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Are You Sure There’s No Voter Fraud?
Commentary Magazine ^ | 8-27-13 | Jonathon Tobin

Posted on 08/28/2013 3:58:52 AM PDT by afraidfortherepublic

As I wrote earlier this month, the decision of Attorney General Eric Holder to sue to stop Texas’s voter ID law has little to do with an attempt to prevent actual discrimination. The outcry from the administration on the voter ID issue as well as the manufactured outrage about the Supreme Court’s decision upholding but modifying the Voting Rights Act is predicated on the false idea that these measures are a new version of discriminatory Jim Crow laws. Given the night-and-day difference between the world of Jim Crow that drew Americans to the 1963 March on Washington and the America of 2013, this is an obvious effort to both revive flagging interest in civil-rights organizations and to brand President Obama’s critics as racists. But opponents of voter ID do have one seemingly rational argument: the problem that voter ID laws seek to solve—preserving the integrity of the vote—is imaginary. To that end, they have told us ad nauseum that voter fraud does not exist in the United States.

The assumption that voter fraud is nonexistent requires us to not only ignore most of American political history; it also obligates us to forget everything we know about human nature. Given that photo ID is now required for virtually every sort of transaction or service, most Americans rightly see it as a commonsense measure. But discussions about shady elections don’t require us to explore the distant past. Examples abound in our own day that place the desire to tighten up new rules that more or less allow anyone to show up on Election Day without proof of their identity or having previously registered, or to vote early or get an absentee ballot in a different context than Holder’s specious arguments about Jim Crow. One such comes from the bankrupt city of Detroit, where the August 6 primary is still unresolved due to the fact that more than 20,000 write-in votes are currently in dispute and may or may not be counted depending on the decisions of the courts. Fraud has not yet been proved and may not be directly related to false identity, but this latest instance of electoral hijinks illustrates what happens when results are called into question by shady practices.

The struggle to be the top official in an insolvent city whose government has been taken over the state is not the most compelling political fight of the year. But regardless of the office’s value, those who voted deserve to have their ballots counted. Indeed, though few if any Americans are denied the right to vote today the way many were prevented from going to the polls under Jim Crow, a crooked election is, in effect, one that denies the franchise to everyone.

Regardless of whether those who showed up to cast write-ins did so legally or of the political motivations of those who threw those ballots out due to technicalities, the nationwide drive to police elections is based in fact, not prejudice. In an era when safeguards against fraud have been thrown out willy-nilly in order to make it easier to vote via early voting, liberal granting of absentee ballots, and same-day registration, it has become almost impossible to guarantee the integrity of the results. To think that politicians and parties do not try to take advantage of this situation is hopelessly naïve. Reforming this situation requires states to make sure that those who vote are who they say they are and that regulations that prevent safeguards from being put in place are re-written to ensure the integrity of the process.

No matter who gets the dubious honor of running Detroit, voters there have a right to know their votes are counted and not being cancelled out by fraud of any kind. The same is true in Texas, North Carolina, Pennsylvania, and every other state that has attempted to deal with this mess. Instead of crying racism, those entrusted with the responsibility of ensuring that voting rights are protected should be seeking to uphold the obligation of the state to stop cheating.


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Crime/Corruption; Government; US: Michigan
KEYWORDS: civilrights; detroit; electionfraud; elections; holder; votefraud; voterfraud; voterid
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1 posted on 08/28/2013 3:58:53 AM PDT by afraidfortherepublic
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To: afraidfortherepublic

Voter fraud is why Obama got back in 2012.


2 posted on 08/28/2013 4:05:27 AM PDT by Biggirl (“Go, do not be afraid, and serve”-Pope Francis)
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To: afraidfortherepublic

This is not an issue of “the distant past”. It is an issue of today. A poll worker here in Cincinnati made no effort to hide the fact that she voted six times in the last Presidential election, voting for Obama. To this city’s credit, she is now serving a jail term. Such is not the case in Lake Country, Indiana where not only do people vote multiple times, some of them are actually dead. If the DOJ fails to enforce voting ID and other safeguards, this Republic is finished.


3 posted on 08/28/2013 4:06:44 AM PDT by econjack (I'm not bossy...I just know what you should be doing.)
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To: afraidfortherepublic

LOL I was going to mention Detroit.

Operation White out is well underway. (Mike Duggan is the white guy who won, then didn’t)


4 posted on 08/28/2013 4:07:04 AM PDT by cripplecreek (REMEMBER THE RIVER RAISIN!)
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To: afraidfortherepublic

“There is no voter fraud” has become a ubiquitous Dem talking point. There is, and it has been documented, and people have been convicted. You have to carry this proof around with you to fend off the liars and the deceived.


5 posted on 08/28/2013 4:09:57 AM PDT by firebrand
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To: Springman; cyclotic; netmilsmom; RatsDawg; PGalt; FreedomHammer; queenkathy; madison10; ...
Its getting harder and harder to cheat in Detroit. Since the last election Ruth Johnson has asked for and gotten a law that means an automatic audit of election results in problem cities.

Image Hosted by ImageShack.us

Michigan legislative action thread
6 posted on 08/28/2013 4:10:26 AM PDT by cripplecreek (REMEMBER THE RIVER RAISIN!)
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To: afraidfortherepublic

How about all States make their EBT cards into photo IDs. Lets see how many LIV can’t manage to get one!


7 posted on 08/28/2013 4:13:40 AM PDT by Red_Devil 232 (VietVet - USMC All Ready On The Right? All Ready On The Left? All Ready On The Firing Line!)
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To: Biggirl

Yeah, I’m sure running the worst possible candidate wasn’t the real problem there. But keep practicing the voter fraud excuse. You’ll need it after hillary beats rubio or bush or whatever hack the establishment hangs around your necks in 2016.


8 posted on 08/28/2013 4:16:05 AM PDT by Orangedog (An optimist is someone who tells you to 'cheer up' when things are going his way)
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To: Biggirl

Voter fraud is why Obama got back in 2012...

...please provide proof of that...it does little good to toss about unsubstantiated claims, regardless of political persuasion...


9 posted on 08/28/2013 4:16:21 AM PDT by IrishBrigade
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To: Red_Devil 232

Excellent suggestion Mr. Devil!


10 posted on 08/28/2013 4:17:29 AM PDT by afraidfortherepublic
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To: afraidfortherepublic

I view the ridiculous argument that voter ID laws are discriminatory as a symptom of something far more dangerous. The political elite are buying time and if I’m right, it means that very shortly, the entire point will be moot.


11 posted on 08/28/2013 4:20:56 AM PDT by liberalh8ter (The only difference between flash mob 'urban yutes' and U.S. politicians is the hoodies.)
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To: Orangedog

Could be an excuse, but that doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist. Rule of law is more important than an election result.


12 posted on 08/28/2013 4:21:55 AM PDT by firebrand
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To: firebrand

The Dems shamelessly use Big Lie propaganda techniques at every turn.


13 posted on 08/28/2013 4:26:25 AM PDT by FreedomPoster (Islam delenda est)
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To: firebrand

Not to the communists.


14 posted on 08/28/2013 4:27:24 AM PDT by SC_Pete
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To: Orangedog

Yeah, I’m sure running the worst possible candidate wasn’t the real problem there...

...actually, Mitt wasn’t the worst...Gingrich or Palin would’ve lost the additional 16 North Carolina EV’s...I know that assessment will get me in trouble on this forum, but that’s how I saw it...

But keep practicing the voter fraud excuse.

...no need to preach to me about that...I know that fraud exists, and has existed as long as electoral politics has been around...and I know that all sides involved have practiced it, and would practice it all the more given the chance...and I know that people sitting around moaning about it after an unwanted election result is a pathetic sight...much like college football fans blaming referees for the team losing a big game...


15 posted on 08/28/2013 4:28:18 AM PDT by IrishBrigade
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To: afraidfortherepublic

Voter fraud is rampant. I can tell you if you look at the voter rolls you will see multiple names at the same address sometimes just a slightly different spelling. The trick is to vote multiple times on an easy to acquire absentee ballot and then once in person. Very few get caught.


16 posted on 08/28/2013 4:33:17 AM PDT by shoff (Vote Democratic it beats thinking!)
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To: afraidfortherepublic

Before the last election the Indiana SOS decertified the use of a specific brand of voting machine for us in the last election. There is a two hundred plus report explaining the particulars
It is my understanding that the machines could be manipulated and were targeted for use in the purple states thereby throwing the election
The report should be available thru the FOI law. Wish someone cared enough to expose it!


17 posted on 08/28/2013 4:33:40 AM PDT by hoosiermama (Obama: "Born in Kenya" Lying now or then)
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To: SC_Pete

Well, obviously. I meant it was a legitimate subject for discussion, even in regard to the last election, even if some are using it for an excuse.


18 posted on 08/28/2013 4:34:18 AM PDT by firebrand
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To: Red_Devil 232

How about all States make their EBT cards into photo IDs. Lets see how many LIV can’t manage to get one!


A fantastic idea!!!

It’ll also cut down on food stamp fraud too.


19 posted on 08/28/2013 4:37:20 AM PDT by The Working Man
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To: afraidfortherepublic

Its not just the ID. In 2004 white republican observers were removed from Cobo hall where ballots were being counted (and created).

Something like 100 ballot counters were being watched by only 5 observers and observers said that counters had stacks of new ballots which were being filled out as old ones were thrown away.


20 posted on 08/28/2013 4:39:01 AM PDT by cripplecreek (REMEMBER THE RIVER RAISIN!)
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To: IrishBrigade

See post 17. I worked the last election we were scheduled for the mentioned new machine. Our county is mention on about page 227 of the report. We had to purchase another brand of machine.


21 posted on 08/28/2013 4:39:35 AM PDT by hoosiermama (Obama: "Born in Kenya" Lying now or then)
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To: Biggirl

I whole-heartedly agree. The meme that voting fraud is non-existent is pure crap. It is no coincidence that in 2012 the leftists were able to find just enough votes in exactly the correct places to guarantee victory.

For me personally, I knew we were screwed when I saw an interview with ‘Adolph’ Axlegrease wherein he stated that if the democrat party loses the election, he would shave off his mustache. It may sound trivial but his appearance is part of his persona. Axlegrease would not offer up such a personal change unless he knew for a fact that there was *no* chance that he would have to follow thru with it. The fix was in place and he knew it.

OTH leftists lie as often as they breathe. Alec Baldwin is still here years after he said he would leave the USA if Bush was re-elected.


22 posted on 08/28/2013 4:44:06 AM PDT by ByteMercenary (Healthcare Insurance is *NOT* a Constitutional right.)
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To: IrishBrigade

There were maybe two or three people running who could have been better but the establishment would have none of that. But someone with access to the Clue Phone should have known that you don’t run an elite private equity asshole who made his fortune taking apart companies when you’re in a depression. Frep Phelps would have had a better chance of being voted mayor of San Francisco.


23 posted on 08/28/2013 4:44:42 AM PDT by Orangedog (An optimist is someone who tells you to 'cheer up' when things are going his way)
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To: hoosiermama
National review rundown of fraud in Detroit 04 (and others)

"Craziest thing I've ever seen," said one poll watcher. "They had 100 tables and just five poll watchers trying to monitor them. Every table had a pile of empty ballots. If the machine rejected a ballot, the workers would just take a fresh ballot, fill it in the way they thought the voter wanted (Detroit voted heavily for Kerry), and then put THAT ballot through the machine." The poll watcher also reported unsigned ballots being counted in the machines, a violation of absentee procedures.


24 posted on 08/28/2013 4:45:35 AM PDT by cripplecreek (REMEMBER THE RIVER RAISIN!)
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To: Biggirl
Philadelphia has 19 voting precincts and not one vote was registered for Romney. The pubs couldn't even bother to find ONE non-obama person in the whole area to say that voting rights were violated... We have a bigger problem that just the guy in office...
25 posted on 08/28/2013 4:45:55 AM PDT by ArtDodger
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To: Orangedog; IrishBrigade

You guys are naive if you don’t think there was serious voter fraud in the swing states. Look up your own “proof.” Its there.

You’ll probably keep whinjng about Rom while the dems fight like dogs keeping there fraud mechanisms in place. They must really , really care about not disenfranchising minorities.


26 posted on 08/28/2013 4:46:38 AM PDT by subterfuge (CBS NBC ABC FOX AP-- all no different than Pravda.)
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To: ArtDodger
We have a bigger problem that just the guy in office...

True. In the story I posted to from 04 it points out that Bush won so no further action was taken against the open fraud.
27 posted on 08/28/2013 4:53:16 AM PDT by cripplecreek (REMEMBER THE RIVER RAISIN!)
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To: subterfuge; IrishBrigade
You guys are turning into a bad parody of the Sore Loserman meme after the 2000 election. But like I said, keep practicing that. It will provide some cover for your establishment when hillary stomps the hell out of the hack they shove down your throats in 2016.

The inescapable truth is that the voters were given a clear choice last year: they could have voted for the liberal, pro abortion, big government, anti gun architect of the new health care law...or they could have voted for obama.

28 posted on 08/28/2013 5:04:59 AM PDT by Orangedog (An optimist is someone who tells you to 'cheer up' when things are going his way)
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To: ByteMercenary

Colleges are fraudulent vote factories too.

In 08 my niece told me that her student advisors at Western Michigan University were justifying it by saying that they have a home at school and another home with their parents and they should vote in both. She said that they were also encouraging foreign students to vote. I told her that I’d turn her in myself if I ever found that she had been cheating like that.

She said they were also passing around petitions to recall Scott Walker in Wisconsin last year.


29 posted on 08/28/2013 5:08:15 AM PDT by cripplecreek (REMEMBER THE RIVER RAISIN!)
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To: Orangedog
Yeah, I’m sure running the worst possible candidate wasn’t the real problem there. But keep practicing the voter fraud excuse.

Sure, you can say that Romney was the wrong candidate at the wrong time, mostly due to the socialized medicine vulnerability. However, we *know* that there's an army of volunteers out there working for the ACORN successor organizations (and other blatantly partisan groups), "registering voters". It just merits discussion every four years when that activity peaks, but they're actually doing it all the time. Do you really suppose that such an effort is being put forth with the intent of keeping everything honest?

30 posted on 08/28/2013 5:08:29 AM PDT by Charles Martel (Endeavor to persevere...)
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To: Orangedog

Hillary will not run, keep an eye on Chessia, she could very well do a “Princess Kate” and make Hillary a grandmother instead.


31 posted on 08/28/2013 5:11:01 AM PDT by Biggirl (“Go, do not be afraid, and serve”-Pope Francis)
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To: Orangedog

If there is no voter fraud, then having a voter I.D. card should be no big deal. You need an I.D. for EVRYTHING except to vote. Why have ANY OTHER kind of I.D. then?

To make in simple, why not place a tattoed number on everyone at birth? (remember who did those?) I’m surprised “the won” hasn’t promoted this yet.


32 posted on 08/28/2013 5:11:35 AM PDT by DaveA37
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To: IrishBrigade

Remember the IRS scandal?


33 posted on 08/28/2013 5:12:43 AM PDT by Biggirl (“Go, do not be afraid, and serve”-Pope Francis)
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To: cripplecreek
Correct! When Bush II won the first election, the departing dem staff trashed some government computers and other property. Bush and the pubs forgave and forgot. We the taxpayers payed for the damage......We have to get rid of these RINOs before we can do anything...
34 posted on 08/28/2013 5:12:47 AM PDT by ArtDodger
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To: Charles Martel

It was a combination of both. Romney sucked and there was major fraud.


35 posted on 08/28/2013 5:13:14 AM PDT by cripplecreek (REMEMBER THE RIVER RAISIN!)
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To: IrishBrigade

Easy. In Hamilton County, Ohio, a Democrat precinct worker was convicted of voting 4 times in the last presidential election.. She said she voted six times, but was convicted of 4 times. She said she had a duty to put Obama back in office. In this county a nun plead guilty to voting twice. 30 police officers of Cincinnati were reprimanded for voting in their wrong precincts. Not sure if they voted twice. It was not investigated further.


36 posted on 08/28/2013 5:14:19 AM PDT by mfish13 (ELECTIONS HAVE CONSEQUENCES!!!!)
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To: firebrand

Not meant to correct you. Just emphasis. I knew you’d agree... The law should prevail, not the Dictator.


37 posted on 08/28/2013 5:18:29 AM PDT by SC_Pete
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To: Charles Martel
Sure, you can say that Romney was the wrong candidate at the wrong time...

It shouldn't have to be said. You don't need an advanced degree from the school of the bleeding obvious to know that. But a lot of people feel really stupid because they carried water for a hack they knew was lying to them about every position of any importance. Their big problem turned out to be that a lot of us were paying attention and didn't turn out to vote for their liar and now they need to cling to something to justify their emotional distress. If I want to be lied to, have my pocket picked and get taken for granted I could have just called my ex-wife. It's easier than getting in line at the polls.

38 posted on 08/28/2013 5:23:47 AM PDT by Orangedog (An optimist is someone who tells you to 'cheer up' when things are going his way)
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To: afraidfortherepublic
Instead of crying racism, those entrusted with the responsibility of ensuring that voting rights are protected should be seeking to uphold the obligation of the state to stop cheating.

A fine sentiment, but it fails to make the connection that those crying racism the loudest, are likely cheating the most.

39 posted on 08/28/2013 5:29:47 AM PDT by wbill
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To: Progov

Do whatever you want with voter ID laws but you’re still going to have your asses handed to you because you will be offered by your establishment a choice of carefully bought and paid for liars. The liars in the other wing of the big government party are better at getting their people to buy their lies than the liars in your wing of the big government party.


40 posted on 08/28/2013 5:36:12 AM PDT by Orangedog (An optimist is someone who tells you to 'cheer up' when things are going his way)
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To: Biggirl

Has your home or Did the police catch the perp? A crime was obviously committed and yet even though there is no doubt it happened, in most cases the police are powerless to catch anyone. So, how in hell can anyone expect a secretive crime like illegal voting to be caught? Bevcause it is almost impossible to know it happened, does that mean it doesnt?


41 posted on 08/28/2013 5:57:53 AM PDT by weezel
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To: cripplecreek

Had Romney won, the economy would be turned around by NOW.


42 posted on 08/28/2013 6:02:17 AM PDT by weezel
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To: weezel

Should have read, has your home or car even been broken into.


43 posted on 08/28/2013 6:04:10 AM PDT by weezel
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To: weezel
Had Romney won, the economy would be turned around by NOW.

And they say useful idiots only exist on the left.
44 posted on 08/28/2013 6:05:10 AM PDT by cripplecreek (REMEMBER THE RIVER RAISIN!)
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To: IrishBrigade
"...please provide proof of that...it does little good to toss about unsubstantiated claims, regardless of political persuasion..."

Apply common sense:
1. Voter Fraud is easy to do.
2. There is a strong motive to do it.
3. If you do it, you do not leave an evidence trail, and there is virtually no chance of getting caught.
4. If you are caught, there is virtually no chance of accountability.
5. Community Organizer groups like ACORN exist for this kind of fraud.

45 posted on 08/28/2013 6:35:11 AM PDT by UnwashedPeasant
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To: firebrand

“There is no voter fraud” has become a ubiquitous Dem talking point. There is, and it has been documented, and people have been convicted. You have to carry this proof around with you to fend off the liars and the deceived.


To twist an old saying: All leftists lie some of the time, but some leftists lie ALL of the time.

And I agree — I’m seeing the “There is no voter fraud” lie repeated every time the ongoing fraud is brought up in discourse...


46 posted on 08/28/2013 6:35:28 AM PDT by Peet (Come back with a warrant.)
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To: econjack
This is not an issue of “the distant past”. It is an issue of today. A poll worker here in Cincinnati made no effort to hide the fact that she voted six times in the last Presidential election, voting for Obama. To this city’s credit, she is now serving a jail term. Such is not the case in Lake Country, Indiana where not only do people vote multiple times, some of them are actually dead. If the DOJ fails to enforce voting ID and other safeguards, this Republic is finished.

There, fixed it.

47 posted on 08/28/2013 6:46:28 AM PDT by 3boysdad (The very elect.)
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To: 3boysdad

I don’t see how, but I hope you’re wrong...


48 posted on 08/28/2013 7:09:41 AM PDT by econjack (I'm not bossy...I just know what you should be doing.)
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To: subterfuge; Orangedog; IrishBrigade

This is the type of action that encouraged Indiana to pass voter ID

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1735385/posts

One election cycle over 100% voter turn out in the same district.
State police followed the buses coming in from Gary to visit various polling station. Finally our state government said no more.
Two opposing D in Gary in primary ratted on each other. Both were convicted. And then 0 pulled the petition fraud in St Joseph county. (Notre Dame). Compare their not being able to get enough signature on the ballot to how the county voted in the fall. Unfreaking-believable!


49 posted on 08/28/2013 9:29:21 AM PDT by hoosiermama (Obama: "Born in Kenya" Lying now or then)
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To: Orangedog

I never said Romney or McCain were decent candidates. The fact is that there is vote fraud. A lot of it. All you are saying is that republicans have to put up a real conservative to overcome the fraud.

Please. No lectures about Gore from 2004.


50 posted on 08/28/2013 10:32:38 AM PDT by subterfuge (CBS NBC ABC FOX AP-- all no different than Pravda.)
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