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More Taxpayers Are Abandoning the U.S.
The Wall Street Journal ^ | Nov 14, 2013 | By Laura Saunders

Posted on 11/15/2013 7:34:55 AM PST by YankeeReb

Edited on 11/15/2013 10:38:37 AM PST by Admin Moderator. [history]

This year will set a record for expatriations by U.S. taxpayers, with at least a 33% increase from the previous high in 2011.

The Treasury Department published the names of 560 people who either were U.S. citizens renouncing their citizenship or long-term residents who turned in their green cards during the third quarter.


(Excerpt) Read more at finance.yahoo.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Foreign Affairs; Front Page News; Government; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: taxes
"Current or anticipated changes in tax law and enforcement are driving this increase."

Read that as
New Taxes brought about by 0bamacare

1 posted on 11/15/2013 7:34:55 AM PST by YankeeReb
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To: YankeeReb

Plenty of reasons: Increasing taxes, increasing regulation, decreasing property rights, and decreasing benefits to being a citizen. Worldwide taxation—a policy that is globally almost unique. Unequal treatment under the law—e.g., alien traffic violators are often just let go—citizens are fined.


2 posted on 11/15/2013 7:42:44 AM PST by Pearls Before Swine
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To: YankeeReb

Still fewer than three thousand, so far.

But three thousand with a relatively high income level, therefore taxes would be onerous and perceived as unfair by those upon whom it is accessed.

Years ago, there were many who fled the United States, but that was to avoid serving in the military to fight a war they thought unjust. Or they were just chicken.

And of course, there is flight all the time to avoid prosecution. Citizenship may or may not be a determining factor.


3 posted on 11/15/2013 7:46:42 AM PST by alloysteel (Men may not always be capable of evil, but they are always capable of incompetence.)
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To: YankeeReb

http://pro.stansberryresearch.com/1310PSIEANEW/PPSIPB04/


4 posted on 11/15/2013 7:51:10 AM PST by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: YankeeReb

New taxes are a part of the problem. The Marxist dictatorship replacing the Constitution and destroying our republic is the over-arching problem facing American citizens. Fear and dread are replacing traditional American confidence and optimism.


5 posted on 11/15/2013 8:02:24 AM PST by July4
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To: Pearls Before Swine

Here’s the problem....having lived in Germany for twenty-odd years, I’ve come to view both sides of the mess.

Both the US and the Germans want to tax the US guy sitting in Germany. The Germans want the income earned in Germany, along with stock sales in the US, and all the various little items of US residency. The US wants all the German income, the sale of German property, etc, etc.

You end up with some high-priced US accountant and a high-priced German accountant, and nothing ever comes to a clean or happy ending. You feel ripped off by the American government for grabbing money that was entirely earned beyond their borders.

If you ran a successful bar in Frankfurt.....IRS wants part of that income. If you had part-ownership in some Heidelberg hotel....same deal.

The regulations? They get deeper each single year. Both the German and American tax guys are idiots at this whole thing...never grasping the pains involved or just how much paperwork is generated.

In the end, an American will evaluate the mess, and just admit he can’t do it anymore. He’s a success because his American background, ideas, and tendency to be aggressive. Sadly, the US government thinks they’ve got a line on all that success, and the German IRS thinks the same thing.

I’ll predict in ten years....that half the Americans living in Germany and running businesses....will give up. It’s a sad part about the mess....being successful....gets you no real leverage.


6 posted on 11/15/2013 8:05:01 AM PST by pepsionice
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To: pepsionice

My son has lived in London for well over twenty years and he pays British income tax and United States income tax. He has an accountant to figure it out every year.


7 posted on 11/15/2013 8:48:27 AM PST by Marcella ((Prepping can save your life today. I am a Christian, not a Muslim.))
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To: YankeeReb

My wife and I are looking at Costa Rico, possibly Belize or Spain. I know these are probably all socialist countries. But at least they are out in the open and are trying to lure wealthier US retirees. As much as I have loved this country, It just sickens us to see the societal deterioration and property confiscation brought on by liberals!


8 posted on 11/15/2013 8:49:54 AM PST by 2nd Amendment (Proud member of the 48% . . giver not a taker)
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To: 2nd Amendment
You're gonna need to change that screen name :-(
9 posted on 11/15/2013 8:54:07 AM PST by liberalh8ter (The only difference between flash mob 'urban yutes' and U.S. politicians is the hoodies.)
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To: YankeeReb

these are just the ones they know about.
Many simply went to a different country, and stopped reporting their income to the IRS. So long as decent revenue is being generated for the host country, no big deal is made out of it. In reality, the IRS has literally no way of finding these people without help from the host country.

And I image the more this administration pisses off the rest of the world, G8 and G20 summits (where these things are worked out) will become more hostile.


10 posted on 11/15/2013 8:54:11 AM PST by jimjohn
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To: liberalh8ter

Yes, I know. Most countries confiscate your guns and then return some of them to you after an exhausting examination process. So what’s your suggestion? Where do we go after we have 8 years of Hillary and 90% of the people on welfare? I’m too old to farm the Ukraine and I despise anyone or anything that comes out of the D.C. Beltway. If this country woke up and eliminated the 5-10% Democrat fraud and elected Ted Cruz or Sarah, I’d stay!


11 posted on 11/15/2013 8:59:28 AM PST by 2nd Amendment (Proud member of the 48% . . giver not a taker)
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To: 2nd Amendment
I hear you. I wanted to get the heck out of Dodge 3 years ago but it's not possible. Instead, I try and educate everyone I can - even if they resist - as to why they need to turn away from the Utopian pipe dream. I figure maybe, just maybe, my words will ring true at some point in their life, and they'll wise up.
12 posted on 11/15/2013 9:18:46 AM PST by liberalh8ter (The only difference between flash mob 'urban yutes' and U.S. politicians is the hoodies.)
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To: liberalh8ter

This country proves the Santayana quote “ Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it” When has liberalism or socialism EVER worked. Has the “New Deal”of Roosevelt Ot the “Great Society” of Johnson ever worked? Was Communism successful anywhere? Why did it need coercion to survive. Why do we keep electing socialist demagogues who are always wrong about history and economics? What produced blue state morons? Public Schools, rejection of the God of the Universe, Moral implosions, etc? After the great sacrifices of the “Greatest Generation” we’ve become a dysfunctional nation of whiners and Kim Kardashion wannabees. My only exemption to this bleak surmisal is our Brave soldiers in uniform, who are still trying to create a livable future for their children. Thanks Free Republic for letting me rant. Now I’ve got to get my lever action and go deerhunting!


13 posted on 11/15/2013 9:29:25 AM PST by 2nd Amendment (Proud member of the 48% . . giver not a taker)
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To: 2nd Amendment
Amen! Bag a big one!
14 posted on 11/15/2013 9:34:10 AM PST by liberalh8ter (The only difference between flash mob 'urban yutes' and U.S. politicians is the hoodies.)
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To: pepsionice

I’ve been on the foreign side as well. When “over there” I earned income that was taxed at a reduced rate so I have money to invest in foreign accounts. Uncle Sam wants full income taxes on any earned income and any income not previously reported. The IRS has browbeat most foreign nations and banks into providing reports on American income and holdings. However, not all foreign banks or governments participate. I know many people in my situation where bringing any money into the US system in any way results in heavy taxes so we leave the money overseas. I won’t bring it here even if I can escape taxes as any investing is then taxed heavily. Foreign governments appreciate our money and my taxes on anything taken out over there is about 5%. Anything taken out and brought over here is taxed and has additional transfer fees applied. My last transfer about 20 years ago was taxed at about 65% after all was said and done. Screw that. My money stays over there until I need to cash out.


15 posted on 11/15/2013 9:46:36 AM PST by CodeToad (When ignorance rules a person's decision they are resorting to superstition.)
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To: alloysteel

Just for comparison, we naturalize about 680,000 citizens a year.


16 posted on 11/15/2013 10:24:22 AM PST by oincobx
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To: pepsionice

About an hour ago a friend of mine from Germany told me he’s going back to Germany before the end of the month to get away from US tax complications. Your observations here are very similar to his...and he’s from Mannheim which is right near Heidelberg!


17 posted on 11/15/2013 10:25:14 AM PST by MeganC (Support Matt Bevin to oust Mitch McConnell! https://mattbevin.com/)
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To: 2nd Amendment
Belize and Costa Rico both have a lot of crime....be careful where you jump....

Spain sounds nice, but do you have children?...grandchildren?...are you rich enough to fly back and forth to see them?...

all of us might just have to get off the grid......have little actual income, and live off savings and investments and the underground economy....

18 posted on 11/15/2013 10:37:23 AM PST by cherry (.in the time of universal deceit, telling the truth is revolutionary.....)
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To: YankeeReb

does the article mention Tina Turner?


19 posted on 11/15/2013 10:38:19 AM PST by GeronL (Extra Large Cheesy Over-Stuffed Hobbit)
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To: liberalh8ter

I think we are going to need to create a real black market economy soon


20 posted on 11/15/2013 10:39:30 AM PST by GeronL (Extra Large Cheesy Over-Stuffed Hobbit)
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To: pepsionice
"I’ll predict in ten years....that half the Americans living in Germany and running businesses....will give up. It’s a sad part about the mess....being successful....gets you no real leverage."

Give up in the sense of renouncing US citizenship, or stop running businesses?

21 posted on 11/15/2013 10:42:54 AM PST by Truth29
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To: GeronL
Honestly, I believe it's going to come down to a barter system; at least for a while.
22 posted on 11/15/2013 10:44:06 AM PST by liberalh8ter (The only difference between flash mob 'urban yutes' and U.S. politicians is the hoodies.)
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To: Pearls Before Swine

it is because EVERYTHING “President” Muhammad Al-Obama DOES is illegal.


23 posted on 11/15/2013 10:48:31 AM PST by 2harddrive
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To: cherry

Living off the grid and bartering are excellent ideas. Anything, legally, you can do to keep the politician’s dirty, grubbing hands from confiscating your private property is desirable. Remember, a socialist gov’t only sees successful people as a source of revenue to support their grovelling voter base! Very, Very, few taxes, or laws are ever rescinded.
The typical American is so dumb that they don’t realize the difference between gross pay and take home pay. They don’t even recognize the thousands of hidden taxes that politicians have secretly concealed in the tax code.


24 posted on 11/15/2013 10:48:34 AM PST by 2nd Amendment (Proud member of the 48% . . giver not a taker)
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To: liberalh8ter

Yes it is


25 posted on 11/15/2013 10:57:24 AM PST by GeronL (Extra Large Cheesy Over-Stuffed Hobbit)
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To: Pearls Before Swine

I talked about this with my Canadian GF and it’s the same in canada except for the “we’ll tax your ass out if you are out of the country”. They kill you with taxes over there but it’s not as draconian as overseas revenue here. That’s why she wont apply for US citizenship. (and because Romney lost too)


26 posted on 11/15/2013 11:29:54 AM PST by max americana (fired liberals in our company last election, and I laughed while they cried (true story))
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To: max americana

Here’s another good reason: She can have an overseas bank account if she wants one.

In the US, it’s bad enough that you have to report all of them over $10,000. But recently, almost any reputable foreign bank refuses you as a client if you are an American citizen because US pressure on foreign banks has become so onerous. The US has destroyed banking privacy for its citizens. The government wants to know—and can easily know—everything. You can be destroyed at a moment’s notice by a court order.


27 posted on 11/15/2013 12:00:34 PM PST by Pearls Before Swine
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To: YankeeReb

That sucks.

Most of those people worked really hard raising those taxes. :(


28 posted on 11/15/2013 1:24:25 PM PST by Tzimisce
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To: max americana

Yep. Permanent residents from Canada are double taxed here.


29 posted on 11/15/2013 1:24:52 PM PST by familyop (We Baby Boomers are croaking in an avalanche of corruption smelled around the planet.)
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To: All

“The Treasury Department published the names...”

Hmmmmmm...

Almost like they were crawling over themselves to do so to embarrass someone, or something...

But hey, they didn’t make the environment so toxic that it forces people to do things like this...


30 posted on 11/15/2013 1:35:30 PM PST by stevie_d_64 (It's not the color of one's skin that offends people...it's how thin it is.)
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To: 2nd Amendment

Just wait till that additional One Trillion dollar marker comes home to roost on Jan. 1, 2014...

All of our taxes, not just the people making that arbitrary number of $250K a year, are going to get screwed and tattoo’d...

Happy friggin’ new year!!!


31 posted on 11/15/2013 1:40:51 PM PST by stevie_d_64 (It's not the color of one's skin that offends people...it's how thin it is.)
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To: All

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/3091385/posts

For those wondering...

It was actually Three Trillion, but hey, whose counting right???


32 posted on 11/15/2013 1:43:45 PM PST by stevie_d_64 (It's not the color of one's skin that offends people...it's how thin it is.)
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To: GeronL

“I think we are going to need to create a real black market economy soon”

It’s already here.


33 posted on 11/15/2013 1:55:27 PM PST by headstamp 2 (What would Scooby do?)
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To: YankeeReb

I’m retirement age.

I’ve been thinking seriously of cashing out my investments and moving to one of the freer South American countries, like Chile, which we helped to make free a long time ago.


34 posted on 11/15/2013 1:58:57 PM PST by Westbrook ()Children do not divide your love, they multiply it.)
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To: familyop

At least she gets a GST check from the gubmint’ over there 4 times in a year. ;)


35 posted on 11/15/2013 2:27:42 PM PST by max americana (fired liberals in our company last election, and I laughed while they cried (true story))
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To: stevie_d_64

Three trillion here, three trillion there. After awhile we’re talking some real money!


36 posted on 11/15/2013 3:08:16 PM PST by RKBA Democrat ( There is no worst president but owebama, and valerie jarrett is his prophet.)
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To: 2nd Amendment

Hey, the “socialist” countries in Central and South America have worked all the kinks out.


37 posted on 11/15/2013 3:30:27 PM PST by VerySadAmerican (".....Barrack, and the horse Mohammed rode in on.")
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To: alloysteel

For right now, its relatively few people. And it’ll probably stay that way for awhile. The problem is that within the next 20 years or so, that trickle will become a torrent. And the strange thing is it won’t be because of abysmal US policies so much as other countries that will be looking to increase their populations.

There is a birth dearth going on in most of the western world. At a certain point, a lot of those countries are going to need to import people to keep their economies afloat. So. Let’s say that you’re country X. Your population is aging. Your birth rate is in the toilet. Your choices are to import unskilled adherents of the religion of peace, commit demographic suicide, or import well educated Americans and Canadians. Maybe some of those Full Quiver families who think having 20 kids is really cool.

What would you do? Bring in people from the US? Offer them a tax deal and a gun permit? Or do you bring in the hordes from goatherdistan? Or disappear because your population is dying of old age? Its a pretty simple choice. And as economies outside the US start doing better, you can expect to see a lot more countries competing for the citizens they want.


38 posted on 11/15/2013 3:35:14 PM PST by RKBA Democrat ( There is no worst president but owebama, and valerie jarrett is his prophet.)
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To: YankeeReb

The antique cruising sailboat I`m slowly getting into shape is my “fan plan”. I thought I did well a few years ago to get it with a running diesel one third of blue book, but today I could get the same vessel for less than half what I paid.


39 posted on 11/15/2013 4:00:57 PM PST by Anton.Rutter
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To: YankeeReb

“More Taxpayers are GOING GALT”

Fixed it.


40 posted on 11/15/2013 5:30:18 PM PST by RWB Patriot ("My ability is a value that must be purchased and I don't recognize anyone's need as a claim on me.")
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To: cherry

Costa Rico? It’s actually Costa Rica....Rhymes with that other Obanana republic, “Amer Rica”...


41 posted on 11/15/2013 8:09:21 PM PST by FDNYRHEROES (It's 3 AM. Let me sleep on it. I'll get back to you in 16 hours.)
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To: RKBA Democrat; MeganC
There is a birth dearth going on in most of the western world. At a certain point, a lot of those countries are going to need to import people to keep their economies afloat. So. Let’s say that you’re country X. Your population is aging. Your birth rate is in the toilet. Your choices are to import unskilled adherents of the religion of peace, commit demographic suicide, or import well educated Americans and Canadians. Maybe some of those Full Quiver families who think having 20 kids is really cool.

VERY interesting speculation RKBA.

I suspect that if any country relaxed their gun laws you just might see just that, I know that would be a huge hurtle for me. I mean can you name any other more Gun-Friendly Country than the U.S.A.? (no Switzerland doesn't count) I mean walk into Cabela's Buy one and waltz back out, no bother, no waiting.

Like Buying a Snow Blower.

Also Families who have lots of Kids are going to stand out. And if the US goes the way of Red China One Child Policy (the Uber Liberals just salivate at that idea) than you know there WILL be an exodus of Quiverfull Families.

42 posted on 11/15/2013 8:42:52 PM PST by KC_Lion (Build the America you want to live in at your address, and keep looking up.-Sarah Palin)
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To: oincobx
Just for comparison, we naturalize about 680,000 citizens a year.

Yes, but we are naturalizing tax transfer recipients while we are expatriating highest bracket tax payers.

43 posted on 11/16/2013 10:59:46 AM PST by VRWCmember
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To: KC_Lion

“VERY interesting speculation RKBA.”

Thanks, but it’s not really speculation. There is a growing market in countries selling citizenship. Some time ago, it was extremely expensive if you were, say, a multimillionaire who wanted citizenship in an EU country. The prices are going down and it’s becoming something that the moderately well off can do if they so choose. It’s not much of a leap for those countries to start seeking out business owners, young families, or people with valuable skills.

While that course of action isn’t attractive to me, there are some who would see it otherwise.

“I suspect that if any country relaxed their gun laws you just might see just that, I know that would be a huge hurdle for me. I mean can you name any other more Gun-Friendly Country than the U.S.A.?”

The US has about the best. Switzerland is of course good, other than that you’re talking mideast countries if you want something like the US when it comes to firearms ownership. The Czech republic isn’t too bad, but nothing like the US.

Again, though, RKBA is not big of a deal for a lot of people. And with some pessimism I have to ask: how long will our liberty in that respect continue? We’re probably losing the long term demographic battle when it comes to RKBA in the US.


44 posted on 11/16/2013 4:24:33 PM PST by RKBA Democrat ( There is no worst president but owebama, and valerie jarrett is his prophet.)
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To: cherry

>>>Spain sounds nice, but do you have children?<<<

Spanish IRS is not less anal. They are broken to a bone, and close to go full communist in no time.


45 posted on 11/19/2013 9:25:24 AM PST by cunning_fish
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