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Why many Republicans won't support Obama on Syria attack
Washington Examiner ^ | 9/2/2013 | Byron York

Posted on 09/02/2013 5:41:35 PM PDT by markomalley

Early signs say it will be hard for President Obama to win congressional authorization for military action in Syria. That could change; lawmakers might re-write the president's draft authorization into something they can live with, ultimately allowing Obama to go forward. But whatever happens, Republicans have a compelling case for rejecting the president's request. Based on off-the-record conversations with some of them, this is it:

1) The chemical weapons evidence. The Obama administration appears to believe that conclusive proof that the Assad regime used chemical weapons against Syrian civilians creates an unassailable case for U.S. intervention. A few lawmakers will likely challenge whether the proof is really conclusive. But a far larger number will accept the evidence that Assad used chemical weapons -- and still reject intervention.

Those lawmakers will argue that Obama did not intervene when Assad used conventional weapons to slaughter thousands of innocent people; the death toll in the two-and-and-half-year civil war is put at 100,000. What is different now? They will also point to the various atrocities and human rights violations around the world in which the United States has not intervened. American involvement, they will argue, should be contingent on a genuine U.S. national security interest, not the simple fact that an awful thing has been done.

2) The blank check problem. Lots of lawmakers, Republican and Democrat, believe Obama's draft resolution gives the president too much power. The draft would grant Obama the authority to use armed force "as he determines to be necessary and appropriate" in connection with weapons of mass destruction in Syria, for the purpose of preventing the future use or spread of those weapons, or, more generally, protecting the U.S. and its allies.

For many lawmakers, that's too broad a mandate. But a significant number of members might reject even a narrowed version of the resolution on the grounds that, once the use of force is authorized, Congress as a practical matter will have little control over how the president exercises it.

3) The nature of the Syrian opposition. Many Republicans will never be convinced the U.S. can come to the aid of good rebels in Syria without also helping bad rebels in Syria. It's just too complicated, they believe, and there are simply too many bad guys. Why risk aiding al Qaeda or its affiliates? These Republicans remain unconvinced by arguments from fellow GOP lawmakers like John McCain, who point out that in the Libyan operation the U.S. essentially set up a safe area for good rebels in Benghazi. Given what happened later in that Libyan city, the skeptics will remain unconvinced.

4) The lack of confidence in Barack Obama. There's no doubt the president has been extremely reluctant to take action in Syria. He also showed terrible judgment by painting himself into a corner with his 2012 "red line" comments on chemical weapons. For those reasons, and more, some Republicans will argue that they simply cannot entrust special warmaking powers to a president who they believe is not competent to use them.

5) The "first to die" dilemma. Some Republicans are so war-weary that they would be loathe to authorize any military action in the absence of an actual attack on the United States. When Sen. Rand Paul re-phrased John Kerry's words from Vietnam -- Kerry famously asked, "How do you ask a man to be the last to die for a mistake?" which Paul changed to "How do you ask a man to be the first to die for a mistake?" -- the senator from Kentucky was signaling that there is virtually no way lawmakers like him will ever support a Syrian initiative.

How many Republicans hold some or all of these beliefs? Quite a few. Perhaps in anticipation of a close vote, a new argument is circulating among pro-interventionists which says that protecting the prerogatives of future presidents is so important that Republicans should support Obama's Syrian action even if there is no good case for doing so.

Rejecting Obama could permanently weaken the presidency, argues political scientist James Ceaser in an article cited by influential conservative commentator William Kristol. Therefore, Republicans should vote to authorize force "even if they think that the president’s policy will prove ineffective, do no good, waste money, or entail unforeseen risks…even if they think he has gotten the nation into this situation by blunders, fecklessness, arrogance, or naiveté; and…even if, and especially, if they have no confidence in his judgment."

That will be a very hard sell for Republicans. In the end, many will carefully consider all the evidence and then vote their instincts. And that will mean a vote against Barack Obama.


TOPICS: Editorial; Foreign Affairs; Government; Israel; Russia; United Kingdom; War on Terror
KEYWORDS: 113th; bho44; byronyork; israel; russia; syria; unitedkingdom; waronterror
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I don't agree with Byron. I think most of the GOPe will be glad to support their butt-buddy so he can prove his quote manhood end quote
1 posted on 09/02/2013 5:41:35 PM PDT by markomalley
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To: markomalley

The GOPe would do it just to spite the TEA Party.


2 posted on 09/02/2013 5:42:49 PM PDT by Paladin2
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To: markomalley

And just what would they strike that would absolutely remove the threat of chemical weapons from Syrian government hands and from jihadist hands?

No one has offered a plan that relates to US security interests.


3 posted on 09/02/2013 5:44:56 PM PDT by xzins ( Retired Army Chaplain and Proud of It! Those who truly support our troops pray for victory!)
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To: markomalley

Need to distinguish between republicans politicians vs the republican voters


4 posted on 09/02/2013 5:45:04 PM PDT by 4rcane
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To: markomalley

It is simply amazing how these people think of the “presidency” as a king. Support him even if he’s wrong? What the hell is wrong with these people?


5 posted on 09/02/2013 5:48:51 PM PDT by VerySadAmerican (".....Barrack, and the horse Mohammed rode in on.")
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To: markomalley

I don’t either. I think the GOP will go right along with bath house Barry..


6 posted on 09/02/2013 5:49:24 PM PDT by cardinal4 (Barack Barry Hussein Soetoro Obama, America's own Perkin Warbeck..)
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To: markomalley

They might give the rubber stamp approval if they get the votes to repeal Obamacare ?


7 posted on 09/02/2013 5:49:50 PM PDT by American Constitutionalist
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To: markomalley

I can’t see it happening. Obama is likely to get perhaps half of his own caucus. He’s unlikely to get half of the Republican side.

In short, even if Obama gets it through the senate, I’d say its DOA in the House.

I’m trying to think in my head who will break with Obama in the senate.

Grahamnesty and McSham of course. Maybe Alexander and Corker.

Who else? I can’t even see Susan Collins saying yes.


8 posted on 09/02/2013 5:50:47 PM PDT by Viennacon
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To: American Constitutionalist

Not likely.
More likely, they will sell their vote for pork.


9 posted on 09/02/2013 5:53:12 PM PDT by tennmountainman (Stop Worrying And Learn To Love The Bomb!)
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To: markomalley

Because Obama is totally inept for the job of military leadership and has no business being seen as ‘commander & chief ‘ .
He is also not adverse to leaving our folks unsupported , then to be killed and then his ineptitude lied about and covered up , ad infitum . F Obama
Let the Syrians kill each other off until none remain .
Give asylum to Syrian Christians ONLY


10 posted on 09/02/2013 5:53:44 PM PDT by LeoWindhorse
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To: Paladin2

Atlanta news reported this evening that Chambliss and Isakson were expected to support an attack on Syria. I expected as much from Chambliss. Isakson showing his true colors.


11 posted on 09/02/2013 5:56:32 PM PDT by True Grit
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To: markomalley; All

Rejecting Obama could permanently weaken the
presidency

Sounds good to me. After Bush and Obama it’s clear that the Executive branch is way too powerful.


12 posted on 09/02/2013 6:08:47 PM PDT by pluvmantelo (Tuffy Gessling, George Zimmerman: They can crash at my pad anytime they like)
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To: pluvmantelo

I’ve been saying the presidency should be weakened all along and after what we’ve seen from this administration I’m thinking we should consider electing our Attorney General.


13 posted on 09/02/2013 6:11:11 PM PDT by cripplecreek (REMEMBER THE RIVER RAISIN!)
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To: markomalley
Rejecting Obama could permanently weaken the presidency, argues political scientist James Ceaser in an article cited by influential conservative commentator William Kristol. Therefore, Republicans should vote to authorize force "even if they think that the president’s policy will prove ineffective, do no good, waste money, or entail unforeseen risks…even if they think he has gotten the nation into this situation by blunders, fecklessness, arrogance, or naiveté; and…even if, and especially, if they have no confidence in his judgment."

Is this STUPID advice or what? So, instead of using common sense, the congress should vote to authorize force regardless of whether they believe that the President is correct.

If they believe that authorization is NOT justified, vote for it anyway. If they believe that authorization is justified, then vote for it. What a deal!

Chances are that the President will do whatever he pleases regardless of the outcome of the Congressional vote.

14 posted on 09/02/2013 6:16:06 PM PDT by olezip (Time obliterates the fictions of opinion and confirms the decisions of nature. ~ Cicero)
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To: True Grit
Yes it weakens the Presidency, as long as the President is this ass clown, so for God's sakes its imperative to neuter this guy.

It doesn't set precedent, or law. Presidents have sometimes gone alone, and sometimes consulted. Every Prez. will be different depending upon the situation.

Obama directing a war in the Mid-East....what could possibly go wrong ?

There are lots of brain-dead pubbies, but not enough, imho. Not all dems will go for it either.

Not to mention our capabilities. To fight it the way McCain and Co. want it done--with some teeth--may be beyond our capabilities. And its sure as hell beyond our budget.

15 posted on 09/02/2013 6:18:31 PM PDT by chiller (NBCNews et al is in the tank and should be embarrassed)
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To: xzins

This is a mess. There is something to be said for not tolerating the chemical weapons use...but this administrations’ (and especially Kerry) most serious attempts to create a foreign policy face with Assad has been to Neville Chaimberlain with Assad. Then to feed the Al Queda weeds on the other side, as he has, just created more bad situations.

Even if there could be a right side to this, is there any reason for either or any side to believe that this administration will be willing to do more than flail?


16 posted on 09/02/2013 6:19:22 PM PDT by lepton ("It is useless to attempt to reason a man out of a thing he was never reasoned into"--Jonathan Swift)
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To: cardinal4

Then, the GOP will share the blame when WW3 breaks out in the Middle East.


17 posted on 09/02/2013 6:19:31 PM PDT by tennmountainman (Stop Worrying And Learn To Love The Bomb!)
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To: cripplecreek

Hear, hear!


18 posted on 09/02/2013 6:20:07 PM PDT by pluvmantelo (Tuffy Gessling, George Zimmerman: They can crash at my pad anytime they like)
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6) Because it's all about Obama.

19 posted on 09/02/2013 6:20:46 PM PDT by Gene Eric (Don't be a statist!)
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To: markomalley

We’ll see what the gop does. I think it possible that this entire fiasco is designed to be cover for domestic issues and we’re being played for suckers. Perhaps dear leader isn’t so much interested in Syria at all as he is in having an issue that will put other domestic issues on the back burner.

As we all know the ‘rat operating philosophy is to “never let a crisis go to waste.” The timing of this is certainly suspicious. Its not like this is the first or last time the Syrians have used this stuff. Perhaps not the first or last time this year. So why the sudden urgency? Why now? And then why was it suddenly OK for this to wait till Congress reconvenes in another week?

Is the underlying issue be the upcoming fight over boehnercare? I found it very interesting how the gop wing of the uniparty went into hiding over the Syria issue. Then they came out very quickly with their response Saturday. It was almost like it was all ready to go. You don’t think it could have been, well, coordinated do you?

How convenient that congress will be discussing Syria over the next few weeks rather than defunding boehnercare. Oh, and the announcement of further gun control measures on Friday was of course Mere Coincidence.

As for what the gop will ultimately do, I doubt it’ll be much different than what the ‘rats do. It’s one big, chummy uniparty.


20 posted on 09/02/2013 6:22:44 PM PDT by RKBA Democrat (Power disintegrates when people withdraw their obedience and support)
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To: Viennacon

Bill Nelson FL. Sure to be on the wrong side of every issue.


21 posted on 09/02/2013 6:23:21 PM PDT by Captain7seas (Fire Jane Lubchenco and John Pistole.)
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To: Captain7seas

Manchin has already come out against the Syria vote if I recall correctly.


22 posted on 09/02/2013 6:27:11 PM PDT by Viennacon
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To: markomalley

The GOP should vote PRESENT and let the democrats and Obama OWN this one. No matter the outcome, Obama once again avoids governing and making a decision. To vote one way or the other simply supports his serial indecision and, by default, gives him credibility that he hasn’t earned. I wrote all three of my reps in DC today stating same ...even tho one was Lindsey Graham. Actually got a PERSONAL note back from Mark Sanford, which surprised me.


23 posted on 09/02/2013 6:29:56 PM PDT by ThePatriotsFlag (When will those PAYING for Obamacare be exempted?)
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To: markomalley

Let him nuke Syria, you’re all so racest (saRC off)


24 posted on 09/02/2013 6:35:42 PM PDT by lavaroise
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To: 4rcane
Need to distinguish between republicans politicians vs the republican voters

Liberals vs Conservatives?
25 posted on 09/02/2013 6:37:06 PM PDT by af_vet_rr
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To: Captain7seas

I just read that Tom Cole in the House (Major league RINO) will vote NO. Good start. Let’s hope Amash and others in the House can sink this vote.


26 posted on 09/02/2013 6:40:15 PM PDT by Viennacon
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To: xzins
No one has offered a plan that relates to US security interests.

You don't automatically trust the word of Barack Hussein Obama and John McCain? They were the top two Presidential candidates in 2008, surely they know what they are doing!

(was that too sarcastic?)
27 posted on 09/02/2013 6:40:27 PM PDT by af_vet_rr
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To: af_vet_rr

Glad you put in that sarcasm line. You had me wondering if you’d started using drugs. :>)


28 posted on 09/02/2013 6:45:44 PM PDT by xzins ( Retired Army Chaplain and Proud of It! Those who truly support our troops pray for victory!)
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To: markomalley

How about many Republicans in Congress don’t trust Obama because of the video lie supposed to cause the Benghazi massacre? Or how James Clapper lied to Congress? Or how the whole administration is corrupt and unbelievable???


29 posted on 09/02/2013 6:46:03 PM PDT by jch10 (The greatest threat to America is the Democrats.)
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To: cardinal4

If anything the Republicans will even be more “gung ho”, same happened during Willard’s bombing of Yugoslavia.


30 posted on 09/02/2013 6:47:30 PM PDT by dfwgator
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To: cripplecreek

I think the AG should be an elected position too....to a single 6 term. That way it doesn’t coincide with the presidential elections (so a liberal AG don’t get on the same ticket with the presidential candidate) and it overlaps administrations.


31 posted on 09/02/2013 6:54:34 PM PDT by Extremely Extreme Extremist (Governor Sarah Heath Palin for President of the United States in 2016)
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To: Extremely Extreme Extremist

I’m happy with our elected AG in Michigan. He’s the same party (GOP) as the governor but is a solid constitutionalist.

He’s representing the unions in the Detroit Bankruptcy fight not because any of us like it but because the state constitution requires it.

Better an AG who strictly adheres to the constitution than one who serves as personal prosecutor or defense attorney of the president.


32 posted on 09/02/2013 6:59:42 PM PDT by cripplecreek (REMEMBER THE RIVER RAISIN!)
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To: markomalley

I’ve got a compelling reason not to support Obama; there is no f***ing reason to interfere when our enemies are killing each other. I know they’re killing Christians too but the winner of this fight is going to keep doing that anyway. We don’t need to help.


33 posted on 09/02/2013 7:04:58 PM PDT by muir_redwoods (Don't fire until you see the blue of their helmets)
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To: markomalley
I think most of the GOPe will be glad to support their butt-buddy

Good post of a PR effort by the RNC to soften up the public for a Republican capitulation. If these spineless, gutless, ball-less bastards support the Mombasa MF on this, it will be just another nail in the coffin of the GOP.

The GOP is having a slow painful demise, to no one's satisfaction but the Democrat Party. Unfortunately, what the GOP cannot seem to realize is that their death as a political force endangers the survival of the Republic.

34 posted on 09/02/2013 7:09:04 PM PDT by Kenny Bunk (Don't miss the Blockbuster of the Summer! "Obama, The Movie" Introducing Reggie Love as "Monica! ")
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To: jch10

How about many Republicans in Congress don’t trust Obama because of the video lie supposed to cause the Benghazi massacre? Or how James Clapper lied to Congress? Or how the whole administration is corrupt and unbelievable???


Happened to see a video clip of O meeting with McCain/ Graham.

Its O & Susan Rice meeting with them. How they could spend 1/2 minute with these 2 liars is beyond comprehension.

Have they forgotten Bengahzi and the role these 2 played ?


35 posted on 09/02/2013 7:10:52 PM PDT by patriotspride
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To: markomalley

Draft the revised binding resolution to fund military action only if Obamacare is defunded.


36 posted on 09/02/2013 7:20:05 PM PDT by Rodamala
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To: patriotspride

” How they could spend 1/2 minute with these 2 liars is beyond comprehension.”

Are you calling McCain/Graham liars?....

Personally, I couldn’t stand to be in the same room with any of them for 10 seconds.


37 posted on 09/02/2013 7:24:53 PM PDT by rustyboots
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To: tennmountainman

That is my thinking as well. Too bad we can’t be flies on the wall to see the horse trading.

On second thought...maybe it’s best we aren’t flies on the wall.


38 posted on 09/02/2013 7:28:15 PM PDT by berdie
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To: markomalley

When (not if) the Republickins go along with this, any last shred of relevancy they had will go bye-bye.


39 posted on 09/02/2013 7:29:30 PM PDT by dfwgator
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To: markomalley

No one should have to die just to save Obama from embarrassment, and I don’t understand why any Republican would want to do so.


40 posted on 09/02/2013 7:31:10 PM PDT by Sun (Pray that God sends us good leaders. Please say a prayer now.)
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To: Sun

Because the Republican Party is now just another wing of the Democratic Party.


41 posted on 09/02/2013 7:32:16 PM PDT by dfwgator
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To: markomalley

Lets hope so: and I would add another reason WHY I DON’T SUPPORT WAR IN SYRIA: As Christians we should be very wary of taking life, especially those of us that preach “pro-life” politically, Jesus died for even the violent fighters that we (as a nation) would be responsible for killing in any attack. Does God want to reach their hearts and save them. I submit 1 Tim Chapter 2 for proof that He does, let’s not be too quick to take life except in circumstances where our citizens are directly effected..

This ACTION in Syria doesn’t raise to that level. -J.S.


42 posted on 09/02/2013 7:35:32 PM PDT by JSDude1 (Is John Boehner the Neville Chamberlain of American Politics?)
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To: ThePatriotsFlag

NO, the Republicans should vote: AGAINST IT, not “PRESENT”. That way we defeat Obama and he ~has~ to go extra-Constitutional and AGAINST his word again if he decides to bomb Syria!


43 posted on 09/02/2013 7:39:57 PM PDT by JSDude1 (Is John Boehner the Neville Chamberlain of American Politics?)
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To: jch10

Exactly!


44 posted on 09/02/2013 7:41:59 PM PDT by tennmountainman (Stop Worrying And Just Learn To Love The Bomb!)
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To: Viennacon

AGREED LETS CALL OUR REPS:

U.S. House of Representatives
Washington, DC 20515
(202) 224-3121
TTY: (202)-225-1904


45 posted on 09/02/2013 7:43:58 PM PDT by JSDude1 (Is John Boehner the Neville Chamberlain of American Politics?)
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To: Sun

Exactly. There are many reasons to exercise military power.
Saving face is not one of them.


46 posted on 09/02/2013 7:49:25 PM PDT by tennmountainman (Stop Worrying And Just Learn To Love The Bomb!)
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To: RKBA Democrat
...the underlying issue be the upcoming fight over boehnercare?'

And the IRS, Benghazi and NSA scandals. As Biden might say, All of those are a really big 'bleeping' deal. It all makes the Nixon admin look like choir boys.

Watch the left hand...

47 posted on 09/02/2013 7:52:17 PM PDT by Earthdweller (Harvard won the election again...so what's the problem.......? Embrace a ruler today.)
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To: markomalley

Obama should be treated to repeated verbatim repeats of what he has said in the past against Bush. Just keep repeating Obama’s opposition to Coalition’s, Bush’s seeking of congressional approval, and throw in a heavy dose of JF Kerry’s “was for it before being against it” just to hammer this administration. And keep up the drumbeat against the administration forever, after all the media will eventually report it.


48 posted on 09/02/2013 8:03:16 PM PDT by Jumper
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To: markomalley

The executive branch has gotten too big. It needs to be taken down many, many pegs. This is a good place to start. At the very least the should make Obama trade Obamacare funding for funding his Syria adventure— publicly.


49 posted on 09/02/2013 8:30:38 PM PDT by WriteOn (Truth)
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To: markomalley

Would the GOP-e defy upwards of 90% of the country on this? I would think not, but then again, this IS the GOP-e we are talking about. The dems that are being wishy-washy right now, on the other hand, will faithfully vote for anything on the floor when the time comes, regardless of what the people want.


50 posted on 09/02/2013 8:52:24 PM PDT by yawningotter
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