Skip to comments.Road Rage Marine
Posted on 08/31/2013 2:50:49 AM PDT by rawhide
Camp Pendleton road rage incident. See link above for video.
I worked in a large hospital's ER for 20 years so I'm at least somewhat familiar with the subject of domestic violence.I've seen more women who were savagely beaten by a husband/boyfriend than I care to recall.I've even seen a few women who were *murdered* by same.I see you're former military as well as a lawyer.Picture yourself as having been assigned to defend a Marine accused of murdering his wife on base.He's done at least one tour of Iraq/Afghanistan,he's been wounded at least once,and there's evidence that he hasn't been the same,mentally and/or physically,since.Perhaps he even sustained a traumatic brain injury while in combat.What do you do?
I'm not saying that *all* these points apply to this Marine but we know that at least *one* of them does.
The sergeant made an idiot of himself and kicked a truck - not exactly a firing squad situation, is it?
Bet you never commanded anything.
I never ran afoul of the UCMJ during my Army hitch...not even an Article 15.Therefore I can't claim to be an expert on military justice.However,if you check the Army's,Navy's and AF's JAG websites you'll see more than a few General Courts Martial scheduled for certain drug offenses.So they're used for things less serious than murder and treason.Perhaps a former JAG lawyer will chime in here...I know that there are at least a couple here on FR.
The sergeant made an idiot of himself and kicked a truck - not exactly a firing squad situation, is it?
Check my posts and you'll see I never mentioned a firing squad...or anything close to that.
Bet you never commanded anything.
The Army wanted me to attend OCS in '69 but I said "no",mainly because I knew that the life expectancy of an O-1 in SE Asia was about 20 minutes.
I was a JAG in the military back in the 80s. Even then the military knew about the individual soldier that was great in battle but didn’t do civilian life so well.
I am not a fan of pschycobabble. So, I say it is a matter of right and wrong. He is responsible for conducting himself in an appropriate manner and as an adult is charged with know thing the difference between right and wrong. He is not the center of any universe. He has a brain and he has a soul and he better grow up fast. Life is full of hard things and disappointments. Life is unfair. You conduct yourself appropriately. And especially in the military. When I was in the military, the culture was such that you didn’t offer up excuses for wrongfulness, you said I was wrong, no excuse.
Seriously, I’ve had road rage from time to time. But nothing like this. Sure, I’ve wanted to duke it out when really ticked off and I think the other guy is being a jerk.
Now, after seeing this, I realize something. I NEVER want to blame another person making me act like this. If I act like this, it is MY problem.
I’m glad I saw this. Maybe God is trying to tell me something. I am listening!
You’re absolutely correct. this generation has a cultural affliction in excusing bad behavior by making up addictions and disorders. Clinton has a sex addiction, that guy has a beating-his-wife addiction, that lady has a PMS disorder that made her kill all her kids in the bathtub...
Seems we’ve forgotten how to blame a person correctly when they do wrong. Going back to the older mentality of forcefully rejecting bad behavior actually cures/prevents that bad behavior. If I could blame it on my “addiction” or “syndrome”, then it’s not my fault, right? And then I could just let myself lose control... Well, that’s too easy.
Real men and women need to use logic and overcome those emotions that would end up getting them in bad trouble, even if it does feel good to lose it once in awhile. It is all about self-control.
Hmmm...a JAG lawyer.Excellent! First,I know nothing about military justice,never even having had even an Article 15 brought against me.Please tell me...how are JAG offices run? Are there JAG officers who exclusively do prosecutions while others exclusively do defense? Or do you switch around? Do JAG officers volunteer to do a particular case or are they assigned,as one would be assigned to guard duty? Did you ever defend a Soldier,Sailor,Airman or Marine in a CM? I ask these things to return to my earlier question to you.Your "client",accused of murder,has a documented brain injury,sustained in the line of duty.It's been noted by many (including medical personnel) that he hasn't been the same since that injury.Do you,his military counsel,hold him morally and legally responsible for having failed to conduct himself in an appropriate manner or do you explore,in depth,the nature and extent of his injury as well as how such an injury is known to adversely affect an individual..with the thought of possibly presenting your findings to the panel?
Oh yeah, if I was assigned as your hypothetical criminal defendant’s legal counsel, I would have an obligation to inform the jury of his medical conditions etc. But I bet they wouldn’t buy it, still you never know
Proud of you - I didn't either during my four year stint as an enlisted Marine (1965-69).
"you'll see I never mentioned a firing squad.."
I know - just exaggerating to make my point..GCMs are a big deal we usually save for the worst offenses. We have Summary Courts Martial for the first level after Article 15, then Special Courts Martial for bigger yet, and the real deal at the GCM level. I have served on three General Court Martial boards and as a convening authority, convened several Summary and Special Courts Martial. in my somewhat busy next 24 years of service.
Like you, I was offered a commissioning program in 1969 but turned it down because I had just recovered from some pretty severe wounds in Vietnam and didn't feel I was ready for another helping just yet. The Corps offered me another chance in '72 and by then I was ready. The bit where I suggested that you "never commanded anything" was just snotty on my part and I apologize. I was very lucky to have had command and I know it.
Ive gotten very angry at other drivers. Just the other week for instance while driving to work, I had signaled and moved over to a designated left hand turn lane when I notice that the car right beside me who only a second before had been behind me, was moving left and over toward me and into my lane. I blew my horn and even made eye contact with her but she just kept coming over. To avoid getting hit by her (an older white woman BTW, FWIW), I both sped up and for a time crossed the double yellow line to avoid her hitting the left side of my car, and fortunately there was only one car in the oncoming lane and he saw what was happening and swerved to avoid me.
When we got to the traffic light, I looked in my rear view mirror and there she was right behind me, right up on my bumper and shaking her head and shaking her finger and fist at me as if I was the one who was in the wrong. I was really tempted to get out of my car and walk up to her and give her a good piece of my mind but instead, I took a deep breath, said the Serenity Prayer, and looked in my rear view and just shook my head and mouthed You just cant fix stupid and went about my day.
About a year ago I was babysitting my nephews kids at his house. We were just about to get hit by a severe thunderstorm and I was just about to get the little ones ready for bed when I heard a loud knock at the door. I couldnt help thinking: Isnt this how a lot of horror movies begin? LOL The dog started barking and the baby started crying and I went to the window at the front door to see who was knocking.
A 30-ish looking guy was standing on the porch and I yelled through the window, Can I help you? He said I think I hit your car. And sure enough I looked and saw that the back end of his pickup truck had slammed into the back of my car. OK. Give me a minute I said and I calmed the baby and the dog down, grabbed my keys and my cell phone (set to dial 9-11 just in case) and went out on the porch. He told me that he was dropping his son off at his ex-wifes house across the street and backed out of her drive way and hit that back of my car. I saw a woman standing on the porch of the house across the street and recognized her as someone Id seen at my nephews house for BBQs and kids birthday parties and I yelled over to her: Do you know him? Yes she said, Hes my ex husband so I figured he probably wasnt some psycho killer so I invited him to come inside as it was now really storming badly many lightning bolts, heavy wind and rain.
He apologized profusely, telling me he had parked his pickup truck in his exwifes driveway, had just dropped their son off and was backing out and hit my car which was parked across the street in front of my nephews house.
He kept saying Im so sorry, Im so sorry, I cant believe I did that. Im so sorry. Im so stupid, Im so sorry. I didnt see your car, Im so sorry. It was evident the guy was really shook up so I told him, Its OK. Thats why we call them accidents and not on-purposes.
He next asked me what he needed to do - it was obvious the guy had never had an accident before. So I told him that I would need to get his insurance and contact information, that I would give him mine, that he needed to contact his insurance company ASAP and inform them of the accident and what happened and that I would do the same with mine and provide my insurance company with his insurance and contact information and that since I was not at fault, that his insurance company would settle the claim and pay to repair any damages to both our vehicles, that the worst thing that might happen was his insurance rate might go up.
He looked rather shocked and said, Dont you need to call the police? to which I said No. No one was injured - youre not injured are you? No. he said. Did you hit my car on purpose? Are you drunk? (And FWIW I didnt smell any odor of alcohol on him) to which he said Oh goodness no! Oh God no! I was bringing my son home from our churchs Bible camp my wife and I are divorced and she is remarried but we get along and we want to do right by our son. And then he apologized yet again.
At this point and since I hadnt been able to go look at the damage to my car what with the thunderstorm and not wanting to leave my little great nieces alone in the house, I figured it was just minor damage. He gave me his drivers license and his insurance card and I copied down all the information and got his address and cell phone number and then told him, Its OK. I once rear ended a car stopped at a stop sign. I didnt mean to do it but for an instant I wasnt paying attention. These things happen; again this is why we call them accidents I felt more bad for him than I did for myself.
The next morning I was finally able to see the damage and it was pretty extensive a lot more than I thought it would be rear bumper smashed, left side tail light was smashed and pushed all the way into the trunk, rear quarter panel smashed and the wheel well guard displaced and against the left side rear tire. The car was drivable but I kept hearing a rubbing noise when the wheel well guard hit my tire when going over bumps in the road. Before I moved my car, I took lots of photos with my cell phone and called my insurance company.
Long story short, his insurance company was great gave me no problems, I even got to use a certified Toyota body shop for the repairs and genuine Toyota replacement parts and they paid for a decent rental car for the week and a half that my car was in the repair shop.
As it all turned out OK, I can say I was glad I remained calm and composed, that it wasnt worth getting angry over or cursing at someone who already felt bad enough already.
He tapped his bumper.
Isn’t it shocking?! I don’t live in a congested area anymore but I could see myself getting this out of control under the wrong circumstances. I would prefer to be as calm as the guy in the car and not the bleeping fool yelling.
Dude, in real life and most movies the ex or soon to be ex usually IS the psycho-killer!
I had a situation like that once, back in my younger years. Construction zone, lots of gravel on the road, and a sudden stop. I tapped the guy's bumper in front of me as I slid to a halt.
He immediately jumped out and called me, among other things, a-hole. Well, at that time in my life, I was determined that I wouldn't take that kind of remark from anybody so I jumped out of the car yelling "what the **** did you call me?".
I was ready to duke it out when, out of nowhere, a local cop walked up, looked at the two cars, and said "no damage, move along". I guess that took the wind out of both our sails! We both looked, agreed with the cop, and went along our merry way.
I don't think I could have remained calm like this guy did facing those kinds of actions, though I am a bit older now (and hopefully wiser, and definitely not as agile as I was 25 years ago). :)
As we get wiser, we should remember that we are not as young as we used to be :-)
True. LOL. But neither his demeanor nor that of his ex didnt set off any alarm bells. I spent a good chunk of my life living in Baltimore so I have pretty good street smarts. Believe me, if there had been anything even slightly off about the guy, I wouldnt have let him inside especially since I was babysitting my great nieces and being a female alone in the house. And even then, the only reason I let him come inside the house was there was a wickedly bad thunderstorm raging with big bolts of lighting crashing down. I would have been in much greater danger of being struck by lighting than from any harm from this guy who looked as if he might start crying at any minute.
I dunno. You baby-sitting, thunderstorm, big bolts of lightning, guy gettin’ all weepy before he goes off...still sounds like a Jamie Lee Curtis pyscho-killer movie to me.
Just darn lucky it wasn’t Halloween.