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On The Elusive Details of Michael Hastings' Death
ZeroHedge ^ | 7/10/2013 | Mike Krieger

Posted on 07/10/2013 9:16:06 AM PDT by mojito

The Michael Hastings Car Crash: No Skids Marks, A Flying Engine And “Boston Brakes”

In cases such as the highly suspicious and tragic car crash/explosion that killed celebrated investigative journalist Michael Hastings, I try to reserve commentary for a little bit to let facts emerge following the initial speculative flurry. Particularly when it involves a journalist with whom I am only slightly familiar. I think we can all agree at this point that based on what has come forward in the past several weeks it is more than likely Mr. Hastings was murdered.

(Excerpt) Read more at zerohedge.com ...


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Extended News; Government; US: California
KEYWORDS: benghazi; breitbart; democrats; fastandfurious; hastings; impeachnow; irs; journalists; lapd; michaelhastings; mystery; obama
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Explain to me how we are not now in the grip of a sinister murderous tyranny?

America under 0bama is now a thuggish, hi-tech banana republic, and the president intends on keeping it that way.

He wanted to destroy America: he succeeded.

1 posted on 07/10/2013 9:16:06 AM PDT by mojito
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To: mojito

Thanks for posting.


2 posted on 07/10/2013 9:19:38 AM PDT by PieterCasparzen (We have to fix things ourselves)
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To: mojito

You have to love how entertaining things get during the endgame. We’re at the stage now where the establishment thugs will not only kill a reporter for committing an act of journalism, but kill him in such an obvious, in-your-face manner so as to advertize that they can kill whoever they want and get away with it. Any bets on when Greenwald and Snowden get Hasting’d?


3 posted on 07/10/2013 9:23:26 AM PDT by Orangedog (An optimist is someone who tells you to 'cheer up' when things are going his way)
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To: mojito
If a high-performance automobile does a 60 degree turn in the middle of the night and crashes leaving no skidmarks, I guess one explanation might be that there was a secret government conspiracy to kill the driver.

Another one might be that he fell asleep or passed out at the wheel.

4 posted on 07/10/2013 9:24:07 AM PDT by wideawake
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To: mojito

Yes, thanks for the post.

I hope Tyler Durden is watching his back, too. He has a habit of posting what he thinks about the Federal Reserve and other matters, and he often criticizes Gubbermint management.

Yes, with the LAPD sitting the evidence, this would be pretty hard to prove. But it seems extremely likely that he was murdered—and not the first.


5 posted on 07/10/2013 9:27:35 AM PDT by Cicero (Marcus Tullius)
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To: mojito

I believe that the C-class is designed to eject the engine in the event of a crash.


6 posted on 07/10/2013 9:28:51 AM PDT by altsehastiin
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To: mojito

The drive train seperated from the body ? And was found 150 feet from the body of the car ?


7 posted on 07/10/2013 9:31:06 AM PDT by PieterCasparzen (We have to fix things ourselves)
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To: altsehastiin

I believe that the C-class is designed to eject the engine in the event of a crash.


I read that it is designed to do that.


8 posted on 07/10/2013 9:31:58 AM PDT by laplata (Liberals don't get it. Their minds have been stolen.)
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To: wideawake
An eyewitness at the scene, Jose, employed at nearby business ALSCO Inc said, the car was traveling very fast and he heard a couple explosions shortly before the car crashed.

Can passing out at the wheel cause the car to explode BEFORE it crashes?

9 posted on 07/10/2013 9:32:26 AM PDT by Count of Monte Fisto
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To: mojito

And no one has asked Mercedes for assistance in understanding what happened ?


10 posted on 07/10/2013 9:32:28 AM PDT by PieterCasparzen (We have to fix things ourselves)
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To: Orangedog
Any bets on when Greenwald and Snowden get Hasting’d?

My only bet would be both Greenwald and Snowden are in somebody's Dead Pool, and the stakes are very high.

5.56mm

11 posted on 07/10/2013 9:32:31 AM PDT by M Kehoe
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To: Count of Monte Fisto
Can passing out at the wheel cause the car to explode BEFORE it crashes?

Good point. If the famous Jose says so, then there is no need for further inquiry.

12 posted on 07/10/2013 9:33:53 AM PDT by wideawake
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To: wideawake

Good point. If the famous Jose says so, then there is no need for further inquiry.


Actually there IS. That’s the point.


13 posted on 07/10/2013 9:38:49 AM PDT by cuban leaf (Were doomed! Details at eleven.)
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To: wideawake

One thing I learned a long time ago was to be very wary of coincidences. The coincidences surrounding this, coupled with the driver’s MO and the details of the event cause one to immediately suspect fowl play. And the more we learn, the more apparent it is.


14 posted on 07/10/2013 9:40:19 AM PDT by cuban leaf (Were doomed! Details at eleven.)
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To: Orangedog
Any bets on when Greenwald and Snowden get Hasting’d?

Don't forget the original one......"Breitbart'd"

15 posted on 07/10/2013 9:41:53 AM PDT by rockabyebaby (We are sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo screwed!)
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To: cuban leaf

fowl play: were ducks and chickens involved?


16 posted on 07/10/2013 9:43:18 AM PDT by kabumpo (Kabumpo)
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To: wideawake

No, no, no. You are in FreeRepublic Konspiracy Korner. You are not allowed to point out “reasonable alternatives” to hyperventilating conspiratorial speculators. Doing so is one sign of a disinformation agent, or a liberal troll! /s


17 posted on 07/10/2013 9:43:41 AM PDT by Boogieman
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To: kabumpo

fowl play: were ducks and chickens involved?


Banty roosters.


18 posted on 07/10/2013 9:44:29 AM PDT by cuban leaf (Were doomed! Details at eleven.)
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To: Boogieman
You are in FreeRepublic Konspiracy Korner.

Is that where we will read how both Breitbart and Hasting's phones were 'on alert' with the help of their carrier? Everyone knows the gov't can't do that.

19 posted on 07/10/2013 9:51:35 AM PDT by presently no screen name
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To: cuban leaf

Hmm, but hasn’t everyone already concluded that he was murdered, based on a video and what a few people like Jose have said? So, why bother to investigate? We don’t need pesky facts coming to light and getting in the way of righteous indignation! /s


20 posted on 07/10/2013 9:53:03 AM PDT by Boogieman
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To: presently no screen name

Well, you’ve posted it just now, so yes, we will all read that here!


21 posted on 07/10/2013 9:54:03 AM PDT by Boogieman
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To: Boogieman

Oh. Then you can read it but don’t believe it - it’s all a conspiracy.


22 posted on 07/10/2013 9:56:49 AM PDT by presently no screen name
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To: cuban leaf
"the details of the event cause one to immediately suspect fowl play."

"Absstthhalutely"

23 posted on 07/10/2013 9:58:46 AM PDT by Justa
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To: presently no screen name

Well, I believe that you wrote that post. Beyond that, I don’t have any clue as to your source or your personal qualifications so that I can judge whether what you wrote is true or not.


24 posted on 07/10/2013 9:59:58 AM PDT by Boogieman
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To: cuban leaf
The basics here seem to be:

(1) Michael Hastings was a journalist best known for getting Stanley McChrystal fired. He got McChrystal fired by revealing that McChrystal and his staff were critical of the Obama adminstration's handling of the war in Afghanistan.

So Hastings, as a journalist, was carrying water for the Obama administration and gave them the political cover they needed to get rid of a troublesome general.

Why this would make him a hero to any conservative is puzzling.

(2) Michael Hastings was one of the hundreds of journalists who were justly critical of the Obama administrations spying on journalists and who wrote opinion pieces expressing their displeasure.

(3) Michael Hastings supposedly told friends that he suspected the FBI was investigating him. Wikileaks also announced that Hastings had been in contact with them. There has not been a whole lot of verifiable information on these points.

(4) Michael Hastings crashed his car at 4:25am on a Tuesday morning. While there are many allegations, what we do know is that the vehicle hit a palm tree at high speed and burst into flames, and that the engine skidded about 50 or 60 yards down the street after the impact.

Despite heated claims to the contrary, Mercedes are not magic and they do indeed burst into flames from time to time.

(5) The LAPD is currently conducting an investigation of the accident, and they have not invited bloggers to collaborate in their investigation with them. Which I would imagine is a standard policy for most law enforcement agencies.

So we have a case of a journalist involved in an early morning car crash. A journalist who agreed with 99% of his colleagues on the issue of government surveillance of journalists.

There is still no plausible, checkable reason why Hastings would be singled out for an assassination, nor is there any obvious sign that this was any different from a car crash in which a sleepy driver loses control.

I look forward to learning more about the case.

25 posted on 07/10/2013 10:00:46 AM PDT by wideawake
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To: wideawake
Another one might be that he fell asleep or passed out at the wheel.

And that seems logical given the time and circumstances. But there's one thing about the incident that troubles me. Images shown right after the crash displayed what appeared to be a shiny new totally intact gas tank behind the car.

If a gasoline explosion killed the driver and burned the car, why is the gas tank intact? I don't know enough about that particular car to judge. Maybe it has two gas tanks and only one blew up. But the worst fire damage appears to be concentrated just behind the driver's seat, ahead of where the tank is lying, and the right rear of the car.

Will we ever know what happened about this and other important things in American life? Each morning when I check the news I feel as if I'm traveling a bit further daily into Never-Never Land.

26 posted on 07/10/2013 10:02:03 AM PDT by Bernard Marx
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To: mojito

Correction,

it IS a Banana Republic but with reserve currency status.

Once that is gone then it`ll be a violent thugish left-wing gestapo type of Banana Republic.


27 posted on 07/10/2013 10:02:18 AM PDT by Para-Ord.45 (Happily in tutelage by the reflection that they have chosen their own guardians.)
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To: wideawake

There hasn’t been a toxicology report released, perhaps because the body was so badly burned that getting a tissue reading is difficult.


28 posted on 07/10/2013 10:09:20 AM PDT by mojito (Zero, our Nero.)
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To: wideawake

Here’s a blogger who has some interesting pictures and questions...

http://whitenoise.gizmodo.com/now-im-convinced-that-michael-hastings-car-was-bombed-632980340


29 posted on 07/10/2013 10:11:12 AM PDT by PieterCasparzen (We have to fix things ourselves)
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To: Bernard Marx
what appeared to be a shiny new totally intact gas tank behind the car

All I see is something shiny and possibly metallic, which could describe many, many objects.

I don't see how it is identifiable as a gas tank, especially when so many tanks do not have a shiny, metallic finish.

30 posted on 07/10/2013 10:11:28 AM PDT by wideawake
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To: wideawake

As I said, I’m not an automobile expert. But one of the images shows an object that looks to me very much like a gas tank. Of course I could be wrong. I have that image on a flash drive but don’t know how to upload it to this thread.


31 posted on 07/10/2013 10:17:01 AM PDT by Bernard Marx
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To: PieterCasparzen
It's definitely an interesting link, but each point he makes is couched in terms of how it could be explained by a bomb.

In other words, he begins with the assumption that it must have been a bomb and then proceeds to explain how to combat arguments against it being a bomb.

So we have four schools of conspiratorial thought now: (a) it was a bomb, (b) it was a "drive by wire" remote crash, (c) he was drugged and the toxicology report is being withheld for this reason, (d) It was done remotely and a "thermite device" was used to burn the car to cover up evidence.

It's a little exhausting.

All of these angles have the same structure: it had to be foul play, there is no chance it could possibly have been an accident, so we need to figure out how to jimmy the facts to fit the foregone conclusion.

32 posted on 07/10/2013 10:22:00 AM PDT by wideawake
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To: wideawake

(4) Michael Hastings crashed his car at 4:25am on a Tuesday morning. While there are many allegations, what we do know is that the vehicle hit a palm tree at high speed and burst into flames, and that the engine skidded about 50 or 60 yards down the street after the impact.*****

My understanding is that the engine and tranny were located about 150 to 200 ft away from the crash site. The funny thing is that they were located along the path the car had taken before impact. Meaning separation from the chassis had to occur prior to impact with the tree. Also photos appear to indicate the car didn’t crash into the palm tree but came to rest against the palm tree.

Laws of physics would dictate the engine assembly could not have separated as a result of impact with the tree given the engine’s location. If so, it would have continued on in the direction of travel at the point of impact which was away from the street and beyond (not before) the point of impact.

I’m certainly no fan of Rolling Stone and I know very little about Hastings, but the crash scene bears little resemblence to a simple head on collision.


33 posted on 07/10/2013 10:23:54 AM PDT by bereanway
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To: bereanway
Meaning separation from the chassis had to occur prior to impact with the tree.

That's an assumption. It did not "have to" occur prior to impact. It could have occurred upon impact and those components could have ricocheted off the tree (or a kerb or any other deflector) back along the path.

Also photos appear to indicate the car didn’t crash into the palm tree but came to rest against the palm tree.

A still photo taken after the fact, by its very nature, cannot demonstrate that to be the case.

Laws of physics would dictate the engine assembly could not have separated as a result of impact with the tree given the engine’s location.

Which laws are those, now, specifically?

If so, it would have continued on in the direction of travel at the point of impact

Unless it hit something, like a sturdy tree, in which case it would not have.

the crash scene bears little resemblence to a simple head on collision

The photos do not show that it was a head-on, 90 degree angle collision.

I don't think anyone is claiming that this was a "simple head on" collision.

34 posted on 07/10/2013 10:33:30 AM PDT by wideawake
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To: wideawake

The simple laws of mechanics, motion and kinetic energy. For the car to have impacted a stationary object and then have an assembly as massive as the drivetrain to reverse direction and end up 150-200ft behind the car is impossible.

The entire drivetrain would have had to reverse direction through the firewall and passenger compartment and then have the energy to travel the 150-200 ft against the direction of travel. Still photos do indicate the type of front end collision necessary to even approach that type of event and generate that level of kinetic energy simply did not occur.


35 posted on 07/10/2013 10:56:27 AM PDT by bereanway
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To: bereanway; wideawake

Well, here’s a little different take on such a happening:

http://www.roadandtrack.com/features/web-originals/features-web-originals-anatomy-of-a-high-speed-car-crash


36 posted on 07/10/2013 11:00:55 AM PDT by jjotto ("Ya could look it up!")
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To: wideawake

Are you stupid?


37 posted on 07/10/2013 11:04:49 AM PDT by bmwcyle (People who do not study history are destine to believe really ignorant statements.)
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To: bereanway

The story that the engine ended up behind the vehicle instead of launched ahead of it came from a dumba** reporterette from San Diego Channel 6 who got it wrong:

http://metabunk.org/threads/debunked-michael-hastings-crash-engine-found-north-of-crash-going-south.1964/


38 posted on 07/10/2013 11:08:25 AM PDT by jjotto ("Ya could look it up!")
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To: kabumpo

Fowl play required him to play chicken with the palm tree.


39 posted on 07/10/2013 11:14:20 AM PDT by Bigg Red (Restore us, O God of hosts; let your face shine, that we may be saved! -Ps80)
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To: wideawake

I was just basically looking at the fact that the car had frontal impact with the tree.

The driveshaft clean break, motor mounts break, and then the engine and transmission flying off to the right at a 45 degree angle and land 180 feet away just sounds like a bit of a stretch.

I did find an accident account online where a Shelby lost its engine, but the supercharged 5.4 liter engine seemed to have ripped the front suspension off the car. The driver in that case, however, was accelerating and hit an embankment and, according to the story...

“Utilizing Ford’s newest ejection technology, the front end of the car separated from the rest of the Shelby. The Acura RSX trailing behind then collided with the supercharged powerplant and punted it down the road.”

I don’t know if Mercedes uses any kind of “ejection” technology in the model car Mr. Hastings was driving. I’ve never heard of an engine flying out of a car when there is frontal impact.


40 posted on 07/10/2013 11:19:38 AM PDT by PieterCasparzen (We have to fix things ourselves)
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To: wideawake
Unless it hit something, like a sturdy tree, in which case it would not have.

I did not see any markings on the palm tree that would have been left by an engine/transmission bouncing off it and flying 180 feet. Would have to go through that video again frame by frame.
41 posted on 07/10/2013 11:23:26 AM PDT by PieterCasparzen (We have to fix things ourselves)
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To: bereanway
The simple laws of mechanics, motion and kinetic energy. For the car to have impacted a stationary object and then have an assembly as massive as the drivetrain to reverse direction and end up 150-200ft behind the car is impossible.

It's entirely possible.

Are you familiar with the concept of a vector?

The entire drivetrain would have had to reverse direction through the firewall and passenger compartment

That's a statement which, again, makes a ton of assumptions about the angle of impact and the trajectory of these components - assumptions which are not provable from the data available.

Still photos do indicate the type of front end collision necessary to even approach that type of event and generate that level of kinetic energy simply did not occur.

They indicate no such thing.

A 3000cc engine weighs a couple of hundred pounds. What happens if you bounce a couple of hundred pounds against a fairly rigid object at 80mph? How far could it go?

42 posted on 07/10/2013 11:30:14 AM PDT by wideawake
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To: bereanway; wideawake

Based on the photos available so far, we do not know the exact angle and point of impact. The arrow drawn on the picture I just looked at is just that - an arrow drawn on a picture.

Based on the many (and there have been many) automobile crashes and post-crash scenes I have witnessed, cleaned-up, and/or been a party to, nothing in that picture - not the engine, not the debris field, not even the front driver’s side wheel/tire assembly - is situated in a manner as to lead me to suspect anything other than a high speed impact with a tree, in the median, at some angle between approximately 30 and 60 degrees to the original direction of travel.

I have to agree with ‘wideawake’ on this one. It appears to me that the conspiracy-theorists are jumping the gun on this one (at least based on the information available so far - and with the caveat that I, of course, was not there and did not witness the event).

Claims of bombs and pre-crash explosions aside, I once had a crash quite similar to the one in question (at least as it has been described in the media). I drove a small European sport sedan more-or-less head-on in to the end of a highway guardrail (after crossing from the right to the left side of the road) at about 110 mph. While in my case the engine did not detach from the chassis, other parts of the car ended up as far away as 350 feet from the point of impact, and they were not situated in a straight line along the direction of travel at impact. They were spread out in a sort of ‘fan’ pattern.

When a car is turning (rotating about its vertical axis)during a crash, the path of any parts/debris which fly off will describe an arc in three dimensions, the length and radius of the arc, and its angle(s) in the horizontal and vertical planes, will be dependent upon the force of impact and the rotational forces acting on the car at the time of impact, and on the part in question at its time of departure from the vehicle (as well as the size, weight, shape and drag coefficient of the part, of course).

The bottom line is, the disintegration of an automobile after a high speed impact is a complicated ‘dance’ with the laws of physics, and its results can seem very strange and can be difficult to explain.

As far as the location of the driver’s side wheel/tire assembly goes, when a wheel/tire detaches from a vehicle during a crash, it is absolutely impossible to predict its subsequent behavior, especially if it continues rolling and or has other parts still hanging off of it (such as hubs, brake rotors, tie-rods, etc).

I once found a wheel/tire/brake assembly from a Mazda RX-7 12-15 feet up in a tree, almost directly perpendicular to the vehicle’s path at impact, about 250 feet away from and on the opposite side of the car (this was following a high-speed crash on a road racing course where I was working as a Corner-Marshall). I witnessed the crash, and I still have no idea how the wheel & tire ended up in that tree.


43 posted on 07/10/2013 11:36:35 AM PDT by WayneS (Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos...)
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To: cuban leaf

Excellent repartee!


44 posted on 07/10/2013 11:36:52 AM PDT by doberville
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To: bmwcyle
Are you stupid?

Yes.

I will never be as intelligent as bmwcycle believes that bmwcycle is.

45 posted on 07/10/2013 11:38:35 AM PDT by wideawake
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To: bereanway

The engine did not land behind the car.


46 posted on 07/10/2013 11:39:15 AM PDT by WayneS (Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos...)
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To: WayneS
The bottom line is, the disintegration of an automobile after a high speed impact is a complicated ‘dance’ with the laws of physics, and its results can seem very strange and can be difficult to explain.

Said much better than I could hope to say it.

Fascinating post.

47 posted on 07/10/2013 11:41:01 AM PDT by wideawake
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To: rockabyebaby
Don't forget the original one......"Breitbart'd"

That one wasn't quite as onvious. Middle aged fat guys expiring from heart attacks every now and again, but exploding Mercedes with engines that go walkies...not so much. This could only have been more obvious if he was driving a Volvo.

48 posted on 07/10/2013 11:41:23 AM PDT by Orangedog (An optimist is someone who tells you to 'cheer up' when things are going his way)
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To: jjotto
Thanks, jjotto.

I've learned more about this incident on this thread - both pro-conspiracy and skeptical - than I have any any other thread on this subject.

49 posted on 07/10/2013 11:44:50 AM PDT by wideawake
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To: Orangedog
This could only have been more obvious if he was driving a Volvo.

You should read posts 36 and 43.

50 posted on 07/10/2013 11:46:23 AM PDT by wideawake
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