their chain to get them to heel.

Speaking of that, I saw Judge Napolitano cut off by a commercial on FOX this morning. It wasn't the tail end of a comment, it was the beginning of an answer the hosts (who are aware of commercial breaks) asked.
15 posted on 06/13/2013 6:02:16 AM PDT by cripplecreek (REMEMBER THE RIVER RAISIN!)
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To: cripplecreek
So when do we charge Leaky Leahy with treason? He actually told the enemy something he didn’t know.

There is no basis to charge anyone from Congress or the Senate, they don't require security clearances once a "need to know" is established based on their function, so no former oath or signature of an oath was ever sworn for evidence, to "safeguard" our nations defense. Heck, you could put a foreigner in the Oval office with those prerequisites!

16 posted on 06/13/2013 6:02:16 AM PDT by BerryDingle (I know how to deal with communists, I still wear their scars on my back from Hollywood-Ronald Reagan)
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To: Venturer
We should be enraged at the pure cost of this alone.

NSA Leaker's Former Employer Makes $5.8 Billion Almost Entirely Off Taxpayers

That's one company of hundreds we're paying.
17 posted on 06/13/2013 6:10:58 AM PDT by cripplecreek (REMEMBER THE RIVER RAISIN!)
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To: cripplecreek

What was the question? How much of the answer did he get out? I got rid of my cable tv years ago when (1 of many reasons) I came to see that the McNews channels were really little more than stenographers for the establishment. No critical thinking, no digging deeper, just repeating what bureaucrats and politicians tell them.


18 posted on 06/13/2013 6:12:26 AM PDT by Orangedog (An optimist is someone who tells you to 'cheer up' when things are going his way)
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To: Orangedog

I didn’t fully catch the question but it was an odd cutoff, enough so that it caught my attention.


19 posted on 06/13/2013 6:17:25 AM PDT by cripplecreek (REMEMBER THE RIVER RAISIN!)
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To: Orangedog

Excellent comment and quite true.


20 posted on 06/13/2013 6:30:43 AM PDT by Luke21
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To: BerryDingle

There’s no mention of “security clearances” or “oath” in the definition of treason posted above. There can be no question that many in the House and Senate since 2001 have given aid and comfort to the enemy with their words, actions, and inactions on various bills passed and defeated over the years. The matter of “adheres to their enemies” is apparently the threshold they haven’t crossed in as obvious a way.


21 posted on 06/13/2013 7:15:31 AM PDT by jiggyboy (Ten percent of poll respondents are either lying or insane)
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To: TomGuy

“...Throw a rock over a fence into a pig pen and the pig that squeals the loudest is the one who got hit...”

Seriously, THE best description of Washington DC I have seen in a long time. Excellent.

Hat tip to you, brother.


22 posted on 06/13/2013 8:35:14 AM PDT by NFHale (The Second Amendment - By Any Means Necessary.)
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To: trebb
I guess the Founders were also guilty of treason then.

Oh, the founding fathers of USA were most definitely guilty of treason against their lawful government, each and every one of them liable to hang had they failed. The Only reason they got away with it was that they succeeded, thus fulfilling the old epigram:

Treason doth never prosper: what's the reason?
Why if it prosper, none dare call it treason.
--Sir John Harington, Of Treason--Epigrams (bk. IV, ep. V)

If a government gets out of control, it is the DUTY of the People to resist it. Like the guy or hate him - he points out a government that oversteps.

Indeed. Whether Snowden is a hero or a traitor has no bearing on the (il)legitimacy of the NSA program he revealed.
23 posted on 06/13/2013 9:09:25 AM PDT by MirrorField (Just an opinion from atheist, minarchist and small-l libertarian.)
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To: BarnacleCenturion
Snowden is clearly lying, and now giving away our secrets to the Chinese. So yes, traitor fits.
24 posted on 06/13/2013 9:17:27 AM PDT by Sam Gamgee (May God have mercy upon my enemies, because I won't. - Patton)
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To: Orangedog; cripplecreek

I don’t give two sh!ts about ‘terrorism’ (exactly because of the open borders, visas like candy, Boston, etc.).

What I DO care about, and nobody is singing the praises...is the total abuse of the 4th Amendment. Another law/department that COMPLETELY runs rough-shod, but because they can dress it up in lipstick, they think they can sell me the pig?!

Bastards, each and every one of them.


25 posted on 06/13/2013 9:29:56 AM PDT by i_robot73 (We hold that all individuals have the Right to exercise sole dominion over their own lives - LP.org)
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To: cripplecreek

If the NSA is spying on people, Malkin and people like her would be high on the list. So, how many of these people who call Snowden a traitor are afraid of what the NSA knows about them?


26 posted on 06/13/2013 11:31:15 AM PDT by VerySadAmerican
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To: MirrorField
Indeed. Whether Snowden is a hero or a traitor has no bearing on the (il)legitimacy of the NSA program he revealed.

I agree with everything you said, BUT it is a program that the powers that be are using against the People and he merely corroborated what most of us already knew. Just because it's a law, doesn't make it legal. If it's illegal, then we really should know and the guy did us a favor. The same folks who claim it needed to remain secret because it "protects" us are those who ignored ample information and allowed the Boston bomber(s) free rein to do their damage.

27 posted on 06/13/2013 2:04:31 PM PDT by trebb (Where in the the hell has my country gone?)
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To: TomGuy

Snowden was a unwilling player in a multi-year program by the Chinese to turn him. This guy was active in forums, and got very active in the last year or two with privacy of data and the government use of the data collected.

The timing of this is what ties Snowden to the Chinese....the week prior to the Palm Springs meeting with Obama.

It may take six months, but Snowden will eventually come around to realize that he was used, and I think his belief in all his efforts as helping liberty....will fall apart.


28 posted on 06/15/2013 8:26:16 AM PDT by pepsionice
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