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Jury weighing Zimmerman's fate asks question about manslaughter option
CNN ^ | 7/13/13 | Mariano Castillo and Greg Botelho

Posted on 07/13/2013 3:17:06 PM PDT by Clint N. Suhks

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To: Ann Archy

Just think how stupid the average juror is...

And then realize that half of them are stupider than that!

(paraphrasing George Carlin)


61 posted on 07/13/2013 3:49:49 PM PDT by PlateOfShrimp
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To: ConservativeStatement
I hope they aren’t thinking of something they saw on a TV show and can’t separate fact from a Hollywood script.

That's entirely possible since unlike most men, very few women have ever been in a fistfight. Since they don't have experience as a guide they will rely on something else to make the decision. The fact that they are even asking about manslaughter is not good. It could mean they have rejected the self defense argument. If you find that someone acted in self defense you cannot then find him guilty of manslaughter. A positive finding of self defense trumps everything.
62 posted on 07/13/2013 3:50:01 PM PDT by slumber1 (My real name is Rusty Shackleford)
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To: Clint N. Suhks

That jury should have been out no longer than 30 minutes. They are worrying about what is the verdict that will make them look to be “caring.” Zimmerman might become another genuine American political prisoner like the fellow who did the little video trailer that got blamed for Benghazi.


63 posted on 07/13/2013 3:51:01 PM PDT by arthurus (Read Hazlitt's EcThomics In One Lesson ONLINE http://steshaw.org/econohttp://www.fee.org/library/det)
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To: Clint N. Suhks

What I hate about the rule that a lesser charge has to be considered is that it makes that lesser offense seem like a reasonable “compromise” in the eyes of the jurors, and lets them be lazy about what the evidence actually showed.


64 posted on 07/13/2013 3:51:03 PM PDT by Steve_Seattle
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To: PlateOfShrimp

OMG!! I would NEVER...EVER want to be judged by my “peers”!!! I’ve served on one jury and they were DUMB as ROCKS!!! Thought it was ALL FUN and GAMES!!!


65 posted on 07/13/2013 3:52:01 PM PDT by Ann Archy (Abortion.....the HUMAN Sacrifice to the god of Convenience.)
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To: Clump

That’s called “normalcy bias”. The universe has changed and you haven’t caught up to it yet.

There will be no appeal if he is convicted. George will not survive incarceration in Gen Pop long enough for that to happen.


66 posted on 07/13/2013 3:52:06 PM PDT by null and void (Republicans create the tools of oppression, and the democrats gleefully use them!)
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To: szweig

But unfortunately I’m not sure he’ll survive that long.


67 posted on 07/13/2013 3:52:31 PM PDT by mykroar (China and Russia are playing chess while Obamas's playing 52 card pick-up.)
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To: Clint N. Suhks
for instance, the fact that an adult had fired on an unarmed teen

Someone has to work to create that description of what was a man on his back bleeding, with broken bones, getting off a single shot into the man on top of him as they were clutched together in a death struggle, this description makes it sound as though Zimmerman fired on Martin at some distance in an act of aggression.

68 posted on 07/13/2013 3:53:07 PM PDT by ansel12 (Sodom and Gomorrah, flush with libertarians and liberals, short on social conservatives.)
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To: knarf

He was cold cocked because he did not exercise due caution.
He had every right to defend himself at that point. However, a little common sense and caution would have helped Zimmerman stay out of jail.

I think what the state of Florida is doing is a travesty of justice. Zimmerman did not commit any crime. I think he is a bit of a dolt, but even dolts don’t deserved to be falsely prosecuted.


69 posted on 07/13/2013 3:53:28 PM PDT by 3Fingas (Sons and Daughters of Freedom, Committee of Correspondence)
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To: Ray76

If that was the extent of the idiot judges “clarification” on manslaughter then it will be reversed.
That is beyond horrible.
It’s either gross incompetence or downright malicious.
That instruction (even if it accurately followed a statute) would be constitutional defective and a violation of due process.
Just horrible.
I’m in disbelief.


70 posted on 07/13/2013 3:53:57 PM PDT by Clump ( the tree of liberty is withering like a stricken fig tree)
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To: ilovesarah2012

It was raining. Washed off.


71 posted on 07/13/2013 3:54:00 PM PDT by Coldwater Creek (")
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To: Georgia Girl 2

At this point, it looks like a hung jury is GZ’s best hope.

I still think that the jury’s going to “compromise” on manslaughter though.

A travesty of justice.


72 posted on 07/13/2013 3:54:06 PM PDT by absalom01 (You should do your duty in all things. You cannot do more, and you should never wish to do less.)
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To: yarddog
the fact that they didn’t declare him not guilty within an hour means that at least one juror is an idiot.
73 posted on 07/13/2013 3:54:55 PM PDT by arthurus (Read Hazlitt's EcThomics In One Lesson ONLINE http://steshaw.org/econohttp://www.fee.org/library/det)
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To: Drango

As if following someone would give that person license to hold the following guy down and beat his head into the cement.

Why do they keep giving CRP to this dead horse?

Trayvon stays on the sidewalk making a bee-line home, no problem. He goes up close to the back of homes, there’s a problem. It looks like he’s casing the joint.

If we’re going to be reminded constantly that Zimmerman followed, then we should also be reminded that it looked like Martin appeared to be casing the homes.


74 posted on 07/13/2013 3:55:57 PM PDT by DoughtyOne (Breaking News: Hillary not running in 2016. Brain tumor found during recent colonoscopy...)
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To: Clint N. Suhks

Disgusting that they are even considering ANY charge against this poor man.


75 posted on 07/13/2013 3:56:00 PM PDT by montag813 (NO AMNESTY * ENFORCE THE LAW * http://StandWithArizona.com)
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To: szweig

Reversal on appeal does not preclude the near inevitable Federal Civil Rights trial.


76 posted on 07/13/2013 3:56:09 PM PDT by arthurus (Read Hazlitt's EcThomics In One Lesson ONLINE http://steshaw.org/econohttp://www.fee.org/library/det)
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To: szweig

Reversal on appeal does not preclude the near inevitable Federal Civil Rights trial.


77 posted on 07/13/2013 3:56:35 PM PDT by arthurus (Read Hazlitt's Ecomics In One Lesson ONLINE http://steshaw.org/econohttp://www.fee.org/library/det)
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To: Coldwater Creek

The defendant’s supporters contend that no blood was detected on the cuffs and lower sleeves of Trayvon Martin’s two sweatshirts because the rain had washed away all of the defendant’s blood and the scrapings from only one fingernail were tested. They also claim that no blood was discovered on Trayvon’s hands because Trayvon covered them with plastic bags before he assaulted the defendant.

Let’s deal with the last claim first because it is the most ridiculous. Police routinely bag the hands of homicide victims to preserve trace evidence and that is what they did to Trayvon’s hands.

They also complain that Trayvon’s hands were not swabbed, but that is not surprising since the standard practice is to cut a homicide victim’s fingernails and examine them for trace evidence. Forensic scientists do this because trace evidence can transfer from a victim’s hands to another person, surface or fall off. Trace evidence, particularly blood and DNA gets trapped under fingernails and that is why fingernail cuttings are the preferred location to check for trace evidence.

They soak the fingernail cuttings in a solution of purified water overnight and spin it out in a centrifuge to obtain all of the cellular debris present. Then they examine the debris under a microscope. If they find intact cells, the extract the DNA and type it. They do not scrape one fingernail and throw the rest away. Whoever conjured up that explanation has absolutely no idea what they are talking about. It’s probably the same person who said Trayvon wrapped his hands in plastic bags before assaulting the defendant.

Pathetic and laughable nonsense.

What about the claim that rain washed away the blood and DNA?

That claim is almost, if not quite as ridiculous, because we are discussing whether the rain would wash away all blood present on fabric leaving no detectable trace amount. To understand why the rain would not wash away any detectable amount of blood, let us take a look at presumptive tests for blood and failed efforts to remove all detectable trace amounts of blood invisible to the human eye.

Experience has shown that it’s virtually impossible to clean-up blood spatter at a crime scene so that no DNA can be detected. And that is after using water, solvents, cleaning fluids and other assorted chemicals in multiple washings to remove all visible traces of blood. Even though the human eye cannot see trace amounts of blood residue, luminol will detect it. Luminol is so sensitive that it can detect the presence of blood in serial dilutions down to 1:100,000. If luminol can detect it, PCR testing certainly will type the DNA present.

Other chemicals used in presumptive testing for the presence of blood are leuchomalachite green, phenolphthalein, Hemastixs, Hemident, and Bluestarr. All are as equally sensitive to blood as Luminol except for leuchomalachite green (1:10,000). For more information, please read this Technical Note in the Journal of Forensic Science, published in 2006. JFS is a peer reviewed professional journal.

The defendant’s supporters do not realize that a complete DNA profile can be developed from the DNA contained in a single white blood cell by using the STR/PCR process (red blood cells do not have a nucleus). In practice, they require more than a single cell to avoid copying a contaminant DNA introduced extraneously into the testing process, but they do not need very much sample.

http://frederickleatherman.com/2013/01/06/rain-did-not-wash-away-defendants-blood-and-dna-in-trayvon-martin-murder-case/


78 posted on 07/13/2013 3:57:32 PM PDT by ilovesarah2012
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To: slumber1
If you find that someone acted in self defense you cannot then find him guilty of manslaughter. A positive finding of self defense trumps everything.

Her honor specifically DID NOT mention that little factoid in her instructions to the jury.

All they know is:

The judge’s instructions to the jury:

“MANSLAUGHTER To prove the crime of Manslaughter, the State must prove the following two elements beyond a reasonable doubt: 1. Trayvon Martin is dead. 2. George Zimmerman intentionally committed an act or acts that caused the death of Trayvon Martin.”

They don't even know the penalty is nearly as harsh, that minor detail has also been deliberately withheld from them.

79 posted on 07/13/2013 3:57:43 PM PDT by null and void (Republicans create the tools of oppression, and the democrats gleefully use them!)
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To: Clint N. Suhks

What a crock of brown stinky stuff. Ho can he be not guilty of murder 2 based on a self defense defense, yet guilty of manslaughter? Either it was self defense or it wasn’t, end of story. Dumbing down to manslaughter sounds like an automatic reversal on appeal. Why not save everyone the trouble and, oh by the way do what’s right, and find not guilty.


80 posted on 07/13/2013 3:57:57 PM PDT by ThunderSleeps (Stop obarma now! Stop the hussein - insane agenda!)
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