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We’re Going to Trial: All Charges Stick in Curley/Schultz/Spanier Preliminary Hearing
Onward State ^ | July 30, 2013 | Kevin Horne

Posted on 07/30/2013 3:33:49 PM PDT by Uncle Chip

After two days of testimony, we’re officially going to trial.

Judge William Wenner ruled instantly after closing arguments this afternoon that all charges against Gary Schultz, Tim Curley, and Graham Spanier will stick.

A trial date has not been set yet but is anticipated for the spring. Yahoo’s Dan Wetzel reports that legal experts think the contentious trial could last up to two months.

“It’s a tragic day for Penn State University for sure,” Judge Wenner said while making his ruling.

AG Investigator Anthony Sassano was the last witness to testify. He was one of the first investigators to interview Mike McQueary as part of the Sandusky investigation.

The three attorneys attempted to paint a picture of coercion by the prosecution to get exaggerated statements by McQueary to make for a better case against Sandusky.

Curley’s co-counsel Brian Perry asked Sassano to explain why Sandusky was acquitted of deviate sexual intercourse in the McQueary victim case in an intense line of questioning that had to be interrupted by Wenner.

“From Day one, Mike McQueary never said he saw penetration,” Sassano said. “He said he saw Jerry Sandusky behind a boy in a position he believed was penetration. They only way we would know is if the victim came forward or McQueary saw it.”

Perry wasn’t the only attorney to go after McQueary’s testimony. Spanier’s attorney Elizabeth Ainslie put it bluntly in her closing remarks.

“I believe Mike McQueary is making it up as he goes along,” Ainslie said, arguing that McQueary’s uncorroborated and inconsistent testimony is the only evidence against her client. “But in the end, he says nothing about Dr. Spanier. The evidence against Dr. Spanier is all innuendos and farfetched inferences.”

(Excerpt) Read more at onwardstate.com ...


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; Government; News/Current Events; US: Pennsylvania
KEYWORDS: pennstate; pennsylvania
Curley’s attorney Caroline Roberto had similar sentiments.

“We heard really nothing out of the ordinary from McQueary when he took the witness stand. Except we did hear some embellishment like we always do,” Roberto said during closing statements. “I really don’t know what foundation the prosecution is proceeding on.”

Ultimately, conviction probably rests on whether the prosecution can prove the three former administrators intentionally and knowingly failed to report child sexual abuse, rather than just honest negligence.

As Gary Schultz’s lawyer Tom Farrell put it, “There’s a difference between failing to make a report and interfering to make a report.”

1 posted on 07/30/2013 3:33:49 PM PDT by Uncle Chip
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To: Uncle Chip

Still won’t go to trial. Not with the mess cynthia baldwin made of this.

I’d love to see MM on the stand though. That could go on for weeks.


2 posted on 07/30/2013 3:39:26 PM PDT by FlJoePa ("Success without honor is an unseasoned dish; it will satisfy your hunger, but it won't taste good")
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To: FlJoePa
This is the best thing that could happen to Happy Valley.

It will be an opportunity to lay all those cards out on the table -- including the Tom Harmon card, and the Louie Freeh card, and the DPW card, and the TSM card, and to finally tie McQueary down to one [or two] stories.

And this will be great with three defendants each with their own legal team. It will be a real circus.

3 posted on 07/30/2013 4:05:09 PM PDT by Uncle Chip
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To: Uncle Chip

Still beating that “Grand Jury is bogus” drum, eh? Louis Freeh was making it all up?

Yes, this trial is a good thing, because it will force all you deniers to finally face the truth.

For those in positions of power, not doing your job is a crime.


4 posted on 07/30/2013 4:11:14 PM PDT by canuck_conservative
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To: Uncle Chip

These slimy win at any cost administrators frankly should be taken out behiund the barn and horsewhipped. They failed the very people they should have protected. I have NO sympathy for them


5 posted on 07/30/2013 4:14:30 PM PDT by Nifster
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To: canuck_conservative

You’re already 0 for 3 —


6 posted on 07/30/2013 4:19:24 PM PDT by Uncle Chip
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To: canuck_conservative

Actually no one took a bigger beating in that courtroom the past few days than louis freeh. That is if one paid any attention to what was actually said.


7 posted on 07/30/2013 4:24:39 PM PDT by FlJoePa ("Success without honor is an unseasoned dish; it will satisfy your hunger, but it won't taste good")
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To: Uncle Chip

There is no difference in my eyes. They should all be staked to anthills and covered in honey.


8 posted on 07/30/2013 4:25:15 PM PDT by Lurker (Violence is rarely the answer. But when it is it is the only answer.)
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To: Uncle Chip

I agree it will shed light, but it’s a still a selfish standpoint. I wouldn’t want to be one of those 3 guys facing jail in a politically charged environment with an out of control OAG’s office.


9 posted on 07/30/2013 4:26:19 PM PDT by FlJoePa ("Success without honor is an unseasoned dish; it will satisfy your hunger, but it won't taste good")
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To: canuck_conservative

“For those in positions of power, not doing your job is a crime.”

Absolutely! These “men” are all enablers by reason of their silence and covering up of Sandusky. And as far as “Joe Pa” is concerned, I hope he’s burning in Hell! These “sports figures” are mostly all a sham. Football has no place in post secondary education, particularly at public universities and colleges. Just a bunch of knuckle draggers taking up space where they have noting to contribute. It ends up being Rah, Rah for the alumni.


10 posted on 07/30/2013 4:27:05 PM PDT by vette6387
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To: Nifster
They failed the very people they should have protected.

Are you referring to Dr Raykovitz and the board member at Sandusky's Second Mile charity who were notified of the 2001 incident??? Because once they were notified they were by law required to follow up with the DPW and to date no one knows for sure whether they did or not.

Penn State has the wrong people on trial and they know it.

11 posted on 07/30/2013 4:36:17 PM PDT by Uncle Chip
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To: vette6387

I see you’ve been closely following this, huh?


12 posted on 07/30/2013 4:37:58 PM PDT by FlJoePa ("Success without honor is an unseasoned dish; it will satisfy your hunger, but it won't taste good")
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To: vette6387
“For those in positions of power, not doing your job is a crime.”

That sounds so righteous, doesn't it, but you won't find that anywhere in the law.

13 posted on 07/30/2013 4:39:16 PM PDT by Uncle Chip
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To: Lurker
"There is no difference in my eyes. They should all be staked to anthills and covered in honey."

Before or after their trial? Or maybe during?

14 posted on 07/30/2013 4:39:49 PM PDT by FlJoePa ("Success without honor is an unseasoned dish; it will satisfy your hunger, but it won't taste good")
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To: Uncle Chip; FlJoePa; Daveinyork; Red Steel; David; okie01; BluesDuke; doug from upland; AJFavish; ..
Can someone out there state (pardon the pun) precisely on what criminal charges these three PSU former officials were indicted? The author of the posted piece, and a couple of other stories I've seen on the Net today on the same subject, is very much remiss in not explaining this to his readers.

Is failing to report a crime by others to law enforcement a crime in and of itself in PA? If so, what is the legal term for it?

15 posted on 07/30/2013 4:49:21 PM PDT by justiceseeker93
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To: justiceseeker93
Here's a decent, short video by an ex-PA AG about what hurdles the state is facing. Remember the burden of proof the past 2 days was literally next to zero.

pennlive.com video here

16 posted on 07/30/2013 4:55:04 PM PDT by FlJoePa ("Success without honor is an unseasoned dish; it will satisfy your hunger, but it won't taste good")
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To: FlJoePa

If you have a short bio on Cynthia Baldwin and what she did in this case that should have her disbarred and sued, please post.


17 posted on 07/30/2013 5:15:01 PM PDT by Uncle Chip
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To: FlJoePa; All
Thanks for the video. Seems as if that lawyer commenting is supposed to be a neutral party. If he is correct, the failure to report charge and the conspiracy charge have to be thrown out because they are based on an ex post facto statute. That's basic constitutional law, I would think.
18 posted on 07/30/2013 5:17:29 PM PDT by justiceseeker93
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To: Uncle Chip
January 16th Blehar - Who Knew? Part 2: The Hiring of Cynthia Baldwin

January 18th Blehar - Did Cynthia Baldwin Commit Perjury In Her 2012 Affidavit?

April 25th Blehar - Baldwin Perjury: Never told PSU Officials About Subpoena 1179

Ray is very sharp and doesn't put stuff out there he doesn't fully research. If he says the Feds are coming (which he does), the Feds are coming. Read his stuff - the amount of time he must spend on this is remarkable. Follow him on twitter @rayblehar

19 posted on 07/30/2013 5:32:22 PM PDT by FlJoePa ("Success without honor is an unseasoned dish; it will satisfy your hunger, but it won't taste good")
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To: Uncle Chip
That sounds so righteous, doesn't it, but you won't find that anywhere in the law.

Not in those words, but the concept is there. How about child endangerment, for starters?

Namely -

These three were in the upper positions of power in an educational setting, and had tremendous control and influence over young, impressionable kids. With that comes the tremendous responsibility to care for those in your charge - and those three, um, guys failed to do that.

Got that? They knew things improper were going on, had been going on for years, and they did nothing/next to nothing about it. Children were violated as a result - these turkeys are responsible for their negligence, if they had done or said something, Sandusky could have been stopped.


20 posted on 07/30/2013 5:41:48 PM PDT by canuck_conservative
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To: canuck_conservative
These three were in the upper positions of power in an educational setting, and had tremendous control and influence over young, impressionable kids. With that comes the tremendous responsibility to care for those in your charge - and those three, um, guys failed to do that.

Now you are 0 for 4.

The kid showering with Sandusky that night was not in the charge of the university or anyone employed there and as such they were not mandated reporters.

But they did excede the law and report the incident to a mandated reporter who did have oversight of this kid -- Dr Raykovitz at the 2nd Mile. Maybe you could ask him what he did with the report.

You haven't even been close thus far but keep trying.

21 posted on 07/30/2013 5:52:56 PM PDT by Uncle Chip
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To: canuck_conservative

You keep assigning guilt in 2001 based on 2013 knowledge. You don’t see a problem with that? You don’t see the flaw there in your thinking?

Until 11-09-11, there was one alleged victim known to 2 of these men (Curley and Spanier) - V2 in the shower and a questionable report from Mike McQueary. Shultz - being in charge of the campus police department also had knowledge of the dismissed 1998 charge - so he knew of 2.

You act like they (and Joe) looked the other way while hundreds of kids were abused by a long retired (1999) coach. That’s a great media story, but it’s also completely ridiculous.


22 posted on 07/30/2013 5:54:16 PM PDT by FlJoePa ("Success without honor is an unseasoned dish; it will satisfy your hunger, but it won't taste good")
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To: justiceseeker93
If you look hard enough (actually do a quick search on the web), if you are in a position of power as relates to schools and children, and you know of actual abuse or see actual abuse or suspect another school worker or officil of abusing childrean, you must report it to legal authorities. Not hint to someone up the chain at work.

So now justeice_83 if it was your kid who had been abused or molested, would you not want to have the abuser brought to justice? What about if there was suspicion that other school personnel knew of or you suspected your kids were being sexual abused wouldn't you want them to be punished?

Everyone who is involved should be severely punished. If the investigations show they knew or should have known about the abuse.

If someone does not suspect that on/in a football program like Penn State talks to each other you are deluding your self and it is probably best you are not a school official.

Hopefully you keep it that way, no matter what uncle jerry or joe said to you.. or caused you to think otherwise.
23 posted on 07/30/2013 6:12:14 PM PDT by JSteff (It was ALL about SCOTUS... We are DOOMED for several generations. . Who cares? The Dems care!)
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To: JSteff

What pap. Universities deal with adults (age 17 and up), not children. You act like PSU is a day care center.

Who knew of actual abuse or saw actual abuse? Answer: No one - not even Mike McQueary. Certainly not JVP, GS, GS, or TC. If you can prove they did, the OAG’s office would love to hear from you because they are going to need some help.

Where do you get your information? The media?

And, your last line makes you a bonafide idiot.


24 posted on 07/30/2013 6:21:12 PM PDT by FlJoePa ("Success without honor is an unseasoned dish; it will satisfy your hunger, but it won't taste good")
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To: Uncle Chip

All of them are accountable.....


25 posted on 07/30/2013 6:47:10 PM PDT by Nifster
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To: justiceseeker93

Failure to report a sexual abuse against a child when you are a mandated reporter certainly is a crime. I do not know what the indictment reads


26 posted on 07/30/2013 6:48:14 PM PDT by Nifster
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To: Nifster

No one involved or named at PSU was a mandated reporter. MM’s father’s friend - with whom he shared his story the night it happened was a mandated reporter, but MM told him nothing sexual happened after being asked 3 times (per Dr Dranov’s GJ testimony).

Why would a University President, or an Athletic Director be a mandated reporter for child abuse? They don’t come in contact with children very often - if at all.


27 posted on 07/30/2013 6:55:31 PM PDT by FlJoePa ("Success without honor is an unseasoned dish; it will satisfy your hunger, but it won't taste good")
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To: FlJoePa
So, you are saying that it NEVER happened to anyone under the age of 18... ever? They all testified they where touched and sexually abused. Do you think they all were lieing??? Really? All of them?

Why would his own kid ask to be emancipated? Get real.

The whole response is just why child abusers should get the death penalty. They are never, ever, cured and have a recidivism rate of nearly 100% over time. That is not worth any risk of cure or normalcy for anyone.

They are pathetic slime. What do you think? Should they ever get a chance to molest/abuse again? Is any chance worth it? If a child abuser knows they may even think of it again, they should just stay away from kids. Forever.

Do you agree or disagree, and why?
28 posted on 07/30/2013 6:56:10 PM PDT by JSteff (It was ALL about SCOTUS... We are DOOMED for several generations. . Who cares? The Dems care!)
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To: canuck_conservative

All of this nonsense could have been avoided if even ONE of these fools had been more worried about doing the right thing than they were about defending “da program” at all costs.

Now, instead if a scandal that would have been a distant memory by now, PaternoPaterno is dead with his legacy destroyed, careers have been ruined, Penn State has been shamed for decades to come, and “da program” lies in ruins.

Yep, they saved “da program” all right.

The only positive out of all of this is that now Penn State can get back to being a university and not just life support for a football team.


29 posted on 07/30/2013 7:00:23 PM PDT by VideoPaul
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To: JSteff

Again, you’re applying 2013 knowledge to events of 2001.

Read my post #22 in this thread.


30 posted on 07/30/2013 7:17:44 PM PDT by FlJoePa ("Success without honor is an unseasoned dish; it will satisfy your hunger, but it won't taste good")
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To: VideoPaul

PSU is/was/and will always be a first class University - ranked as high as #50 in the world.

None of this changes that and once you actually do some research, none of this has anything to do with the football program.

The past few days had prosecution witnesses saying over and over again that no one ever told them to keep secrets, not talk about js, etc. If this was a coverup, it was the worst in history.

As I said earlier - the biggest loser in these proceedings was louis freeh. These guys were going to trial regardless. His “reasonable conclusions” of a massive coverup were blown out of the water.


31 posted on 07/30/2013 7:21:32 PM PDT by FlJoePa ("Success without honor is an unseasoned dish; it will satisfy your hunger, but it won't taste good")
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To: FlJoePa

The best outcome that can come from this is for the truth, whatever that is, to be revealed at last.


32 posted on 07/30/2013 7:27:35 PM PDT by Delta Dawn (Fluent in two languages: English and cursive.)
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To: FlJoePa

And now this first class university can turn its attention to education and not to ‘da program’.

all’s well that ends well.


33 posted on 07/30/2013 7:28:59 PM PDT by VideoPaul
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To: FlJoePa

‘proof the past 2 days was literally next to zero.’

Hence the old adage that, ‘One can indict a ham sandwich’.

I hope that this isn’t going to be like the Zimmerman farce.

McQueary can read and write cursive, can he not?


34 posted on 07/30/2013 7:33:54 PM PDT by Delta Dawn (Fluent in two languages: English and cursive.)
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To: JSteff

‘Why would his own kid ask to be emancipated? Get real. ‘

I can answer that one. Upon conviction Sandusky lost whatever pension Penn St was paying him. This kid chimed in at the last minute to become eligible for the civil suit funds being set aside by Penn St.

Money talks.


35 posted on 07/30/2013 7:42:26 PM PDT by Delta Dawn (Fluent in two languages: English and cursive.)
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To: FlJoePa
§ 42.42. Suspected child abuse—mandated reporting requirements.

(a) General rule. Under 23 Pa.C.S. § 6311 (relating to persons required to report suspected child abuse), licensees who, in the course of the employment, occupation or practice of their profession, come into contact with children shall report or cause a report to be made to the Department of Public Welfare when they have reasonable cause to suspect on the basis of their professional or other training or experience, that a child coming before them in their professional or official capacity is a victim of child abuse.


36 posted on 07/30/2013 8:11:46 PM PDT by kitchen (Make plans and prepare. You'll never have trouble if you're ready for it. - TR)
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To: FlJoePa

All three, on Pay Per View.


37 posted on 07/30/2013 8:49:56 PM PDT by Lurker (Violence is rarely the answer. But when it is it is the only answer.)
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To: Nifster; FlJoePa; JSteff; Uncle Chip; All
Failure to report a sexual abuse against a child when you are a mandated reporter certainly is a crime.

Please see the link to a video of a neutral lawyer's comments at post # 16. From what I understand him to be saying, the accused PSU officials had some knowledge of Sandusky's sexual abuse of children in the early 1990s. However, the mandatory reporting statute was not enacted until 1997.

Yes, I would say they had a moral responsibility to report Sandusky to law enforcement when they found out about what was happening. But apparently they were under no legal mandate under the Pennsylvania statutes to report it at that time.

So as much as these three may be morally culpable for not reporting, they can't be convicted for violating a statute that wasn't on the books at the time of the events in question. It may cause us to be frustrated and angry, but there are instances where morally outrageous conduct does not reach the level of criminal guilt, and this may be one of them.

38 posted on 07/30/2013 9:04:37 PM PDT by justiceseeker93
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To: justiceseeker93

Here is the Grand Jury presentment:

http://www.attorneygeneral.gov/uploadedFiles/Press/spanier-schultz-curley_presentment-11-1-12.pdf

http://www.attorneygeneral.gov/press.aspx?id=6270
“Child sex charges filed against Jerry Sandusky; two top Penn State University officials charged with perjury & failure to report suspected child abuse”

http://www.attorneygeneral.gov/press.aspx?id=6699
“Former Penn State President Graham Spanier charged in “conspiracy of silence;” Gary Schultz & Tim Curley face additional charges”


39 posted on 07/30/2013 11:05:12 PM PDT by iowamark
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To: justiceseeker93

You have your dates off by a decade. Also, only one (Schultz - because of his role of overseeing the the campus police department) was aware of the 1998 incident which was fully investigated by the state police and local agencies, then dismissed by Ray Gricar.

The other two were only ever aware of what Mike McQueary told them about 2001. Whether he told them there was “sexual abuse of a child” remains to be seen. They claim he watered down the story to “horse play”.

There were no other incidents or victims reported until after the charges came down in 2011.


40 posted on 07/31/2013 4:21:19 AM PDT by FlJoePa ("Success without honor is an unseasoned dish; it will satisfy your hunger, but it won't taste good")
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To: iowamark

That presentment is a work of fiction as it claims Mike McQueary witnessed a rape in the shower. Mike McQueary never testified to any such thing. It was also suspiciously leaked to the media in a manner to attract more victims and also spurn outrage (which it obviously did).

I firmly believe that Linda Kelly’s AG office is going to be in some real hot water over that document before all this is said and done.


41 posted on 07/31/2013 4:23:48 AM PDT by FlJoePa ("Success without honor is an unseasoned dish; it will satisfy your hunger, but it won't taste good")
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To: FlJoePa

I do not pretend to follow Pennsylvania law. All sorts of people are mandated reporters that do not fit the ‘thought of’ as typical. Why are you trying to protect men who encouraged a win at all costs attitude to pervade PSU? With Paterno, Sandusky is nobody.


42 posted on 07/31/2013 9:00:42 AM PDT by Nifster
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To: Nifster

I guess I don’t understand where this myth that PSU had/has a “win at all costs” attitude towards it’s football program.

For years they have been a model program - even used by the ncaa as a model for other schools to emulate. They graduate 80% of their players and are the only division 1 school to never have had a major violation.

PSU has always been proud of it’s football program - and ALL their student athletes. But certainly never more so than any comparable school.

As far as protecting TC, GS, and GS - I simply don’t think they did anything wrong. In hindsight, sure you can say if they’d have done this, then that wouldn’t have happened, etc... But not at the time, given the information they were provided.

This is a very emotional issue, and I think they are paying an exorbitant price for that - especially when compared to the local and state agencies, as well as the second mile itself - who truly failed those kids (and continue to to this day). JMO of course.


43 posted on 07/31/2013 9:50:31 AM PDT by FlJoePa ("Success without honor is an unseasoned dish; it will satisfy your hunger, but it won't taste good")
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