Skip to comments.Pope attacks mega-salaries and wealth gap in peace message
Posted on 12/12/2013 7:11:26 AM PST by what's up
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>> Isnt it possible that what it says is, every person, especially if one is a Christian, but at least if one considers oneself moral or caring, should not horde ones possessions but rather always wish to first share it with others who are in need? <<
The second commandment.
Love thy neighbor as thy self.
I understand Economics enough to understand that without preservation of the middle class capitalism cannot survive. I also understand that unless individual and small businesses can thrive and grow there’s going to be a lack of opportunities to move ahead.
“Moreover, if on the one hand we are seeing a reduction in absolute poverty, on the other hand we cannot fail to recognize that there is a serious rise in relative poverty, that is, instances of inequality between people and groups who live together in particular regions or in a determined historical-cultural context. In this sense, effective policies are needed to promote the principle offraternity, securing for people who are equal in dignity and in fundamental rights access to capital, services, educational resources, healthcare and technology so that every person has the opportunity to express and realize his or her life project and can develop fully as a person.
One also sees the need for policies which can lighten an excessive imbalance between incomes. We must not forget the Churchs teaching on the so-called social mortgage, which holds that although it is lawful, as Saint Thomas Aquinas says, and indeed necessary “that people have ownership of goods”,12 insofar as their use is concerned, “they possess them as not just their own, but common to others as well, in the sense that they can benefit others as well as themselves”.13...
...For this reason, I appeal forcefully to all those who sow violence and death by force of arms: in the person you today see simply as an enemy to be beaten, discover rather your brother or sister, and hold back your hand! Give up the way of arms and go out to meet the other in dialogue, pardon and reconciliation, in order to rebuild justice, trust, and hope around you! “From this standpoint, it is clear that, for the worlds peoples, armed conflicts are always a deliberate negation of international harmony, and create profound divisions and deep wounds which require many years to heal. Wars are a concrete refusal to pursue the great economic and social goals that the international community has set itself”.16
Nevertheless, as long as so great a quantity of arms are in circulation as at present, new pretexts can always be found for initiating hostilities. For this reason, I make my own the appeal of my predecessors for the non-proliferation of arms and for disarmament of all parties, beginning with nuclear and chemical weapons disarmament.
We cannot however fail to observe that international agreements and national laws while necessary and greatly to be desired are not of themselves sufficient to protect humanity from the risk of armed conflict. A conversion of hearts is needed which would permit everyone to recognize in the other a brother or sister to care for, and to work together with, in building a fulfilling life for all. This is the spirit which inspires many initiatives of civil society, including religious organizations, to promote peace. I express my hope that the daily commitment of all will continue to bear fruit and that there will be an effective application in international law of the right to peace, as a fundamental human right and a necessary prerequisite for every other right....
...It is well known that present production is sufficient, and yet millions of persons continue to suffer and die from hunger, and this is a real scandal. We need, then, to find ways by which all may benefit from the fruits of the earth, not only to avoid the widening gap between those who have more and those who must be content with the crumbs, but above all because it is a question of justice, equality and respect for every human being. In this regard I would like to remind everyone of that necessary universal destination of all goods which is one of the fundamental principles of the Churchs social teaching. Respect for this principle is the essential condition for facilitating an effective and fair access to those essential and primary goods which every person needs and to which he or she has a right...
...From the Vatican, 8 December 2013
What did the “lamestream media” misquote?
He looks like he has at least 20% more, at least visually. :)
>> He and Obama seem to be on the same page
Except under Obama, the wealth gap has increased.
Govt policy that facilitates small business capitalism is one that would better spread the wealth through natural means, and not through the iron fist of govt.
Communism and tyranny best exemplify the most severe wealth disparity.
Start taxing the church if it wants to go political.
That would be fine if that's all he said. But he asked for Gov'ts to engage in guarantees for the poor. This isn't personal charity, it's Gov't intrusion.
Yeah, what if my neighbor is an ass****. What about “Thou shall not steal”. All very nice, lets all hold hands and sing “We Are The World.” In the real world people work for certificates of appreciation and happiness called money. The more happiness you bring people in the goods you sell them, the more certificates of happiness you earn.
But what is need and why are they in need? If someone spends $100 a week at a nail salon and then complains about not being able to afford groceries are they really in need? Is someone with multiple flat screen TVs who buys three cases of beer, $50 worth of scratch offs and eats in restaurants three times a week in need because they then can't afford a new sweater?
The concept of the "working poor" is a statistical myth. While numerically speaking there are actually a number of people who are genuinely poor through no fault of their own, a study done (and quickly buried) about 20 years ago shows that wealth/poverty was strongly correlated to the number of hours worked per week by the total number of family members working. As I remember 20 hours or less per family usually landed the family in the poverty level, 20 - 40 hours per week landed them in the low but not poverty level. 40 - 60 put them solidly in the middle class, and 80 + usually dropped them into the upper income brackets.
That wasn't the portion that calls on Gov't to create policies that guarantee access to capital, healthcare, etc. It wasn't the portion that bashes "trickle down" economics either.
If you want to know what the Pope really says I suggest you go to the Vatican website
I have done so.
Inform your antagonists that fascism and its crony-capitalists pay out big, tax-payer-funded salaries; GM, AIG, etc...
Many faux capitalists talk out their a-holes while in reality living a life of dependency working for unions, govt, crony-corps.
I consider the commentary from this Pope very carefully. So far on numerous occasions he has been misunderstood by a media taking a few lines out of the context of the conversation.
And let’s all face reality ....capitalism ...as most of us would define it and prefer it demands a moral foundation. Within that context we would not need to spread the wealth around for every person would conduct themselves according to that morality.
Modern day ‘capitalism’ is corrupted as evidence by the very discussion on Rush Limbaugh today regarding the wealthiest/”smartest” zip codes. One would quickly realize that what masquerades as capitalism and wealth is but a façade of evil and looters. So for a twisted modern world, capitalism, is the folly of the evil and the result is an increase in the wealth gap.
So I say and perhaps even agree with this Pope...that we slay this ‘capitalist’ monster and carve away from the bones that which is diseased and dead. Let us again try to raise up a moral economy based on the Biblical standards. Let us set up a new economic language that separates this new economy from that of progressives/liberal/Marxists.
Yes, I do see room for the rebuke of wealth. Wealth gained through deceit, treachery and every form of underhanded dealings. While you and I understand that this is not capitalism as we would define it, millions do not.
Where has he said "governments" are to "engage" the poor, as if it's some nameless, faceless (and I dare say atheist) "government" responsibility to care for the poor, to show and share charity with the poor? And what kind of "guarantees for the poor" does he apparently advocate?
“The solution is not to empower corrupt, elite-saturated government further”
You’re right...but that’s already happened. America has become fascist through three kissing cousins...big government, big business, and big unions.
grania is right also...without somehow taming an unbridled ferocious capitalism, we will and are falling into the same servile state that happened in Europe some 200 years ago. Only difference there...they chose an evil just as bad ...Socialism.
You should read Hilaire Belloc “The Servile State” if you want to understand this pope.
What we have is not a "capitalist monster". What we have is Statism and more and more socialism.
But the Pope didn't bash that idea. No...in fact he called for more intervention by the State.
Guaranteed access to capital, healthcare among others.
In a free society one must work to gain access to capital. Not everyone should be granted access by the Gov't as the Pope calls for. There are millions who are undeserving of such.
Gov't imposed access to capital is what crashed the economy in '08. Yet the Pope believes it is the State's function to perform this role.
When you slay freedom, you end up without freedom
socialism is based on greed
the freedom to earn more by working harder and smarter is not making anyone else poorer
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