Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Lac-Megantic crash could be oil-by-rail’s Exxon Valdez
Platts ^ | July 10, 2013 | Melanie Wold

Posted on 07/10/2013 10:47:48 AM PDT by thackney

As the smoke clears (literally) in Lac-Megantic, Quebec, after a runaway train packed with crude oil tankers crashed July 6, the oil industry is coming to terms with a business that has perhaps grown too far too fast. The Lac-Megantic accident is shining an unwelcome spotlight on the lack of regulatory oversight on oil by rail in both the US and Canada. The fact that the rail cars (belonging to the Maine, Montreal & Atlantic rail company) that crashed and exploded were considered unfit to carry hazardous materials sharpens that focus.

Getting landlocked crude out of newer fields in North Dakota, Canada and other far flung parts of North America has become an obsession with producers, traders and refiners, the latter group looking lustfully at the cheaper feedstock.

The oil rush has changed the face of rail in North America. In a country where passenger and cargo-bearing rail was largely replaced by the car and large 18-wheel trucks half a century ago, the speed with which new railroad lines, railcars and loading facilities are being built is simply astonishing.

Today around one million barrels per day of crude oil is moved via rail across the US and Canada. To put that into perspective, it equates to more than the total daily output of the UK North Sea, which fell below 1.0m b/d last year. Or to roughly four VLCC’s worth of crude oil every week. In other words, it is a lot of oil.

And this is set to grow. In the US alone, crude by rail shipments are expected to reach to near 1.10 million b/d at the end of 2014, up from about 718,000 b/d this month and about 156,000 b/d in January of 2012, according to Bentek Energy, a unit of Platts.

The Railway Association of Canada estimated that as many as 140,000 carloads of crude, totaling about 91 million barrels, will be shipped on Canadian tracks this year, compared with 500 carloads, or about 325,000 barrels, in 2009.

But the headlong dive into crude by rail may have just been stopped short by the Lac-Megantic incident. And, just as the Exxon Valdez oil spill in Alaska in 1989 spelled the end of single-hull oil tankers coming to the US (and banned them worldwide in 2010), the Lac-Megantic crash would spell the end of using DOT-111A railcars. And it could herald a new rash of regulation for the rail industry.

A US National Transportation Safety Board study in 2012 said that 69% of tank cars are DOT-111A. In Canada, these are known as CTX-111A, and comprise 80% of the fleet, according to Canada Transportation Safety Board’s chief investigator Donald Ross.

Ross said that changes as a result of the MM&A investigation could include thicker steel or shields for the tank cars. The American NTSB had already changed the specifications of DOT-111 from October 2011 to include thicker shells and a ½ inch thick head shield. But there is no rule on retrofitting existing cars, which have a long service life.

Like the single-hull tanker post-Exxon Valdez, DOT-111As could be the next casualty of the oil rush in North America.

But there are other issues raising their ugly heads, including the state of some of the railroad tracks around both countries. While the oil industry is spending billions on railcars and loading/unloading facilities, who is spending the money to maintain and upgrade the railroads?

As Avrom Shtern, a rail-transport policy representative with Montreal-based Green Coalition, said in Platts Oilgram News July 9, Canadian government’s budget cuts have left the rail industry to police itself. “That’s unacceptable. You can’t just write rules and expect the railways to police themselves,” he said.

Also, questions are rife over the capital adequacy of smaller gathering and distribution companies such as World Fuel, which owned the oil on board the MM&A train. Will they have the financial stability to survive a lawsuit?

The crash was only a few days ago, so most of these questions will be answered over time. Crude by rail has come a long way in a short time. But the Quebec accident could slow the pace and the way in which the industry grows going forward, in both Canada and the US.


TOPICS: Canada; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: energy; lacmegantic; oil; train; traincrash
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-5051-73 next last

1 posted on 07/10/2013 10:47:48 AM PDT by thackney
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies]

To: thackney

Corporate terrorism?


2 posted on 07/10/2013 10:55:09 AM PDT by Errant
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: thackney

I never really thought about moving crude from land locked areas. The refinery where I work produces mostly jet fuel, and has pipelines to both STL and Ohare. The rest of the product (lubricants and coke, mostly)is moved by truck or barge, as we are right on the river..


3 posted on 07/10/2013 10:55:52 AM PDT by cardinal4 (Skip impeachment and move straight to deportation..)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: thackney

No it won’t. Only people were killed, not birds and seals.


4 posted on 07/10/2013 10:56:35 AM PDT by Tijeras_Slim
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: thackney
No. The message is clear.

We need to put windmills and solar panels on trains.

That way we can move them when necessary to the best places for wind and sun.

The trains themselves will be run completely on the positive vibes of good intentions.

5 posted on 07/10/2013 10:59:38 AM PDT by who_would_fardels_bear
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: thackney
"the rail cars (belonging to the Maine, Montreal & Atlantic rail company) "

I doubt that that is true.

6 posted on 07/10/2013 11:04:16 AM PDT by Paladin2
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: thackney

Surprisingly, they’re not calling it Øbama’s exxon-valdez and all the drama it has caused to him, blah blah, blah, ‘we must act before its too late’, blah blah blah
yet


7 posted on 07/10/2013 11:04:42 AM PDT by ßuddaßudd (>> F U B O << "What the hell kind of country is this if I can only hate a man if he's white?")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: thackney
"as many as 140,000 carloads of crude, totaling about 91 million barrels, will be shipped on Canadian tracks this year, "

That's on the order of 4 trains/day starting their journey.

8 posted on 07/10/2013 11:07:14 AM PDT by Paladin2
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: thackney

Ban tanker trains? The solution is in the pipe...


9 posted on 07/10/2013 11:07:51 AM PDT by null and void (Republicans create the tools of oppression, and the democrats gleefully use them!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: thackney

So, how did the “Greens” manage to sabotage the train?


10 posted on 07/10/2013 11:12:51 AM PDT by JimRed (Excise the cancer before it kills us; feed &water the Tree of Liberty! TERM LIMITS, NOW & FOREVER!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Paladin2

Montreal, Maine & Atlantic Railway (MMA)
July 6, 2013 Derailment in Lac-Mégantic, Quebec (Update)
http://www.mmarail.com/sections/news/files/MMA_7.7.2013_Press%20Release_1415.EST.pdf
: Sunday, July 7, 2013: 1615 EST

Montreal, Maine & Atlantic Railway wishes to provide updated information on yesterday’s tragic train accident at Lac-Mégantic, Quebec. We are advised the fires are largely extinguished, and it appears the fire brigade will finish that part of their task shortly. Provincial and Federal authorities have taken control of the derailment area, and MMA personnel have not been able to enter to continue their investigation concerning cause and to plan recovery operations.

There are a dozen MMA representatives on hand in Lac-Mégantic, with more arriving continuously. Many have been there since yesterday afternoon, in spite of statements that MMA people have not been available. MMA has established a command center in the Municipal Building. On hand also is Yves Bourdon, MMA board member, who will be the “voice of the MMA” in dealing with municipal, provincial and Federal officials, emergency personnel, relief organizations and affected individuals and property owners. Also on hand is Robert Grindrod, MMA’s President and CEO.

More at:
http://www.mmarail.com/mma_news.php


11 posted on 07/10/2013 11:16:10 AM PDT by thackney (life is fragile, handle with prayer)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 6 | View Replies]

To: JimRed

By convincing the train company to put a oil train on a grade with no one in attendance and not set sufficient hand brakes to hold it in place?


12 posted on 07/10/2013 11:21:37 AM PDT by thackney (life is fragile, handle with prayer)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 10 | View Replies]

To: null and void

They are busy creating what environmentalists love, a “you can’t get there from here” situation. Apparently, the lack of a fail safe breaking system is the core problem here. That’s a quite solvable problem. No, the bureaucrats will mandate an immediate replacement of 60+% of the tankers and massive rail upgrades. All horribly expensive which is right down Obama’s alley.

Now ten dollar a gallon gas is within our reach.


13 posted on 07/10/2013 11:23:02 AM PDT by JimSEA
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 9 | View Replies]

To: who_would_fardels_bear
The trains themselves will be run completely on the positive vibes of good intentions.

Nahh. The trains are self-powered by their own windmills.

14 posted on 07/10/2013 11:24:21 AM PDT by Sherman Logan
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 5 | View Replies]

To: thackney
"MMA said it does not own the rail cars involved in the latest accident. Chairman Ed Burkhardt said the cars were leased by the same company that was shipping the crude, but he declined to identify it, Reuters reported."

I read that tanker railcars are leasing at $3,000/mo these days. All the more reason to keep them moving 24/7 rather than parking them at the "top of a hill" overnight.

15 posted on 07/10/2013 11:24:37 AM PDT by Paladin2
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 11 | View Replies]

To: JimRed

http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/2013/07/10/lac_megantic_explosion_mma_railway_boss_ed_burkhardt_tours_town.html

Ed Burkhardt, the chairman of Maine, Montreal and Atlantic Railways...

Burkhardt arrived Wednesday morning in Lac Megantic, a Quebec town decimated after a runaway MMA train hurtled into downtown early Saturday morning, derailed and exploded. Burkhardt announced that Tom Harding, the engineer who left the train, has been suspended and will likely not work for the company again.

“I have never been involved in anything remotely approaching this in my whole life,” he said, as angry residents heckled from behind the media scrum on a Lac Megantic street.

Burkhardt said it now appears that Harding didn’t properly set the handbrakes on the rail cars.

“He’s not being paid, I don’t think he’ll be back working for us,” said Burkhardt.


16 posted on 07/10/2013 11:32:00 AM PDT by thackney (life is fragile, handle with prayer)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 10 | View Replies]

To: Paladin2

Thanks, I had not seen that but found it with your lead.

I don’t think that will change the responsibility, unless the inadequate DOT-111 tank cars were claimed to be something stronger.

Criminal probe launched into Quebec rail disaster
http://www.upstreamonline.com/live/article1331824.ece
09 July 2013

MMA said it does not own the rail cars involved in the latest accident. Chairman Ed Burkhardt said the cars were leased by the same company that was shipping the crude, but he declined to identify it, Reuters reported.

World Fuel Services has confirmed it was shipping the crude, but did not respond to Reuters questions about the cars.


17 posted on 07/10/2013 11:38:08 AM PDT by thackney (life is fragile, handle with prayer)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 15 | View Replies]

To: Paladin2

Interesting they haven’t taken this page down yet.

Risk Management
https://www.wfscorp.com/Risk_Management/index.jsp

In today’s global economy, risk and price volatility are urgent concerns of both customers and suppliers. The dedicated team of risk management experts at World Fuel Services provides solutions.

Uniquely positioned by our global presence, singular focus, and organizational expertise, our team designs comprehensive, creative and effective risk management programs customized to client needs.

(www.wfscorp.com => World Fuel Services Corporation)


18 posted on 07/10/2013 11:41:45 AM PDT by thackney (life is fragile, handle with prayer)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 15 | View Replies]

To: thackney

Wouldn’t the MSM have at least mention the derailment, before it became a factor in the discussion?

oh....maybe even show the 10 min. video once?????

perhaps a 30 second excerpt????


19 posted on 07/10/2013 12:01:11 PM PDT by G Larry (Let his days be few; and let another take his office. Psalms 109:8)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: G Larry

I wouldn’t know. I quit getting news from such sources a long time ago.


20 posted on 07/10/2013 12:07:27 PM PDT by thackney (life is fragile, handle with prayer)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 19 | View Replies]

To: G Larry

My local ABC, NBC & CBS all include the story at their web site.

http://abclocal.go.com/ktrk/channel?section=news/national_world&id=7102517

http://houston.cbslocal.com/world-news/

http://www.click2houston.com/news/nationalnews


21 posted on 07/10/2013 12:12:22 PM PDT by thackney (life is fragile, handle with prayer)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 19 | View Replies]

To: thackney
There are data out there regarding derailment rates:

Found so far:

http://www.tc.gc.ca/media/documents/railsafety/transys.pdf

http://www.tsb.gc.ca/eng/rapports-reports/rail/etudes-studies/sr9401/sr9401.asp#a3

22 posted on 07/10/2013 12:12:41 PM PDT by Paladin2
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 18 | View Replies]

To: Mycroft Holmes; All

Can someone with more direct train knowledge provide information or speculation on the following:

http://www.cnn.com/2013/07/10/world/americas/canada-runaway-train/index.html?hpt=hp_t1

Nine black tanker cars filled with crude oil still stand silently in the town of Nantes.

They remained behind when the rest of the train they were attached to broke away and began rolling early Saturday down an incline, seven miles uphill from Lac-Megantic.

...

His engineer reported having deployed the hand brakes on a number of tanker cars and on the engines. The brakes on the locomotives eventually held, he said.

They stopped a quarter of a mile away from their original parking spot in Nantes, he said. They did not make it to Lac-Megantic.

He could not explain what happened with the brakes on the 72 oil cars that did.

- - - - - - -

Please ping those that might be able to explain more how cars might separate in such an event.


23 posted on 07/10/2013 12:21:20 PM PDT by thackney (life is fragile, handle with prayer)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: thackney

I was being semi-sarcastic about the “Greens”; I wouldn’t put it past them to cause an environmental disaster to prove that they are right in their opposition to whatever technology they are currently against.


24 posted on 07/10/2013 12:31:16 PM PDT by JimRed (Excise the cancer before it kills us; feed &water the Tree of Liberty! TERM LIMITS, NOW & FOREVER!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 16 | View Replies]

To: thackney

This wreck was created.
1. locomotives have a deadman switch which must be disengaged to let the engine move.
2. When train cars are unintentionally separated, all brakes on the train are automaticaly engaged.
3. It is surprising that tank cars filled with crude oil would explode is surprising as the stuff is not very volatile.


25 posted on 07/10/2013 12:44:42 PM PDT by Lion Den Dan
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Lion Den Dan
1. Locomotive brake torque and steel wheel to steel rail friction may not be sufficient to hold an entire loaded freight train on a grade.

2. The tank cars only separated from the train at the derailment point.

3. Crude can have all sorts of hydrocarbons present. Where does straight run gasoline come from? Also look up BLEVE.

26 posted on 07/10/2013 12:54:47 PM PDT by Paladin2
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 25 | View Replies]

To: thackney

I don’t believe that there are any normal circumstances that would cause the cars to break away from each other. The couplings must have been released. I’m thinking teenagers pulling a tragic prank.


27 posted on 07/10/2013 12:57:00 PM PDT by Mycroft Holmes (<= Mash name for HTML Xampp PHP C JavaScript primer. Programming for everyone.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 23 | View Replies]

To: Lion Den Dan
1. locomotives have a deadman switch which must be disengaged to let the engine move.

I believe you are talking about moving by the engine, not a gravity roll as happened here.

2. When train cars are unintentionally separated, all brakes on the train are automatically engaged.

Yes, each car has an air reservoir tank that provides pressure to engage the brakes on loss of main air supply. But those tanks don't last forever. They are intended to give the train operators time to set the hand brakes. They are not intended to hold the train indefinitely while unattended.

3. It is surprising that tank cars filled with crude oil would explode is surprising as the stuff is not very volatile.

The tank cars were DOT-111 design which US National Transportation Safety Board has advised these, when used to carry ethanol and crude oil, be reinforced to make them more resistant to punctures if trains derail.

The tanks didn't initially explode, but several did leak and a large pool fire started. Several tanks that did not rupture but sat in the burning pool eventually did explode after being heated and building up significant pressure.

You might want to look at the link in post #16 where the Chairman of the railroad operating this train talked about the engineer who left the train unattended did not appear to set sufficient hand brakes.

28 posted on 07/10/2013 1:00:27 PM PDT by thackney (life is fragile, handle with prayer)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 25 | View Replies]

To: Mycroft Holmes

Thank you. The little I know about them seemed to require some intention action, rather than a loss of power, pressure, etc.

There could have been some attempt during the first fire (when the engine was shut down) to separate the cars, but that is only my speculation; I haven’t read anything like that.


29 posted on 07/10/2013 1:02:59 PM PDT by thackney (life is fragile, handle with prayer)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 27 | View Replies]

To: Paladin2
2. The tank cars only separated from the train at the derailment point.

Actually, some few cars, including the engines I think, separated prior to the derailment and stopped on the grade. I don't understand this part.

See post 23 for link.

30 posted on 07/10/2013 1:05:18 PM PDT by thackney (life is fragile, handle with prayer)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 26 | View Replies]

To: thackney
Here's what I think happened (based on belief in the Newtonian laws of physics and reading lots of "journalist" reports and reviewing multitudinous photos):

The train was parked near the top of a ~1% grade. One locomotive was left running and the regular (whole) train brakes were left on (air pressure from the loco's compressor to make up for the normal leakage). The locomotive brakes were likely applied in some fashion. The mechanical "park" brakes on a few tanks cars were set in some fashion. The (one man) train crew caught a cab to town for the night.

The front locomotive had a fuel leak and the locomotive caught fire.

A Nantes resident was driving by and saw the fire. Nantes FD was called. They shut off the locomotive per procedure and put out the fire. The Nantes FD contacted somebody associated with the railroad. One or more RR reps showed up. The FD left. The RR reps did who knows what and left.

Eventually the brake forces reduced and the train started to move.

By the time the train reached Lac Megantic it was doing something like 40 to 60 mph. The train entered the town's rail yard where the typical speed is 10mph to be able to negotiate the switches and curve.

At least the locomotives and maybe some tank cars made it through the yard. Approximately 50 cars derailed near the first switch and piled into each other disconnecting from the front of the train which kept going. 9 to 13 cars at the end of the train remained on the tracks.

Ruptured tanks spread the crude which caught on fire from some unknown ignition source. The fire swept through parts of the town as some of the crude flowed downhill towards the lake.

The intense fire at the pileup caused 4 to six of the tank cars to achieve a BLEVE explosion.

During the fire the engineer (who was now in town at his hotel) grabbed a rail car moving vehicle and removed the intact tanks cars from the rear of the train and pulled them away from the blaze. A day or so later the RR came and hauled the 9 to 13 intact tank cars back up to Nantes.

The locomotives and possibly a few tank cars came to a stop somewhere on the other side of town as there were still brakes applied, the grade was now level or rising and the mass of the train was now much less.

31 posted on 07/10/2013 1:24:05 PM PDT by Paladin2
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 23 | View Replies]

To: Paladin2
Thank you for that summary.

During the fire the engineer (who was now in town at his hotel) grabbed a rail car moving vehicle and removed the intact tanks cars from the rear of the train and pulled them away from the blaze. A day or so later the RR came and hauled the 9 to 13 intact tank cars back up to Nantes.

I had not seen this part. If you come back across the link, I would like to read it. Not doubting, just trying to learn more.

Cheers!

32 posted on 07/10/2013 1:30:32 PM PDT by thackney (life is fragile, handle with prayer)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 31 | View Replies]

To: Paladin2
A Nantes resident was driving by and saw the fire. Nantes FD was called. They shut off the locomotive per procedure and put out the fire. The Nantes FD contacted somebody associated with the railroad. One or more RR reps showed up. The FD left. The RR reps did who knows what and left.

How do you know that part? I ask because it is the crux of this who incident.

33 posted on 07/10/2013 1:36:10 PM PDT by Balding_Eagle (When America falls, darkness will cover the face of the earth for a thousand years.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 31 | View Replies]

To: Balding_Eagle

Lac-Mégantic timeline

http://www.edmontonjournal.com/news/M%C3%A9gantic+fire+timeline/8626739/story.html

11:25 p.m.: An engineer from the Montreal, Maine & Atlantic Railway (MMA) parks a train carrying 72 tankers, each carrying thousands of litres of crude oil (roughly 100,000 litres), and five locomotives in Nantes, approximately 11 kilometres outside of Lac-Mégantic. According to the MMA, he had stopped for a crew change and then retired to a nearby motel for the night.

11:30 p.m.: A resident in Nantes calls 911 after seeing a parked locomotive on fire between Nantes and Lac-Mégantic. Firefighters arrive on the scene and are able to extinguish the blaze.

11:42 p.m.: 12 firefighters arrive on the scene. Nobody (from MMA or otherwise) was there.

SATURDAY

12:12 a.m.: Fire in locomotive is extinguished.

12:13 to 12:15 a.m.: Two MMA employees arrive on the scene. Firefighters leave soon after establishing that the situation is under control.

1:15 a.m.: The first explosion in Lac-Mégantic is reported, followed by at least two others. Initial reports suggest 30 buildings are destroyed. Much of downtown is flooded with crude oil and fire. Patrons of a crowded bar flee. Many remain unaccounted for.

- - - -

more at link above


34 posted on 07/10/2013 1:41:42 PM PDT by thackney (life is fragile, handle with prayer)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 33 | View Replies]

To: thackney
I saw similar info from a difference original source elsewhere, earlier.

From: http://www.cnn.com/2013/07/10/world/americas/canada-runaway-train/index.html?hpt=hp_t1

"Montreal, Maine and Atlantic Railways chair Ed Burkhardt said the engineer found a Trackmobile, a vehicle that can pull several cars at a time, and went to the rear of the train.

He hooked up several cars, all the lightweight vehicle for hauling rail cars can pull, and moved them away from the wreckage, Burkhardt said.

He returned once more, pulling a total of nine from the disaster site, where explosions over the course of several hours killed a confirmed 13 people, with almost 50 still missing."

I on-line "chatted" with some Star "reporter" who was apparently in town. I asked him questions about the location of the locomotives and he only gave evasive answers because apparently he was not really there to look around, he was there to interview victims and regurgitate the voicings of the authorities.

35 posted on 07/10/2013 1:41:51 PM PDT by Paladin2
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 32 | View Replies]

To: Paladin2

Thank you!


36 posted on 07/10/2013 1:44:36 PM PDT by thackney (life is fragile, handle with prayer)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 35 | View Replies]

To: Paladin2

From that same article (which I had previously read and missed/forgoten) I had found:

The engines and nine other cars remained behind when the rest of the train broke away sometime later. They stopped a quarter of a mile away from their original parking spot in Nantes.


37 posted on 07/10/2013 1:46:17 PM PDT by thackney (life is fragile, handle with prayer)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 35 | View Replies]

To: Paladin2
Ruptured tanks spread the crude which caught on fire from some unknown ignition source.

The source was likely some red hot wheels and brakes. One of the eyewitnesses leaving the MusiCafe remarked about some of the wheels being red hot -- probably the ones whose manual brakes had been set and were dragged all the way down the hill.

38 posted on 07/10/2013 1:47:12 PM PDT by okie01 (The Mainstream Media: IGNORANCE ON PARADE)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 31 | View Replies]

To: thackney
Loco on fire:

End view of likely the last loco with no tank cars still attached

Picture (taken well before this incident) of lead locomotive (MMA 5017) with a remote control system in the converted caboose.


39 posted on 07/10/2013 1:56:51 PM PDT by Paladin2
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 34 | View Replies]

To: okie01

The eyewitness also described sparks (from wheel flanges grinding on the rails?). Could have also come from sparks associated with later cars still crashing into each other. Smokers out on the porch?


40 posted on 07/10/2013 2:00:36 PM PDT by Paladin2
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 38 | View Replies]

To: thackney
I think that is misdirection.

After the Nantes siding there is only single track into town until the yard switches. How does the end of the train get ahead of the front of the train? The TSB pic of the (blue) locomotive make it look upright and still on the track.

The scribes still don't have their story straight.

41 posted on 07/10/2013 2:05:06 PM PDT by Paladin2
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 37 | View Replies]

To: Paladin2

Probably not smokers, likely some of the few (but not enough) hand brakes set.

I’ve tried to set light crude oil on fire with a lit cigarette. (semi-controlled experiment in a safety discussion during oil field construction) I’m convinced it is essential impossible. Maybe some with a extreme amounts of specific light ends but I doubt it.


42 posted on 07/10/2013 2:07:43 PM PDT by thackney (life is fragile, handle with prayer)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 40 | View Replies]

To: Paladin2
How does the end of the train get ahead of the front of the train?

I see that. It is hard to believe that the locomotives went through before that destruction, but there was good track to haul them back through that mess towards the original parking location.

43 posted on 07/10/2013 2:20:17 PM PDT by thackney (life is fragile, handle with prayer)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 41 | View Replies]

To: Balding_Eagle

Well, there’s the pic of the loco on fire and published outtakes of interviews with the Nantes FD chief.


44 posted on 07/10/2013 2:21:06 PM PDT by Paladin2
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 33 | View Replies]

To: Paladin2
Found a pic of where the train was parked in Nantes.

Nantes Siding

Caption reads:
MMA #1 is leaving Nantes, for Montreal, after switching the MMA Remote control caboose, and shuffling some units. The locos (along with the Remote Control caboose) for MMA #2 leaving in the evening, are in the siding.

MMA #1 and #2 are the "oil trains" to the Irving refinery in St. John, so we're talking about the same trains at the same location where #2 (the eastbound train) was parked.

And, apparently, an overnight at this location is SOP.

45 posted on 07/10/2013 2:25:28 PM PDT by okie01 (The Mainstream Media: IGNORANCE ON PARADE)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 31 | View Replies]

To: thackney
I think it likely that the locomotives have a lower center of gravity than loaded tank cars. They also have larger diameter wheels and 3 axle trucks to help them stay on the track. They may have taller wheel flanges.

It has been really rare to see any pic of the locomotive string post accident.

46 posted on 07/10/2013 2:25:55 PM PDT by Paladin2
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 43 | View Replies]

To: Paladin2

I can see the engines making a curve that the tank cars didn’t.

What I don’t comprehend is enough useable track left after this destruction to move the engines back through the same spot towards the initial location before they rolled downhill to Lac-Megantic.


47 posted on 07/10/2013 2:29:25 PM PDT by thackney (life is fragile, handle with prayer)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 46 | View Replies]

To: thackney
I don't believe that they did.

"Journalists" get all sorts of facts wrong.

48 posted on 07/10/2013 2:34:07 PM PDT by Paladin2
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 47 | View Replies]

To: okie01
The freight on the #1 looks mixed rather than being a returning unit oil train.

I'm sure that parking overnight with one loco running to keep the whole train brakes on was SOP.

Too bad there was a fire in an unattended vehicle.

49 posted on 07/10/2013 2:38:57 PM PDT by Paladin2
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 45 | View Replies]

To: Paladin2

There is double track (siding) from the edge of Nantes towards Lac-Megantic for ~1.4 miles.

https://maps.google.com/maps?q=Nantes+and+Lac-M%C3%A9gantic&ie=UTF8&ll=45.629414,-71.013501&spn=0.001467,0.003661&hnear=Lac-M%C3%A9gantic,+Le+Granit+Regional+County+Municipality,+Quebec,+Canada&t=h&z=19


50 posted on 07/10/2013 2:40:32 PM PDT by thackney (life is fragile, handle with prayer)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 41 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-5051-73 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson