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Police Shoot Dead Grandfather, 72, While Searching the Wrong Home for Burglar
http://www.theblaze.com ^ | 07/27/2013 | Jason Howerton

Posted on 07/26/2013 9:30:35 PM PDT by redreno

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To: Ultra Sonic 007
Why am I reading so many stories of police getting the address wrong before going in all gung-ho? Is it really that hard to get a simple address right? I mean, really?

You know, isn't that also at the heart of the Zimmerman matter?

Didn't George Zimmerman say he was getting out of his car to get a CORRECT address to give to the police, when he was ambushed by Trayvon Martin?

-PJ

51 posted on 07/26/2013 10:50:00 PM PDT by Political Junkie Too (If you are the Posterity of We the People, then you are a Natural Born Citizen.)
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To: roadcat

There are (I think) ways to tune the sensors so they won’t pick up smaller animals, but will still grab larger beings even if they’re moving slow. As to recording, if you have broadband, I suggest setting up a link such that if the cameras go on, the recording server starts a real-time mirror session with someplace off-property. That way you have a “safe” copy of the video recording even if the cops grab the onsite drive. Once the off-site recording stops, it should be easy to have a script launch that makes duplicates of the duplicate. Keep the session on the remote drive, but also burn at least 2-3 copies of it to DVD, and arrange to have at least one mailed to an attorney you have on retainer.

It might seem over-complicated, and it shouldn’t have to be on the citizen to make such extreme preparations, but in the face of the increasingly-unaccountable actions of law enforcement at all levels it is almost a necessity these days.


52 posted on 07/26/2013 10:51:40 PM PDT by Little Pig (Vi Veri Veniversum Vivus Vici.)
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To: Little Pig
I suggest setting up a link such that if the cameras go on, the recording server starts a real-time mirror session with someplace off-property.

Sounds like a good idea for anyone, in these days of no-knock raids on wrong addresses. You can bet they would seize and destroy the security hard drive. I can access the drive over the internet, but not after the fact if it's taken. However, I think I can mirror it to my laptop, and the laptop is constantly backed up every hour to a network drive. This backup destination can be pointed to an offsite location. Thanks for the tip.

53 posted on 07/26/2013 11:07:46 PM PDT by roadcat
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To: roadcat
I think I can mirror it to my laptop, and the laptop is constantly backed up every hour to a network drive. This backup destination can be pointed to an offsite location. Thanks for the tip.

Isn't living in Obunga/Holder's new police state so nice that you need to contemplate these things as part of daily life?

54 posted on 07/26/2013 11:19:21 PM PDT by doorgunner69
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To: redreno
Every night, on my property, I go feed the outside animals (All manner of critters like cat chow, deer, coons cats, dogs, opossums, birds, squirrels) and walk around my my workshop, tractor barn, etc.

I am armed when I do it, looks like a thug/thief is not my only concern in the times we live in.

And as another poster said, this didn't happen a decade ago.

55 posted on 07/26/2013 11:21:57 PM PDT by The Cajun (Sarah Palin, Mark Levin, Ted Cruz......Nuff said.)
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To: redreno

cops need to be fired, lose pensions and go to jail for this increasingly bullsh1t behavior.

itisgetting so thatyouhad better be ready to defendyourself from any cop approaching you.


56 posted on 07/26/2013 11:27:33 PM PDT by Secret Agent Man (Gone Galt; Not averse to Going Bronson.)
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To: SaraJohnson

they would crucify a ccw person who did the same thing.


57 posted on 07/26/2013 11:30:28 PM PDT by Secret Agent Man (Gone Galt; Not averse to Going Bronson.)
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To: chiefqc
There was no dog so they had to shoot something, the grandfather.

After all, grandfathers are mans 2nd bestest friend....
58 posted on 07/26/2013 11:48:22 PM PDT by JSteff (It was ALL about SCOTUS... We are DOOMED for several generations. . Who cares? The Dems care!)
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To: redreno

C’mon. Where are they? Where’s the holster-sniffers to explain this away, how the cops were “just doing their jobs” and “it was most important for these two public employees to go home at the end of their shift?”


59 posted on 07/26/2013 11:51:27 PM PDT by NVDave
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To: bunkerhill7
Cops don`t know which side of the street the even-numbered houses are on?

That is in the police officers handy excuses manual that they all get at the academy.
60 posted on 07/26/2013 11:53:31 PM PDT by JSteff (It was ALL about SCOTUS... We are DOOMED for several generations. . Who cares? The Dems care!)
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To: redreno

OMG!!! The Police shot an elderly WALKER!!!


61 posted on 07/27/2013 12:06:03 AM PDT by Patriot Babe
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To: Gene Eric

None, why do you ask? It’s just that this whole continuing thread of cops going to the wrong house is mystifying to me.

We have so many stories of gung-ho LEOs barging into houses and ruining lives...at the wrong address.

For so much firepower to get aimed in the wrong direction is comically depressing.


62 posted on 07/27/2013 12:15:10 AM PDT by Ultra Sonic 007 (Hope for the best. Prepare for the worst.)
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To: Errant

While there are many jokes to be made of the headline.....One day that will be me.

Cops just running out depending on Tom-Tom or Garmin type systems will always make this mistake.

I will shoot the first bastard that rushes my homestead, badge or no, I am innocent.


63 posted on 07/27/2013 12:20:16 AM PDT by eyedigress ((zOld storm chaser from the west)/ ?s)
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To: redreno

Obviously, the man should have had a dog. Then the Barney Fife guys would have shot the dog and alerted the homeowner to their presence.


64 posted on 07/27/2013 12:20:46 AM PDT by Smokin' Joe (How often God must weep at humans' folly. Stand fast. God knows what He is doing)
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To: The Cajun

I cannot even identify with 15 years ago. This Nation is on a fast track to utter mayhem. This tribal crap is going to ruin America.


65 posted on 07/27/2013 12:24:07 AM PDT by eyedigress ((zOld storm chaser from the west)/ ?s)
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To: Ultra Sonic 007

Rhetorical.

>> We have so many stories of gung-ho LEOs

Paramilitary and SWAT.

Policy, bureaucracy, and unions have decimated preparedness and accountability.


66 posted on 07/27/2013 12:30:41 AM PDT by Gene Eric (Don't be a statist!)
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To: redreno

These cops said he pointed the gun at them. They always say that! They will probably be promoted now. /s


67 posted on 07/27/2013 1:18:53 AM PDT by rawhide
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To: Chode

My first thought.


68 posted on 07/27/2013 1:19:46 AM PDT by Eagles6 (Valley Forge Redux)
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To: redreno
Police shoot dead grandfather...

Shooting an old man's corpse for target practice?

69 posted on 07/27/2013 2:34:06 AM PDT by AndyTheBear
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To: Jet Jaguar

But Chief, he looked exactly like those targets we used. We were just falling back on our training.
Also how come you never here about an ambulance picking someone up at the wrong house or the fire department responding to the wrong residence. Maybe the Fire Department should be sent first so the cops will know where to stop. Look for the big red truck.


70 posted on 07/27/2013 3:18:29 AM PDT by DeWalt
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To: redreno

Thank God he was already dead.


71 posted on 07/27/2013 3:24:49 AM PDT by Protect the Bill of Rights
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To: DeWalt

Excellent!


72 posted on 07/27/2013 3:25:17 AM PDT by glock rocks (No comment.)
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To: roadcat
Just hope she would be able to hide the camera hard drive so the cops don’t steal it.

Auto continuous backup to the cloud.

73 posted on 07/27/2013 3:53:04 AM PDT by Sherman Logan
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To: redreno

As a citizen who was not speaking Spanish, or from Iran
or Mexico illegally, HE HAD NO RIGHT TO LIVE.


74 posted on 07/27/2013 3:55:14 AM PDT by Diogenesis
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To: Sherman Logan

the real HDD should be hidden too, put a dummy one out for the thieves/cops to take


75 posted on 07/27/2013 3:56:34 AM PDT by GeronL
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To: Jeff Head

One result of ever expanding SWATification. Except that the original SWATs (the TV show had a pretty cool tune, I used to play it as a piano exercise) didn’t show up for mere run of the mill burglaries. What kind of “superheros” get odd and even house numbers confused?


76 posted on 07/27/2013 3:58:15 AM PDT by HiTech RedNeck (Whatever promise that God has made, in Jesus it is yes. See my page.)
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To: GeronL

Actually, both HDDs can be “real” ones. It’s just that one of them is in a hidden location.


77 posted on 07/27/2013 3:58:56 AM PDT by Sherman Logan
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To: Sherman Logan

true!


78 posted on 07/27/2013 3:59:32 AM PDT by GeronL
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To: EEGator

“They should pay a price, but I highly doubt they planned to kill him before arriving.”

I’m sure they’ll be sternly chastised and banned from donut shops for a whole week!


79 posted on 07/27/2013 4:09:40 AM PDT by RKBA Democrat (GOTS: Food, water, guns, ammo, useful skills, friends, cash, and precious metals.)
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To: SaraJohnson

“We would go to jail for killing the wrong guy at a crime scene. The excuse of “I could not see who I was shooting” probably would not go over real big.”

Silly serf. Of course you would go to prison. And Lord help you if the person you happened to shoot was a 17 y.o. black male high on cough syrup.


80 posted on 07/27/2013 4:14:43 AM PDT by RKBA Democrat (GOTS: Food, water, guns, ammo, useful skills, friends, cash, and precious metals.)
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To: NVDave

The criticism as to “wrong number” by so many posters isn’t always as reasonable as it sounds. Back when streets were laid out on a grid, it would have been, but that just isn’t true today. Streets wind around, and odd/even numbering, and for that matter what street you are on changes unpredictably. This neighborhood is one of that type.

However, in this case I looked the house up on Street View. The mailbox has a number, and the curb is numbered at both the sidewalk and the driveway. It’s actually an unusually well-marked nehghborhood. It shouldn’t have been terribly difficult for them to figure out which house was which.

There are no streetlights in the area, and the garage in question is entered from the back of the home. IOW, the driveway wraps around the house, so the cops were in his backyard when they shot him.


81 posted on 07/27/2013 4:21:55 AM PDT by Sherman Logan
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To: Chode
Indeed, they had to shoot something with their egos all jacked up wearing tactical gear.

Have badge will murder.

82 posted on 07/27/2013 4:29:46 AM PDT by DTogo (High time to bring back The Sons of Liberty !!)
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To: EEGator

If they practiced on a “Grandfather” target, they were thinking about it beforehand.

Any idiot can pull a trigger or say “10-4”. A policeman MUST have discipline and good sense. If you put this police department in a dark warehouse, told them there was a “perp” inside, then shouted “BOO!” they’d probably gun each other down before it was all over.

Fire their entire chain of command. That’s what they do to the military, during war, with known, armed enemy shooting at the troops day & night and one of the soldiers shoots a civilian in error.


83 posted on 07/27/2013 4:37:53 AM PDT by BwanaNdege ("To learn who rules over you simply find out who you are not allowed to criticize"- Voltaire)
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To: NVDave

What a tragedy!

I think the best takeaway from this is the old saw about never pointing a gun at anything you don’t intend to kill. An extension would be not to unnecessarily insert yourself into a situation where an armed confrontation might result.

IOW, even if you have a gun it’s not always a good idea to go looking for trouble. In some circumstances, such as this one, especially if you have a gun.

I find the notion that “they identified themselves as police” problematic as a justification. It’s dark, uniforms can’t be seen, and armed men are yelling at you. Possibly you don’t have your hearing aid in. In all likelihood they pointed their flashlights at him and blinded him. It is not at all unreasonable for you to react by pointing your gun at the shouters.

Unfortunately, once you do point your gun at them (if that’s what really happened) it’s entirely reasonable for the cops to shoot first.

The absolute need to shoot first in a confrontation at close range means the chance of tragedy goes WAY up when both sides are armed.

I think the cops in this case should be charged with whatever the homeowner would have been charged with had he shot one or both of them.


84 posted on 07/27/2013 4:39:16 AM PDT by Sherman Logan
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To: redreno

If grandfather was dead, why did they shoot him?


85 posted on 07/27/2013 4:42:46 AM PDT by bert ((K.E. N.P. N.C. +12 ..... Travon... Felony assault and battery hate crime)
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To: Jeff Head

Yes. It DOES “happen all the time”.

Which brings the question:

Has the “Mission” of the Police CHANGED?


86 posted on 07/27/2013 4:54:34 AM PDT by left that other site (You Shall Know the Truth, and the Truth Shall Set You Free...John 8:32)
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To: redreno

This is murder. And there will be no trial.


87 posted on 07/27/2013 4:58:49 AM PDT by I want the USA back (We live in a fascist dictatorship, thanks to half the public having its head up its a$$.)
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To: Sherman Logan

Horse-Crap! The police were in this man’s home illegally. They crept in, in the dark. The fact that they have badges does not give them an absolute need, or right, to shoot first.


88 posted on 07/27/2013 5:01:46 AM PDT by Hugh the Scot
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To: redreno

Welcome to May 28th.


89 posted on 07/27/2013 5:02:18 AM PDT by AppyPappy (Obama: What did I not know and when did I not know it?)
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To: KarlInOhio
In Fort Worth, every house number is spray painted on the curb of the sidewalk.

Funny how the "lighting was too poor" to find the correct address (all they had to do was shine their little flashlights on the curb to get the correct address), but good enough to ascertain that Mr. Waller was pointing a handgun at them. And, of course, pairing two rookie cops for the initial call to the burglary was sheer stupidity.

The FWPD must think that FW residents are idiots by coming up with this excuse.

When the band plays "Hail to the Chief", they're pointing the cannon at you.


90 posted on 07/27/2013 5:02:25 AM PDT by ex91B10 (We've tried the Soap Box,the Ballot Box and the Jury Box; ONE BOX LEFT!)
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To: Little Pig

Been there, done that. If the property is wooded at all your house will be blinking on and off like a marquee all night if there’s the slightest breeze. Same with any wildlife crossing the yard, and they do.

No trees or large bushes, and fence the entire property. Then it might work. Otherwise, it’s impossibly annoying, for both you and your neighbors.


91 posted on 07/27/2013 5:07:20 AM PDT by RegulatorCountry
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To: redreno
This happened in May.

The Blaze has become useless and so has Glenn Beck and his TV 'network', I'm out of there. I didn't sign up there for Religious Classes nor to hear non-stop about Jews and Israel.

92 posted on 07/27/2013 5:08:20 AM PDT by Condor51 (Si vis pacem, para bellum.)
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To: Condor51

Wrong address? Maybe that was intended for the thread across the way.


93 posted on 07/27/2013 5:10:13 AM PDT by RegulatorCountry
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To: left that other site

“Has the “Mission” of the Police CHANGED?”

Yes. IMHO, they no longer keep the peace but 1) politick for advancement and safe, personal cushiness, 2) dress to the nine millimeters and full auto black, 3) assume and target people and dogs as enemies 1st, and 4) forencify the after effects (if they’re smart enough).

They make me mad. I was raised to believe in them and to approach them easily. I don’t think they want anyone to talk to them anymore. Except their cronies.


94 posted on 07/27/2013 5:11:29 AM PDT by combat_boots (The Lion of Judah cometh. Hallelujah. Gloria Patri, Filio et Spiritui Sancto!)
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To: Sherman Logan

“isn’t always as reasonable as it sounds.”

Their jobs are to be exact. For reasons of life and death. I don’t care if streets wind or not. It’s their job - and others’ lives - for them to know.


95 posted on 07/27/2013 5:13:30 AM PDT by combat_boots (The Lion of Judah cometh. Hallelujah. Gloria Patri, Filio et Spiritui Sancto!)
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To: redreno
Bullshit! They were going to shoot anything that moved. He happen to move. If they can't tell one side of a street from another, they shouldn't[for their own safety] not be out in the public any. Now, because of their ineptness, an innocent man is dead. But, he and his family can take solace the fact that there will be many more following him as the police become more “professional”.
96 posted on 07/27/2013 5:17:44 AM PDT by sport
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To: Condor51

“This happened in May.”

Probably took ‘em this long to get their lies straight.


97 posted on 07/27/2013 5:19:34 AM PDT by PLMerite (Shut the Beyotch Down! Burn, baby, burn!)
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To: TArcher
We are living in the age of affirmative action, My FRiend. Just be satisfied that they thought to use English letters.
98 posted on 07/27/2013 5:22:06 AM PDT by sport
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To: Condor51
The Blaze has become useless...

Amen...STILL trying to get them to post the story about the Kelly Hunnewell murder that occurred in South Carolina recently...the one that left FOUR YOUNG CHILDREN orphaned. She was shot down by three hoodie-wearing Trayvons in their late teens...nothing but 'crickets' from the Blaze.

A fund has been set up for the children:

Kelly Hunnewell Survivor Trust
c/o First Citizens Bank
P. O. Box 520
Hull, Georgia. 30646

99 posted on 07/27/2013 5:24:30 AM PDT by who knows what evil? (G-d saved more animals than people on the ark...www.siameserescue.org.)
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To: TArcher

Who were his instructors in college? His editor probably as ignorant as he is.


100 posted on 07/27/2013 5:25:32 AM PDT by sport
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