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May this help put an end to those who come here and claim to like and admire Ted Cruz but go on to swear that he couldn't possibly be qualified to run for President.

If you think he doesn't know that he's talking about, yet he openly declares this (he has issued a statement through his senate office before now, saying the exact same thing), then to be consistent you have to think he is stupid or a liar.

Please.

Give it up.

Or at least admit that you are directly contradicting what Ted Cruz claims for himself.

And stop making unreasoned, hypocritical statements.

1 posted on 10/29/2013 9:02:51 AM PDT by txrangerette
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To: txrangerette

Cruz is certainly as eligible as the loser we have now.


2 posted on 10/29/2013 9:04:29 AM PDT by Venturer (Keep Obama and you aint seen nothing yet.)
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To: FReepers; Patriots; FRiends





TED CRUZ, COMPLETELY ELIGIBLE FOR POTUS!
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3 posted on 10/29/2013 9:05:31 AM PDT by onyx (Please Support Free Republic - Donate Monthly! If you want on Sarah Palin's Ping List, Let Me know!)
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To: CodeToad; Jim Robinson; All

Here it is from THE MAN himself...

Wishing a great day to all!

(Well, except for the misguided and the trolls)


5 posted on 10/29/2013 9:07:51 AM PDT by txrangerette ("...hold to the truth; speak without fear." (Glenn Beck))
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To: txrangerette

There won’t be any legal consequences.

Both him and Arnold can run and the voters will be the judge.

There are no precedents for the courts to step in.


7 posted on 10/29/2013 9:09:07 AM PDT by BarnacleCenturion
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To: txrangerette
May this help put an end to those who come here and claim to like and admire Ted Cruz but go on to swear that he couldn't possibly be qualified to run for President.

Good luck on that.

10 posted on 10/29/2013 9:12:30 AM PDT by DoodleDawg
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To: txrangerette
NATURAL BORN CITIZENDEFINED
T.J. McCann, III

This authoring involves no consideration whatsoever of the contentious “birth certificate”, as the contents of that document are entirely irrelevant to the final conclusion. This analysis examines the importance of historic context in considering the terms of qualification for the Office of President of the United States, resolving that Barack Obama is incapable of being a natural born citizen and is thereby forever ineligible to hold that Office, based on established fact.

Introduction:
The positive mandate in Article 2, Section 1, Clause 5, that “No person except a natural born Citizen,… shall be eligible to the Office of President” is neither irrelevant nor antiquated and originates from the core philosophy of the Declaration of Independence, and U.S. Constitution, and is of the very same origin as our “unalienable rights” as American citizens.

“Natural born citizen” is a known, static definition, derived from Natural Law,a term of art outside of any Positive Law, hence the reason it needs no definition within the Constitution. This Natural Law involves a “self-evident” status so fundamental to our “unalienable rights” and freedoms, that it is expressed in the very first sentence of the Declaration of Independence: When in the Course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, …

A “natural born citizen” is a “self-evident” status upon birth because that offspring could not possibly be a citizen of, and owe allegiance to, any other country or peoples. Natural Born incorporates all aspects of citizenship heritance at birth, including that conveyed by the soil (jus soli) and that conveyed by both parents ‟blood allegiance” (jus sanguinis).

“Natural Born Citizen”, Not “Citizen”
The requirement for President in Article II is not "citizen" nor “citizen at birth”, but rather“ natural born citizen". In Alexander Hamilton's first draft of Article II the requirement was indeed only "citizen" or more accurately citizen at birth ("born citizen"). However they did not go with Hamilton's early draft of Article II.

From the Yale Law Journal [Vol. 97: 881] referencing John Jay’s letter to George Washington leading to the inclusion of “natural born citizen” [8]:On June 18, a little over a month before Jay's letter, Alexander Hamilton submitted a "sketch of a plan of government which 'was meant only to give a more correct view of his ideas, and to suggest the amendments which he should probably propose ... in... future discussion.' "40 Article IX, section 1 of the sketch provided: "No person shall be eligible to the office of President of the United States unless he be now a Citizen of one of the States, or hereafter be born a Citizen of the United States.": "Hamilton's draft, which appears to be an early version of the natural-born citizen clause, contains two distinct ideas: first, that those currently citizens will not be excluded from presidential eligibility, and second, that the President must be born a citizen. What actually transpired over this change in wording , replacing “born a citizen” with“ natural born citizen”, was that the President was no longer to be elected by Congress, but rather by the people, and therefore the office required more stringent safeties regarding the allegiance of the office holder.[12]By selection among the duly qualified and elected Congress, a certain degree of security was established for the office of President. However in transferring the responsibility to the citizens, a more stringent requirement was needed to ensure that any occupant of the Office would have allegiance to Constitutional principle sand American society. Especially given this draft change, it is clearly wrong to equate "natural born citizen" with anyone who is a citizen at birth. Similarly, it is improper to ignore the word "natural" in the phrase "natural born citizen" simply because one has no innate understanding of the meaning of "natural". Again, "natural" in "natural born citizen", in the language of our founding documents and principles, is a “self-evident” status upon birth, owing no allegiance to any other country, and thereby a full participant in this society. Given that the requirements for the Office of President have long been inscribed on parchment, since the founding of this country, it would be unreasonable to assume that the definition of "natural born citizen" was unknown or vague. This same Yale Law Journal article [Vol. 97: 881] recognizes that the only reasonable interpretation of “natural born citizen” would be that held by the founders at the time of ratifying the Constitution, and that this meaning was “clear.”[8]: "Constitutional scholars have traditionally approached the uncertainty surrounding the meaning of the natural-born citizen clause by inquiring into the specific meaningof the term "natural born" at the time of the Constitutional Convention. They conclude that a class of citizens should be considered natural born today only if they ould have been considered natural-born citizens under the law in effect at the time of the framing of the Constitution"(see footnote 8)

8. These writers assume that the phrase "natural born citizen" was a term of art during the preconstitutional period since the phrase is not defined in either the Constitution or the records of the Constitutional Convention. See Gordon, supra note2, at 2 ("The only explanation for the use of this term is the apparent belief of the Framers that its connotation was clear."); These two conclusions together indicate that 'scholars' believe that the one interpretation of "natural born citizen" by the founders from 200+ years ago remains intact, discernable, and the only valid interpretation today.

Natural Born Citizen vs. British “Common Law” Natural Born Subject:
Many reference British Common Law in search for a definitive answer as to the meaning of natural born, and resolve, by that Common Law, the definition of natural born to result from birth on the native soil of a country. Justice Gray does a thorough job of delving into British history in the landmark case of U.S. vs. Wong Kim Ark, 169 U.S. 649 (1898), even going back to Lord Coke and Calvin’s case (1608), some 180 years before this nation’s founding ,and preceding the Ark decision by 290 years.

However, in truth, Lord Coke’s decision in Calvin’s case is as fundamentally alien to these United States’ founding principles as the rest of British Common Law citizenship. Calvin’s case was landmark in its day, and the early modern common-law mind, for being the first to articulate a theoretical basis for territorial birthright citizenship. Calvin’s Case was not only influential in establishing the citizenship right of American colonials, but also was much later argued as the basis common-law rule for U.S. birthright citizenship. Calvin's Case is the earliest, most influential theoretical articulation by an English court of what came to be the common-law rule that a person's status was vested at birth, and based upon place of birth. .[7] However this recognition of British common law also ignores the inherent conflicts with the fundamental tenets of our Constitution, conflicts so profound philosophically that they were causal in the Revolutionary War and War of 1812. In Lord Coke’s decision, the law of the Creator is conflated with the law of England and being lain down via edict to the common man from that divine Crown through the judiciary. Even as described by Justice Gray in Wong Kim Ark, the Coke decision involves feudal concepts of “‘ligealty,’ ‘obedience,’ ‘faith,’ or ‘power’ of the ‘King’”.[11]

This feudal oblige and extension of the dominion of the Crown to ANY territory held by the King, even making “natural born subjects” of those born in America, contributed to British settlers leaving Britain in the first place and ultimately became a primary factor in the "Declaration of Independence", with colonists declaring themselves free of such an involuntary burden of the Crown while having no protection and no representation. In 1765 the British Jurist William Blackstone recognized the mandate of the Crown having changed the inherent meaning of "natural-born Subject", progressively over time, to be anyone born in British territory, regardless of the parents' allegiance or citizenship. Initially a child was born a natural-born subject if born on British soil, even if the child's parents were aliens. However, Blackstone later wrote in his 1765 Commentaries, the following[2]1:To encourage also foreign commerce, it was enacted by statute 25 Edw. III. st. 2. That all children born abroad, provided both their parents were at the time of the birth in allegiance to the king, and the mother had passed the seas by her husband's consent ,might inherit as if born in England: and accordingly it hath been so adjudged in behalf of merchants. But by several more modern statutes these restrictions are still farther taken off: so that all children, born out of the king's ligeance, whose fathers were natural-born subjects, are now natural-born subjects themselves, to all intents and purposes, without any exception; unless their said fathers were attainted, or banished beyond sea, for high treason; or were then in the service of a prince at enmity with Great Britain. This passage indicates that even those not born on British territory are to be thenceforth considered "natural born" because of blood lineage no less, and for the purpose of trade (aswell as the Treasury), showing that this is not a static understanding of "natural born", but one evolved over time and by “executive” mandate of the Crown – hardly any sort of “common law.”5

What Gray has represented as British “common law” natural born subject, was not static and was the evolution of Crown dictate over time, expressed in statutory law. This statutory definition is far removed from any sort of natural, “self-evident‟ term employed by the United States in its Constitution. Only 30 years prior to Blackstone’s writings, in 1736, British scholar Matthew Bacon recognized the fundamental meaning of "natural-born Subject" to be: "All those are natural-born Subjects whose Parents, at the Time of their Birth, were under the actual Obedience of our King, and whose Place of Birth was within his dominions." (Matthew Bacon, A New Abridgement of the Law, 1736, Vol 1, pg 77)2

Not only does this indicate that the place of birth must be within the "dominion" (British territory) itself, but it also indicates that the parents must be under the “actual obedience” of the King. The emphasis on “actual Obedience” seems to strongly differentiate that from a presumed obedience resulting from mere happenstance of birth within the dominion. Given this, those who had foreign allegiance did not give birth on British soil to British natural born subjects. This is definition by Bacon is the same as our own “Natural Law” Definition today, involving (1) the allegiance (citizenship) of both parents and (2) birth within the U.S. territory (dominion).

In Gray’s majority opinion for Wong Kim Ark, Gray makes two references to natural born citizen which directly conflict with his British common law approach. The first is a reference to Justice Waite’s opinion from Minor vs. Happersett[6], in which Waite refers to a Vattel’s definition of natural born citizen as birth to two citizen parents on country’s soil[10]. In the second, Justice Gray quotes from a pamphlet entitled “Alienigenae of the United States”, by Horace Binney, which used the term "natural born" in connection with a child of a citizen, but not in connection with a child of an alien parent. :The right of citizenship never descends in the legal sense, either by the common law or under the common naturalization acts. It is incident to birth in the country, or it is given personally by statute. The child of an alien, if born in the country, is as much a citizen as the natural born child of a citizen, and by operation of the same principle. (Binney’s statement, as cited by Gray U.S. v. Wong Kim Ark (1898)[11]) While Binney references both children as citizens, only the child born of a citizen is referenced as "natural born".

Justice Gray’s articulation of British Common Law in Wong Kim Ark regarding U.S. citizenship should be considered nothing short of an abomination, because it is truly runs contrary to the very origins and hard-won principles of this country. While Gray’s argument in Wong Kim Ark has had deleterious effect on citizenship, the case did not affect natural born citizen because Gray never pronounced that a natural born citizen was equivalent to a natural born Subject, despite obviously desiring to do so, and Gray never at all undermined 6 the definition provided by Justice Waite from Minor vs. Happersett. While Wong Kim Ark was pronounced a citizen of the United States, Ark was never declared to be a natural born citizen of the United States. George Mason, called the "Father of the Bill of Rights" and considered one of the "Founding Fathers" of the United States, is widely quoted as saying: The common law of England is not the common law of these states. (Debate in Virginia Ratifying Convention, 19 June 1788) More recently Justice Antonin Scalia confirmed the irrelevancy of British Common Law: The common law is gone. The federal courts never applied the common law and even in the state courts it's codified now. (Audio/Video: Justice Scalia speech, Nov 22, 2008)

Citizen vs. Subject:
Those who argue that meaning of “natural born citizen” can be resolved by looking to British common law “natural born Subject” ignore the vast difference between Citizen and Subject. AMichigan Law Review article considers the profound difference between Citizen and Subject[9]: So far we have assumed that the conventional meaning of “natural born citizen” for those learned in the law in the eighteenth century was equivalent to the meaning of “natural born subject” in nineteenth century English law. But is this assumption correct? Does the substitution of the term “citizen” for “subject” alter the meaning of the phrase? And if those learned in the law did recognize a difference, what implications does that have for the meaning of the natural born citizen clause? The distinction between citizens and subjects is reflected in Chief Justice John Jay’s opinion in Chisholm v. Georgia, the first great constitutional case decided after the ratification of the Constitution of 1789: “[A]t the Revolution, the sovereignty devolved on the people; and they are truly the sovereigns of the country, but they are sovereigns without subjects. . . .”

Justice James Wilson confirmed Jay’s articulation of the opposition between subjects and citizens. The term “citizen” reflects the notion that individual citizens are the soil, and via “blood” heritance from the parents. While both British common law “natural born subject” and American “natural born citizen” might be said to involve “birthright” citizenship, the former involves an unequal obligation to the Crown and the latter involves natural, self-evident recognition of at-birth conditions of the citizen, with that citizen being sovereign, and a full member of American society having no allegiance to any other society.

Supreme Court Opinion:
While there are deviations from the Natural Law definition of “natural born”, these deviations have generally been asserted on the state rather than federal level and part of court “obiter dicta” , offered without any supporting legal argument. Both British common law and American statutory history involve such assertions, yet these do not change the fundamental meaning of “natural born”, as it is exerting statutory definition on a term outside of Positive Law, when it is resolved by natural, self-evident means.

Not surprisingly the first 100+ years of this country’s history are spanned by Supreme Court opinions clearly indicating the definition of natural born citizen, and repeatedly indicating the same reference consulted by our founders as they authored the Constitution in Carpenter's Hall, that reference being Emmerich de Vattel's "Law of Nations".

1814 The Venus, 12 U.S. (8 Cranch) 253, 289 (1814) (Marshall, C.J., concurring) (cites Vattel’s definition of natural born citizens);

1830 Shanks vs. Dupont, 28 U.S. 242, 245 (1830) (same definition without citing Vattel);

1875 Minor vs. Happersett, 88 U.S. 162, 167-68 (1875) (same definition without citing Vattel);

1879 Ex parte Reynolds, 1879, 5 Dill., 394, 402 (same definition and cites Vattel);

1890 United States vs. Ward, 42 F.320 (C.C.S.D. Cal. 1890) (same definition and cites Vattel);

1898 U.S. vs. Wong Kim Ark, 169 U.S. 649 (1898) (same definition and C.J, Fuller’s dissent confirming Vattel’s definition of a “natural born Citizen” );

1899 Keith vs. U.S., 8 Okla. 446; 58 P. 507 (Okla. 1899) (common law rule that the offspring of free persons followed the condition of the father was applied to determine the citizenship status of a child);
13 posted on 10/29/2013 9:15:38 AM PDT by DustyMoment (Congress - another name for the American politburo!!)
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To: txrangerette

Let’s all go beat a dead horse.


16 posted on 10/29/2013 9:18:42 AM PDT by Cowboy Bob (They are called "Liberals" because the word "parasite" was already taken.)
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To: txrangerette

Isn’t it funny that the press focuses on Cruz like that, yet completely ignore Zero and his foreign born British Citizen father?


20 posted on 10/29/2013 9:20:55 AM PDT by Darksheare (Try my coffee, first one's free..... Even robots will kill for it!)
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To: txrangerette
As time goes on I develop more and more respect for Cruz.However,this is a Constitutional issue that will,for better or for worse,be settled by nine individuals sitting in DC...at least four of whom are filthy,worthless,despicable Maoists...and the jury,if you will,is still out on two others.
31 posted on 10/29/2013 9:34:31 AM PDT by Gay State Conservative (Osama Obama Care: A Religion That Will Have You On Your Knees!)
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To: txrangerette
"May this help put an end to those who come here and claim to like and admire Ted Cruz but go on to swear that he couldn't possibly be qualified to run for President."

Some folks will probably never accept this fact. Doesn't change the truth, though....a person can be either a naturalized citizen or a citizen at birth who doesn't need to be naturalized. Cruz is the latter. Now when do we start bugging him to run for president? ;)

40 posted on 10/29/2013 9:39:15 AM PDT by CatherineofAragon ((Support Christian white males----the architects of the jewel known as Western Civilization.))
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To: txrangerette

Ted will run and even dirty harry and nazi piglosi can’t stop him.


47 posted on 10/29/2013 9:46:59 AM PDT by LibLieSlayer (FROM MY COLD, DEAD HANDS! BETTER DEAD THAN RED!)
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To: txrangerette; gruffwolf; Katarina; sjneuf; Graewoulf; lonevoice; americas.best.days...; GregoTX; ...

Ted Cruz Ping!

If you want on/off this ping list, please let me know.

Please beware, this is a high-volume ping list!


50 posted on 10/29/2013 9:49:48 AM PDT by SoConPubbie (Mitt and Obama: They're the same poison, just a different potency)
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To: txrangerette

There are going to be RINOs passing themselves off as constitutional conservatives who work very hard at keeping conservatives out of power. They’re probably the same ones who aren’t talking about needing to cut into the hispanic vote, like they were just a few months ago.


51 posted on 10/29/2013 9:50:35 AM PDT by grania
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To: txrangerette

Of course he is a citizen by birth. The legal question is whether that is the same thing as “natural born citizen”. It’s a legal question we ALL deserve to get an answer to. It would not be fair to Ted Cruz to run and win the Presidency and then have a SCOTUS with Obama appointees rule that he is not eligible. Every candidate and every voter deserves to have a set-in-stone, legally locked-down answer to the question BEFORE running or voting.

That’s all I’m saying, and it’s all I’ve ever said about that. It’s what I said at a committee hearing at the Nebraska legislature. We all deserve answers, and the judicial system is ROBBING us of that right, by deflecting the cases with the excuse that it’s nobody’s business.

Everybody has their opinion of what is meant by the term, but what we ALL need is a SCOTUS decision. BEFORE we spend our energy, money, and votes. That is not too much to ask, and the courts have abdicated their responsibility by refusing to give us that answer.

Everybody agree?


55 posted on 10/29/2013 9:57:40 AM PDT by butterdezillion (Free online faxing at http://faxzero.com/ Fax all your elected officials. Make DC listen.)
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To: txrangerette
Please. Give it up.

Let people talk. That's the only path to understanding.

The more you and others try to shut down discussion, the less people are going to arrive at the same conclusions you have.

For my part, I believe that Ted Cruz is exactly the sort of citizen the Framers had in mind when they crafted the restrictive eligibility requirements for the office of President. I believe he's cut from as good a stock as any of them were, and is eminently qualified to be our CIC.

But --- it took listening to, and reading the well crafted arguments of others on this board for me to logically work my way to that eureka conclusion.

Don't stop now. You're helping others to get to that same place, but you've got to be willing to let them talk too.

56 posted on 10/29/2013 9:58:37 AM PDT by Windflier (To anger a conservative, tell him a lie. To anger a liberal, tell him the truth.)
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To: txrangerette
....And stop making unreasoned, hypocritical statements.

Amen!

65 posted on 10/29/2013 10:17:05 AM PDT by yoe ( Defund Obamacare now — or risk voter backlash in 2014)
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To: txrangerette

What strikes me in Cruz’s statement about eligibility is that he claims such on only his mother’s citizenship. This is like saying a father has no bearing as to birth status. I don’t believe a father can be taken out of the birth status. Obama has cleverly played the system in this regard as to his eligibility. I believe the Founders as men of the world were aware of possible situations involving parentage and they intended a requirement as to both parents being eligible citizens, not a take your choice of which parent best fits your desires. That is why in cases cited it is parentS not either or.


69 posted on 10/29/2013 10:22:20 AM PDT by noinfringers2
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To: txrangerette

Works for me! Go Cruz missile!


80 posted on 10/29/2013 10:47:04 AM PDT by LUV W (All my heroes wear camos! Thank you David, Michael, Chris Txradioguy, JJ, CMS, & ALL of you heroes!)
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To: txrangerette

It’s not about whether he is or isn’t so much as that *any time at all* is dedicated to discussing/explaining it. This will be like gum on the sole of a shoe. It’s truly unfortunate. And not fair.


87 posted on 10/29/2013 10:56:26 AM PDT by kabumpo (Kabumpo)
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To: txrangerette

Cruz WAS a US citizen at birth. No controversy, except that ginned up by those who fear him. Bob


108 posted on 10/29/2013 11:33:24 AM PDT by alstewartfan ("Old admirals who feel the wind Are never put to sea." Al Stewart)
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