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Zimmerman trial has all the ingredients for a miscarriage of justice
The Chicago Tribune ^ | June 30, 2013 | Eric Zorn

Posted on 06/29/2013 4:06:07 PM PDT by 2ndDivisionVet

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To: Bringbackthedraft

Well, police really shouldn’t have any business forcing a family to do something beyond not violate the law. That’s not in the legal charter so it would be an abuse of law. We laud nanny states, even when seemingly fortuitous, to our peril as the monster will not go back in the box when the mission you lauded is over.


51 posted on 06/29/2013 4:54:17 PM PDT by HiTech RedNeck (Whatever promise that God has made, in Jesus it is yes. See my page.)
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To: Old Sarge

Well if we trusted in God more, we would worry about the machinations of Caesar less.


52 posted on 06/29/2013 4:55:44 PM PDT by HiTech RedNeck (Whatever promise that God has made, in Jesus it is yes. See my page.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Chicago Tribune???

Isn’t that owned by the same people who own the Whorelando Slantinel.


53 posted on 06/29/2013 4:59:07 PM PDT by Uncle Chip
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To: Old Sarge
I don't see the logic in that, Sarge.

If there are riots, the Stand Your Ground Law and the Castle Doctrine will prove their worth in lives saved by voters.

The feral yutes will loot, maim, and burn...but that only bolsters the gun laws.

54 posted on 06/29/2013 5:03:32 PM PDT by RoosterRedux (You can't eat Sharia)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Sympathetic victim? You mean the neighborhood watch guy attacked by a thug who tried to kill him?


55 posted on 06/29/2013 5:05:00 PM PDT by ozzymandus
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To: RummyChick

The starting point for this story is that Zimmerman’s neighborhood was being vandalized, he was part of the neighborhood watch, he found a person there who wasn’t supposed to be there, and he followed that person.

Apparently, that really, really riles people that this community and this man were making a concerted effort to prevent vandalism and make their neighborhood a better place to live.

It turns out that Martin did not belong there. I have no idea if where he lived and where he said he was going required him to go through that neighborhood, but it is a fact that it wasn’t his neighborhood, so Zimmerman was right to follow him.

That’s where we pick up the events described by the witnesses for the prosecution (defense) this past week. I can’t imagine what would be said at this point that would prove beyond a reasonable doubt that Zimmerman is a wild-eyed murderer.


56 posted on 06/29/2013 5:15:58 PM PDT by xzins (Retired Army Chaplain and Proud of It! True supporters of our troops pray for their victory!)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Eric Zorn is an uber-lefty, and is well known to be rabidly anti-gun, and so quick to vilify anyone acting in self-defense, unless that person is a minority (but even at that, if the minority self-defender had used a gun Zorn would slam him for it).

So, the fact that in this article Eric Zorn showed even the slightest effort at trying to be objective is mind-boggling, and should send shivers up the spines of all of Skittles’ supporters.


57 posted on 06/29/2013 5:16:06 PM PDT by ought-six ( Multiculturalism is national suicide, and political correctness is the cyanide capsule.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Eric Zorn is an uber-lefty, and is well known to be rabidly anti-gun, and so quick to vilify anyone acting in self-defense, unless that person is a minority (but even at that, if the minority self-defender had used a gun Zorn would slam him for it).

So, the fact that in this article Eric Zorn showed even the slightest effort at trying to be objective is mind-boggling, and should send shivers up the spines of all of Skittles’ supporters.


58 posted on 06/29/2013 5:18:58 PM PDT by ought-six ( Multiculturalism is national suicide, and political correctness is the cyanide capsule.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

The script has been flipped in open court, by the facts. The irony and karma is pure justice: Martin racially profiled, stalked, and attacked Zimmerman, trying to kill him with Zimmerman’s own gun. Zimmerman’s entire story has held up.

Trayvon is NOT A VICTIM. He’s a dead perpetrator of attempted murder.

Now the Trayvon camp is insisting it was never about race, shouldn’t be about race, seeing as they’ve been exposed now...Trayvon called Zimmerman racial epithets, profiled and stalked/tried to murder Zimmerman, not the other way around.


59 posted on 06/29/2013 5:26:23 PM PDT by IChing
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

If Zimmerman is acquitted, Eric Holder’s justice department will probably file civil rights charges against him.


60 posted on 06/29/2013 5:26:31 PM PDT by Fiji Hill
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To: xzins

Far more than vandalism was going on—at least 7 burglaries and even daylight home invasion, such as the one we saw on video in NJ recently—had taken place at the complex in the months leading up to the incident in question. As to the rest of what you said, I suggest getting up to speed on salient facts and details, you get some things wrong.


61 posted on 06/29/2013 5:30:46 PM PDT by IChing
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
A young man who had just bought the ingredients for "Purple Drank/Purple Lean" when shot ....

A bit off-topic, but speaking of Purple Lean, the Rite-Aid Pharmacy where I get my prescriptions has a very big display of Arizona Iced Tea, standing all by itself, on the end cap of the row containing the cold and allergy medication. All by itself, completely isolated from the place where other beverages are sold. The cold medicine is directly nearby.

62 posted on 06/29/2013 5:36:10 PM PDT by Mr Ramsbotham (Laws against sodomy are honored in the breech.)
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To: Mr Ramsbotham

Just before this incident the Feds busted the Stanford CVS for selling an enormous amount of OxyContin Perscriptions were 7 x the nber of residents of the community. The drive thru , clerks reported, actually would have a line with customers calling the drug by street name. The drugs were then taken to Miami for distribution

Have not seen what happened to this business adventure.


63 posted on 06/29/2013 5:47:26 PM PDT by hoosiermama (Obama: "Born in Kenya" Lying now or then!)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Just maybe the problem in Florida is Angela Corey!
Not only in the George Zimmerman case but the two cases involving
Marissa Alexander and Ronald Thompson. Both involving use of a firearm, both persons receiving 20 year sentences. No person was injured. Both were bulldozed through by Angela.
Ronald’s case was overturned and then Angela appeal, then the court ruled for a new trial because of wording on instructions to the jury. Angela says she will look at filing for another trial.
Marissa is still in prison for shooting a warning shot at her abusive husband who was threatening her.
Something is VERY wrong in this state when the Fat B-—is crucifying the people that have every right to protect one’s self.
All I know if I’m ever threatened and if I shoot to warn and could receive 20 years, I will go the whole nine yards!
Time to FIRE Angela Corey and free Marissa Alexander and Ronald Thompson
http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/05/11/11660804-marissa-alexander-gets-20-years-for-firing-warning-shot-after-stand-your-ground-defense-fails?lite
++++++++++++++++
http://flaglerlive.com/40188/ronald-thompson-shooting/


64 posted on 06/29/2013 5:49:43 PM PDT by GOYAKLA (Waiting for the Golden Screw to be removed from Obama's navel and his a$$ falls off!)
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To: xzins

Martin had been sent there by his mother in Miami (who couldn’t control him) after he’d gotten into trouble in school. He was supposed to be living with his father and his father’s girlfriend, although it appears that neither one of them particularly cared where he was or what he was doing.


65 posted on 06/29/2013 5:58:57 PM PDT by livius
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
I don't presume to know exactly what happened between Zimmerman and Trayvon Martin on the subdivision walkway on that rainy night in Sanford, Fla., in early 2012. And, a week into the prosecution's case, I don't know how anyone else can presume to know....

And there it is, the bottomline for the media dingbats. The media circus clowns and the Florida state clowns don't have the evidence to convict a presumed innocent man. The defended doesn't have to prove anything under our system of justice.

66 posted on 06/29/2013 6:02:25 PM PDT by Red Steel
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To: Kozak
The 75 year old dean of the school I work at said those exact words to describe this case. I told her Trayvon was a trouble maker and thug. She accused me of racism and insisted he was just a sweet little innocent boy. Before I walked away I asked her if she would want an armed citizen to intervene if a 6 foot tall 17 year old punk was kneeling on her chest and punching her in the face. She was speechless.
67 posted on 06/29/2013 6:29:05 PM PDT by peeps36 (America is being destroyed by filthy traitors in the political establishment)
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To: IChing
As to the rest of what you said, I suggest getting up to speed on salient facts and details, you get some things wrong.

That’s where we pick up the events described by the witnesses for the prosecution (defense) this past week. I can’t imagine what would be said at this point that would prove beyond a reasonable doubt that Zimmerman is a wild-eyed murderer.

Are you suggesting it would be simple at this point to prove Zimmerman a wild-eyed murderer???

68 posted on 06/29/2013 7:10:42 PM PDT by xzins (Retired Army Chaplain and Proud of It! True supporters of our troops pray for their victory!)
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To: livius

Any idea the address he was supposed to be at and the location of the skittles store he was going to?


69 posted on 06/29/2013 7:12:07 PM PDT by xzins (Retired Army Chaplain and Proud of It! True supporters of our troops pray for their victory!)
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To: hoosiermama

I thought that was hysterical. When the defense lawyer asked her how does wet grass sound, and she just went silent while trying to figure out an answer, I hope this doesn’t sound racist, but this reminded me of Amos & Andy when Kingfish would ask a question to Andy while trying to pull one over on him.


70 posted on 06/29/2013 7:17:20 PM PDT by murron (Proud Mom of a Marine Vet)
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To: DaveyB

The problem the prosecution is having is that they have no case to present. Never did. It’s hard putting on a case that has no evidence to back it up. Their only hope at this point would be some sort of jury nullification.


71 posted on 06/29/2013 7:20:55 PM PDT by murron (Proud Mom of a Marine Vet)
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To: ought-six

“Eric Zorn is an uber-lefty . . .”

You got that exactly right, and If Eric Zorn has pulled his head out of his posterior cavity long enough to smell the stink permeating from this trial, you know that the prosecution’s “case” has got to be as weak as everyone here has always suspected it to be.

I think some of the less-dogmatic shills on the left realize their credibility got badly burned on the Duke lacrosse case, and may be giving themselves some cover if they have to do some backing-and-filling when the Zimmerman verdict comes in.


72 posted on 06/29/2013 7:22:16 PM PDT by Stosh
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

‘Has everything changed that much?’

Not sure if you have been paying attention or not, but we have a black messiah in the White House now...can you say, transformative?


73 posted on 06/29/2013 7:34:15 PM PDT by Delta Dawn
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To: ought-six
Eric Zorn is an uber-lefty, and is well known to be rabidly anti-gun, and so quick to vilify anyone acting in self-defense, unless that person is a minority (but even at that, if the minority self-defender had used a gun Zorn would slam him for it). So, the fact that in this article Eric Zorn showed even the slightest effort at trying to be objective is mind-boggling, and should send shivers up the spines of all of Skittles’ supporters.

Why do you think he attempted to be fair?

74 posted on 06/29/2013 7:34:42 PM PDT by GOPJ (... liberal anger - - the privileged wheeze of entitled brats ... Greenfield)
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To: fatnotlazy

“Obama can’t wait for the riots to begin. Then he can declare martial law and make himself king, president for life or whatever he wants to call himself.”

The more decadent Roman emperors declared themselves gods once they’d solidified their power; I can’t see BO settling for anything less.


75 posted on 06/29/2013 7:36:32 PM PDT by Stosh
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To: murron

Neighbors heard shoes skiffle on ground sidewalk or grass. She just didn’t have the vocabulary to describe it


76 posted on 06/29/2013 7:43:30 PM PDT by hoosiermama (Obama: "Born in Kenya" Lying now or then!)
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To: murron

Neighbors heard shoes skiffle on ground sidewalk or grass. She just didn’t have the vocabulary to describe it


77 posted on 06/29/2013 7:44:07 PM PDT by hoosiermama (Obama: "Born in Kenya" Lying now or then!)
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To: xzins

No, get up to speed as to why he was in that complex. I believe Zimmerman, but too many people on our side are late to the party and reporting wrong information. TM was casing his next burglary target, but he was stayin at the complex and Z saw him along the route from the store back to his father’s girlfriend’s unit. Thing is, it took him 45 min. to go 1 mile.


78 posted on 06/29/2013 7:55:47 PM PDT by IChing
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To: RummyChick; Vision
It’s pretty amazing coming from the Chicago Tribune.

Old timers such as myself recall when the Trib was a solidly Republican paper. During era of Colonel Robert R. McCormick, it was consistently Conservative and strongly supported Senator Joseph McCarthy in his battle against communism even after others had abandoned his righteous crusade.

On a trivial note, back then the Chicago Tribune used its own style of spelling such as using "thru" for "through" and "tho" for "though". This was McCormick's mini-crusade against what he saw as one aspect of decadent European influence on America. Colonel McCormick was a proponent of American Exceptionlism and even wanted our county's spelling to be, well, exceptional. :-)

Sadly, the Chicago Tribune bears no resemblance to its former greatness and the Colonel would be brokenhearted at what's become of his once-mighty and formerly pro-American paper. And the distinctive spelling is gone too.

79 posted on 06/29/2013 7:57:53 PM PDT by re_nortex (DP - that's what I like about Texas)
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To: IChing

The map of his route that I saw had him enter the neighborhood through the upper entrance. Are you saying the father’s girlfriend has a unit in that same complex? I have no problem with that. It just means the annotated map I was looking at is wrong.


80 posted on 06/29/2013 7:58:35 PM PDT by xzins (Retired Army Chaplain and Proud of It! True supporters of our troops pray for their victory!)
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To: RummyChick
It’s pretty amazing coming from the Chicago Tribune.

Especially from Eric Zorn, This sounds like something Kass would write

81 posted on 06/29/2013 8:00:17 PM PDT by sharkhawk (Mr Gorbachev, tear down this wall.)
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To: re_nortex
Thanks for the memory. Other than Rush, it’s hard to imagine that people/papers were pro America like that. You can see them in old movies but that’s about it.
82 posted on 06/29/2013 8:11:26 PM PDT by Vision (Political Correctness is unAmerican)
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To: xzins

Have you seen the evidence video taken the day after the incident. It clears a lot up


83 posted on 06/29/2013 8:24:14 PM PDT by hoosiermama (Obama: "Born in Kenya" Lying now or then!)
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To: Theodore R.

I agree. I think FReepers need to be prepared for another outrageous political driven verdict like that of OJ, except the defendant this time will be convicted to appease the mob.


84 posted on 06/29/2013 8:30:20 PM PDT by snarkytart
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To: HiTech RedNeck

There is little sanity left in our system..

A jury of Freepers would see this case for what it is. The general public?

I wouldn’t trust um with it.


85 posted on 06/29/2013 8:56:27 PM PDT by cableguymn (The founding fathers would be shooting by now..)
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To: xzins

Zimmerman was doing neighborhood watch for The Retreat at Twin Lakes, the same complex where the incident took place and where Trayvon was staying with his father and Brandy Green. My understanding is that Zimmerman first spotted him as he was re-entering the complex on the route he took on foot from the 7-11 back to the Twin Lakes complex, and that he seemed to be meandering in the rain in an odd and suspicious way, looking around.

If you are saying that your information is Zimmerman saw Martin in a different neighborhood, such as prior to him re-entering the Twin Lakes complex, that’s news to me. Maps I’ve seen have Z spotting him at/within the boundary, along the route I specified.

I’m going on about it because I continually run into fellow patriots who unwittingly spread misinformation that they pick up, such as Trayvon had no business there whatsoever, or was under house arrest, or people posting pictures of a 30-something-year old rapper known as “The Game” saying it is Trayvon, etc.

If we are going to argue this in the cybersphere, we have to have our facts nailed down.


86 posted on 06/29/2013 9:39:46 PM PDT by IChing
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To: murron

Jury nullification is what defense would want if state had a solid case.


87 posted on 06/29/2013 9:42:01 PM PDT by IChing
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To: IChing
If you are saying that your information is Zimmerman saw Martin in a different neighborhood,

Nope. That's not what I'm saying. Zimmerman first saw Martin in GZ's neighborhood. My question is whether Martin was also living in GZ's neighborhood or was his father's girlfriend's home in GZ's neighborhood. The map I saw had Martin enter at the entrance to GZ's neighborhood...which would imply that Martin did NOT live/was not staying in GZ's neighborhood.

88 posted on 06/30/2013 2:37:49 AM PDT by xzins (Retired Army Chaplain and Proud of It! True supporters of our troops pray for their victory!)
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To: hoosiermama

I saw the video in which GZ is accompanied by 2 officers and then walks them through the events of the previous evening.


89 posted on 06/30/2013 2:38:54 AM PDT by xzins (Retired Army Chaplain and Proud of It! True supporters of our troops pray for their victory!)
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To: xzins

Why would it imply that? As I explained, Martin was staying at Twin Lakes, and the 7-11 was a mile away. Zimmerman, incidently, was himself on the way to Target or Home Depot or something in his truck when he saw Martin. You started off declaring that Martin had no business in that neighborhood at all.


90 posted on 06/30/2013 6:44:14 AM PDT by IChing
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To: IChing

Now don’t tell me you haven’t grasped that Zimmerman lived where he was a neighborhood watchman.


91 posted on 06/30/2013 6:49:00 AM PDT by IChing
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
Nails it...

Evidence of innocence explained away with far-fetched theories or else ignored.

Evidence of guilt magnified and bolstered with irrelevant detail and innuendo.

92 posted on 06/30/2013 7:51:00 AM PDT by kanawa (FB...Save George Zimmerman from racial onslaught)
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To: IChing
It turns out that Martin did not belong there. I have no idea if where he lived and where he said he was going required him to go through that neighborhood, but it is a fact that it wasn’t his neighborhood, so Zimmerman was right to follow him.

Nope, this is what I said. It wasn't his neighborhood. That is still a fact. And I still haven't discovered whether the girlfriend's unit is in that neighborhood. But, even if it is, Martin is still a stranger in that neighborhood if he's simply staying at his father's girlfriend's crib.

Also, if your path is show as entering at the entrance rather than originating at some location within the neighborhood, then it is a fair inference that it is not your neighborhood. For example, if I see you enter at the entrance to my neighborhood, knowing that you just left YOUR house, then it's safe to infer that your house is not inside the neighborhood.

93 posted on 06/30/2013 9:53:54 AM PDT by xzins (Retired Army Chaplain and Proud of It! True supporters of our troops pray for their victory!)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

94 posted on 06/30/2013 10:02:54 AM PDT by kcvl
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

95 posted on 06/30/2013 10:10:53 AM PDT by kcvl
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To: GOPJ
Why do you think he attempted to be fair?

Many leftists always try to be fair, but are blind to things that contradict their world view. As a former liberal, I think I have a better appreciation of such blindness than many conservatives will ever have. What is notable here is not that Eric Zorn is trying to be fair, but rather that elements of truth are managing to sneak past his mind's defense mechanisms.

96 posted on 06/30/2013 10:23:22 AM PDT by supercat (Renounce Covetousness.)
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To: RummyChick

Given the overwhelming sentiment in this country that the death penalty is a fitting comeuppance for multiple murderers, I’ve been puzzled by the almost universal expressions of relief since Friday that accused multiple murderer O.J. Simpson did not kill himself while he was on the lam.

“Nobody wanted that,” as a talk-radio host put it Monday morning.

Oh?

As the chase and standoff proceeded Friday night, I felt it would have been quite appropriate for Simpson to take his own life if, in fact, he’s guilty of the crimes of which he is accused.

——Eric Zorn (Chicago Tribune). June, 21, 1994


97 posted on 06/30/2013 10:26:29 AM PDT by windsorknot
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To: kcvl; xzins

That is not a pic of the Trayvon Martin in question(it’s of a different thug named Trayvon Martin), although it could just as well be, the gangsta-thug mugging is very similar.


98 posted on 06/30/2013 10:59:13 AM PDT by IChing
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To: xzins

How often does it have to be explained to you that Brandy Green’s unit is in the Retreat at Twin Lakes complex, and that TM was returning from the 7-11? Are you really unable to follow the bouncing ball here?

You had claimed that GZ “found a person there who wasn’t supposed to be there” and you also said “It turns out that Martin did not belong there. I have no idea if where he lived and where he said he was going required him to go through that neighborhood, but it is a fact that it wasn’t his neighborhood, so Zimmerman was right to follow him.”

GZ was suspicious of TM mainly because of the way he was acting, as detailed in the recording of his call to the non-emergency police line—not because of where he was, as you allege.

Furthermore, you just said: “Also, if your path is show as entering at the entrance rather than originating at some location within the neighborhood, then it is a fair inference that it is not your neighborhood. For example, if I see you enter at the entrance to my neighborhood, knowing that you just left YOUR house, then it’s safe to infer that your house is not inside the neighborhood.”

Where the hell do you come up with the inane claim that GZ “knew” TM had “just left (HIS) house”?? He hadn’t just left Brandy Green’s, or any, house—he was returning from the 7-11, as I’ve tried repeatedly to explain to you, and GZ had no way of knowing from where he was coming. My goodness, this is tedious. Please, if you can’t track and apply basic logic, just admit it, and spare me any sulking histrionics while you’re at it.


99 posted on 06/30/2013 11:14:17 AM PDT by IChing
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To: hoosiermama
How does wet sound?

Like grass silly, don't you know anything?

100 posted on 06/30/2013 11:30:05 AM PDT by itsahoot (It is not so much that history repeats, but that human nature does not change.)
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