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Chinese Naval Vessel Tries to Force U.S. Warship to Stop in International Waters
Washington Free Beacon ^ | 12/13/2013 | Bill Gertz

Posted on 12/13/2013 2:57:59 AM PST by markomalley

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To: Zhang Fei

Ok, so why did we fire on 4 North Vietnamese torpeodo boats which lead to escalation of war. And why did we shoot down that Iranian airliner and why did the russians shoot down KAL 007 ?


361 posted on 12/14/2013 3:32:47 PM PST by staytrue
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To: staytrue
Ok, so why did we fire on 4 North Vietnamese torpeodo boats which lead to escalation of war. And why did we shoot down that Iranian airliner and why did the russians shoot down KAL 007 ?

They were reported to have fired on US ships. The Iranian airliner was shot down in the midst of a military confrontation between the US and Iran that came about because the Iranians were attacking civilian ships transiting the Persian Gulf, and just after the Iraqi attack on the USS Stark. KAL 007 was within Soviet air space. Nonetheless, the Soviets shouldn't have shot it down and the shoot down probably cemented the image of the Soviet Union as the Evil Empire.

Unless American naval units have fighting a low-level war with the PLAN, I wouldn't expect the US Navy to initiate an engagement. Whether the Chinese have given their junior officers the green light is something we'll find out in the months and years ahead.

362 posted on 12/14/2013 3:57:28 PM PST by Zhang Fei (Let us pray that peace be now restored to the world and that God will preserve it always.)
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To: staytrue
Money is a zero coupon debt instrument. It is a debt where you present paper, they give you something of value in return. If the USA and China, the two world’s largest economies shrink dramatically, the paper is no good as there is no longer anything of value. That would be the death of western monetary system and of capitalism.

The combined European economies were far bigger than the US prior to WWII. At the end of WWII, the world economy prospered despite the fact that Europe's factories had been turned to rubble. Laugh and the world laughs with you. Weep and you weep alone.

363 posted on 12/14/2013 4:01:45 PM PST by Zhang Fei (Let us pray that peace be now restored to the world and that God will preserve it always.)
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To: sport

Why are you assuming that I have just now discovered that no one will stop Obama? In my post I made a rhetorical statement. If you haven been reading my posts over the years, you would not feel the need to suggest that you could tell me about Obama.


364 posted on 12/14/2013 4:20:56 PM PST by Shane (When Injustice Becomes Law, RESISTANCE Becomes DUTY.----T.Jefferson)
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To: 1rudeboy

You’re right.


365 posted on 12/14/2013 5:29:35 PM PST by Hugh the Scot
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Comment #366 Removed by Moderator

To: urbanpovertylawcenter

The treasonous sale of the machine and die equipment from the closing McDonald-Douglas factory - which, if I recall correctly, involved denying the employees attempting to purchase and re-purpose the factory....even though they had the funds on hand - was the first time I got pissed off at government.


367 posted on 12/14/2013 6:32:47 PM PST by Psycho_Bunny (Thought Puzzle: Describe Islam without using the phrase "mental disorder" more than four times.)
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To: Little Pig

As my grandpa used to say, “Never bring a tank landing ship to a guided missile cruiser fight.”


368 posted on 12/14/2013 6:46:35 PM PST by DemforBush (A Repo Man is *always* intense.)
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To: DemforBush; Little Pig

Or guided missile destroyer, as the case may be.


369 posted on 12/14/2013 6:47:31 PM PST by DemforBush (A Repo Man is *always* intense.)
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To: yldstrk

“In other words, the US ship was acting belligerent and the Chinese ship didn’t give way”

No, the US ship was acting legally in international waters, and the Chicoms decided to get belligerent. They chose to put themselves in the way, and ordered the US ship to stop. That the US ship didn’t immediately kiss Chinese ass doesn’t make the US ship the aggressor.


370 posted on 12/14/2013 8:27:47 PM PST by LevinFan
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To: Little Pig

The Red Chinese tank landing ship: because;

* our destroyer is not designed for ramming
* can’t lower the main deck guns to fire below their own deck in the forward position (i.e. blind spot re using weapons at a lower-hulled ship coming at them)
* Adm. Locklear sounds like a coward. When I think back over the Naval Commanders I’ve met over the decades, I cringe at who we have leading the Navy today esp. the cowardly incompetent Secy of the Navy Mabus - (I’ve met and/or known Adm. Radford, Arleigh Burke, Dan Galley, John Middendorf, John McCain (CINCOMPAC, Vietnam war), Secy of Navy Lehman, and Jeremiah Denton, etc.)
* probably no US air CAP for the ship (like the USS Pueblo)
* Obama the Appeaser is our CIC (Coward in Chief)
* The Red Chinese want war and are building themselves up to win one with us. We, on the other hand, are retreating and will soon abandon the few remaining friends left in the Pacific.
* The Red Chinese are already giving vailed ultimatums of choice to Australia and/or New Zealand, and may already own Fiji.

If Obama once said “Yes we can”, he was only referring to our surrender on the world stage.


371 posted on 12/14/2013 9:12:03 PM PST by MadMax, the Grinning Reaper
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To: sushiman
What happened to RCA , Zenith , Motorola , Sylvania , Westinghouse , GE , Emerson , Magnavox ...etc...etc...? ;-)

Possibly wrong, but I would guess:
Unions?

372 posted on 12/14/2013 9:13:53 PM PST by doorgunner69
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To: staytrue
Ok, so why did we fire on 4 North Vietnamese torpeodo boats which lead to escalation of war.

From all that I have read about it, those boats were phantoms that no one ever saw and were likely the result of hyperactive imagination.

Having been in a bunker during Tet 68 watching the dark, I know what imagination can conjure up.

No digital recordings of the radar tracks back then.

373 posted on 12/14/2013 9:20:23 PM PST by doorgunner69
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To: staytrue
Carriers are the most important ships in any navy. You don’t let any credible threat get close to one before shooting.

This is too good to pass up:

Didn't a ChiCom sub surface in the middle of a carrier group recently?

374 posted on 12/14/2013 9:25:06 PM PST by doorgunner69
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To: 1rudeboy
when I bought the Audi............I’m happy with my purchase.

Buying a car that loses up to half of it's resale value the moment you drive off the lot is not a glowing testament to your purchasing prowess.........

Enjoy it now, and run it into the ground, the only way to get your moneys worth out of the POS, saying that as a former Audi owner.

375 posted on 12/14/2013 9:30:54 PM PST by doorgunner69
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To: Wyrd bið ful aræd
Ramming speed!

Not a good idea with an aluminum hulled ship.

Brings to mind those guys that smash aluminum beer cans on their foreheads................

376 posted on 12/14/2013 9:34:21 PM PST by doorgunner69
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To: Venturer
Speaking of Chickens-—we are now going to accept chicken imports from China.

Like we cannot raise enough American chickens to keep McDonalds supplied.

And Chick-fil-A, I would add...!

Maybe it's that U.S. farmers costs have been driven up substantially. It was not that long ago that one could buy 10 lb. bags of leg quarters for $.29/lb. on sale, and $.39/lb. routinely. Now the same stores' sale ads are at $.79/lb.

Still, chicken imports from China? That's pretty amazing. It's sure be interesting to see what's happened to chicken production in the U.S. in the last 50 years. If the farms around here are any indication, it has to have skyrocketed.

Perhaps it is demand. Just consider the influx of Filipinas married to Americans and immigrating here. Not only does my (Filipina) wife eat lots of chicken, I think my consumption has quadrupled. :-)

377 posted on 12/14/2013 11:13:35 PM PST by Paul R. (We are in a break in an Ice Age. A brief break at that...)
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To: cherokee1
And by the way-—our balance of trade is actually getting closer to even. Occasionaly we might be on the upside in any given month. The gooks buy nearly all of the wheat that comes out of the Pacific Northwest and they buy huge loads of timber and coal. While I try really hard to avoid buying their krap I don’t mind selling TO them. You might say they have good taste.

That's a very good point. It might also address (more seriously) at least part of my complaint about food prices, although I'm sure exports are not the only thing driving up U.S. food prices! (#$%&*@!% ethanol policy!)

Former farmland that has been out of production around here for decades is being reconverted to farmland...

As China becomes richer, their demand for U.S. food, timber, and energy exports grows, and their ability to compete at the bottom of the labor price ladder diminishes.

At any rate, if for the last 5 years we hadn't been in the grip of REAL commies (the Obama crowd) and had also followed an energy resources policy that made a lick of sense, we would have a consistently positive balance of trade, now. IMO.

378 posted on 12/15/2013 12:18:09 AM PST by Paul R. (We are in a break in an Ice Age. A brief break at that...)
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To: doorgunner69

“Didn’t a ChiCom sub surface in the middle of a carrier group recently? “

Wasn’t the first time a foreign sub surprised us.


379 posted on 12/15/2013 12:22:36 AM PST by CodeToad (When ignorance rules a person's decision they are resorting to superstition.)
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To: kabar
There is no doubt that China can provide a more welcoming business environment free from such restrictions as the use of child labor, OSHA standards, environmental regulations, taxes, government subsidies, etc. How far should the US go towards replicating such an environment in the interest of businesses?

Well, having worked at engineering jobs for multiple U.S. manufacturers, the last of which / my current main employer is doing well but could be doing even better, let me take those item by item:

child labor

Generally, I'd say the regulations and policies in effect @ the end of the "Dubya" era were fine. There is no place for "industrial child labor" in the U.S. We should be effectively educating kids, period. On the other hand, it is ridiculous to say that farmers' kids should not be allowed to work on family farms, as long as they get their schoolwork in too. Some of the most ingenious / effective engineers and technicians I've ever met came from farming backgrounds.

OSHA standards

Some should be relaxed somewhat, but my main beef with OSHA Standards is not the levels set, or whatever the rules are, but how the rules are enforced. OSHA inspectors do not try to guide businesses into compliance, they slam businesses with big fines for the slightest 1st time infraction. Not to mention that the rules often change and can be insanely complex. I'm not saying that OSHA should be business' friend, but they could be more like the firm cop who writes you a warning ticket that you were going 58 mph coming into that 50 mph zone, and "the next time it won't be a warning ticket."

environmental regulations

Ditto OSHA comments above in some areas, and more so in others. Don't get me wrong, there's no way I'd want to go back to Chinese standards. My brother has been there a few times and... blechh. I love the outdoors and very much appreciate that, for example, many local sources of mercury pollution have been reduced or eliminated. If my family goes on a camping / fishing trip, the fish we eat are less likely to be contaminated by local sources than they would have been 20 years ago. However, there is a point where what one does is counterproductive: In many areas of the U.S. today, what mercury there is in fish in local waters likely has more mercury in it from Chinese sources making it all the way here, than from local pollution! If overzealous environmental regulations drive manufacturing overseas, which undoubtedly is the case, one may be shooting themselves in the foot both economically AND environmentally.

taxes

Corporate taxes absolutely should be lowered drastically, especially those on small business. Deductions for R&D and plant modernization should be increased and / or depreciation sped up.

government subsidies

Should be eliminated in most cases. There are better ways to create business-friendly environments -- and by the way I do agree with you about the current "crony capitalism" system.

380 posted on 12/15/2013 1:38:45 AM PST by Paul R. (We are in a break in an Ice Age. A brief break at that...)
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