Skip to comments.This is the Strategy. Now Do It
Posted on 10/09/2013 8:56:40 AM PDT by JSDude1
Conservatives need to push the debt ceiling fight off the front burner to after Christmas.
Republican Leaders are begging us to merge the continuing resolution fight and debt ceiling fight. They covet this with all their mind and heart.
They do not want a stand alone fight on Obamacare. They want to conflate it with the debt ceiling so they can do a grand bargain and leave Obamacare alone.
Consider Rep. Paul Ryans op-ed in the Wall Street Journal. He wants a grand bargain and not once mentions Obamacare. Not once.
Friends, as I noted the other day, we lose everything if we merge the continuing resolution and debt ceiling fights.
Whats more, if the debt ceiling gets pushed to just before Christmas, the GOP will collapse in that fight just like they did with Obamacare in 2009.
I think somebody like Steve Scalise, who chairs the Republican Study Committee, needs to propose a short-term debt limit for a few weeks and attach to it the Full Faith and Credit Act that ensures the Treasury Department prioritizes interest payments in the event the debt limit is ever not increased. This would buy us some time to finish the fight to defund Obamacare and set us up well to fight the next long-term debt limit increase to the death by removing some of the Presidents scare tactics. How do Republican Leaders not adopt and push such a proposal? How does Obama not accept it without looking completely unreasonable?
(Excerpt) Read more at redstate.com ...
U.S. House of Representatives Washington, DC 20515 (202) 224-3121 TTY: (202)-225-1904
Prioritizing interest payments is essential. The scum running the country might default just to default.
there is no point to prioritizing payments. a Default on any payment will be seen the same way by market forces. If you choose to pay your car loans but not your credit card, when you go to buy a new car they won’t care that you have always paid them first, they will just see that you have had trouble making your payments. The market will react to ANY default. You dont want to be holding the debt of somone that is prioritizing payments, even if you are at the top.
Something irks me about the idea of giving all those federal workers on furlough more paid vacation during shutdown and then passing a big deal that cuts future medicare and social security, and Obama-care fully funded too.
In return for future cuts Ryan wants to offer Dems near turn spending increases over the house CR, typical.
Fortunately doesn't seem like Dems would go for this.
“The scum running the country might default just to default.”
At this point, that might be the best possible outcome. If we default, the gravy train comes screeching to a halt, and there will be no option but to shrink government considerably. Forget about raising the debt ceiling, what is the point if nobody would loan us money?
It might be like a short term balanced budget amendment, in practical effect.
In a way it is our very good fortune that Ted Cruz and Mike Lee precipitated this crisis over Obamacare rather than remaining passive on the promise of John Boehner and Mitch McConnell the fight over the issue of the debt ceiling. This not just because those promises by these two are illusory but because the Obamacare shutdown has smoked Obama out and provides cover to the Republicans to extend the debt while maintaining a shutdown in pursuit of Obamacare.
The problem is, as always, we cannot rely on our own troops to remain steadfast. But it seems that they of that we had better alert the country about Obama's unconstitutional intentions and we really should devise a strategy to deal with it. The most obvious strategy is, as I have described, to continue steadfast over Obamacare but extend the debt ceiling for a very limited time. Please note that Obama is insisting on a 13 month extension of the debt ceiling and will not otherwise negotiate. This is further evidence of his desire to force an emergency. At least the Republicans should keep the issue alive with a very short extension of the debt ceiling while depriving him of the justification for stealing the power of the purse from Congress.
I expect to receive some criticism for even consenting to extension of the debt ceiling but I await a better strategy to emerge.
Not so. A "default" is defined as failing to pay any part of a pre-existing debt - i.e. interest or principal on a loan. That is very different from not paying full boat on some other governmental program that is merely a political promise.
Right now, the Treasury brings in well over $200 billion/month. The amount of interest payments and actual debt reduction (paying off bills, notes and bonds - even if there are many more issued that same month) pales in comparison to that number, so the only reason for a "default" (which would, after all, violate that terms of the 14th Amendment) would be a purposeful decision coming right from the top. No President can simply decide not to pay interest and principal because he would rather pay for some program that he likes better. It is a specific violation of the Constitution, and if he does it he should be impeached (and who cares what the Senate does - the impeachment itself would send the message that the Republicans can only be backed up so far).
I don't even know why the Rs want to pass a full faith and credit bill - Obama will veto it, but more importantly, IT ISN'T NECESSARY since the Constitution requires it.
The majority of the republicans want government perks the rest of their lives just like the democrats do. obamacare is just a new perk they’ve figured out a way to give themselves.
Or to put the nail in the coffin of the dollar being the world's reserve currency. Such a move would be nothing less than treason when national security implications are considered.
i don’t really care with the definition of ‘default’ is. Every financial person I have seen write about this agrees there is no difference between defaulting on an actual bond payment and defaulting on other payments the government must make. Markets will view it the same way.
I thought that was already the law.
I agree, but I’m not sure a default is the end of the world as some would have it. Greece is still there last I checked.
Some dumb creditors who’d invested in Greece lost money.
If dumb creditors would quit loaning us money wouldn’t that be a good thing?
As much money as we have coming in there is no need for any default on the credit card or the car. We need to pay what is legally obligated and then cut out the yard service and the maid. We need to quit buying single malt and take the kids camping for a week instead of flying to Disney. The problem with liberals is they see all of the programs as a birthright, as absolutely necessary.
Hi, Nathanbedford! You will get NO flack from me, you are one of the most
informed people I know! If you think this what WE should do I am with you
whole heartedly! To the phones and e-mail I go, I halfway expect the NSA
to come knocking at my door! I have been so VERY surprised at the GOP
holding their ground, the citizenry must be EXTREMELY active!
agree, but prioritization doesn’t do this.
Memo to GOP: If Obama Wont Compromise, Dont Raise the Debt Ceiling
That’s right. The claim that not raising the debt limit equals “default” is simply a lie.
Legally forcing them to pay interest first doesn’t make sure the interest is paid? What?
your statement was they should trim back (not disney land etc) the prioritation of debts doesnt make them trim back expenses ti makes them order their expenses on which get paid and which do not when the money runs out. even with Prioritization SOMETHING will not get paid. and reguardless of what that something is, the market will see it as an inability to pay debts.
Believe what you want. I still believe they should be legally obligated to meet certain obligations first. Insufficient cash to fund pet programs is far different from failure to handle debt service and the markets know the difference. One is a solvency issue, the other a political problem.
ah. I think I see where you are coming from now. We assume that if the debt limit isn’t raised and there is no catastrophe that we need to take the reigns of what to spend on and what not to spend on out of the president’s hands and provide clear steps... In that case I’m completely on board with you!
You are a smart guy. Way to smart for this. All these strategies to “win harts and minds” will come to nothing. Bottom line. We will NEVER allow our rights as individuals to be subordinated to “the collective” no matter what subterfuge used. Call it BozoCare or whatever or strategies or tactics to deal with the fact or fiction that we are outnumbered by 2% or whatever. This is the fight. Make it CLEAR. We will not quit. We will not submit. We will not bend a knee to any man.
There is the point that without an increase in the debt ceiling evern more federal workers would be fired.
And then, as the debts increase, them more federal workers would be fired.
But the current bums would be sure to hurt honorable veterans first, and old people dependent on SS after that, so long as the democrat activists with federal pay got their money, and the union thugs got their cut.
I like your idea.
Default has a specific meaning.
You are using it incorrectly.
So we want to keep the matter cooking.
Reverting to the first issue, it looks like Paul Ryan and his boys are trying to switch the matter to the general budget. This is attractive to them because it gets us past Obamacare which they regard to be a battle we cannot win. I regard it as a battle we win as long as we fight it. Nevertheless, they want an exit strategy and their strategy is to move over to the budget.
By granting a short-term debt extension, I hope we can keep the matter open, keep our side together, keep Obamacare alive, but not lose all leverage over the administration.
Given my druthers, which we rarely are given, I would go to the wall with Yosemitest and say damn your eyes all of you and make them live within the current debt limit. But that ain't gonna happen.
I have always thought that as long as we fight we are winning. That is because we have reason and logic on our side and the Democrats are essentially lying to the people. Every day the anomalies of their position become exposed. That is why Obama looks so inept. If we can keep the battle going we win the public relations fight everyday. Ultimately, that is what will decide Obamacare and the budget.
I want to keep the fight going and I want to deflect Paul Ryan and the establishment Republicans from switching over to some sort of half-assed compromise on the budget as a substitute. We have seen this game played before to our sorrow.
We would not be in this position if Ted Cruz and Mike Lee had not shamed the Republican establishment into it. At the time there was, as Doctor Krauthammer says, no clear path to repealing or defunding Obamacare. But the fight itself has created opportunities. Whatever leverage we now have on the budget comes from the fight over Obamacare.
More, the appalling anecdotal evidence is mounting on a huge scale in the media of skyrocketing premiums, skyrocketing-almost surrealistic- self-pay provisions, and loss of coverage previously held. These media reports must be replicated a million times in the social media a million times more around the water cooler. All of this too must vindicate opposition to Obamacare.
The idea that the public is disproportionately punishing the Republican brand for the situation and for their opposition to it is contrary to our common assumptions and expectations, not as conservatives but as citizens. For the public to get this so wrong means that democracy is hopeless.
I understand the media bashes the Republicans daily but their bashing comes down to this, the Republicans are mindlessly fighting a law which is oppressing you and which is unfairly applied against you, a fight which they cannot win not because it is inherently wrong but only because Obama is arrogant and stubbornly defends his signature legacy. Therefore, you should blame the Republicans for government shutdown and bad weather.
I simply do not buy it nor the polls which seem to say it.
I agree with you 100%, there should be an open season on Rinos this primary season.