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Dick Cheney: Rand Paul is wrong on government surveillance
Washington Post ^ | June 16 2013 | Sean Sullivan

Posted on 07/19/2013 11:10:19 PM PDT by WilliamIII

Former vice president Dick Cheney said Sunday that Sen. Rand Paul (R-Ky.) was wrong to suggest that the government’s recently revealed sweeping surveillance techniques are an invasion of Americans’ privacy. “Two-thirds of the Congress wasn’t here on 9/11, or for that period immediately after when we got into this program,” Cheney said on “Fox News Sunday.” He later added: “When you consider the possibility of somebody smuggling something like a nuclear device into the United States, it becomes very, very important to gather intelligence on your enemies and stop that attack before it ever gets launched.”

Cheney defended a National Security Agency program to collect phone records from millions of Americans, about which Paul has expressed deep concerns. The Kentucky senator announced last week that he has taken steps toward bringing legal action against the government over its surveillance efforts.

(Excerpt) Read more at washingtonpost.com ...


TOPICS: Breaking News; Government; US: Kentucky
KEYWORDS: 1984; 4a; cheney; dickcheney; kentucky; randpaul; randsconcerntrolls; waronterror
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1 posted on 07/19/2013 11:10:19 PM PDT by WilliamIII
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To: WilliamIII

Between Rand Paul and Dick Cheney, I think I will go with Cheney.


2 posted on 07/19/2013 11:16:03 PM PDT by doc1019 (Get our troops the hell out of the ME)
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To: WilliamIII

Neocon versus libertarian.

They can have each other.


3 posted on 07/19/2013 11:19:06 PM PDT by sickoflibs (To GOP : Any path to US citizenship IS putting them ahead in line. Stop lying about your position.)
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To: WilliamIII
FU Dick Cheney.

09/11/2001 was the opportune time to rid the USA of muslim terrorist sleeper cells and active terrorists; to outlaw islam in the USA, and extend the prohibition to every civilized nation in the world.

Did you and GW Bush do that? No. GWB stepped out in front of a microphone on 09/12, and sentenced human civilization to another century or millennia of muslim terrorism.

"Islam is a religion of peace." Remember this, Dickhead?

4 posted on 07/19/2013 11:19:47 PM PDT by meadsjn
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To: doc1019

Between Rand Paul and Dick Cheney, I think I will go with Cheney.


That’s not the real choice though, is it?

The government can’t find its a$$ with both hands ...no need to spy on citizens...do a bit of profiling and leave me and mine alone.


5 posted on 07/19/2013 11:21:46 PM PDT by KittenClaws ( You may have to fight a battle more than once in order to win it." - Margaret Thatcher)
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To: meadsjn
09/11/2001 was the opportune time to rid the USA of muslim terrorist sleeper cells and active terrorists; to outlaw islam in the USA, and extend the prohibition to every civilized nation in the world.

Excellent post on your part. Everything you said is spot on. Right after 9/11 we needed a Reagan and a Patton. We got two LBJ's instead.

The West will pay very dearly for Bush and Cheney's errors.

6 posted on 07/19/2013 11:26:50 PM PDT by Leaning Right
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To: WilliamIII
Cheney said on “Fox News Sunday.” He later added: “When you consider the possibility of somebody smuggling something like a nuclear device into the United States, it becomes very, very important to gather intelligence on your enemies and stop that attack before it ever gets launched.”

It might help to secure the border, don't you think? But sure, lets look in every Americans car, up their skirts, in their bodies, break their doors down and listen to their phone calls, read their mail. But screw the borders.

They aren't worried about security, the Boston bombers were not stopped with all the crazy invasive 'security measures' that are in place. Nope, look at all those people missing limbs. They weren't kept safe.

Listening to Jeb Bush about fertility and all that, I had to wonder--do these people look at the rest of us like a bunch of cattle. Sure, they need to breed in some better stock in order to better serve them and their elitists buddies. It's their country you know and we're just the cattle. grrr../rant off

7 posted on 07/19/2013 11:27:11 PM PDT by Irenic (The pencil sharpener and Elmer's glue is put away-- we've lost the red wheel barrow)
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To: WilliamIII
“When you consider the possibility of somebody smuggling something like a nuclear device into the United States, it becomes very, very important to gather intelligence on your enemies and stop that attack before it ever gets launched.”

Then maybe it might have been a good idea for you and George to have closed the border.

No one has been a more staunch supporter of Dick Cheney than I have, but good God!


8 posted on 07/19/2013 11:27:31 PM PDT by nathanbedford ("Attack, repeat, attack!" Bull Halsey)
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To: WilliamIII

Safety at any price, what could possibly go wrong.....


9 posted on 07/19/2013 11:27:53 PM PDT by yadent
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To: KittenClaws

Based on the headline, I think the discussion is Rand Paul v. Dick Cheney and thus my response not whether the government did the right thing or not.


10 posted on 07/19/2013 11:28:55 PM PDT by doc1019 (Get our troops the hell out of the ME)
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To: WilliamIII
Reagan to Dick Cheney: Aw, shut up!
11 posted on 07/19/2013 11:30:44 PM PDT by conservative98
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To: doc1019

it does not follow that you must spy one every single citizen and grab every single communication. the more hay you gather, the worse your chances of finding the needle.


12 posted on 07/19/2013 11:31:32 PM PDT by bioqubit
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To: doc1019

Oh, ok. Sorry.

I’m just in a mood, I guess.


13 posted on 07/19/2013 11:31:39 PM PDT by KittenClaws ( You may have to fight a battle more than once in order to win it." - Margaret Thatcher)
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To: KittenClaws

LOL! I spend my waking days in “that mood”. Angry old man at your disposal.


14 posted on 07/19/2013 11:35:07 PM PDT by doc1019 (Get our troops the hell out of the ME)
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To: doc1019

I think I’ll go with Rand. The NSA domestic spying is appalling.


15 posted on 07/19/2013 11:37:07 PM PDT by 9YearLurker
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To: WilliamIII
The road to hell is paved with good intentions. First it was to stop terrorists (legitimate). Then it devolved into some sort of broad surveillance resembling Bentham's Panopticon.

Personally, I've always preferred having eyes and ears on the ground rather than dredging anyone and everyone's communications.

Thanks for your service Dick, but we'll take it from here.

16 posted on 07/19/2013 11:38:02 PM PDT by UAConservative (We have just begun to fight!)
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To: doc1019

Wasn’t it Cheney that said ‘deficits don’t matter’ and other such math challenged economic wisdom? Our ‘esteemed’ leaders, spending money we don’t have AND keeping an eye on US citizens making sure their collective mind’s are right. I am so glad our leaders have not abused any of that power. Ever.


17 posted on 07/19/2013 11:44:28 PM PDT by yadent
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To: WilliamIII

Orwell Cheney is wrong on this count. Government is becoming too watchful, and look at how they abuse their power.


18 posted on 07/19/2013 11:44:48 PM PDT by Viennacon
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To: WilliamIII

However in this case Cheney is supporting Obama as a side effect.


19 posted on 07/19/2013 11:45:20 PM PDT by sickoflibs (To GOP : Any path to US citizenship IS putting them ahead in line. Stop lying about your position.)
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To: sickoflibs
However in this case Cheney is supporting Obama as a side effect.

So whose position most closely matches your own - Paul or Cheney?

20 posted on 07/19/2013 11:54:59 PM PDT by Ken H
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To: UAConservative
Thanks for your service Dick...

I don't know if I'd go that far. As far as I can see, Cheney is just another typical DC politician. From Wikipedia:

When Cheney became eligible for the draft, during the Vietnam War, he applied for and received five draft deferments. In 1989, The Washington Post writer George C. Wilson interviewed Cheney as the next Secretary of Defense; when asked about his deferments, Cheney reportedly said, "I had other priorities in the '60s than military service".

Of course, it is possible that the Washington post writer is lying. But somehow I don't think so.

21 posted on 07/19/2013 11:56:12 PM PDT by Leaning Right
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To: WilliamIII

The NSA lied to congress. and the datacenter in Utah they are building is designed to store everything. And I mean everything. I ran into an IBM guy in Texas who is saying the NSA is buying tons of storage for that site. In the multiple yottabyte range.


22 posted on 07/20/2013 12:01:38 AM PDT by ColdSteelTalon (Light is fading to shadow, and casting its shroud over all we have known...)
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To: Ken H; Impy; BillyBoy; fieldmarshaldj
RE :”So whose position most closely matches your own - Paul or Cheney? “

You just had to pull that,
Lets see, we got secret judges making secret decisions and secret enforcement and only one side gets to present their case to them and 99% they win against no opposition. And under Obama.

And when Cheney set this all up most in GOP never dreamed that a Dem would EVER be POTUS.

So how to I take sides on that?

Cheney needs to find another hobby, he has done enough damage.
Pro-gay pro-illegal fing neocon.

23 posted on 07/20/2013 12:04:14 AM PDT by sickoflibs (To GOP : Any path to US citizenship IS putting them ahead in line. Stop lying about your position.)
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To: doc1019

So you’d rather have all your communications unlawfully monitored... because the idiots in DC won’t turn the heat up on the source of terror, Islam?

That “religion of peace?”

IMO, the revelations of the NSA’s agenda and actions show that Bush and Cheney were handmaidens of totalitarianism. Rand Paul is one of the few who has had the spine to stand up to totalitarian busybodies who talk a great game about “fighting terrorism,” but do precious little about it - other than grope us, bug us and censor us.


24 posted on 07/20/2013 12:07:28 AM PDT by NVDave
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To: doc1019

Cheney is wrong on this. There is NO reason for this program. Even if it is well intended it is still wrong and we both know this data will be abused. This isn’t a Left vs Right issue. It is a Constitutional issue. There is no way in hell the Founding Fathers would condone this crap. Keep drinking the Kool-Aid, but be carefull you just might spill it all over your nice wool coat.


25 posted on 07/20/2013 12:09:33 AM PDT by sean327 (God created all men equal, then some become Marines!)
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To: WilliamIII

Cheney is wrong and the Patriotic act as promoted by the Bush admin never mentioned it would be used to spy on every American just those engaging terrorists overseas.


26 posted on 07/20/2013 12:34:18 AM PDT by RginTN
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To: doc1019

“Between Rand Paul and Dick Cheney, I think I will go with Cheney.”

And that makes you a lib.

Cheney is pro-gay marriage and said that deficits don’t matter.

Plus, he had the brilliant idea that American lives should be sacrificed to bring democracy to the middle east.

He was the biggest mistake that Bush ever made.


27 posted on 07/20/2013 12:34:27 AM PDT by BarnacleCenturion
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To: WilliamIII

Sorry Dick but, your wrong.

You don’t have the right to serve a search warrant on a suspect and then collect huge swaths of Americans who had or have nothing to to with the investigation.

Further, you have no right to store the information, create a file and then a profile of our lives and habits, in the hope you can catch us in a crime or turn over information relevant to some agency who might it useful.

It’s an outright violation of the 4th, 5th and 1st amendment.

I could make the case for another amendment but, that my government violates just one is enough.

Do not renew PA, PA II. Fix CALEA, HIPPA and FISA.

They are documents of imprimatur to those who “just want to do their job and their part to protect us”. I get that but, it gives them too much and too broad powers to offend our individual sovereignty.


28 posted on 07/20/2013 12:43:43 AM PDT by Vendome (Don't take life so seriously, you won't live through it anyway)
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>> Cheney: “Two-thirds of the Congress wasn’t here on 9/11”

Well, that’s an intelligent rebuff. /s

Too much bitching directed at the NSA when it should have been directed at the lawmakers setting policy and provisioning funds.


29 posted on 07/20/2013 12:44:49 AM PDT by Gene Eric (Don't be a statist!)
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To: Vendome

I’ll never forget the former Senator Feingold’s relentless attacks against Bush’s Patriot Act. I’ll never forget how silent he was during his final two years served during the Obama Administration.


30 posted on 07/20/2013 12:47:47 AM PDT by Gene Eric (Don't be a statist!)
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To: BarnacleCenturion

Plus, he had the brilliant idea that American lives should be sacrificed to bring democracy to the middle east.

He was the biggest mistake that Bush ever made.


And Bush was the biggest mistake Ronald Reagan ever made.

Bush and Cheney are part of the New World Order network. And they knew all about Obama and could have quietly seen that he never made it past the primaries. They had all the intelligence on him and knew he is an avowed enemy of the United States.

Earlier this week GHW Bush went to the White House wearing his clown socks and kissed up to the evil bastard who’s doing all he can to destroy this country. It’s beyond disgusting.


31 posted on 07/20/2013 1:07:00 AM PDT by laplata (Liberals don't get it. Their minds are diseased.)
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To: laplata
And Bush was the biggest mistake Ronald Reagan ever made.

Behind the amnesty allowance (precedent)

32 posted on 07/20/2013 1:08:21 AM PDT by catfish1957 (Face it!!!! The government in DC is full of treasonous bastards)
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To: catfish1957

at least Reagan admitted it was a mistake


33 posted on 07/20/2013 1:10:58 AM PDT by GeronL
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To: catfish1957

Behind the amnesty allowance (precedent)


Right you are. Bush gave Reagan some bad advice on a number of things.


34 posted on 07/20/2013 1:15:50 AM PDT by laplata (Liberals don't get it. Their minds are diseased.)
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To: doc1019

I used to like Cheney a lot, but he’s wrong here, and it has me re-evaluating my whole take on him.

I’d rather have a foreign terrorist nuke go off here than a totalitarian police/surveillance state that thinks I’m a terrorist.

I’d rather not have either, of course, but that doesn’t seem to be a current choice on the menu, unfortunately.


35 posted on 07/20/2013 1:20:54 AM PDT by dagogo redux (A whiff of primitive spirits in the air, harbingers of an impending descent into the feral.)
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To: meadsjn

You couldn’t be more correct, sir.


36 posted on 07/20/2013 1:22:54 AM PDT by dagogo redux (A whiff of primitive spirits in the air, harbingers of an impending descent into the feral.)
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To: WilliamIII

Dick Cheney is Chairman of the Board of the military complex.

Never has such an unqualified person obtained so much power.


37 posted on 07/20/2013 1:49:32 AM PDT by Rum Tum Tugger
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To: RginTN

We are giving up freedom for security and will lose both.


38 posted on 07/20/2013 1:57:41 AM PDT by fortheDeclaration (Pr 14:34 Righteousness exalteth a nation:but sin is a reproach to any people)
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To: WilliamIII

The breadth, depth and scope of NSA spying is such that whoever controls it can control every official of the government..by way of blackmail. Congressman, Senators, Presidents and Supreme Court Justices. The IRS. The FBI. The DEA. THE BATF. The SEC. The Federal Reserve Chairman. Anyone and everyone can be blackmailed using the data they’re collecting.

Nothing justifies that. Nothing. It may not happen overnight, but given time there can be no other result but a police state that will put anything in human history to shame. If you support this level of surveillance, that’s what you support. Own it, it’s yours.


39 posted on 07/20/2013 2:00:59 AM PDT by sourcery (If true=false, then there would be no constraints on what is possible. Hence, the world exists.)
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To: fortheDeclaration

And what’s ironic is the Boston terrorist attacks, Benghazi happened with Prism.


40 posted on 07/20/2013 2:03:01 AM PDT by RginTN
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To: sourcery

bump


41 posted on 07/20/2013 2:03:12 AM PDT by GeronL
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To: WilliamIII

Cheney is wrong on this one. We are gathering intelligence on regular Americans and storing it for who knows how long. Wonder how much information VP Cheney thinks the NSA should gather to protect us? How much is enough? Where’s the limit?

I’ll stand with Rand on this one.


42 posted on 07/20/2013 2:13:42 AM PDT by Girlene (Hey, NSA!)
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To: Irenic

The Bushs and collaborators have not been very outspoken about the need to honor the intent of our Founders Constitution. Bush1 took the USA to war to help his friend the Saudi King out of a jam by preserving his oil fields. Then Bush1 steps out and boldly declares that there has been a ‘world order’ established, nothing about any benefit for maintaining the Founder’s Constitution. Bush2 follows with a crusade to keep the evil forces from retaliating against Bush1 and the Saudi oil interests even as far as into Afghanistan. Then comes Bush3,Jeb, who says he wants to flood the USA with all kinds of people from south of the USA border. Of course the fact that the Bush family has some important members who seem to care more about illegal immigrants than keeping citizenship according to the Founders intentions for growth of this Nation gets buried in the feely-goodie mentality. I can recognize and respect military service to/for this Nation as I myself am a vet of WWII and lost my only brother in the battle of Okinawa, but I do not honor the ideas of a ‘new world’ order apart from the Constitution.


43 posted on 07/20/2013 2:17:57 AM PDT by noinfringers2
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To: nathanbedford
Thank you. The elitist keep harping on safety as the reason to take away and violate American citizen's rights yet they won't deal with illegals and scream about how horribly racist it is to profile. Okay then, we have to lose rights because the people in charge refuse to do a couple of common sense things that would legitimately make us more safe.
44 posted on 07/20/2013 2:26:42 AM PDT by snarkytart
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To: WilliamIII

“When you consider the possibility of somebody smuggling something like a nuclear device into the United States, it becomes very, very important to gather intelligence on your enemies and stop that attack before it ever gets launched.”

Sweeping up my emails and phone calls don’t do any of that.

It was wrong when initiated and has only become worse.


45 posted on 07/20/2013 3:08:13 AM PDT by Adder (No, Mr. Franklin, we could NOT keep it.)
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To: bioqubit

” the more hay you gather, the worse your chances of finding the needle.”

Brilliant!

Too the point and pithy.


46 posted on 07/20/2013 3:25:08 AM PDT by PoloSec ( Believe the Gospel: how that Christ died for our sins, was buried and rose again)
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To: WilliamIII
Former vice president Dick Cheney said Sunday that Sen. Rand Paul (R-Ky.) was wrong to suggest that the government’s recently revealed sweeping surveillance techniques are an invasion of Americans’ privacy.

And how does Lynn Cheney feel about it? I'm sure the fine folks in Wyoming would be interested in hearing.

47 posted on 07/20/2013 3:27:01 AM PDT by 0.E.O
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To: doc1019
Dick Cheney is in this for Dick Cheney. He is a big government crony capitalist where anything goes. He loves illegal aliens coming into this country working on the cheap for his donor buddies. He is John McCain on steroids.
There is no difference between him and Obama except the tactics that they use.
We have been here before and it didn't go well then and it'll be a bigger mistake now.
48 posted on 07/20/2013 3:28:38 AM PDT by lucky american (The Democrats will follow the big "D"even if it means going over a cliff.)
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To: sickoflibs
Lets see, we got secret judges making secret decisions and secret enforcement and only one side gets to present their case to them and 99% they win against no opposition. And under Obama.

To be fair, these decisions are for the approximate equivalent of search warrants. I don't recall the target of a proposed search warrant ever being given the opportunity to show why it should not be granted.

49 posted on 07/20/2013 3:38:45 AM PDT by Sherman Logan
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To: bioqubit
the more hay you gather, the worse your chances of finding the needle.

Actually, if there's a needle somewhere in the hay field, you will have zero chance of finding it unless you search the entire field. (Come to think of it, that's not true, as you might find the needle in your first five minutes of search. But I wouldn't place a large bet on it if I were you.)

Unless you have some way of narrowing the location down to some extent. But we can't do that, because it would be "profiling."

50 posted on 07/20/2013 3:46:05 AM PDT by Sherman Logan
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