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When Cops Don't Need a Warrant To Crash Through Your Door
Reason ^ | July 31, 2013 | J.D. Tuccille

Posted on 08/05/2013 6:15:09 AM PDT by bamahead

The Fourth Amendment protects us from random invasions of our homes by police, right? We know we're secure in our "persons, houses, papers, and effects" unless the cops demonstrate probable cause to a judge and get a warrant. Except... Except when they don't. The fact of the matter is that police have a lot of leeway to bust your door down and take a look around if they fear that waiting for a warrant could lead to loss of evidence or danger to people. Or lead to something, anyway. That end run around the Fourth Amendment is called "exigent circumstances," and nobody really seems to be sure where it starts and stops. Except for the police. They know it when they see it.

On July 17, a law enforcement task force including federal and local officers barged into the Sarasota, Florida home of Louise Goldsberry after a brief standoff. The officers, looking for a suspected child molester in Goldsberry's apartment complex, insisted that the nurse's frightened reaction to the sight of a stranger pointing a gun through her kitchen window was all the reason they needed to assume their target's presence. "I feel bad for her," U.S. Marshal Matt Wiggins told Sarasota Herald-Tribune columnist Tom Lyons. "But at the same time, I had to reasonably believe the bad guy was in her house based on what they were doing."

What Goldberry and her boyfriend were doing was cowering in the presence of armed invaders. But that really might be all that it takes.

-SNIP-

[S]trangely, the courts have been unable to provide officers with a useful definition of the term "exigent circumstances."

-SNIP-

"Not only is the definition of the term elusive, the number of situations that are deemed 'exigent' keeps expanding."

(Excerpt) Read more at reason.com ...


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Crime/Corruption; Extended News; Government
KEYWORDS: 4thamendment; donutwatch; govtabuse; homeinvasion; policeinvasion; policestate; rapeofliberty; sarasota; searchwarrant; swat; swatabuse; tyranny; warrant; warriorcops

1 posted on 08/05/2013 6:15:09 AM PDT by bamahead
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To: neverdem; Abathar; Abcdefg; Abram; Abundy; albertp; Alexander Rubin; Allosaurs_r_us; amchugh; ...
Fourth Amendment notwithstanding, we really do live in a world where screaming when an unidentifiable police officer points a gun at you through your window may be all it takes to authorize knocking your door off its hinges and dragging you outside in handcuffs.



Libertarian ping! Click here to get added or here to be removed or post a message here!

2 posted on 08/05/2013 6:16:39 AM PDT by bamahead (Few men desire liberty; most men wish only for a just master. -- Sallust)
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To: bamahead

The 4th Amendment will become the vehicle by which armed Federal thugs will exterminate a few million political dissidents.

I, for one, am beginning to believe my death will be at the hands of a Federal government thug for simply being a Conservative.

When a Federal government agency openly calls for the monitoring and arrest of Christians, conservatives, gun owners, and patriots, you have to know your time on this Earth is being counted.


3 posted on 08/05/2013 6:26:42 AM PDT by rarestia (It's time to water the Tree of Liberty.)
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To: rarestia

obamaworld: Constitution???? We don’t need no steenkin’ Constitution!


4 posted on 08/05/2013 6:32:40 AM PDT by hal ogen (First Amendment or Reeducation Camp?)
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To: rarestia

Same. But I hope I take some with me if I end up with a warrantless invasion of thugs with badges.


5 posted on 08/05/2013 6:35:12 AM PDT by Crazieman (Are you naive enough to think VOTING will fix this entrenched system?)
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To: bamahead

There was some ruling when the lower court ruled that if police offices saw two guys fighting with knives in a picture window, they still had to ask for a search warrant to enter. The higher court said that was ridiculous and overturned it.


6 posted on 08/05/2013 6:43:56 AM PDT by proxy_user
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To: rarestia

Police activity in my neighborhood the other night had me concerned.

I know how to kill a bad guy intruder.

But what if the cops break in?


7 posted on 08/05/2013 6:49:43 AM PDT by Uncle Miltie (Where's my pressure cooker backpack wmd ricin laced al qaeda terrorist BASSELOPE?)
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To: Uncle Miltie

If it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck, and crashes thru your window like a duck without announcing a search warrant, it’s a duck.


8 posted on 08/05/2013 6:54:11 AM PDT by ctdonath2 (Making good people helpless doesn't make bad people harmless.)
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To: Uncle Miltie

The police have been given carte blache to break down anyone’s door on suspicion of anything.

“Hey Boomer! That there house’s blinds done gone aflutterin’ when we look at ‘em. I bet they’re doin’ sumtin’ suspicious-like in there. We should go knock down that there door and check it out.”


9 posted on 08/05/2013 6:56:11 AM PDT by rarestia (It's time to water the Tree of Liberty.)
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To: rarestia
When a Federal government agency openly calls for the monitoring and arrest of Christians, conservatives, gun owners, and patriots, you have to know your time on this Earth is being counted.

Theirs is being counted now. The clock is ticking.

10 posted on 08/05/2013 7:01:31 AM PDT by unixfox (Abolish Slavery, Repeal the 16th Amendment)
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To: bamahead
Not only is the definition of the term elusive, the number of situations that are deemed 'exigent' keeps expanding

Maybe that's because the government first perverted the term 'public' from meaning OWNED by the public to 'anywhere a member of the public can go'.

11 posted on 08/05/2013 7:15:19 AM PDT by MamaTexan (I am a Person as defined by the Law of Nature, not a 'person' as defined by the laws of Man)
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To: hal ogen
obamaworld: Constitution???? We don’t need no steenkin’ Constitution!

I dislike Obama as much as anyone but this crap has been going on for years under both republican and democrat administrations
12 posted on 08/05/2013 7:18:15 AM PDT by slumber1 (My real name is Rusty Shackleford)
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To: Uncle Miltie

Don’t be the first to die.


13 posted on 08/05/2013 7:38:46 AM PDT by G Larry (Let his days be few; and let another take his office. Psalms 109:8)
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To: Uncle Miltie
>>I know how to kill a bad guy intruder. But what if the cops break in?<<

If in your sleep state you are jostled out of bed, cobwebs in your head and you grab your 9mm.....your wife will likely be arranging a funeral or weeping by your bedside.

14 posted on 08/05/2013 7:41:35 AM PDT by servantboy777
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To: rarestia
The thought you conveyed in your second sentence is correct. The only thing in question will be how you die: [a] From a Federalized member of your local police. or [b] starved ,worked, and beaten to death by Obama's goons in one of his camps while bastards like Hillary tour said camp and laugh at you. Like Himmler did the Jews in Hitler's camps.

That is the choice you will be left with all too soon down the road.

15 posted on 08/05/2013 7:51:03 AM PDT by sport
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To: bamahead

People ask “how on earth did the holocaust happen..?”

That question is being very silly.


16 posted on 08/05/2013 8:05:40 AM PDT by gaijin
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To: proxy_user
There was some ruling when the lower court ruled that if police offices saw two guys fighting with knives in a picture window, they still had to ask for a search warrant to enter. The higher court said that was ridiculous and overturned it.

That's because the higher courts are (a) idiots or (b) involved in the degradation of the Constitution.

The NSA's crap would never fly if they had the slightest respect for the fourth amendment, so I'm inclined to say the latter. (Besides, the police have no obligation to protect any private citizen, why should such protection apply, circumventing the 4th, because they wish it?)

17 posted on 08/05/2013 8:06:25 AM PDT by OneWingedShark (Q: Why am I here? A: To do Justly, to love mercy, and to walk humbly with my God.)
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To: Uncle Miltie

“I know how to kill a bad guy intruder.

But what if the cops break in?”


Same response! Someone breaks in, shoot, shoot straight, shoot often, reload, shoot again.


18 posted on 08/05/2013 8:07:50 AM PDT by Wurlitzer (Nothing says "ignorance" like Islam! 969)
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To: rarestia

As is documented throughout history, a police state has declared war on people like us who oppose an incipient tyranny.

They are hoping we don’t understand it and reciprocate.

If every conservative had the balls to die defending against such raids with deadly force, it would stop.

But most, in the moment, after all the training and prepping, acquiesce to save their hides.

We don’t really take seriously the Constitution we live by, the power it gives us, and what it will take individually to stand against this with any hope of success: we’re still too comfortable, too naive, too trusting, too scared.

Declared or not, they know they’re at war with us, but we still refuse to believe it. Until we do, the Constitution and its Bill of Rights is mere paper.


19 posted on 08/05/2013 8:10:27 AM PDT by dagogo redux (A whiff of primitive spirits in the air, harbingers of an impending descent into the feral.)
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To: sport
The thought you conveyed in your second sentence is correct. The only thing in question will be how you die: [a] From a Federalized member of your local police. or [b] starved ,worked, and beaten to death by Obama's goons in one of his camps while bastards like Hillary tour said camp and laugh at you. Like Himmler did the Jews in Hitler's camps.

There's a third choice:

And how we burned in the camps later, thinking: What would things have been like if every Security operative, when he went out at night to make an arrest, had been uncertain whether he would return alive and had to say goodbye to his family? Or if, during periods of mass arrests, as for example in Leningrad, when they arrested a quarter of the entire city, people had not simply sat there in their lairs, paling in terror at every bang of the downstairs door and at every step on the staircase, but had understood they had nothing left to lose and had boldly set up in the downstairs hall an ambush of half a dozen people with axes, hammers, pokers, or whatever else was at hand. The Organs would very quickly have suffered a shortage of officers and transport and, notwithstanding all of Stalin's thirst; the cursed machine would have ground to a halt!
— Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn, The Gulag Archipelago

20 posted on 08/05/2013 8:10:30 AM PDT by OneWingedShark (Q: Why am I here? A: To do Justly, to love mercy, and to walk humbly with my God.)
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To: bamahead

It is hard to argue with a police state.


21 posted on 08/05/2013 8:19:53 AM PDT by pallis
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To: OneWingedShark
I intended to phrase it thusly: You can either die on your feet fighting as a free man/woman or on your knees as a slave begging.

I have made my choice. To the point it is: I was born free and I will die free. I have made my Peace with my Maker and am now just going along until that time gets here. But anyway, my race is about run, at the longest, either way,I don't have very much time left. I just enjoy what I have left.

22 posted on 08/05/2013 8:20:16 AM PDT by sport
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To: sport

It’s bone chilling how Weimar we are now, but no one wants to see it.


23 posted on 08/05/2013 8:46:35 AM PDT by rarestia (It's time to water the Tree of Liberty.)
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To: rarestia
The 4th Amendment will become the vehicle by which armed Federal thugs will exterminate a few million political dissidents.

I, for one, am beginning to believe my death will be at the hands of a Federal government thug for simply being a Conservative.

When a Federal government agency openly calls for the monitoring and arrest of Christians, conservatives, gun owners, and patriots, you have to know your time on this Earth is being counted.

At least a few of us understand what time it is.

The rest of America..... not so much.

History is repeating and it's screaming at us what is about to come.

Few are listening.

24 posted on 08/05/2013 8:56:12 AM PDT by INVAR ("Fart for liberty, fart for freedom and fart proudly!" - Benjamin Franklin)
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To: Crazieman

I’ve been saying this for years.I don’t trust any LEO’s at this point in history.There is no reason for every little hamlet to have a “militarized” SWAT team.


25 posted on 08/05/2013 9:02:45 AM PDT by Renegade
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To: INVAR

I was discussing this with my father this weekend. What’s happening here in America makes it seem like someone somewhere is reading 1984, Animal Farm, Brave New World, and Atlas Shrugged and implementing everything in the same order.

I’m literally waiting day-by-day for a morning when I wake up and Obama is on every channel telling us that resistance against the Federal government is an act of war and we’ll be exterminated with the full power and prejudice of the government.

A more chilling script could not be written, folks.


26 posted on 08/05/2013 9:22:12 AM PDT by rarestia (It's time to water the Tree of Liberty.)
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To: sport

there is a third option, Warsaw


27 posted on 08/05/2013 9:31:42 AM PDT by ClayinVA ("Those who don't remember history are doomed to repeat it")
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To: bamahead
the number of situations that are deemed 'exigent' keeps expanding."

Yup, and the vast majority of precedent for this come to us courtesy of the war on drugs.

Drug warriors are more dangerous than drug users are.

28 posted on 08/05/2013 10:03:29 AM PDT by zeugma (Be a truechimer, not a falseticker!)
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To: rarestia

Amen! Kinda reminds you of the German Jews, doesn’t it?


29 posted on 08/05/2013 10:04:09 AM PDT by sport
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To: ctdonath2
If it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck, and crashes thru your window like a duck without announcing a search warrant, it’s a duck.

Announcing the presence of a warrant as they crash through your window should result in their death.

If they have a warrant, they can serve it like civilized human beings, not a bunch of steroid-abusing monkeys in a rage.

30 posted on 08/05/2013 10:06:29 AM PDT by zeugma (Be a truechimer, not a falseticker!)
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To: rarestia

That is EXACTLY what is going to happen.

We already have the evidence to note that this is their plan; Larry Grathwol’s account of Obama’s handlers plotting the genocide of millions of Americans they believe cannot be ‘re-educated’ - way back in the 80’s. Those same people - from the Ayers to the Soros’ - were and are instrumental in Obama’s regime.

Now take into consideration what we learned last week about Obama’s ‘Nudge’ program. It does not take a rocket scientist to understand Obama is doing everything Grathwol warned that the radical Left was plotting to do.

Then consider the 2009 DHS Terror Assessment report that names Conservatives, Christians, returning vets and the ‘Right wing’ as radical terrorists - with not a single word about Islam or Muslims mentioned.

Then consider 1.6 billion rounds of hollow point ammo, tanks, APCs, drones and weapons being secured by DHS for domestic use.

Do we really want to put our heads in the sand about whom they intend to use that weaponry on?

History folks. There is not a SINGLE Marxist despotic regime ever come into existence that did not commit genocide against their own people.

No ‘soft tyranny’ ever remains that way.

Too many Americans and ALL of Talk Radio’s hosts will call such a warning ‘absurd’. They are stuck in their own version of Normalcy Bias.


31 posted on 08/05/2013 11:00:06 AM PDT by INVAR ("Fart for liberty, fart for freedom and fart proudly!" - Benjamin Franklin)
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To: INVAR

The problem is that they’ve got us cornered. There’s literally no way to effect any change without being labeled an enemy of state. After which they will either infiltrate any attempts at an organized response or have that organization targeted for elimination.

In martial arts, it’s the attacker who has the advantage of surprise. If we are only responding to a despotic government, we’ll never win.


32 posted on 08/05/2013 11:22:22 AM PDT by rarestia (It's time to water the Tree of Liberty.)
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To: bamahead

Thanks for posting!


33 posted on 08/05/2013 11:42:24 AM PDT by neverdem (Register pressure cookers! /s)
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To: bamahead

Animal shelters beware!! No warrant is needed to crash into your property and seize little fawns! Maybe puppies and kittens too!!


34 posted on 08/05/2013 11:47:23 AM PDT by jch10 (The greatest threat to America is the Democrats.)
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To: rarestia

“I’m literally waiting day-by-day for a morning when I wake up and Obama is on every channel telling us that resistance against the Federal government is an act of war and we’ll be exterminated with the full power and prejudice of the government.”

If a day like that actually happens, I won’t hide at home. I’ll go hunting. For uniforms.


35 posted on 08/05/2013 1:00:59 PM PDT by TexasRepublic (Socialism is the gospel of envy and the religion of thieves)
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To: Uncle Miltie

“But what if the cops break in?”

Shoot him and call 911. It’s getting to the point where you need a video surveillance system INSIDE your house on a 48 hour loop just to protect YOUR OWN ACTIONS in court.

You mind your own business, door comes crashing in, you grab your shotgun and kill two cops with hollow point slugs. They finally figure out they bashed in the wrong door, but only after two of their own are dead.

Lord knows they are coming to kill you if you fart in the wrong key.


36 posted on 08/05/2013 1:16:15 PM PDT by RinaseaofDs
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To: rarestia

Well, the Founder’s won responding to a despotic government attempting to subjugate this people by force.

We have to understand and believe, our Rights come from God - and the government asserting it’s power over us is an attempt to get us to break the First Commandment.

So who will we obey and be willing to sacrifice for? God, or the State - who will end up demanding to be worshipped as a god?

That’s history talking.

Also, Obama does not have the element of surprise except upon the ignorant and uninformed.

Those of us paying attention should not be surprised by ANYTHING this enemy attempts to do. Our problem is that most of us refuse to see them as an enemy. I would not doubt for a second that Obama and his MarxoFascists would allow a city to be nuked if it meant they remain in total power. Do not underestimate them or what their ultimate goals are. You are not part of their goals and aims - except as a slave.

Obama wants to destroy - and on our ashes, lift up his utopia, by any and all means.

He does not have the element of surprise. He just has militarized thugs and a clueless sheeple who get their news from Communist outlets and Comedy Central.

In Aikido, you USE the overreach of the attacker against him and redirect his momentum so he is vulnerable to a counterattack. My favorite move is to slightly sidestep an attack and to redirect the enemy’s face into a wall after he is already committed and the momentum is carrying him forward.

Any decent martial artist knows to always be mindful of their surroundings. Understanding your enemy, or at minimum how to defend against tactics will be the difference between your face in the wall, or his.


37 posted on 08/05/2013 1:56:45 PM PDT by INVAR ("Fart for liberty, fart for freedom and fart proudly!" - Benjamin Franklin)
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To: bamahead

I think that what the 4th ammendment is trying to tell them is that there are no “exigent circumstances.”


38 posted on 08/06/2013 9:15:42 AM PDT by editor-surveyor (Freepers: Not as smart as I'd hoped they'd be)
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To: INVAR

>> “Obama wants to destroy - and on our ashes, lift up his utopia, by any and all means.” <<

.
And his ‘utopia’ is what most would call HELL!


39 posted on 08/06/2013 9:18:10 AM PDT by editor-surveyor (Freepers: Not as smart as I'd hoped they'd be)
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To: neverdem

Anytime.


40 posted on 08/06/2013 10:16:40 AM PDT by bamahead (Few men desire liberty; most men wish only for a just master. -- Sallust)
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