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Tests: E-Cat has an energy density 10 times higher than other energy source
Phys dot org ^ | May 23, 2013 | Lisa Zyga

Posted on 08/21/2013 4:27:14 AM PDT by citizen

Full title:
Tests find Rossi's E-Cat has an energy density at least 10 times higher than any conventional energy source

(Phys.org) —In the ongoing saga of Andrea Rossi's energy catalyzer (E-Cat) that promises clean, cheap power for the world, the latest events continue to bring as many questions as answers. Several scientists have performed supposedly independent tests of two E-Cat prototypes under controlled conditions and using high-precision instrumentation. In a paper posted at arXiv.org, the researchers write that, even by the most conservative of measurements, the E-Cat produces excess heat with a resulting energy density that is at least 1 order of magnitude—and possibly several—higher than any other conventional energy source, including gasoline.

Of the seven scientists who authored the paper, two are from Italy (Giuseppe Levi at Bologna University and Evelyn Foschi of Bologna, Italy) and five are from Sweden (Torbjörn Hartman, Bo Höistad, Roland Pettersson and Lars Tegnér at Uppsala University; and Hanno Essén at the Royal Institute of Technology in Stockholm).

Essén, who submitted the paper, is an associate professor of theoretical physics at the Swedish Royal Institute of Technology and former chairman of the Swedish Skeptics Society.

"I have followed the Rossi E-Cats for a couple of years now and participated in two experiments (including the present one) and read, and heard, about several other more or less independent ones," Essén told Phys.org. "My overall impression is that there must be something there, but scientists must always be cautious until everything has been checked and rechecked."

(Excerpt) Read more at phys.org ...


TOPICS:
KEYWORDS: canr; cmns; coldfusion; ecat; energy; lenr; rossi
A quite interesting article describing the tests and Rossi's device in some detail, without the magic ingredients of course.
1 posted on 08/21/2013 4:27:14 AM PDT by citizen
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To: Kevmo; Wonder Warthog

Ping


2 posted on 08/21/2013 4:29:22 AM PDT by citizen (We get the government we choose. America either voted for Obama or handed it to him by not voting.)
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To: citizen

Great!!

Where can I buy one?


3 posted on 08/21/2013 4:29:29 AM PDT by Mr. K (Lies, Damned Lies, Statistics, and then Democrat Talking Points.)
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To: Mr. K

Hopefully we will all know that soon. Contact A. Rosssi?


4 posted on 08/21/2013 4:33:45 AM PDT by citizen (We get the government we choose. America either voted for Obama or handed it to him by not voting.)
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To: Liberty1970; Red Badger; PA Engineer; glock rocks; free_life

A few pings from Kevmo’s ping list, the ones I can see from a previous article.


5 posted on 08/21/2013 4:36:49 AM PDT by citizen (We get the government we choose. America either voted for Obama or handed it to him by not voting.)
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To: citizen

I don’t see your article at that link.


6 posted on 08/21/2013 4:42:02 AM PDT by saganite (What happens to taglines? Is there a termination date?)
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To: saganite
http://phys.org/news/2013-05-rossi-e-cat-energy-density-higher.html
7 posted on 08/21/2013 4:45:08 AM PDT by Frapster (Clear the mechanism)
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To: Frapster

Thanks. There’s nothing new here. This is a rehash of old info.


8 posted on 08/21/2013 4:59:14 AM PDT by saganite (What happens to taglines? Is there a termination date?)
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To: citizen

I hope so too! it sounds wonderful... should change the world... he should become a $trillionaire...

when can I get one? oh- its still not available? what is this-like 10 years now? what are they waiting for...?

is he too stupid to file a patent?


9 posted on 08/21/2013 5:00:28 AM PDT by Mr. K (Lies, Damned Lies, Statistics, and then Democrat Talking Points.)
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To: citizen

And in another 3 or 4 decades we might even may see a commercial use maybe.


10 posted on 08/21/2013 5:00:46 AM PDT by riverrunner
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To: Frapster; saganite

Thanks for the link assistance! I need to go to article posting school :(


11 posted on 08/21/2013 5:03:30 AM PDT by citizen (We get the government we choose. America either voted for Obama or handed it to him by not voting.)
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To: riverrunner

I hope it doesn’t take another 3 or 4 decades. I won’t live that long.

How about 3 or 4 years, as it seems a lot of progress is being made lately by a host of researchers and organizations.


12 posted on 08/21/2013 5:06:44 AM PDT by citizen (We get the government we choose. America either voted for Obama or handed it to him by not voting.)
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To: Admin Moderator

I didn’t post properly and the article link doesn’t work. Can you fix it, please?


13 posted on 08/21/2013 5:08:52 AM PDT by citizen (We get the government we choose. America either voted for Obama or handed it to him by not voting.)
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To: citizen

Color me skeptical


14 posted on 08/21/2013 5:15:40 AM PDT by riverrunner
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To: citizen

I have a friend who is an older fellow who holds several patents that relate to catalysts and cat crackers. Every refinery in the world uses his inventions. He has not looked in to this but some of the things he says about catalysts are very interesting. I guess my point is that you never know what a human may come up with:)


15 posted on 08/21/2013 5:41:08 AM PDT by isthisnickcool (NO MORE IRS!)
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To: citizen
Amazing. The same old hand-waving abracadabra is trotted out with new fanfare and presented as if it were something new. I guess the current crop of rubes investors is drying up, so a new crop needs to be cultivated.

A while back, someone posted a link to a story of a con artist a century ago, who used an approach almost identical to Rossi's to keep a scam going for decades. When he died and people were able to actually examine his device, they found a very clever mechanism for producing the effects--but no actual device. I'm guessing we'll see the same with Rossi. The main difference between that 1800s scammer and Rossi is that the 1800s scammer had some artistic talent, so that his "devices" were nice to look at. Rossi has no sense of style at all.

16 posted on 08/21/2013 5:51:47 AM PDT by exDemMom (Now that I've finally accepted that I'm living a bad hair life, I'm more at peace with the world.)
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To: citizen

Given that sites advocacy of man made global warming I question the source and its agenda.

Science label for gov cash seems to be a new industry.


17 posted on 08/21/2013 6:09:35 AM PDT by Wildbill22 (They have us surrounded again, the poor bastards- Gen Creighton Williams Abrams)
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To: riverrunner
"And in another 3 or 4 decades we might even may see a commercial use maybe."

You're talking about hot fusion, right??

18 posted on 08/21/2013 6:18:17 AM PDT by Wonder Warthog
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To: Mr. K
"....is he too stupid to file a patent?"

He has a European patent, but not (yet) a US one. Whether that is due to the fact that the US patent office has (wrongully) in the past treated cold fusion like perpetual motion, I don't know. Several other researchers and agencies have very recently received US patents for CF approaches. The secret of US success seems to be to NOT call it "cold fusion", but some other terminology.

19 posted on 08/21/2013 6:22:58 AM PDT by Wonder Warthog
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To: exDemMom

There are other researchers besides Rossi. Read Beaudette’s book yet?? Or ANY published research paper on LENR??


20 posted on 08/21/2013 6:24:45 AM PDT by Wonder Warthog
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To: Mr. K
Where can I buy one?

Last I heard they went on sale last fall in Home Depot. You didn't pick one up?

21 posted on 08/21/2013 6:44:52 AM PDT by TheMightyQuinn
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To: TheMightyQuinn
Last I heard they went on sale last fall in Home Depot. You didn't pick one up?

Man that was a bust. Lasted just past the 90 day warranty then shot craps.

22 posted on 08/21/2013 7:03:07 AM PDT by Starstruck (If my reply offends, you probably don't understand sarcasm or criticism...or do.)
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To: citizen

I’m a web developer... I hiccuped and it came out. ;-)


23 posted on 08/21/2013 7:25:53 AM PDT by Frapster (Clear the mechanism)
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To: riverrunner

Well, that’s me, too. I am skeptical.

While I do admit to being a wanna-be believer, I’m not going to be fundung an E-Cat device unless it’s by buying a new Rossi or whatever brand water heater at Home Depot.


24 posted on 08/21/2013 7:55:13 AM PDT by citizen (We get the government we choose. America either voted for Obama or handed it to him by not voting.)
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To: Mr. K

He’s waiting for the one that’s 20 times as good. This ten times stuff is just child’s play


25 posted on 08/21/2013 7:57:35 AM PDT by Hegewisch Dupa
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To: citizen

Why can’t they just hook one of those E cats up and see if can run a house or a building?


26 posted on 08/21/2013 9:59:41 AM PDT by Georgia Girl 2 (The only purpose of a pistol is to fight your way back to the rifle you should never have dropped.)
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To: Georgia Girl 2

I believe they have done so over 14,700 times or somethign. I dunno; I forget my e-cataganda


27 posted on 08/21/2013 10:24:54 AM PDT by Hegewisch Dupa
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To: Georgia Girl 2

That’s a good question. The thing is the technology isn’t really at that point yet. An E-Cat device in its current form is only a heat generating device.

What has people excited about the E-Cat concept is that these devices are producing large amounts of heat with virtually no fuel being consumed. At least, that is the claim being made.

Non-nuclear power plants burn enormous quantities of coal or natural gas to boil water to generate high-pressure steam. This steam then powers turbines that generate electricity.

So the scientists are working to perfect these devices to generate sufficient heat to replace the coal and natural gas now used in power plants.

If these things actually work, you might eventually see a lot of city/town/neighborhood sized power stations built where they are needed instead of the having today’s huge power plants where the electricity must be sent here and there all across the country.

The other avenue is simply using the E-cat process to heat water for home, buisness and industrial uses.


28 posted on 08/21/2013 11:00:25 AM PDT by citizen (We get the government we choose. America either voted for Obama or handed it to him by not voting.)
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To: Georgia Girl 2

Who knows, there might even eventually be small, self-contained E-Cat power units sized for providing electricity and hot water for an individual home.


29 posted on 08/21/2013 11:05:55 AM PDT by citizen (We get the government we choose. America either voted for Obama or handed it to him by not voting.)
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To: exDemMom
Amazing. The same old hand-waving abracadabra is trotted out with new fanfare and presented as if it were something new. I guess the current crop of rubes investors is drying up, so a new crop needs to be cultivated.

A while back, someone posted a link to a story of a con artist a century ago, who used an approach almost identical to Rossi's to keep a scam going for decades. When he died and people were able to actually examine his device, they found a very clever mechanism for producing the effects--but no actual device. I'm guessing we'll see the same with Rossi. The main difference between that 1800s scammer and Rossi is that the 1800s scammer had some artistic talent, so that his "devices" were nice to look at. Rossi has no sense of style at all.

Amazing. The same old hand waving abracadabra fake debunking trotted out as if it were something new.

I remember a story posted by my friends uncle that talked about a guy who knew someone who tried to trade the Brooklyn Bridge to someone who owned swampland in Florida. As a result, it's clear that Rossi's work doesn't have to be clearly explained or analyzed, because well over five people related to my friend's uncle would have built it by now. After all, when my friend's uncle died, no one could find the Brooklyn bridge in Florida.

30 posted on 08/21/2013 3:15:24 PM PDT by Talisker (One who commands, must obey.)
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To: dangerdoc; citizen; Liberty1970; Red Badger; Wonder Warthog; PA Engineer; glock rocks; free_life; ..

The Cold Fusion/LENR Ping List

http://www.freerepublic.com/tag/coldfusion/index?tab=articles


http://lenr-canr.org/


31 posted on 08/28/2013 7:01:42 PM PDT by Kevmo ("A person's a person, no matter how small" ~Horton Hears a Who)
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To: TheMightyQuinn; Mr. K

asked & answered

http://www.mail-archive.com/vortex- href=”mailto:l@eskimo.com”>l@eskimo.com/msg85737.html


32 posted on 08/28/2013 7:06:02 PM PDT by Kevmo ("A person's a person, no matter how small" ~Horton Hears a Who)
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To: Hegewisch Dupa

Asked & answered. Notably, each time I’ve posted to you I have pointed out that you have never contributed substantially to the scientific discussion. Zero contribution.

http://www.mail-archive.com/vortex- href=”mailto:l@eskimo.com”>l@eskimo.com/msg85732.html


33 posted on 08/28/2013 7:09:24 PM PDT by Kevmo ("A person's a person, no matter how small" ~Horton Hears a Who)
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To: Kevmo; Hegewisch Dupa; Wonder Warthog

“When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him/her by this sign, that the dunces are all in confederacy against him/her” — Jonathan Swift, updated

Guess where I found this quote. Yup, the profile page of ;Hegewisch Dupa;


34 posted on 08/28/2013 7:40:43 PM PDT by B4Ranch (AGENDA: Grinding America Down ----- http://vimeo.com/63749370)
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To: B4Ranch

Interesting. But considering my interactions with her, not surprising.


35 posted on 08/28/2013 8:04:08 PM PDT by Kevmo ("A person's a person, no matter how small" ~Horton Hears a Who)
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To: Wonder Warthog

I have a serious problem with the US patent process.

You submit something and they you wait for THEM to deem it as worthy.

I say the patent process should be a simple form you fill out, that lists your idea and BLAMMO it gets a date-time stamp and you got a patent.

Then it is up to you to defend your patent, if someone uses your idea.

The process of getting a patent now is too costly and time consuming.

And if you want to patent a perpetual motion device then go ahead. It should not be up to the government to decide if your idea is good or not.


36 posted on 08/29/2013 6:55:04 AM PDT by Mr. K (Lies, Damned Lies, Statistics, and then Democrat Talking Points.)
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To: exDemMom

Wasn’t there a guy named John Neuman (or similar) that had a motor he claimed worked on the energy from ‘pulses’ generated when a circuit is switched on or off?

This would be about in the 70’s or early 80’s

He used to hook it up to a battery to start it, then disconnect the battery and it would still run (no gas or external fuel or wires)

Never knew what happened to that


37 posted on 08/29/2013 6:58:50 AM PDT by Mr. K (Lies, Damned Lies, Statistics, and then Democrat Talking Points.)
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To: Mr. K

I have never heard of that one, but it sounds like a classic perpetual motion device.

Some of our fun exercises in physics class involved reading about real perpetual motion devices that have been invented in the past, and figuring out why they wouldn’t work. Some of them are not obvious.


38 posted on 08/29/2013 7:45:09 AM PDT by exDemMom (Now that I've finally accepted that I'm living a bad hair life, I'm more at peace with the world.)
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To: exDemMom

99.999% of them won’t work because of friction

The theoretical “frictionless surface” in physics classes does not exist in reality


39 posted on 08/29/2013 9:52:04 AM PDT by Mr. K (Lies, Damned Lies, Statistics, and then Democrat Talking Points.)
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To: Mr. K
"I have a serious problem with the US patent process. You submit something and they you wait for THEM to deem it as worthy. I say the patent process should be a simple form you fill out, that lists your idea and BLAMMO it gets a date-time stamp and you got a patent. Then it is up to you to defend your patent, if someone uses your idea. The process of getting a patent now is too costly and time consuming. "

Unfortunately, that is the law that the inventor has to live with. And future changes will likely favor corporate inventorship over individual inventors (the Euro-patent process is worse). I don't see things getting any better.

"And if you want to patent a perpetual motion device then go ahead. It should not be up to the government to decide if your idea is good or not.

If you've ever spent time perusing issued patents (I have), you will find that things just as impossible as perpetual motion have been patented. Of common sense there is very little among patent examiners. They very much have a script, and follow it "to the letter".

I've been through the process 26 times, both as a corporate inventor and as an individual. But I've been lucky in that my patent agent is literally a genius at it. His "won/loss" ratio is far higher that typical. In college he majored in chemistry and minored in English, which for a techie is a REALLY strange combo. He has always been interested in law and at one time contemplated going to law school. He took up patent work just before he retired from the chemical corporation we both had worked for, and "found his calling", then retired and kept at it.

40 posted on 08/29/2013 10:20:43 AM PDT by Wonder Warthog
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