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Hundreds get gun permits despite Conn. cops' rejection
PoliceOne / The Hartford Courant ^ | June 23, 2013 | Matthew Kauffman and Dave Altimari

Posted on 06/24/2013 5:53:47 PM PDT by 2ndDivisionVet

When Jesse Hovanesian applied for a pistol permit two years ago, he did not mention his criminal conviction in a case where police said he fled on foot toward his house after a traffic stop, yelling, "You can't come in here without a warrant," before the officer grabbed him at the front door and wrestled him to the ground.

When Bristol police dug a little deeper, records show, they found the unemployed 23-year-old had been a suspect in a variety of drug and larceny investigations, along with a road-rage incident in which he was accused of a slashing another driver with a knife. He was not convicted or charged in most of the cases.

But in the end, none of it mattered.

After Bristol's police chief rejected his application to carry a gun, Hovanesian appealed to the Connecticut Board of Firearm Permit Examiners, which found that the chief was a few days late in submitting a written explanation of his denial -- a deadline for which the board shows no mercy. As a result, when Hovanesian's case was called in March, the board took no testimony and voted immediately and unanimously to overturn the police chief's denial and give Hovanesian a pistol permit by default.

"I did have some complications in the past; I'm not going to deny that," Hovanesian said last week. "I had to jump through some hoops, but it all worked out and I got my permit."

In outcome, if not in speed, that is the typical result of the board's deliberations. In more than two-thirds of permit-denial cases in recent years, the board has rejected a local official's judgment that an individual cannot be trusted to carry a gun in public, a Courant examination of board records reveals.....

(Excerpt) Read more at policeone.com ...


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Crime/Corruption; Extended News; Government; US: Connecticut
KEYWORDS: 2ndamendment; banglist; connecticut; guncontrol; rtkba; secondamendment
Notice the slant here? Imagine the story was about blacks wanting the right to vote or Mexicans wanting amnesty.
1 posted on 06/24/2013 5:53:47 PM PDT by 2ndDivisionVet
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

If a person is not in prison, he should be allowed to carry a gun, I don’t care who he is.


2 posted on 06/24/2013 5:59:46 PM PDT by Sporke (USS Iowa BB-61)
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To: Sporke
IIRC, a person “accused” of domestic violence loses their right to firearms.
3 posted on 06/24/2013 6:02:03 PM PDT by 2ndDivisionVet (I'll raise $2million for Sarah Palin's next run. What'll you do?)
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To: Sporke
If a person is not in prison, he should be allowed to carry a gun, I don’t care who he is.

It took me a long time to arrive at the same conclusion. I kept thinking, "Well, yeah, but what if...?" and "Yeah, but what about...?" Eventually, a little at a time, I understood freedom is always—necessarily—risky. Better too much freedom than too little, and better to regard freedom as a non-negotiable absolute than the exception-riddled remnant of freedom it's become.

4 posted on 06/24/2013 6:08:29 PM PDT by Standing Wolf
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Nothing here says that the subject has a felony conviction. So, yeah... he gets his permit.


5 posted on 06/24/2013 6:08:45 PM PDT by Rio
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To: Rio

I didn’t see that he had ANY convictions for anything.


6 posted on 06/24/2013 6:10:43 PM PDT by 2ndDivisionVet (I'll raise $2million for Sarah Palin's next run. What'll you do?)
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To: Sporke
If a person is not in prison, he should be allowed to carry a gun, I don’t care who he is.

I absolutely do not concur with the premise that the only restrictions that can/should be placed on a person's liberty, via due process, must involve a prison cell.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with giving a person a 15 year prison sentence AND a lifetime restriction on their liberty. Fifteen years in prison didn't make them a better citizen, nor did it pay any debt. It just kept them away from the innocent.

There are already legal means by which a felon can regain their voting and 2A rights, let them use those. Concerning overly restrictive sentencing, that is a matter of opinion that ebbs and flows with the composition of the legislature.

7 posted on 06/24/2013 6:16:40 PM PDT by SampleMan (Feral Humans are the refuse of socialism.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

The police chief dragged his feet for TWO YEARS and missed the deadline and they are bitching because he got the permit? I trust an ex-con with a gun more than any liberal or moderate politician any day.


8 posted on 06/24/2013 6:23:33 PM PDT by Blood of Tyrants (Inside every liberal and WOD defender is a totalitarian screaming to get out.)
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To: Standing Wolf

Then you are also opposed to the War on Drugs.


9 posted on 06/24/2013 6:25:19 PM PDT by Blood of Tyrants (Inside every liberal and WOD defender is a totalitarian screaming to get out.)
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To: SampleMan

The founding fathers disagree. For most of this county’s history an ex-con was given all his rights back when they were released from prison. Including the RKBA and the right to vote.


10 posted on 06/24/2013 6:28:46 PM PDT by Blood of Tyrants (Inside every liberal and WOD defender is a totalitarian screaming to get out.)
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To: Blood of Tyrants
The founding fathers disagree. For most of this county’s history an ex-con was given all his rights back when they were released from prison. Including the RKBA and the right to vote.

No, they totally agreed that sentencing should be up to the legislators, and when they were state legislators the penalities they put into law were generally much more severe than what we have today. The large change over time was not that we took away a felon's rights when we let them out of prison, but rather that we started letting them out of prison.

So the man that the Founders would have hanged, is now given 20 years in prison and lifetime restrictions. Which one lost more freedom?

11 posted on 06/24/2013 7:01:34 PM PDT by SampleMan (Feral Humans are the refuse of socialism.)
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To: SampleMan

Once he is incarcerated and freed he has paid.i cannot find where in the wording of the Second Amendment it says that people someone thinks are bad guys lose their RKBA. Please point to the clause that makes that exception to RKBA “shall not be infringed.”


12 posted on 06/24/2013 7:17:06 PM PDT by arthurus (Read Hazlitt's Economiws In One Lesson ONLINE http://steshaw.org/econohttp://www.fee.org/library/det)
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To: arthurus
Once he is incarcerated and freed he has paid.i cannot find where in the wording of the Second Amendment it says that people someone thinks are bad guys lose their RKBA. Please point to the clause that makes that exception to RKBA “shall not be infringed.”

Apparently, the Founders didn't think anyone would be so thick, as not to understand that individual rights, both enumerated and unenumerated, are abridged, via due process, when a person is sentenced after conviction for a crime.

A prisoner does not have the right to free speech, nor association, nor 2A rights, when they are imprisoned, something the Founders were perfectly OK with. They were also OK with branding a person for life, as an indication that they were a bad person.

Life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness were clearly not intended to be kept by felons, or the Founders wouldn't have hanged so many of them. Depriving a man of his life is certainly no less serious a penalty than depriving that same man of certain liberties.

DUE PROCESS, is the key. Releasing a person from prison does not make them freshly innocent, nor does is there any magic under the law the makes them a newly mented, trustworthy citizen.

13 posted on 06/24/2013 7:35:35 PM PDT by SampleMan (Feral Humans are the refuse of socialism.)
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To: SampleMan
Once he is incarcerated and freed he has paid.

Paid what and to whom? Did the raped victim get unraped? Did the robbed victim get their money and dignity back? Did the dead victim come back to life?

Prison pays no debt, it simply serves to punish the guilty and protect the innocent. Penalties in addition to prison are part of the original sentence and serve the exact same purpose as the prison sentence, albiet with fewer restrictions on the guilty.

Frankly, there are many felons that I would never send to prison, I would instead make the work as indentured servants for a period of time.

You can make a logical case that not all felonies should include lifetime restrictions, but that is a different matter than stating that a violent rapist has paid for his crimes and should be treated as an equal of every honest citizen.

14 posted on 06/24/2013 7:44:08 PM PDT by SampleMan (Feral Humans are the refuse of socialism.)
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To: Blood of Tyrants
Then you are also opposed to the War on Drugs.

You've got that right, Blood of Tyrants! If some self-appointed genius is toking and driving, I want to see the law land on him like a ton of brick, because he's putting everyone else's life at risk just like a drunken driver; if he's sitting home toking and going through snack food by the bushel basket and totaling out his own brain cells, however, he's his own problem, not ours.

I've met an awful lot of self-proclaimed "freedom lovers" who loudly proclaim the feral government has no business in our gun safes, but demand the same feral government keep a close eye on the contents of everybody's pockets and lungs and veins.

15 posted on 06/24/2013 8:24:42 PM PDT by Standing Wolf
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To: Standing Wolf
Treat all intoxicants equally. If the future crack and meth heads of the world get a legal means to access their particular “libation” and in an unlimited way they will all be dead in a few years and thus remove themselves from our midst along with any resultant genetic material from the pool.

no more methadone clinics, drug lords , mass exodus of US dollars to foreign nationals, taliban money contracts, and hardcore users

16 posted on 06/24/2013 10:23:29 PM PDT by ping jockey (IT IS IMPORTANT TO ME YOU GREASY,HAIRY ARMPIT,HIPPIE.)
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To: Standing Wolf
I've met an awful lot of self-proclaimed "freedom lovers" who loudly proclaim the feral government has no business in our gun safes, but demand the same feral government keep a close eye on the contents of everybody's pockets and lungs and veins.

Also known as spitting on the Tenth Amendment. And yes, there are many who do so.

17 posted on 06/25/2013 2:36:38 AM PDT by Ken H
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To: Ken H

Just defend pot somewhere else. It’s not needed


18 posted on 06/25/2013 2:38:04 AM PDT by Monty22002
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To: Standing Wolf

Ditto on that,,, If they can’t be trusted with a firearm, they should have never been let out of jail.The person as paid for their crime.


19 posted on 06/25/2013 4:54:44 AM PDT by piroque ("In times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act")
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To: Sporke

I agree


20 posted on 06/25/2013 5:59:59 AM PDT by silentreignofheroes
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

“IIRC, a person “accused” of domestic violence loses their right to firearms.”

That is true, especially in CA and NY.


21 posted on 06/25/2013 7:34:07 AM PDT by Sporke (USS Iowa BB-61)
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To: SampleMan

“There is absolutely nothing wrong with giving a person a 15 year prison sentence AND a lifetime restriction on their liberty. Fifteen years in prison didn’t make them a better citizen, nor did it pay any debt. It just kept them away from the innocent.

There are already legal means by which a felon can regain their voting and 2A rights, let them use those.”

Prisons are where we punish those who break our laws. That should be the ONLY place. The only reasons we have parole/probation, and the other creative sentencing options is because it’s cheaper for the taxpayer. If we have so many people in jail that we can’t afford to keep them, then just maybe we have to many people in prison, because of stupid laws.
As for felons filing motions to get their rights back, yes, it can be done. All it takes is several thousand dollars and a sympathetic DA and Judge. If you don’t have both, you have donated your cash to the state.

I am a simple person. I believe if a person is convicted of a crime, he is sentenced and goes to prison, if the crime is worthy of it. The day the sentence is completed, every right should be restored. Since our rights aren’t given to us by the state, they should have no right to take them from us.


22 posted on 06/25/2013 7:43:56 AM PDT by Sporke (USS Iowa BB-61)
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To: Sporke
Prisons are where we punish those who break our laws. That should be the ONLY place.

Well, that's an opinion, but I don't agree. I think penal labor is a great form of punishment and has many good uses. Let someone that embezzles pay back 150% of what they stole.

The only reasons we have parole/probation, and the other creative sentencing options is because it’s cheaper for the taxpayer.

Its a reason, but there are many suitable punishments besides being confined to a cell.

As for felons filing motions to get their rights back, yes, it can be done. All it takes is several thousand dollars and a sympathetic DA and Judge. If you don’t have both, you have donated your cash to the state.

I would hope it would take more than money and sympathy, like a good judgment of whether the person is still to be considered a violent threat to others.

I am a simple person. I believe if a person is convicted of a crime, he is sentenced and goes to prison, if the crime is worthy of it. The day the sentence is completed, every right should be restored. Since our rights aren’t given to us by the state, they should have no right to take them from us.

Either you believe in the state having the power to take away rights, or you don't, which is it? Its all about due process. When someone rapes a child, I want the state to have the power to strip them of their rights, as free people do not reside in prison, nor are free people put to death. As for the automatic full restitution of rights, their status as a dangerous person has not changed. If Bob tries to kill Bill with a hammer, but only succeeds in wounding Bill, he's only going to get about 5 years, but Bob is still a very dangerous, homicidal person.

If I accept your logic that people should only be punished in prison and be automatically fully restored thereafter, then I will revert to pre-1800 sentencing, and seek the death sentence for most all violent crimes, and prison sentences stretching into old age for the others.

23 posted on 06/25/2013 9:24:43 AM PDT by SampleMan (Feral Humans are the refuse of socialism.)
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