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Air Force general in charge of ICBMs to be fired
Washington Times ^ | October 11, 2013 | Robert Burns

Posted on 10/12/2013 6:46:01 AM PDT by incredulous joe

WASHINGTON — The Air Force fired the general in charge of its nuclear missiles on Friday, just two days after a Navy admiral with top nuclear weapons responsibilities was sacked. Both men are caught up in investigations of alleged personal misconduct, adding to a cascade of turmoil inside the nation’s nuclear weapons force.

The Air Force removed Maj. Gen. Michael Carey, a 35-year veteran, from his command of 20th Air Force, responsible for all 450 of the service’s intercontinental ballistic missiles. Carey, who took his post in Wyoming in June 2012, will be reassigned pending the outcome of an investigation into personal misbehavior, the service said.

The Air Force would not specify what Carey is alleged to have done wrong, but two officials with knowledge of the investigation indicated that it was linked to alcohol use.

They said it was not related to the performance or combat readiness of ICBM units or to his stewardship of the force.

Removing senior officers in the nuclear force is rare but has happened twice this week.

On Wednesday the Navy said Vice Adm. Tim Giardina, the second-in-charge at U.S. Strategic Command, was fired amid an investigation of gambling issues. He was demoted from three- to two-star rank and reassigned to a Navy staff job until the investigation is completed.

(Excerpt) Read more at washingtontimes.com ...


TOPICS: Front Page News; Government; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: carey; general; icbm; militarypurge; strategiccommand
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This smells funny. Two generals in charge of strategic command in less than one week?
1 posted on 10/12/2013 6:46:01 AM PDT by incredulous joe
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To: incredulous joe

Probably had a beer in his office, kicking back after a long week. . .muttering something about ‘precious bodily fluids”. . .

/sarc


2 posted on 10/12/2013 6:48:27 AM PDT by Hulka
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To: incredulous joe

They needed an excuse to replace them with members of the Muslim Brotherhood.


3 posted on 10/12/2013 6:53:37 AM PDT by Jack Hydrazine (I’m not a Republican, I'm a Conservative! Pubbies haven't been conservative since before T.R.)
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To: incredulous joe

From don’t ask don’t tell to up yours and that cascade is OK? The guys must have been Christian.


4 posted on 10/12/2013 6:54:16 AM PDT by mountainlion (Live well for those that did not make it back.)
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To: incredulous joe

Maybe they were caught adding the GPS coordinates of the WH to the targeting list.../s


5 posted on 10/12/2013 6:54:59 AM PDT by jsanders2001
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To: Hulka
"Do you know anything about fluoridation, Mandrake?"


6 posted on 10/12/2013 6:56:38 AM PDT by Flatus I. Maximus (Fight Third-World Despotism. Overthrow Obama.)
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To: incredulous joe

Let the show trials begin!


7 posted on 10/12/2013 6:56:51 AM PDT by P.O.E. (Pray for America)
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To: incredulous joe

The Kenyan faggot is ridding our military of its leadership. I said it before, 3 good generals need to step forward, one for each branch of this criminal regime.


8 posted on 10/12/2013 6:59:26 AM PDT by Neoliberalnot (Marxism works well only with the uneducated and the unarmed.)
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To: incredulous joe

If it was vice related then it is probably Ok that they be relieved. A drunk with “The Bomb!” is not reassuring. It will be interesting to see their replacements.


9 posted on 10/12/2013 6:59:41 AM PDT by AEMILIUS PAULUS (It is a shame that when these people give a riot)
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To: incredulous joe

Obama probably has some gay officers ready to step into those roles.


10 posted on 10/12/2013 7:02:11 AM PDT by Bryanw92 (Sic semper tyrannis)
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To: P.O.E.

I think that trials would be great. Then we would know exactly what was done. I have a feeling that these guys might just disappear?


11 posted on 10/12/2013 7:02:19 AM PDT by incredulous joe ("No road is too long with good company" Turkish Proverb)
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To: AEMILIUS PAULUS
It will be interesting to see their replacements.

Absolutely!

The replacements will tell us if this is a takeover or just business as usual.

12 posted on 10/12/2013 7:03:19 AM PDT by Erik Latranyi (When religions have to beg the gov't for a waiver, we are already under socialism.)
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To: All

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2013/05/17-air-force-officers-have-nuke-launch-keys-revoked

7 generals + 4 recent (2 nuke+2 marine) & 17 nuke launch control officers11 generals and 17 officers total=28 total

http://www.ijreview.com/2013/06/62053-president-obamas-purge-military-officers-replaced-by-the-commander-in-chief/


13 posted on 10/12/2013 7:05:03 AM PDT by seeker41 (take your country back by whatever means necessary)
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To: AEMILIUS PAULUS

I agree, drunks with ICBMs are bad. These guys have had very long careers in the military. They did not get this far by accident. I expect that these are some of the most meticulous and uptight individuals on the face of the earth.


14 posted on 10/12/2013 7:07:26 AM PDT by incredulous joe ("No road is too long with good company" Turkish Proverb)
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To: incredulous joe

Is there any congressional oversight of any of this? Don’t know that I’ve ever heard one peep out of any elected representative as the president has wiped out the existing military leadership.


15 posted on 10/12/2013 7:11:03 AM PDT by John W (Viva Cristo Rey!)
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To: Erik Latranyi

It may be he shot his mouth off about cleaning house. Unfortunately one simply cannot believe any statement coming from Washington. The Washington “politico” simply lies as it is his nature, his essence, his very being. That is what is sad. I’m old enough to remember when the word of the U.S. government was invoked to settle arguments and it did. Our government was really respected. Again IF he was a drunk then “OUT!”


16 posted on 10/12/2013 7:11:45 AM PDT by AEMILIUS PAULUS (It is a shame that when these people give a riot)
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To: incredulous joe

“This smells funny. Two generals in charge of strategic command in less than one week?”

Seems they are cleaning house.


17 posted on 10/12/2013 7:16:02 AM PDT by CodeToad (Liberals are bloodsucking ticks. We need to light the matchstick to burn them off. -786 +969)
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To: incredulous joe

“This smells funny.”

Smells funny to me too.

Let us look at the tolerance of incompetence at the IRS, NSA and Justice dept. No one gets fired.

Let’s look at Bengazi and Susan Rice.

So yes this not only smells funny. It stinks to high heaven.


18 posted on 10/12/2013 7:19:15 AM PDT by staytrue
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To: AEMILIUS PAULUS

Amen! There are some bad apples, and I am all for weeding them out. Drunk officers mean drunk underlings. I have seen the result of a lack of discipline on a ship. Every day I think I will hear of some major catastrophe on this particular vessel. Root out the bad apples. As for the gambling Admiral, what else would he gamble with? I am not a fan of gambling much less a cheating gambler.


19 posted on 10/12/2013 7:22:38 AM PDT by petitfour
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To: incredulous joe

If it was a drinking issue one would think it would have been noted long before. I sincerely doubt the drinking problem started just this year. The statements by Washington politico’s simply cannot be believed their very nature is to lie.


20 posted on 10/12/2013 7:24:07 AM PDT by AEMILIUS PAULUS (It is a shame that when these people give a riot)
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To: incredulous joe

Is anyone compiling a list of 2 and 3 stars relieved under this regime?

I bet it would make interesting reading.


21 posted on 10/12/2013 7:24:53 AM PDT by Jim Noble (When strong, avoid them. Attack their weaknesses. Emerge to their surprise.)
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To: incredulous joe

Night of the long knives?


22 posted on 10/12/2013 7:26:52 AM PDT by johnny reb (When in the course of human events.....)
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To: AEMILIUS PAULUS

Someone posted the other day that the guy was caught cheating in a casino. Who knows? We probably never will.


23 posted on 10/12/2013 7:31:06 AM PDT by bigbob
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To: incredulous joe

Were they anti homosexual deviancy?


24 posted on 10/12/2013 7:35:49 AM PDT by LibLieSlayer (FROM MY COLD, DEAD HANDS!)
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25 posted on 10/12/2013 7:47:54 AM PDT by RedMDer (http://www.dontfundobamacare.com/)
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To: Jim Noble

See reply 13 above.


26 posted on 10/12/2013 8:08:02 AM PDT by Arrowhead1952 (The Second Amendment is NOT about the right to hunt. It IS a right to shoot tyrants.)
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To: johnny reb

The military is being purged of experienced leadership. Zero is trying to “coup-proof” himself.


27 posted on 10/12/2013 8:09:09 AM PDT by Wordkraft (Remember who the Collaborators are.)
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To: incredulous joe
My guess is that the flag officers of today understand just how much contempt that Osama Obama has for the Armed Forces.I'm sure they've read up on Stalin's activities during the 1930’s regarding *his* top officers.
28 posted on 10/12/2013 8:11:50 AM PDT by Gay State Conservative (Osama Obama Care: A Religion That Will Have You On Your Knees!)
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To: incredulous joe
Two generals in charge of strategic command in less than one week?

**************

Better late than never if in fact it was issues llike alcoholism and gambling.

29 posted on 10/12/2013 8:13:26 AM PDT by deport
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To: incredulous joe

Coup d’Etat! Coming soon from a fascist government.


30 posted on 10/12/2013 8:13:45 AM PDT by Busko (The only thing that is certain is that nothing is certain.)
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To: Erik Latranyi

“The replacements will tell us if this is a takeover or just business as usual. “

Give me takeover for $500 Alex.


31 posted on 10/12/2013 8:13:46 AM PDT by Georgia Girl 2 (The only purpose of a pistol is to fight your way back to the rifle you should never have dropped.)
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To: bigbob

I find it preposterous that a Navy Admiral would be counterfeiting casino chips and cashing them. That’s seems like a crazy accusation to get the man out.


32 posted on 10/12/2013 8:14:23 AM PDT by IndispensableDestiny
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To: Hulka
.muttering something about ‘precious bodily fluids”. . .

Or "Benghazi"?

33 posted on 10/12/2013 8:14:46 AM PDT by jiggyboy (Ten percent of poll respondents are either lying or insane)
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To: incredulous joe
They already have their replacements:


34 posted on 10/12/2013 8:16:41 AM PDT by GrandJediMasterYoda (What do we want? Time travel. When do we want it? It's irrelevant.)
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To: bigbob
Someone posted the other day that the guy was caught cheating in a casino. Who knows? We probably never will.

Back in the day, you wouldn't have had a hard time finding out if they cheated, just look at their hands.

35 posted on 10/12/2013 8:20:06 AM PDT by dfwgator
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To: incredulous joe

Sounds like a purge to me.....


36 posted on 10/12/2013 8:20:32 AM PDT by expat2
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To: Jack Hydrazine
They needed an excuse to replace them with members of the Muslim Brotherhood.

I really do think that Obama is busily replacing senior officers with people he can be sure will be loyal to him, and who in turn can be counted on to sniff out people junior to them who are "politically unreliable".

If a next Republican president attempts to undo this, and remove the Leftists in the military, the press will suddenly screech about "McCarthyism!"

37 posted on 10/12/2013 8:20:48 AM PDT by PapaBear3625 (You don't notice it's a police state until the police come for you.)
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To: incredulous joe

Call me a raving paranoid for having such a thought....but would it be possible that Obumbles is putting people in place who would have no trouble dropping The Bomb on their own people if so ordered?

I mean...say there’s a section of the country or a state that finally gets fed up with his shenanigans and does something that equals a gigantic middle-finger towards Washington. In a fit of extreme petulance, he orders a city-buster dropped on that state’s capitol. Far-fetched, yes....but I would not put anything past him (or Valerie Jarrett).


38 posted on 10/12/2013 8:21:56 AM PDT by hoagy62 ("Tyranny, like hell, is not easily conquered..."-Thomas Paine. 1776)
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To: incredulous joe

I was to Michael Savage last night ( home sick). He had a retired pilot call in ( served under Reagan and Bush1). He said he believes Obama is coup- proofing the military.


39 posted on 10/12/2013 8:22:48 AM PDT by riri (Plannedopolis-look it up. It's how the elites plan for US to live.)
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To: IndispensableDestiny
I find it preposterous that a Navy Admiral would be counterfeiting casino chips and cashing them.

How hard would it be to get a casino employee (in Harry Reid's fiefdom) to pass counterfeit chips to somebody to frame him?

40 posted on 10/12/2013 8:24:06 AM PDT by PapaBear3625 (You don't notice it's a police state until the police come for you.)
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To: incredulous joe

And it smells funny that “alcohol” is cited in this era of “General order #1” and an absolutely zero tolerance atmosphere for alcohol use beyond light social drinking.

A problem drinker would have been weeded out long before making 3 stars.

Sorry. I don’t buy it without independent confirmation by a trusted source.


41 posted on 10/12/2013 8:27:18 AM PDT by xzins ( Retired Army Chaplain and Proud of It! Those who truly support our troops pray for victory!)
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To: incredulous joe

This country becomes more and more of a third world banana republic every day.


42 posted on 10/12/2013 8:27:38 AM PDT by Red White and Blue patriot
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To: hoagy62

“U.S. military police were targeted and killed by Obama in the Washington DC Navy Yard shooting. Why? Agents from the U.S. military’s criminal investigation units had uncovered a plot to detonate a nuclear device in the heart of the nation’s capitol as part of an Obama government false flag.

Officials from NCIS (United States Naval Criminal Investigative Service) and the U.S. Office of the Provost (both with field offices inside the Washington DC Navy Yard) had threatened to arrest Obama for planning to attacked Syria without Congressional approval following a planned nuclear detonation false flag in Washington DC. The Office of the Provost is on the second floor of Building 34, One First Avenue, Charlestown Navy Yard and NCIS is located at 716 SICARD STREET SE, SUITE 2000, WASHINGTON NAVY YARD, DC.”

Kind’a hot, right? I suspect if I posted this, it would be pulled.

What are your opinion?

Following is the entire article and the address.
******************************************

At the first of the week, a question was asked what if your nightmares concerning FEMA were true? We know a nuclear bomb has been missing in transit from a Military base to the East Coast and was put out by Glenn Beck, Fox News, and other media outlets. We know that the president had attempted to circumvent the US Congress prior to the G20 summit in bombing Syria and even went as far as waiving a US law to provide arms to the Free Syrian Army that was treason in itself. We know the government is trying hard to circumvent the constitution. So what if the Navy shooting was to cover up that a Supreme Court Justice and the United States Military were plotting to arrest the President for Treason?

I know, it sounds like I ate some bad shrimp and had a nightmare after watching “Clear and Present Danger”, but I started looking at the chain of events and could not put my finger on it. We have a credible evidence of UN troops on American soil, a missing nuke, a President arming our enemies, a UN small arms treaty that is un-Constitutional, and a big event planned for Region III that nobody seems to know why DHS needs that much ammo, water rations, or food supplies that they are buying. Nothing makes sense from a logical stand point, until an article was found in a Canadian news paper that referenced everything and tied to rt.com and EU Times articles that set everything in its proper place.

From the Press Core: “In politics, nothing happens by accident. If it happens, you can bet it was planned that way.” – Franklin D. Roosevelt. U.S. military police were targeted and killed by Obama in the Washington DC Navy Yard shooting. Why? Agents from the U.S. military’s criminal investigation units had uncovered a plot to detonate a nuclear device in the heart of the nation’s capitol as part of an Obama government false flag. Officials from NCIS (United States Naval Criminal Investigative Service) and the U.S. Office of the Provost (both with field offices inside the Washington DC Navy Yard) had threatened to arrest Obama for planning to attacked Syria without Congressional approval following a planned nuclear detonation false flag in Washington DC. The Office of the Provost is on the second floor of Building 34, One First Avenue, Charlestown Navy Yard and NCIS is located at 716 SICARD STREET SE, SUITE 2000, WASHINGTON NAVY YARD, DC.

The United States Naval Criminal Investigative Service (NCIS) is the primary law enforcement agency of the United States Department of the Navy. It investigates activities concerning crimes against or by United States Navy and United States Marine Corps personnel, along with national security, counter-intelligence, and counter-terrorism cases. A false flag is the crime of treason – levying war against the United States. If United States Navy or United States Marine Corps personnel are involved in planning for and preparing a false flag event in Washington DC or anywhere else in the United States, NCIS and its agents are duty bound to investigate and take action to counter those terrorist acts against the United States.

Prior to the Washington DC Navy Yard shooting the Joint Chief of Staff and Provost Marshals were planning and preparing to arrest Obama for treason. For levying war against the United States with a planned false flag in Washington DC on the anniversary of 9/11 – a nuclear detonation.

In the United States the Office of the Provost has the authority to arrest the President if he or she violates the terms of his/her employment, or commits an act that is detrimental to the United States. He/she can be held liable, arrested, imprisoned etc., depending on the depth of the violation, by the Provost Marshal.

If it has been determined that the president of the United States has committed treason in a manner unmistakable to all, the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff convenes a covert meeting (in this case the Washington DC Navy Yard) to get a vote of the Joint Chiefs of Staff. The Provost Marshall General of the Army and/or Marines will usually be in attendance. Remember that a military officer takes an oath of office to do one thing and one thing only – “……. to support and defend the Constitution of the United States against ALL enemies, foreign OR DOMESTIC.” They must determine above a reasonable doubt that the enemy domestic is the treasonous president before they can attempt to arrest him or her.

Once the Joint Chiefs of Staff have determined beyond a reasonable doubt that the president has committed treason a convoy of 10 to 12 HIGH ranking officers (13 killed at the Navy Yard) depart the Pentagon, accompanied by a large contingency of Military Police (Provost Marshals, NCIS agents) and all necessary armament and provisions to enter the grounds of the White House, by FORCE if necessary, and proceed to the location of the president and put him under arrest. Then, The Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff would advise the Speaker of The House, The President of the Senate, The Attorney General and the Secretary of State of their actions. Obama’s response to the threat of arrest was a coordinated assault against NCIS agents who uncovered the false flag plot against the United States and Provost Marshals who threatened to arrest Obama at the Washington DC Navy Yard.

rt_washington_navy_yard_shooting_2_ll_130916_16x9_9921

Have you wondered why not all of the names and the rank of those who were killed in the assault have been released? The White House (Obama) ordered their names and rank classified as it would raise alarm bells in Washington DC should the public know Joint Chiefs of Staff members, Provost Marshals and NCIS agents were targeted and killed for threatening to arrest Obama for treason. The White House is claiming that the names of those killed are being withheld pending next of kin notification.

On September 28, 2009 the History Channel released a movie titled “Day After Disaster“. The entire movie is about Washington DC being the target and victim of a nuclear detonation. The movie also features Obama talking about nuclear detonations in the U.S. Movie 0.50 time stamp – “One terrorist, one nuclear weapon could unleash massive destruction” ~ Obama says. Last year PRESS Core wrote an article titled “COG planning for and preparing Washington DC nuclear detonation false flag event.” after receiving information that September 30, 2012 was the day “Day after Disaster” was to executed in real-time. Obama’s planned false flag attack for September 30, 2012 was averted after the public was made aware of the false flag beginning August 18th, 2012.

Obama’s 9/11 anniversary false flag was thwarted when the Joint Chief of Staff and the Provost Marshals from the Washington DC Navy Yard confronted Obama and threatened to arrest him for treason for planning to detonate one or more nukes in the nation’s capitol – Washington DC.

bilde

Former Department of Homeland Security Secretary Janet Napolitano ABC News Aug 27, 2013: “A massive and “serious” cyber attack on the U.S. homeland is coming, and a natural disaster — the likes of which the nation has never seen — is also likely on its way.“

The only way anyone could know that there is “a natural disaster — the likes of which the nation has never seen — is also likely on its way” is if you are the one planning and preparing it.

“You also will have to prepare for the increasing likelihood of more weather-related events of a more severe nature as a result of climate change, and continue to build the capacity to respond to potential disasters in far-flung regions of the country occurring at the same time.

“You will need a large bottle of Advil,” Napolitano joked.

Fema regions

Don’t think the U.S. government is planning to detonate a nuke in Washington DC? They’ve already planned for it. DHS (illegal posse posse comitatus force) / FEMA Washington DC nuclear detonation scenario report –http://www.fas.org/irp/agency/dhs/fema/ncr.pdf complete with nuclear detonation maps, charts and fatality estimates. NCR stands for National Capital Region.

Why else would Department of Homeland Security Secretary Janet Napolitano suddenly resign her post (announced her resignation July 12, 2013) and leave Washington DC for California? Because while she was Department of Homeland Security Secretary Janet Napolitano planned for and prepared for a major Washington DC event. She got out of dodge before the “attack on the U.S. homeland is coming“.

Janet Napolitano’s resignation as Department of Homeland Security Secretary was effective … September 7, 2013 – just 4 days before the planned 9/11 anniversary nuclear device detonation false flag. Just before leaving her post Dyess Air Force base reportedly moved nuclear warheads to the East Coast of the United States in a secret transfer that had no paper trail. The Dyess Air Force Commander allegedly authorized unknown parties to transfer nuclear warheads to an unknown location on the U.S. East Coast, where the warheads would then be picked up and potentially utilized. Conspiracy?

Legal definition for conspiracy – An agreement between two or more persons to engage jointly in an unlawful or criminal act, or an act that is innocent in itself but becomes unlawful when done by the combination of actors.

A conspiracy is codified as a criminal offense. A conspiracy is not fiction, made up, make belief or theory. A conspiracy is an indictable offense wherein – two or more persons engage jointly in an unlawful or criminal act. The evidence reveals that Obama, the DHS, FEMA and other agencies of the United States are actively conspiring to levy war against the United States through a false flag – an unlawful or criminal act.


43 posted on 10/12/2013 8:41:31 AM PDT by SatinDoll (NATURAL BORN CITIZEN: BORN IN THE USA OF USA CITIZEN PARENTS)
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To: seeker41
7 generals + 4 recent (2 nuke+2 marine) & 17 nuke launch control officers11 generals and 17 officers total=28 total

Smells like political cleansing ala Hitler or Stalin. The question now remains as to what is happening in the lower officer ranks...................

44 posted on 10/12/2013 9:03:36 AM PDT by varon ( para bellum, remove Obama)
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To: AdmSmith; AnonymousConservative; Berosus; bigheadfred; Bockscar; cardinal4; ColdOne; ...

Thanks incredulous joe.
Maj. Gen. Michael Carey, a 35-year veteran... that it was linked to alcohol use... On Wednesday the Navy said Vice Adm. Tim Giardina, the second-in-charge at U.S. Strategic Command, was fired amid an investigation of gambling issues.
And yet, those who gambled with our future in the 2008 and 2012 elections will still be allowed to vote.


45 posted on 10/12/2013 9:55:04 AM PDT by SunkenCiv (It's no coincidence that some "conservatives" echo the hard left.)
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To: seeker41; All
Given recent events: only one at CIA, retired Army General Petraeus. How about anyone at NSA? How about IRS? State Department? DOJ? Didn't think so.
46 posted on 10/12/2013 9:55:12 AM PDT by PowderMonkey (WILL WORK FOR AMMO)
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To: SunkenCiv
I , personally, believed that the charges are trumped up. Obama is just putting his yes men/women who will do his bidding at the appropriate time. They could be true , but I doubt it.
47 posted on 10/12/2013 9:58:28 AM PDT by sport
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To: Wordkraft

The military is being purged of experienced leadership. Zero is trying to “coup-proof” himself.


I agree.


48 posted on 10/12/2013 10:57:52 AM PDT by laplata (Liberals don't get it .... their minds are diseased.)
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To: PowderMonkey; seeker41; incredulous joe; John W; AEMILIUS PAULUS; CodeToad; staytrue; johnny reb; ..
PowderMonkey :" Given recent events: only one at CIA, retired Army General Petraeus.
How about anyone at NSA? How about IRS? State Department? DOJ? Didn't think so."

EXACTLY TRUE !!
CIA : 1 ( David Patraeus , Director , alleged marital infidelity )
NSA : 0 < in-house investigation pending >
DHS : 0 (Janet Napolitano,Director, early retirement )
IRS : 0 < Congressional House Committee investigation pending >
State Dept : 0 < in-house investigation completed /"WHITEWASH" >
DOJ : 0 < several in-house investigations pending >
Air Force : 1 Major General( Michael Cary , ICBM Commander, alleged alcohol 10/11/13)
Navy : 1 Vice Admiral (Tim Giardina , second-in-charge,US Strategic Command,alleged gambling 10/11/13)
----------------------------------------------------------------------

7 generals + 4 recent (2 nuke+2 marine) & 17 nuke launch control officers
11 generals and 17 officers total=28 total
Smells like political cleansing ala Hitler or Stalin.
The question now remains as to what is happening in the lower officer ranks
And who / what are the replacements !!

49 posted on 10/12/2013 11:01:26 AM PDT by Tilted Irish Kilt (Enlightened statesmen will not always be at the helm. -- James Madison)
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To: jsanders2001

Exactly! bozo’s afraid he will go BOOM! I pray each day that one day he DOES go BOOM.


50 posted on 10/12/2013 11:01:40 AM PDT by itssme
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