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The Zimmerman trial is already over
foxnews.com ^ | 5 July, 2013 | John Lott

Posted on 07/06/2013 12:52:17 PM PDT by marktwain

Prosecutors in the George Zimmerman second degree murder trial have pushed hard on two points as they seek to make their case against him: that the injuries to Zimmerman on the night Trayvon Martin died were “insignificant” and that he had studied Florida’s “Stand Your Ground” law in a college class in 2010.

To win conviction on second-degree murder, the prosecution has to show that the death was caused by a criminal act “demonstrating a depraved mind without regard for human life.”

That’s why the prosecutor keeps pushing the claim that Zimmerman profiled Martin because he was black. Meanwhile, the lesser charge of manslaughter generally is a crime that's been committed in the heat of passion, where there is no premeditation. The jury would have to believe Zimmerman lost his temper in shooting Martin.

People can use force to protect themselves when they reasonably believe it is “necessary to prevent imminent death or great bodily harm to themselves.” On this score, the testimony of the Jacksonville medical examiner, Valerie Rao, that Zimmerman injuries were “insignificant” is largely irrelevant.

A broken nose, a head being slammed into cement, and punches to the face may not have left Zimmerman incapacitated. The important question is whether such an attack with a man on top of him would leave Zimmerman to “reasonably believe” that there was a threat of “imminent death or great bodily harm to himself.”

(Excerpt) Read more at foxnews.com ...


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; News/Current Events; Politics/Elections; US: Florida
KEYWORDS: banglist; fl; martin; zimmerman
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The question is: Will the jury do its job?
1 posted on 07/06/2013 12:52:17 PM PDT by marktwain
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To: marktwain
I expect the jury will do its job better than the judge and persecutors.
2 posted on 07/06/2013 12:55:59 PM PDT by mountainlion (Live well for those that did not make it back.)
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To: marktwain

And, if a not guilty verdict is rendered, what will the reactions be of Jackson, Sharpton, black youth in the streets?????

Will idiots such as Spike Lee attempt to give the names and addresses of the jurors? He caused great harrassment to innocent people by going on Twitter but listing an incorrect address for George Zimmerman. Of course, since Spike Lee is Negro and Liberal and all that, he will never be called to account for making a mistake on the address, or the mistake of sticking his nose into this case in the first place.


3 posted on 07/06/2013 12:57:33 PM PDT by Dilbert San Diego
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To: marktwain

If someone was slamming my head on the pavement, I might lose my temper, too. Self-defense is obvious.


4 posted on 07/06/2013 1:01:37 PM PDT by ozzymandus
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To: marktwain

I just don’t understand why people keep bringing up “stand your ground” in this case. Zimmerman had no ability to retreat, with Martin sitting on him. So how can it even be an issue; and, Zimmerman’s attorneys are not even arguing it. Can someone please explain that for me?

I know the anti-gunners want to make it an issue, but I don’t see how this case can make it so.


5 posted on 07/06/2013 1:02:32 PM PDT by Real Cynic No More (Border Fence Obamacare!)
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To: mountainlion
I expect the jury will do its job better than the judge and persecutors.

It could hardly do it less. However, they may feel a need to throw a bone to St Skittles family. And convict an innocent man on a lesser charge for which they fail to comprehend the consequences.

6 posted on 07/06/2013 1:03:29 PM PDT by RugerMini14
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To: marktwain
I think they will.

The evidence presented so far points to Z on the bottom getting beat.

Whether anyone recognizes his voice crying for help is not so important as the fact that Z was beaten that night.

IF Z was on top ... HE WASN'T BEING BEATEN, BUT WAS BEATING.

and for THAT to be true, TM must have marks evedencing that beating ... he had none.

So .. someone was getting beaten ... obviously Z

Self defence is being in fear for your life ... Z has more evidence of being in fear than TM.


I honestly believe the jury will see it that way

They don't want to break for food nor go home at the stroke of 5 ... they want to know the evidence.

I think Z walks with Self Defence.

7 posted on 07/06/2013 1:03:55 PM PDT by knarf (I say things that are true ... I have no proof, but they're true.)
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To: marktwain

Has no bearing on what occurred. I’ve taken an accident prevention course but that didn’t stop someone from plowing into me.


8 posted on 07/06/2013 1:04:41 PM PDT by Sacajaweau
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To: mountainlion

I have a suspicion that you are correct. Normally I’m pessimistic in these cases, but for some reason, I have faith that the jury will find reasonable doubt.


9 posted on 07/06/2013 1:06:17 PM PDT by andyk (I have sworn...eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man.)
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To: marktwain

Benjamin Crump and Angela Corey need to be disbarred.


10 posted on 07/06/2013 1:07:51 PM PDT by E. Pluribus Unum (Who could have known that one day professional wrestling would be less fake than professional news?)
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To: Real Cynic No More
I just don’t understand why people keep bringing up “stand your ground” in this case.

Even back when Zimmerman was first arrested I noticed and commented here that the only people I noticed bringing up "stand your ground" were the MSM and FReepers.

11 posted on 07/06/2013 1:08:40 PM PDT by Roccus
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To: Real Cynic No More

Actually, stand your ground is relevant. Prosecution witness Jeantel testified that Trayvon was nearly at Brandy Greene’s condo, then went back to confront Zimmerman.

Trayvon had a duty to retreat rather than confront, especially as he and his father were forbidden to stay there under the lease agreement.

What?
The media hasn’t mentioned this?


12 posted on 07/06/2013 1:10:45 PM PDT by MrEdd (Heck? Geewhiz Cripes, thats the place where people who don't believe in Gosh think they aint going.)
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To: marktwain
Will the jury do its job?

Yes, this is not like the O.J. trial. This is like the Duke Lacrosse trial in that the prosecution is political, and like the Rodney King trial in that the charges were inflated from manslaughter to murder 2.

13 posted on 07/06/2013 1:12:53 PM PDT by Jeff Chandler (Harriet Meiers is looking pretty good right about now.)
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To: Real Cynic No More

“I just don’t understand why people keep bringing up ‘stand your ground in this case?”

Honestly, I don’t really know either. The only thing I can think of (and this is a stretch) is if they are claiming, “Well, if he lied about this, he may be lying about what happened that night, also.”

This is the most stupid prosecution ever—and I am usually pro-prosecution.

This entire trial seems completely backward—with the Prosecution acting more like defense attorneys and vice-versa. This time, the Defense seems to have the complete story and almost all of the evidence in their favor, and the Prosecution is trying to create the reasonable doubt.

I HOPE AND PRAY THE JURY SEES THIS TRIAL FOR WHAT IT IS!


14 posted on 07/06/2013 1:14:56 PM PDT by davandbar
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To: marktwain

It isn’t the insignificance of the wounds he received, but the significance of the wounds he would have received if he hadn’t stopped the kid on top of him when he did.

There is little doubt in my mind that Trayvon would have killed this man if he had been allowed to continue.


15 posted on 07/06/2013 1:15:02 PM PDT by Venturer
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To: ozzymandus

And G Z thought he was going to grab his pistol.


16 posted on 07/06/2013 1:16:08 PM PDT by laplata (Liberals don't get it. Their minds have been stolen.)
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To: marktwain

Don’t overlook; “You know, if I had a son, he’d look like Trayvon”. Put NOTHING past that racist Chicago thug and his band of debris.


17 posted on 07/06/2013 1:19:35 PM PDT by Proud2BeRight
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To: marktwain
That is what I'm afraid of that the jury will do a "JOB" on Zimmerman.

The judge will be asked to take the case from the jury and she should if she is willing to follow the law. She won't take the case from the jury.

Of major interest being has the threats by our little brown brothers increased, decreased or stayed the same? Any preparations being made to have a good riot with lots of dead whites? In the event Zimmerman is not convicted.

18 posted on 07/06/2013 1:22:50 PM PDT by AEMILIUS PAULUS (It is a shame that when these people give a riot)
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To: marktwain
Will the jury do its job?

Hard to say for sure, it takes some training to spot fabrication of character by relevant evidence omission and coverup, and assassination of character by evidence tampering.

The egregious behavior of the prosecution, some of their witnesses and even the judge is obvious, even to women, so I'm thinkin' maybe full acquittal.

19 posted on 07/06/2013 1:23:13 PM PDT by Navy Patriot (Join the Democrats, it's not Fascism when WE do it, and the Constitution and law mean what WE say.)
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To: MrEdd
No, I don't think the media DID mention that. Where did you come across it?

Speaking of media, this looks like a good idea to me:
Kickstart Truth in Media
20 posted on 07/06/2013 1:23:41 PM PDT by Zarro (Find and support the Truth in Media Project)
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To: marktwain

“A broken nose, a head being slammed into cement, and punches to the face may not have left Zimmerman incapacitated”

I think the whole idea of self defense is to avoid incapacitation.


21 posted on 07/06/2013 1:28:05 PM PDT by Georgia Girl 2 (The only purpose of a pistol is to fight your way back to the rifle you should never have dropped.)
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To: knarf
Whether anyone recognizes his voice crying for help is not so important as the fact that Z was beaten that night.
Another thing, who was screaming for help on the 911 recording? If it was TM, maybe it was because at the last moments of his life, he came to the realization that he wasn't the bad-a** thug he was bragging about on Twitter. If anything TM's fate should serve as a lesson to those wannabe gangstas and "Miss Thangs" out there, regardless of their race, as to the potential consequences of "letting your alligator mouth get your butterfly a** in trouble" as they say in the 'hood.
22 posted on 07/06/2013 1:28:26 PM PDT by Impala64ssa (You call me an islamophobe like it's a bad thing.)
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To: marktwain
I wouldn't be surprised at a Hung Jury Vote of 3 vs. 3.
23 posted on 07/06/2013 1:31:12 PM PDT by SandRat (Duty - Honor - Country! What else needs said?)
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To: marktwain

When one is pinned to the ground getting their head smashed in, how exactly does one “retreat”? Hope the defense brings this point up.


24 posted on 07/06/2013 1:34:19 PM PDT by Red in Blue PA (When Injustice becomes Law, Resistance Becomes Duty.-Thomas Jefferson)
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To: Dilbert San Diego

Tit for Tat. Spike lees, Sharpton and other address should be put out if any trouble starts by these leftist race baitors.


25 posted on 07/06/2013 1:34:20 PM PDT by spawn44 (MOO)
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To: Impala64ssa
It couldn't be TM

The help screaming is what? ... 1 or 2 minute's worth.

Analyze ..

Z's on top .. doing what?

He's got a gun out, waving it in TM's face and TM just lays there (unscathed) and screams for help?

WHEN did Z's injuries happen?

BEFORE or AFTER he got the best of TM and for 1 or 2 minutes torments him with a gun in his face ?

I'm gonn'a kill you n*gg* ??

None of anything pointing to Z besting TM fits.

Mama martin says it's her boy ... why is your boy so afraid ? Why is he not fighting for his life? Why are there NO marks indicating TM was being beaten and afraid for his life to scream help so many times for so long ?

26 posted on 07/06/2013 1:36:44 PM PDT by knarf (I say things that are true ... I have no proof, but they're true.)
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To: marktwain
“Bob Beckel, bought the claim: “I think that the prosecution got back in the case today for a very simple reason: this professor made it very clear that Zimmerman knew everything about the ‘Stand Your Ground’ law”

Zimmerman plotted killing since college? Wow. I also heard another “proof” - Zimmerman's gun was off the safety, meaning he was hunting... That's the evidence??? It's not even circumstantial! Studying law in college 2 years ago? Off safety? When alone confronting with questions a 6 feet guy with gang tattoos it is now advisable to put the gun on safety lock? Just in case if he attacks you, you won't harm him...

27 posted on 07/06/2013 1:37:13 PM PDT by alecqss
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To: alecqss

My husband owns a gun like Zimmerman’s; he said there is no safety on it. My husband is a cop—I think he’d know!

So, when the pundits make absurd statements like that, they obviously haven’t done their homework.


28 posted on 07/06/2013 1:42:20 PM PDT by davandbar
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To: Zarro

I listened to her testimony.
I expect the defense will be bringing this up.


29 posted on 07/06/2013 1:44:56 PM PDT by MrEdd (Heck? Geewhiz Cripes, thats the place where people who don't believe in Gosh think they aint going.)
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To: alecqss

with the gun he had, the trigger is the safety - at least from what I understood of it.


30 posted on 07/06/2013 1:45:50 PM PDT by jurroppi1
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To: marktwain

This jury also will be ostracized in their community and families if they convict Zimmerman....and if their families were smart they slipped a little info during the family outing on Jul 4.

You can bet the Hispanic lady juror thinks a lot differently after Mom Zimmerman and uncle Jorge Meza testified yesterday


31 posted on 07/06/2013 1:47:03 PM PDT by SeminoleCounty (Don't Blame Me For La Raza Rubio....I Voted For Alex Snitker)
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To: Proud2BeRight

IF the resident had a son, he would look AND ACT just like Trayvon.


32 posted on 07/06/2013 1:49:03 PM PDT by basil (2ASisters.org)
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To: SeminoleCounty

nobody remembers juries.

oj jury?

king jury?

kacey anthony?


33 posted on 07/06/2013 1:50:59 PM PDT by longtermmemmory (VOTE! http://www.senate.gov and http://www.house.gov)
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To: marktwain
"The Zimmerman trial is already over"

No trial with racial overtones is over until Eric Holder says it's over. If Zimmerman is acquitted, I fully expect him to bring a Federal complaint of Civil Rights violations against Zimmerman as soon as the riots are over.

34 posted on 07/06/2013 1:52:08 PM PDT by Baynative (Lord, keep one hand on my shoulder and the other over my mouth.)
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To: marktwain

The prosecution said that there was no DNA from Martin on Zimmerman’s gun. That information was designed to create doubt about the theory the neighborhood watch volunteer shot Martin only to prevent the teen from reaching the weapon first. However, The holster of Zimmerman’s gun had DNA from at least three people. One is Zimmerman, but it is uncertain whether one of the two remaining was Martin. Who are the other one or two unidentified people?

Perhaps the defense will nail this DNA inconsistency next week. It may be as simple as Zimmerman got to the gun first when he realized Martin’s hand was going after it.


35 posted on 07/06/2013 1:52:27 PM PDT by jonrick46 (The opium of Communists: other people's money.)
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To: E. Pluribus Unum

Angela Corey holding the hand of tm’s mother in photo op support demands a bias investigation.

Did gz mom have a special mayora audio presentation?


36 posted on 07/06/2013 1:53:45 PM PDT by longtermmemmory (VOTE! http://www.senate.gov and http://www.house.gov)
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To: jurroppi1

Yes the gun expert testified to that fact, bullet in chamber is par for the course and no safety on this gun. She was one of the better to testify,we’ll spoken and seemed to have no agenda.


37 posted on 07/06/2013 1:55:27 PM PDT by lilypad
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To: marktwain

The media is waiting for the verdict, hoping that the evil White man is convicted. But if not, they are ready to film the riots, and to turn their cameras off when an innocent White person is pulled out of his car and beaten mercilessly. The cops are ready to stand by and do nothing.


38 posted on 07/06/2013 2:00:18 PM PDT by I want the USA back (If I Pi$$ed off just one liberal today my mission has been accomplished.)
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To: jurroppi1; alecqss
Kel-Tec PF-9 9mm semi-automatic pistol - http://newsfeed.time.com/2012/03/28/george-zimmermans-gun-a-popular-choice-for-concealed-carry/

From the manual for the gun (http://www.keltecweapons.com/uploaded_files/resources/f_40e0390a11d369dfd1ab8071bc5c91efPF-9_Manual.pdf): SAFETY To achieve highest operator safety, combined with ease of handling, the pistol is "DOUBLE ACTION ONLY". It has no manual safety and the hammer is never fully cocked. The hammer is of a novel design. Compared to a conventional hammer, the pistol is very light and consequently, operates at high velocities. It is driven by a special free floating extension spring. Furthermore, the hammer's mass is concentrated around its axis giving an inertia in the critical direction of the firing pin close to zero. In its ready position the hammer is securely held by the hammer block. Only by deliberately pulling the trigger can the hammer block be disengaged. The tilting action of the barrel excludes firing unless the breech is fully locked. A direct blow to the hammer is impossible, as it is enclosed by the slide and grip. The hammer's energy is transmitted to the primer through a low mass firing pin.

The PF9 is similar to a Glock - the trigger is the safety.

39 posted on 07/06/2013 2:02:00 PM PDT by jurroppi1
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To: jonrick46

the prosecution said there was other dna which could not exclude tm.


40 posted on 07/06/2013 2:03:26 PM PDT by longtermmemmory (VOTE! http://www.senate.gov and http://www.house.gov)
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To: E. Pluribus Unum

At the very least.


41 posted on 07/06/2013 2:04:30 PM PDT by meatloaf (3)
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To: MrEdd

Wonder why the insurance company folded and settled?


42 posted on 07/06/2013 2:05:30 PM PDT by meatloaf (3)
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To: marktwain

What do you think their job is?


43 posted on 07/06/2013 2:06:33 PM PDT by edcoil ("The cave you fear to enter holds the treasure you seek." Joseph Campbell)
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To: davandbar; alecqss

True. Keltec pistols are DOuble Action Only. No external safety to take “off”.


44 posted on 07/06/2013 2:08:03 PM PDT by Eagles6 (Valley Forge Redux)
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To: meatloaf

45 posted on 07/06/2013 2:09:11 PM PDT by E. Pluribus Unum (Who could have known that one day professional wrestling would be less fake than professional news?)
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To: alecqss
The Keltec 9mm is double-action only, just like the Glocks that most cops carry these days.

There is no "safety" to engage.

The long, hard trigger-pull of DAO is the safety, just like on a revolver, which has no "safety."

46 posted on 07/06/2013 2:11:26 PM PDT by E. Pluribus Unum (Who could have known that one day professional wrestling would be less fake than professional news?)
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To: Proud2BeRight

You just KNOW the Wookie is screeching at him every night to make sure that honky cracker fries and does not get away with it..............


47 posted on 07/06/2013 2:13:17 PM PDT by doorgunner69
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To: marktwain

Let em’ riot. Florida is a CCW state and many are armed and ready for a target rich environment if it should present itself. There is not going to be a repeat of the Rodney King runaway riots in areas of the country where CCW is respected.


48 posted on 07/06/2013 2:15:36 PM PDT by vetvetdoug
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To: marktwain

If 40 seconds of getting your head bashed against the sidewalk while screaming for him to stop is not reason enough to shoot to save your life, then when is???


49 posted on 07/06/2013 2:17:24 PM PDT by Uncle Chip
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To: MrEdd; All

“Trayvon had a duty to retreat rather than confront, especially as he and his father were forbidden to stay there under the lease agreement.”

This is actually a pretty important point, because it puts the lie to the claim that Martin had a right to be there.

Is there a source for this claim?


50 posted on 07/06/2013 2:23:22 PM PDT by marktwain (The MSM must die for the Republic to live. Long live the new media!)
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