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Warthog fans rally after Flake revelation
Arizona Daily Independent ^ | August 20, 2013 | Diego Moya

Posted on 08/20/2013 4:01:59 AM PDT by \/\/ayne

A nationwide effort has begun to save the Air Force’s A-10 after Arizona Senator Jeff Flake revealed on the James T. Harris radio show that plans were in place to mothball the craft. Boots on the ground have joined A-10 pilots and crews to save the plane that has frequently saved them.

Fans of the A-10 warthog are circulating a petition in the hopes of gathering 100,000 signatures by September 16. Facebook groups Stand for Protecting Heroes, Keep the A10 in the U.S. Military, and Save the A-10 deployed rapidly in defense of the plane that offers them their best chance of survival in war.

Flake, on a brief visit to Arizona during the Congressional summer recess, was asked by Harris if he would confirm reports that the A-10 was going to be retired. Flake responded that the A-10 would be retired but held out the promise of the F-35 as a viable substitute.

Flake’s candor shocked the Harris’ listeners, many of who work at the nearby Davis Monthan Air Force Base, which is home to the Warthog. The admission sent shockwaves throughout Arizona, and rippled out to the warrior community over the weekend.

(Excerpt) Read more at arizonadailyindependent.com ...


TOPICS: News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: a10; airforce; f35; flake; warthog
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Save the A-10 Thunderbolt II from retirement due to budget cuts White House petition
1 posted on 08/20/2013 4:01:59 AM PDT by \/\/ayne
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To: \/\/ayne

“but held out the promise of the F-35 as a viable substitute. “
lol thats a good one


2 posted on 08/20/2013 4:08:49 AM PDT by driftdiver (I could eat it raw, but why do that when I have a fire.)
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To: driftdiver

MI ANG, sign me up!


3 posted on 08/20/2013 4:14:11 AM PDT by equaviator (There's nothing like the universe to bring you down to earth.)
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To: driftdiver

Yeah, that’s pretty funny. The Air Force won’t risk that aircraft in a close support role. It’s too expensive.

If the Air Force gets rid of the A-10 with no follow up aircraft capable of doing the job then the close support role needs to be handled the Army. IIRC the Army threatened to do just that the last time the Air Force said it was going to mothball the A-10. Maybe this time it will happen.


4 posted on 08/20/2013 4:14:28 AM PDT by saganite (What happens to taglines? Is there a termination date?)
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To: \/\/ayne

The USAF isn’t going to risk the expensive F-35A running into flak-traps where it could get knocked down by a lucky shot or a MANPAD. The virtue of the A-10 is that it is tough, relatively cheap and the Avenger cannon is a lot less expensive to use on certain targets.

Using the F-35 on a straffing run is like hooking a Porsche up to your camper for the weekend.


5 posted on 08/20/2013 4:15:04 AM PDT by Tallguy (Hunkered down in Pennsylvania)
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To: \/\/ayne

Congress tried this before and it didn’t float. The Hawg is too reliable and valuable for the CAS mission.


6 posted on 08/20/2013 4:17:48 AM PDT by aviator (Armored Pest Control)
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To: \/\/ayne

Barry would love to see us get rid of the A-10.


7 posted on 08/20/2013 4:20:15 AM PDT by caver (Obama: Home of the Whopper)
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To: driftdiver

Statement is indeed snark worthy. F-35 is the next F-100 jack of all trades master of none aircraft. Designed as a stealth aircraft it won’t meet close support mission requirements that the beautiful Warthog can. I haven’t seen any depiction of the payload but doubt it will come close to the A-10’s.


8 posted on 08/20/2013 4:22:47 AM PDT by Jimmy Valentine's brother (01-21-13, Obama declares war on The Constitution of the United States)
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To: caver

Barry would love to see us get rid of almost all military
hardware.


9 posted on 08/20/2013 4:24:03 AM PDT by Maine Mariner
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To: \/\/ayne

I have a better plan... mothball ALL demoncrats, obama and 2/3 of the republican party and build America back as the baddest MF’er in the valley and repeal every law passed since 1988.


10 posted on 08/20/2013 4:29:15 AM PDT by LibLieSlayer (FROM MY COLD, DEAD HANDS!)
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To: \/\/ayne
Thanks for the post.
Read an interesting article by, I think, David French on NR.
Perfect ground support aircraft against foes like Iraq and Afgahnistan, but against the enemy it was originally intended for (the Soviets swarming through the Fulda gap into Western Europe), it would have been quickly swept from the battlefield.

Works well against the Muzzies, though, and as they are enemy No. 1, the A-10s are still relevant.

11 posted on 08/20/2013 4:29:43 AM PDT by Psalm 73 ("Gentlemen, you can't fight in here - this is the War Room".)
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To: \/\/ayne
Jeff is a flake!

...on a brief visit to Arizona during the Congressional summer recess...

Apparently doesn't live there?

12 posted on 08/20/2013 4:30:21 AM PDT by Bushbacker1 (Molon Labe! (Oathkeeper))
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To: YHAOS; GBA
A-10 'Warthog' ... so ugly, it's beautiful ... ping.


Save our Warthogs!

13 posted on 08/20/2013 4:31:02 AM PDT by Servant of the Cross (the Truth will set you free)
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To: \/\/ayne

The B-52 and C-130 still have roles to play. No reason why the A-10 couldn’t.


14 posted on 08/20/2013 4:37:46 AM PDT by edpc (Wilby 2016)
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To: \/\/ayne
This is so ridiculous and why I am ready to retire after 26 years: I have absolutely no confidence in my leaders to make non-political, rational decisions.

They want to retire the Hog so that can then say OH....we need the F-35 now more than ever since we don't have a plane that can do CAS.

And then when we get there...they will say...we can't risk the F-35 on the CAS mission.

The generals in the AF are a bunch of PC hacks. They embarrass me. I hope that some of them are reading. YOU EMBARRASS ME. YOU ARE A DISGRACE. YOU DON'T DESERVE TO WEAR THE SAME RANK AS LEMAY and TIBBETS.

15 posted on 08/20/2013 4:40:05 AM PDT by NELSON111
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To: Psalm 73

In the 70’s & ‘80’s man-portable SAMs were not really up to the task except for the the US Stinger. The Soviets would have been relying on their ZSUs and tracked SAMs for defending the airspace over their armored spearheads. The A-10 would have shreaded them.

Today’s MANPADS are a lot deadlier. But the A-10 design is still the most survivable in the inventory.

But military planners are always extrapolating the capabilities of weapons and they have been thinking the A-10 is obsolete for quite some time now. But all we seem to get involved in is counter-insurgencies and other low-threat air environments where A-10’s, B-52’s and AC-130’s are what the doctor ordered.


16 posted on 08/20/2013 4:46:06 AM PDT by Tallguy (Hunkered down in Pennsylvania)
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To: \/\/ayne
Don't forget to sign the petition!


17 posted on 08/20/2013 4:48:44 AM PDT by \/\/ayne (I regret that I have but one subscription cancellation notice to give to my local newspaper.)
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To: \/\/ayne
they'd make a hell of a FAC plane...
18 posted on 08/20/2013 4:50:08 AM PDT by Chode (Stand UP and Be Counted, or line up and be numbered - *DTOM* -ww- NO Pity for the LAZY)
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To: Jimmy Valentine's brother

I doubt the F35 hang time can match the A10 either.


19 posted on 08/20/2013 4:53:50 AM PDT by R. Scott (Humanity i love you because when you're hard up you pawn your Intelligence to buy a drink)
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To: Chode

they’d make a hell of a FAC plane...


They ARE being used as a FAC plane.


20 posted on 08/20/2013 4:55:36 AM PDT by aviator (Armored Pest Control)
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To: \/\/ayne

The air force leadership has been trying to kill the Warthog for years.
Back in the ‘90s their master plan was to replace it with the F-16 Fighting Falcon.
They were smugly arrogant about it too.
Claimed that while the ‘Hog was designed to take hits, the Falcon was designed to avoid them...
Idiocy at its best.


21 posted on 08/20/2013 4:55:48 AM PDT by Darksheare (Try my coffee, first one's free.....)
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To: driftdiver
When an F-35 can take a SAM THROUGH ITS WING AND BRING ITS PILOT BACK, then I'll be impressed.

When its loiter time is 8+ hours, where the ground crew have to help the pilot out of the cockpit due to fatigue, then I'll be impressed.

When its logistic's foot print and support requirements are less than the A-10’s, then I'll be impressed.

When it can execute the ground support mission BETTER than the A-10, I'll be impressed.

Noe of the above are realizable with that POS.

22 posted on 08/20/2013 5:00:18 AM PDT by Freeport (The proper application of high explosives will remove all obstacles.)
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To: Darksheare

The USAF leadership has a favorite refrain: “Big sky, little bullet” Yet, the planes still take hits and the A-10 does that better than any currently in the inventory.


23 posted on 08/20/2013 5:05:41 AM PDT by T-Bird45 (It feels like the seventies, and it shouldn't.)
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To: \/\/ayne
The air force has never liked the A-10 (or the CAS mission either). Not "sexy" or glamorous like a fighter. Screw them, it gets the job done in a cost efficient manner. Let army aviation, or even the Marines have 'em. they'll know what to do with 'em.

CC

24 posted on 08/20/2013 5:06:04 AM PDT by Celtic Conservative (tease not the dragon for thou art crunchy when roasted and taste good with ketchup)
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To: aviator
good... i didn't know any were still flying
25 posted on 08/20/2013 5:09:36 AM PDT by Chode (Stand UP and Be Counted, or line up and be numbered - *DTOM* -ww- NO Pity for the LAZY)
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To: Jimmy Valentine's brother
...F-100 jack of all trades master of none aircraft

I take exception to that statement!

26 posted on 08/20/2013 5:10:53 AM PDT by Wilum (Never loaded a nuke I didn't like)
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To: edpc

“The B-52 and C-130 still have roles to play. No reason why the A-10 couldn’t.”

No reason but for administrative indifference?


27 posted on 08/20/2013 5:14:28 AM PDT by equaviator (There's nothing like the universe to bring you down to earth.)
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To: \/\/ayne

Another important national and regional story broken by Cheesehead turned Tucsonian James T Harris.


28 posted on 08/20/2013 5:14:44 AM PDT by Mygirlsmom (FReepers! Support business that support conservatism. PM me to learn of a good one.)
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To: Freeport; All
A-10 battle damage pic
29 posted on 08/20/2013 5:16:04 AM PDT by ken5050 (CRUZ MISSILE! Ted 2016...aimed directly at the Democrat party)
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To: saganite

Why have an Airforce in the first place. Tie it to the Army and Navy where it belongs.


30 posted on 08/20/2013 5:25:10 AM PDT by 1010RD (First, Do No Harm)
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To: caver

Obama’s just trying to help out his friends.


31 posted on 08/20/2013 5:26:08 AM PDT by 1010RD (First, Do No Harm)
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To: T-Bird45

Yes, I recall them pretty much chanting that during the 90’s with that round of idiocy.
They had one officer literally stating “the A-10 is designed to take hits, the F-16 is designed to AVOID them!”
As if that changes the reality of low level flying in flak infested air in the CAS flight bounds.
Mentioned was made of the A-10 being “Ugly” as well.
It boils down to that, every time.
The leadership wants only to field “pretty planes”.


32 posted on 08/20/2013 5:28:02 AM PDT by Darksheare (Try my coffee, first one's free.....)
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To: Jimmy Valentine's brother
F-35 is the next F-100

You mean... a Ford pickup?

33 posted on 08/20/2013 5:33:07 AM PDT by ROCKLOBSTER (Celebrate "Republicans Freed the Slaves Month")
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To: Darksheare

A-10 pilots call F-16s in a CAS role “lawn darts” for this exact reason. While the F-16 is a beautiful dogfighter, it can’t take a tenth of the punches an A-10 can.


34 posted on 08/20/2013 5:49:50 AM PDT by snowrip (Liberal? You are a socialist idiot with no rational argument.)
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To: Tallguy

You couldn’t use the F-35 on much of a strafing run since it only carries 180 bullets. I don’t know why they even put a gun in the thing.


35 posted on 08/20/2013 5:57:21 AM PDT by saminfl
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To: \/\/ayne

Give them to the Army. We’ll take them.


36 posted on 08/20/2013 5:57:25 AM PDT by cll (Serviam!)
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To: Darksheare

It’s long past time to scrap the 1948 Key West Agreement (http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Key_West_Agreement) which was in aid of the newly formed US Air Force. Navy was allowed to keep their air arm while the Army surrended all but recon and medical aircraft. There have been some modifications to the agreement, but the world and technology have changed dramatically since 1948.

All tactical combat air support assets and personnel needed to be released to direct and immediate control of ground troop commanders. The fast pace of asymetric warfare cannot not tolerate the lag time inherent in CAS requests. The Op-forces we are facing now do not have massive base camps or formations of the USSR.

There needs to be a critical re-thinking of command and control of combined arms in terms of the conflicts we now face.


37 posted on 08/20/2013 5:57:48 AM PDT by Covenantor ("Men are ruled...by liars who refuse them news, and by fools who cannot govern." Chesterton)
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To: Covenantor

Yes, but it won’t happen.
The insular and heavily politicized leadership will never admit there is s problem unless forced to.


38 posted on 08/20/2013 6:04:38 AM PDT by Darksheare (Try my coffee, first one's free.....)
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To: saminfl

Thanks for mentioning that... The ammo capacity of the 20mm F35 cannon is puny. Only enough for a few well aimed bursts. It doesn’t begin to compare with the hitting power of the GAU cannon on the Hog, either.

Lets face it: left to themselves air forces like to plan to fight other air forces. CAS is the very last mission that gets any real attention. But when you think about it it’s one of the primary reasons that air forces evolved in the first place!


39 posted on 08/20/2013 6:11:18 AM PDT by Tallguy (Hunkered down in Pennsylvania)
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To: \/\/ayne

If they can keep the BUFFs airborne and effective as long as they have, seems the Warthogs outta get their chance.


40 posted on 08/20/2013 6:21:32 AM PDT by grobdriver
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To: grobdriver

There is no reason why they can’t still be produced.....what the hell why end the production of a popular and well working weapon!!!!


41 posted on 08/20/2013 6:58:52 AM PDT by ontap (***)
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To: ontap
No glass cockpit.
Not fly-by-wire
Not mach
Not sexy.

Simple works. Fancy breaks.

42 posted on 08/20/2013 7:25:50 AM PDT by grobdriver
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To: caver

Part of the gay military drawdown...and eventual defeat.


43 posted on 08/20/2013 7:29:14 AM PDT by onedoug
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To: Tallguy
It doesn’t begin to compare with the hitting power of the GAU cannon on the Hog, either.


44 posted on 08/20/2013 7:52:55 AM PDT by Servant of the Cross (the Truth will set you free)
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To: \/\/ayne

James T Harris is a black conservative talk show host broke this story over his local talk show. The Arizona station he broadcasts over in owned by the Milwaukee Journal and has been doing a remote morning sub for vacationing Charlie Sykes over WTMJ am 620 from 8:30 till 10am as well as his own show.


45 posted on 08/20/2013 8:21:38 AM PDT by mosesdapoet (Serious contribution pause.Please continue onto meaningless venting no one reads.)
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To: Servant of the Cross
It's a flying cannon. The Warthog is my favorite military aircraft and it's bada$$. If I remember correctly they tried to scrap it before and it didn't take. Let's hope it doesn't take this time, as well.
46 posted on 08/20/2013 8:26:18 AM PDT by liberalh8ter (The only difference between flash mob 'urban yutes' and U.S. politicians is the hoodies.)
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To: liberalh8ter
It's a flying cannon.

Yep. Look up two posts.

47 posted on 08/20/2013 8:33:02 AM PDT by Servant of the Cross (the Truth will set you free)
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To: Servant of the Cross

This is my cannon. There are many like it but this one is mine.....................................


48 posted on 08/20/2013 8:55:34 AM PDT by Einherjar
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To: Servant of the Cross; GBA
A-10 'Warthog' ... so ugly, it's beautiful ...

I remember thinking, when I first laid eyes on a picture of the A-10 in ’77 even before it was called a “Warthog,” this is about the most ugly plane I’ve ever seen. So I looked into its design and mission. Even in those days of scant information, it quickly became obvious that it was perfectly crafted for its purpose (hence, “so ugly it’s beautiful”). I’ve been an avid fan ever since.

The A-10 was originally designed, if I recall correctly, to be a killer of Eastern Block tanks in the event of an European ground war. It eventually has become a perfect instrument for a number of combat roles.

Love the beast.

49 posted on 08/20/2013 10:40:04 AM PDT by YHAOS
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To: T-Bird45

The air force is run by fighter pilots


50 posted on 08/20/2013 10:40:14 AM PDT by driftdiver (I could eat it raw, but why do that when I have a fire.)
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