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Rand Paul Defends: 'Mr. Snowden Told the Truth in the Name of Privacy'
Weekly Standard ^ | 6/23/13 | DANIEL HALPER

Posted on 06/23/2013 12:09:10 PM PDT by Nachum

"They're going to contrast the behavior of James Clapper, our national intelligence director, with Edward Snowden," said Paul. "Mr. Clapper lied in Congress in defiance of the law in the name of security. Mr. Snowden told the truth in the name of privacy."

Paul continued: "So I think there will be a judgment because both of them broke the law, and history will have to determine."

But the senator suggested his opinion of Snowden could change. "I do think for Mr. Snowden, if he cozies up to the Russian government, it will be nothing but bad for his name in history. If he goes to an independent third country like Iceland and if refuses to talk to any sort of formal government about this, I think there's a chance that he'll be seen as an advocate of privacy.

(Excerpt) Read more at weeklystandard.com ...


TOPICS: News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: defends; paul; rand; snowden
Vid at link
1 posted on 06/23/2013 12:09:10 PM PDT by Nachum
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To: Nachum

This means the Russians are not going to let him leave.

They wouldn’t want to miss out on Obama’s “flexibility”.


2 posted on 06/23/2013 12:11:00 PM PDT by FreedomStar3028
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To: FreedomStar3028
This means the Russians are not going to let him leave.

Oh, I think the Russians will do whatever gets them the most milage. They have all sorts of options to milk.... and enjoying every second of it.

3 posted on 06/23/2013 12:12:39 PM PDT by Nachum (The Obama "List" at www.nachumlist.com)
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To: Nachum

Remember the good ol days during Bush when whistle blowers were heroes? Poor commies continue to show their hypocrisy.

Pray for America to Wake up


4 posted on 06/23/2013 12:16:51 PM PDT by bray (Stop tolerating beheading!)
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To: Nachum

The guy is a traitor. Look where he is and where he’s been.


5 posted on 06/23/2013 12:16:58 PM PDT by TheRhinelander
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To: TheRhinelander
The guy is a traitor. Look where he is and where he’s been.

Yup, Snowden is a traitor who will wind up hiding out in socialist/communist Venezuela or Ecuador. The sad thing is how many people right here on FR have been defending and supporting him. It's just been disgusting to watch.

The fact that Rand defends Snowden is no surprise. Rand is much more like his father than he lets on - and his father believes gender confused Bradley Manning is a hero and patriot.

6 posted on 06/23/2013 12:26:17 PM PDT by Longbow1969
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To: Nachum

http://definitions.uslegal.com/d/dirty-hands-doctrine/

Dirty Hands Doctrine Law & Legal Definition

Dirty hands doctrine refers to an equitable defense available to a defendant against the plaintiff. In this defense, the defendant can claim that the plaintiff should not be granted relief because the plaintiff has acted in bad faith regarding the subject matter of the complaint. A person is abstained from receiving equitable relief when s/he acts in bad faith or in an unethical manner. The rule embodied in this doctrine is that the participant in a wrongful act may not recover damages resulting from it. Generally it is the defendant who claims the defense; hence, the burden of proof is on the defendant to show that the plaintiff is not acting in good faith. This doctrine is also known as the unclean hands doctrine.
....................................................
IOW: Clapper lied in his March 2013 testimony. He is the Gubmint (plaintiff) with dirty hands.


7 posted on 06/23/2013 12:27:32 PM PDT by sodpoodle (Life is prickly - carry tweezers.)
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To: TheRhinelander

Snowden only betrayed Obama and his commie followers. They will no doubt try to have him killed for this. Snowden took an oath to protect and defend the constitution so he had no choice but to do what he did.


8 posted on 06/23/2013 12:31:30 PM PDT by BarnacleCenturion
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To: Longbow1969
“Yup, Snowden is a traitor who will wind up hiding out in socialist/communist Venezuela or Ecuador. The sad thing is how many people right here on FR have been defending and supporting him. It's just been disgusting to watch.”

People who have an insatiable desire to read other people's mail—be that person Hussein Obama or anyone else including FP control freaks are just ordinary PeepingToms!

9 posted on 06/23/2013 12:31:49 PM PDT by texican01
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To: sodpoodle

Something that I have been thinking about today, Petraeus worked under the NSA. I am wondering if that story about the FBI search of Petraeus’ emails was entirely truthful. It just seems very coincidental that he was taken down by exposing his private emails.


10 posted on 06/23/2013 12:33:10 PM PDT by Eva
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To: Longbow1969

No, whats disc=gusting is people like you that cried and cried on FR for someone on the inside to expose the BS in the admin, then when someone did, turned on a dime screaming TRAITOR! and thus ensuring no one will ever do it again.

And idiots wonder why conservatives can’t be trusted to stand for squat anymore.


11 posted on 06/23/2013 12:34:19 PM PDT by Norm Lenhart
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To: Eva

Petraeus was pulled into the Administration as a ‘token’. He probably took the job believing he could serve the US’.

Too bad he didn’t know that he had already been ‘profiled’ and set up for a fall if he ‘disappointed’ his superior.

Perhaps he was ready to blow a few whistles himself - then they pulled the plug.


12 posted on 06/23/2013 12:39:49 PM PDT by sodpoodle (Life is prickly - carry tweezers.)
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To: Nachum
This isn't black and white. I don't believe one word the government claims as truth and I don't know enough to make a judgment. That is the way life is in America today.
13 posted on 06/23/2013 12:44:24 PM PDT by jwalsh07
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To: Longbow1969

Snowden did America a service


14 posted on 06/23/2013 12:46:27 PM PDT by The Wizard (Madam President is my President now and in the future)
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To: Norm Lenhart

Dick Cheney still has a huge FR following.

Have discussed Edward Snowden’s situation with family and we determined that if this 29 year-old wanted to spy for a foreign enemy he would have done so and kept his mouth shut.

We believe he truly wanted to scream the truth from a mountain-top but realized that he had no-one at the NSA, or in Congress who would help him. He probably snapped when Clapper lied to Congress - took a short-cut to Hong-Kong and spilled his secrets. Not smart - just scared and out of ideas.


15 posted on 06/23/2013 12:50:39 PM PDT by sodpoodle (Life is prickly - carry tweezers.)
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To: sodpoodle

Pretty much how I see t too.

We decided lesser evils in the GOP were OK so he had nowhere he could trust to go. All the people screaming TRAITOR need to publicly state they would trust turning their lives/future over to this GOP to protect if they think he’s such a traitor. If they can’t even take the well deserved mockery they get from us then it’s self evident that Snowden had a point.

It ain’t Reagan’s party anymore.


16 posted on 06/23/2013 12:56:37 PM PDT by Norm Lenhart
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To: sodpoodle

“Dick Cheney still has a huge FR following.”

Cheney hijacked the Bush presidency and is the main reason why Obama got elected.

He is the guy who said that deficits don’t matter, who pushed for wars to create democracies in the muslin world, who was for gay marriage before Obama was, etc.. The list goes on and on. Anybody who follows Dick Cheney is no better than a lib.


17 posted on 06/23/2013 12:59:37 PM PDT by BarnacleCenturion
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To: Norm Lenhart

Good points....

We now have some goods on Obama.....and....poof......they all become Obama Supporters

I doubt this Snowden guy has any info other than the NSA were spying on Americans. The overreacting by Obama and his Supporters now has given our enemies a chance to make Obama squirm


18 posted on 06/23/2013 1:13:07 PM PDT by SeminoleCounty (Don't Blame Me For La Raza Rubio....I Voted For Alex Snitker)
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To: Norm Lenhart
No, whats disgusting is people like you that cried and cried on FR for someone on the inside to expose the BS in the admin, then when someone did, turned on a dime screaming TRAITOR! and thus ensuring no one will ever do it again.

Actually, the way they treated Snowden guarantees more Snowdens. Snowden et. al. want the abuse of privacy stopped and the outlaw US Government is doing everything it can to let them know it wont stop. Thus, we need dozens more Snowdens. Normally I do not like to let the statist know they are failing, but now the statist are just plain acting criminally.

19 posted on 06/23/2013 1:17:05 PM PDT by justa-hairyape
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To: justa-hairyape

I wish//hope that’s true. But they now see that no one has their back and they will basically become informational suicide bombers.


20 posted on 06/23/2013 1:24:32 PM PDT by Norm Lenhart
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To: Nachum

Snowden blew it. After his leaks, he should have turned himself in with press in tow and said he was ready to face any punishment in an attempt save his country from tyranny.

The public uproar would have been massive and influential on the govt.

Now he’s got no path forward that’s any good, and he’s in danger from not only the US govt, but every govt he approaches for succor.

Snowden is about to get an education on the George Will’s Law:

“America is an imperfect country surrounded by atrocious countries.”


21 posted on 06/23/2013 1:30:52 PM PDT by SaxxonWoods (....Let It Burn...)
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To: Norm Lenhart
Not true. 9/10's of the worlds population has their backs. The US government is fast making itself into an international criminal regime.
22 posted on 06/23/2013 1:33:55 PM PDT by justa-hairyape
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To: Nachum

The traitors are the ones in violation of the US Constitution.

These traitors are found in the Obama administration, the Federal depts, the intel agencies, the courts, most of congress, much of the media, and some right here on FR who only use the Constitution as it suits them.

There has already been a coup d’etat and this administration has corrupted the military, the courts, the intel/surveillance agencies and all the Federal depts. The Constitution means nothing to these “we are building a better society” scum.

The only thing that smells about Snowden is the blood of the US Constitution and freedoms it guarantees us against a corrupt govt.


23 posted on 06/23/2013 3:00:06 PM PDT by free_life (If you ask Jesus to forgive you and to save you, He will.)
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To: Nachum

Snowden saw his oath to protect secrets as being in conflict with his oath to uphold the Constitution. From that perspective, he chose the Constitution.


24 posted on 06/23/2013 3:05:02 PM PDT by TBP (Obama lies, Granny dies.)
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To: Longbow1969
Yup, Snowden is a traitor

Not yet he ain't. The program he disclosed is unconstitutional and damaging to our liberty. There are other means of fighting terrorism than recording the lives of American citizens.

25 posted on 06/23/2013 3:42:06 PM PDT by BfloGuy (The Eurozone policy might best be described as "Laurel and Hardy Carry a Piano Upstairs.")
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To: Norm Lenhart

“We decided lesser evils in the GOP were OK so he had nowhere he could trust to go.”

Agreed. I think the only people hurt by Snowden is the ruling class elite. We now know a little more about how they manipulate us and the world.


26 posted on 06/23/2013 3:54:35 PM PDT by Jay Redhawk (Zombies are just intelligent, good looking democrats.)
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To: TheRhinelander

This guy needs a medal of honor. Thanks to him we know all about the extent of the NSA spying. I for one at least want to know the police state is in place.


27 posted on 06/23/2013 4:59:32 PM PDT by Georgia Girl 2 (The only purpose of a pistol is to fight your way back to the rifle you should never have dropped.)
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To: TheRhinelander

“The guy is a traitor. Look where he is and where he’s been.”

PS: The traitors are in the Whitehouse and the Congress selling us down the river even as we speak.


28 posted on 06/23/2013 5:01:38 PM PDT by Georgia Girl 2 (The only purpose of a pistol is to fight your way back to the rifle you should never have dropped.)
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To: TheRhinelander
My POV on this NSA circus.

The reason Edward Snowden himself has been made the distraction by the NSA is but for ONE SIMPLE reason.

Snowden has REVEALED to the American Public what is ALREADY UNCLASSIFIED information. He called attention to what was going on behind the curtain.

The NSA is ANGRY because the public was supposed to stay unaware and naive' enjoying their "bread & circuses" while the NSA infirnged on your Constitutional Rights. Snowden threw a turd into their punchbowl.

As my longtime friend, a very good Internet security expert, who posted the following told me directly after I stated to him via the phone
that "it appears you released MORE information than Edward Snowden:"

His response:

I wrote that days ago, but sat on it thinking about just that. The key is what I wrote is NOT classified information. It is freely available on telco specs, if you know where to look.

I'm not sure that matters to some people, but it is what it is.

This from an individual who is a former Emergency Response Engineer for Lucent Technologies.
He helped to construct part of the network he describes.

Read his full post for yourself if you want to know WHAT is going on with your cellphone RIGHT NOW and has been, long before Edward Snowden.:

http://slashdot.org/~chill/journal/430067

29 posted on 06/23/2013 5:04:51 PM PDT by VideoDoctor
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To: Norm Lenhart

If he is exposing what he believes to be government abuse of our privacy, why is he running his mouth about what kind of surveillance the NSA is doing in China?

Does he want to protect China’s privacy, too?


30 posted on 06/23/2013 7:29:29 PM PDT by TheGipperWasRight
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To: TheGipperWasRight

So I assume you believe that the multiple public reports of China hacking military computers and backdoored hardware chips in mission critical equipment resulted in China obtaining nothing greater than porn site visitation records for govt employees?

If you think they didn’t know far more than a low level schmuck to begin with, I have no hope for you.


31 posted on 06/23/2013 7:43:28 PM PDT by Norm Lenhart
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To: TheGipperWasRight

And if he was such a treasure trove of data they DIDN’T ALREADY HAVE, why exactly did they put him on a plane and LET HIM GO? You think they downloaded his brain into the latest Chinese pirated hard drive?

Sometimes things are so obvious...but people with religious conviction to the guilt of ‘the traitor’ can’t be swayed by logical argument.


32 posted on 06/23/2013 7:47:23 PM PDT by Norm Lenhart
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To: Norm Lenhart

He revealed that we have been spying on Chinese telecoms and digital network hubs, as well as what the British have been up to with their own surveillance program.

Whether they already knew this or not, it doesn’t matter. He flew to Hong Kong and started blabbing about classified intelligence info to a country that while not an official enemy, doesn’t care much for us.

Why they didn’t keep him, I don’t know.

If you want to make him into a modern day Paul Revere, be my guest.

This thing stinks to high heaven, and I can only hope he doesn’t get so intoxicated by his own importance that he keeps blabbing about stuff not related to his supposed purpose of protecting the privacy of American citizens.


33 posted on 06/23/2013 8:31:57 PM PDT by TheGipperWasRight
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To: Georgia Girl 2

“This guy needs a medal of honor. Thanks to him we know all about the extent of the NSA spying. I for one at least want to know the police state is in place.”

Absolutely! Sure, we could say everybody suspected they had this level of information on each of us, but to have that confirmed as fact, is quite frightening.

Obamacare starts in 90+ days.... What could go wrong?


34 posted on 06/23/2013 9:32:11 PM PDT by Bshaw (A nefarious deceit is upon us all!)
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To: TheGipperWasRight

“Whether they already knew this or not, it doesn’t matter.”

Ya see it actually does if words are to continue meaning things. If I said to you that Free Republic was started by a conservative guy to further conservatism, would I be revealing that to you? Is it some national secret? Nope.

I swear that some Americans are the only people on the planet that didn’t know we spy on every other country. Their Biebers are utterly stuned that we have govt agencies doing exactly that.

The only revealing Snowden did is to people who live in fantasyland. And they are shocked (Shocked I tell you!) by it.

Why on earth are you so upset by the discovery? I knew. Most of FR knew. Most of OWS knew. DU knew, the guy at the bar knew. Yankee Stadium knew. In all likelihood, dogs in the pound knew and were barking about it trying to tell clueless humans about it whenever they checked their cages.

China knew, Russia knew all the worlds leaders and governors of the 57 American stater knew. But a few Americans, who I think all came to FR to spaz about it were sans clue.

So since all these men and beasts ‘knew’ (and yes, since telecom/IT people have freely and openly discussed details for years, people KNEW.) it cannot be said he ‘revealed’ squat and a case be made for it if the word is to retain any meaning.

Now as to Paul Revering him, I didn’t do that. In fact I have said he may YET turn out to be the traitor you claim he is. But that moment has not yet happened. As of now all he is is a guy that did what conservatives begged anyone on the inside to do before they became liberals and stabbed him in the back for doing it.


35 posted on 06/24/2013 5:06:20 AM PDT by Norm Lenhart
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To: Norm Lenhart

I was never under the impression that our government wasn’t spying on just about every nation on Earth, including our allies. I also knew that with the cloud of data that we generate, it would be a very tempting target for them to tap into.

What bothers me is some of the specifics he said about spying in regards to some of their internet hubs, and a university. They very well may have known we did it, but it didn’t help for him to confirm it.

For example, I know the Air Force likely has a vehicle that we have no idea exists, with amazing speed and capabilities. It is a different matter for a government employee (current or former) to acknowledge it.

I’m not crazy about his choice of hideout locations, either.

I may turn out to be wrong. He may have good intentions, and ultimately help awaken the American people. I just have a bad feeling about him. The whole thing seems odd.


36 posted on 06/24/2013 4:36:12 PM PDT by TheGipperWasRight
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