Skip to comments.Are True Conservatives A Minority In America?
Posted on 12/13/2013 3:37:52 AM PST by LD Jackson
In the past few days, much has been written and said about the budget deal worked out between Paul Ryan and Patty Murray. That budget deal passed the House of Representatives by a vote of 332-94. The vote came after a fairly harsh push-back against outside conservative groups like Heritage Action, Club for Growth, Americans for Prosperity, and Freedom Works. Speaker John Boehner made his displeasure for these groups plain for all to see and hear, saying they had lost all credibility, that he didn't care what they did. Clearly, he is tired of the thorn in his flesh and is pushing back against the groups that he perceives have made his life as Speaker more than a little tough.
This brings me to the subject of this post. Conservatives in America seem to be losing the battle they have fought, not only with liberals, but with the more moderate wing of the Republican Party. I know everyone has different priorities concerning what they would like to see accomplished, but it seems that conservatives are being pushed to the side, in favor of more moderate policies. That's how it looks to me, at any rate.
I believe the spine we are seeing John Boehner display is a direct result of what happened with the most recent government shutdown. Clearly, conservatives lost that fight in a landslide and Boehner must feel they damaged the GOP brand in the process. I would contend that brand was smashed long ago, but that's how he must perceive what happened. He is now fighting back against what he sees as a portion of his party that needs to be reined in. Here is portion of what has gone on in Washington, both in public and behind the scenes.
Real Clear Politics - But Boehner wont be taking any pointers from Heritage or the others. I dont care what they do, he said Thursday.Where do conservatives stand from here? Paul Ryan has an obvious point with his warning to the conservatives of his party. If we expect to accomplish anything of substance in Washington, we are going to have to win some elections. I expect to see the House leadership working towards that goal in the mid-term elections next year. Where the real tale will be told is in 2015.
You know, they pushed us into this fight to defund Obamacare and shut down the government, Boehner told reporters. It wasnt exactly the strategy I had in mind. But if you recall, the day before the government re-opened, one of the people at one of these groups stood up and said, Well, we never really thought it would work. Are you kidding me?
Also this week, a Gallup poll found just 30 percent of Americans view the Tea Party movement favorably -- a new low -- while 51 percent dislike it.
Last December, Boehner failed to cajole his conference around a Plan B proposal to avoid the fiscal cliff, and took heat for bringing up a bill that failed to extend the Bush tax cuts for high earners and needed Democratic help for passage. The speaker felt similar tension when trying to pass legislation for hurricane relief and a Farm Bill that included food stamp funding.
He had pledged to avoid a shutdown this past fall, but allowed his members to follow a strategy heralded by Heritage and its ilk, shutting down the government if the short-term budget included Obamacare funding.
Quickly, GOP approval numbers went from bad to worse.
But interestingly, Boehners standing among his members, even some of those who had been most critical of him in the past, rose. Many House Republicans saw their leader as fighting for them until the very end, and talk of taking him down subsided. They then shifted their sights to a timely political opportunity: the troubled rollout of the health care law.
While budget issues have been especially problematic for this Congress, GOP leaders hoped to put it behind them, avoid another shutdown that could damage their approval ratings further, and focus on the Affordable Care Act heading into the midterm year. So when the outside groups spoke out against the Ryan-Murray budget agreement before details were released, Boehner headed to his weekly conference meeting with a full head of steam, in the words of one GOP aide. There was a feeling of we let you guys try it and you drove the car right into a cliff, the aide said.
This week, some members appear to have gotten an education about the limits of GOP power in Washington, given divided government. Some members who blasted the deal were also mindful of Paul Ryans task.
For his part, the Budget Committee chairman also had a stern message for critics on the right. To really do what we think needs to be done, we are going to have to win some elections, he said on the House floor before the vote.
For the moment, let us accept the fact that winning elections is more important. Long-term goals vs. short-term goals. Let us assume the Republicans go into 2015 with a majority of the Senate and the House of Representatives. What comes after that? Will John Boehner still push conservatives into a dark corner and warn them to not come out and play? Or will he use his newly won majority to push for real conservative reforms of our fiscal process? To that point, are there enough true conservatives in America to force that to happen? Or are we a minority who will have to be satisfied with the little tidbits we are thrown from time to time?
I fully understand the point behind this budget deal. I realize we are in a position of limited power and can only accomplish so much. That was never more on display than it was during the fight to defund ObamaCare. I am pragmatic enough to realize how that strategy failed and how we have to look forward to the 2014 elections and beyond. At the same time, I find myself wanting to make sure the Republican Party does not give away their entire soul and body, just for the chance to regain it in 2014.
The system corrupts them faster than we can vote them out.
Sometimes doing the right thing is just unpopular.
No, I believe real conservatives are only a minority in Government. The House RINOs that forced this through are way out of touch with their base. Theyve attacked the base, raised taxes (remember what happened to Bush #1 with read my lips, no new taxes), and challenged the tea party to form an opposition party by forcing this through. Since when do Republicans force through major legislation in two days that raises taxes and grows government without allowing the public to digest and debate? Sounds like a desperate move out of the Dem playbook, designed to hide consequences from its base. If you told me 4 years ago that the Rs in the house would do this, Id have said you were nuts. Unbelievable and in need of a real response from us in the base.
Glenn Reynolds said it best yesterday You can try and defend this deal, but Boehners gratuitous Tea Party-bashing wont help the GOP win next year. A lot of Tea Party folks stayed home in 2012 because the GOP establishment made clear it didnt like them. That makes all this talk about the need to win elections ring a bit hollow.
I would say yes to the question. It’s a rare bird who doesn’t have a pet exemption or tax credit that they want preserved. Cut everyone’s pork except mine. A good example is ethanol. Most midwest farmers are conservative - until you start talking about doing away with ethanol exemptions and credits at which point they start squealing like those hogs they used to raise before ethanol became so profitable. There are plenty more examples. Pick your favorite :)
If the Republicans want to win elections, they are going to have to represent the conservative values of those who elect them. This bending over backwards to appease liberal Democrats once they get elected is killing them.
Who says the shut-down was a loss for conservatives? It was a brilliant strategy abandoned in mid-battle by those who are supposed to represent us. I don’t want gutless wonders who throw up the white flags of surrender every time the MSM criticizes them. I want more Ted Cruzes.
I have stopped donating to the Republican party and its subsidiaries. Perhaps I should write to them to let them know why. It is for the opposite reason they think—it is *not* because I agree with MSM criticisms. I stopped donating because I don’t like their caving in the face of such criticism.
Amash of Michigan Amendment No. 100 (reining in NSA abuse)
Republican 94 Yes, 134 No, 6 Not Voting
Democratic 111 Yes, 83 No, 6 Not Voting
Republicans will face intense pressure over unemployment benefits
BY GREG SARGENT
December 11 at 12:24 pm
[snip] The imminent expiration of the Emergency Unemployment Compensation program for 1.3 million Americans is mostly being treated as a fait accompli in Washington... (Dems have created an interactive map showing how many people in each state stand to lose benefits.)... This strategy includes placing Op ed pieces by Democrats in papers that serve the districts of top Republicans, such as this one by Rep. Sander Levin in the Cleveland Plain-Dealer, the largest paper in John Boehners home state. The game plan is granular: One Democrat points out to me that stats are available on how many would lose benefits on the county level, and that Dems are trying to push these numbers into the coverage, because it is tangible for people in local communities. [/snip]
In politics, yes, in society, no.
Are True Conservatives A Minority In America?
Nope, they comprise 58% of the electorate, which is why the GOP cannot win without them.
During his speech in Detroit this week Rand Paul spoke of term limits. He said that the pressure to do the wrong thing is incredible and that eventually every man will get worn down.
Though I believe that if am a “true” conservative, it is very difficult to be one in practice today with the different levels of government here in the USA having their collectivist hands stuffed two yards deep into every facet of our business and personal lives.
Doctors are forced to accept Medicare/Medicaid patients or they cannot get surgical privileges at hospitals. Wall Street and banking are addicted to welfare as badly as any crackhead baby mama, and the regulatory schemes distort markets and strategy. A cabal of Unions, Environmentalists, and a partnership of safety nannies by the Insurance industry and the government have controlled how cars are designed for the last 50 years, and our regulated media make the auto companies seem like the problem. State and local zoning and environmental regulations make expanding the physical plant of about any business super expensive and in many cases impossible. This is fascism and tyranny.
The GOP primaries in 2014 will tell the future of the USA (and the GOP). I
I too understand why the GOPe have done this, to put aside issues that may tarnish the Republican name brand and focus on the elections in 2014. But I don't view the government shutdown as a failure. We saw conservatives who were willing to fight for the Constitution and our Republic. Ted Cruz and Mike Lee came out heroes, which Boehner doesn't like.
I don't think going Democrat and giving in to Trillion dollar budgets and put reductions off for later is consistent with a true conservative ideology. Boehner only wants to help junior RINOs get elected and into positions of power - not to save the Republic, increase Republican presence in his "Ruling Class".
America is CONSERVATIVE and AMERICA is not represented in DC.
“In politics, yes, in society, no.”
You are viewing only in your small circle.
Marxist education and Marxist media are what is destroying America.
America will never be the country that I grew up in, from 1944 to 1980.
I now live in a totally new life on the other side of the world, and at age 69 I am as happy as a clam.
No we are a majority being tortured by the minority
Sorry, I am more pessimistic - I think we are seeing the future now. Unfortunately, I think it is too late. I still hope for the best and prepare for the worst. The future is economic collapse I think is a certainty at this point - it is only a matter time.
Have you ever heard of the saying, “if at age 20 you are a CONSERVATIVE, you have NO HEART, if at age 40 you are a LIBERAL, you have NO BRAIN?”
Translation: As you get older, IT IS EXPECTED that you WILL become A LOT LESS LIBERAL . That is REALITY.
DITTOS! ! ! !
I think you are defining tactics with targets.
“True conservative,” to me, is a target. It refers to the policy mix. For example, a strong national defense, a free-market economy, returning domestic policies to the states, and promoting traditional social values.
How we get there, given that the Republicans control only one of the two houses of the Congress, is a different question. Should we use the power we actually have to (1) force the other side to accept our positions by shutting down the government or (2) work with the other side to get a fair compromise position.
The question is moot since conservatives don’t bother to vote. 4 million stayed home in Nov. 2012.
“Have you ever heard of the saying, if at age 20 you are a CONSERVATIVE, you have NO HEART, if at age 40 you are a LIBERAL, you have NO BRAIN?
Dear, I have known that phrase for many years.
The sad thing is that there is no longer a Churchill or a Ronald Reagan.
The way the Republican party appears to be standing now I don’t want anything to do with them.
Come election time I will pick and choose. I will vote Republican only if that Republican is Conservative, Other than that they can KMA./
A perfect example of what I have telling you: you seem to want to come on to FR and proclaim how much superior your lifestyle is now that you live in the Philippines and away from that evil USA.
The question is: why are you even here if all the politics being discussed don't even affect you?
conservatives are a plurality in America, but not a majority. The fact is, most people are un-engaged enough to fall for whatever emotional ploy is made during a political campaign. As others said, people are conservative in principle but will fight to the mat for whatever program they receive benefit. That can be SS, Medicare, subsidies, tax breaks, etc.
As said recently in the right-wing media, what is going on in DC is more of a soap opera or reality show...completely un-reflective of real life or the problems we face as a nation. Most are not engaged to get past that aspect.
If you think conservatives are a minority, then you better explain how conservatives and Republicans control 28 states while liberals control 11 states.
There are two political battlefields: the states and Washington DC.
I am more correct than you think. I have two friends who used to be very liberal and they have gotten more conservative as they aged.
Plus you sure sound like a pessimist.
Keep a close eye on 2014, we could very well see a replay of 2010 here. :)
“The question is: why are you even here if all the politics being discussed don’t even affect you?”
Because I am am an American going back to my great great great uncle, Uncle Sam, Troy, NY, war of 1812, and I have been a FReeper longer then you.
The fact that I am enjoying a new life in my retirement has nothing to do with love of country, but it IS far superior to what I would have back there, as there is no way that I could live there on my small social security.
Feel free to join the “dog in a manger club” They are a small group of sad kids that hate my guts because I am not there to share their pain in the Obamination.
The simple answer is “Yes”. The underlying reasons are manifold and not quite so simple; ranging from single issue voters, to low/no information voters, and a federally corrupted public education system that teaches accommodation to extremes rather than true basic, functional knowledge and accurate history.
Thanks to “Obamacare” people are NOW waking up and smelling the coffee for a change.
“Plus you sure sound like a pessimist.”
No, I am a realist. America will not recover in MY lifetime.
I do, however, pray that it will in yours, but prepare for very hard times.
In the end there is right and wrong and all those gray areas are BS but via Group Speak and PCness too many people have come to accept it.
A vast majority of people are conservative in their personal lives.
He’s right. DC is the enemy of The People. A conservative working for DC, thinking they’re going to change something, is like a Jew working in Berlin, circa 1940.
Why should we re-elect spineless republicans that fold and roll over ALL THE TIME!?!?
They're dead and useless.
I used to have respect for Ryan, but he should've gotten a much better deal than he did. The dhimmis are weakened because of the disaster they brought on themselves. And he let them lift the sequester for what?
A bunch of empty promises!
We're going to have a $700B deficit this year! The dhimis are going to pack the courts so tight we're screwed for a generation.
How dare they lecture us when they've been nothing but miserable failures. If they don't have the stomach for a fight they should get the hell off the stage.
Republicans now lead the generic congressional ballots by the major poll takers, and eliminating Obamacare was the key reason Democrats -- not conservatives -- shut down the Federal government by their unwillingness to negotiate.
That would not have happened, and the national conversation would not have shifted to eliminating Obamacare, were it not for the principled stand of the conservative wing of the Republican Party.
Care to try again?
“people are NOW waking up and smelling the coffee for a change.”
Yes, but the coffee has already been brewed and being served.
You need to think outside the box. Being a devoted FReeper is great, but we are a very small minority in the scheme of Obumbo’s USSA.
Reality has very hard knocks.
I’m betting that all the issue positions of the “Tea Party” would poll favorably,
but then when mentioned by name, the Tea Party itself polls unfavorably.
There’s only one reason for that - propaganda.
MSM - when/if the SHTF, you’re gonna be decorating the most lampposts.
“But I don’t view the government shutdown as a failure.”
The vets dragging the Barrycades to the White Hut was proof that it wasn’t a failure. A few more weeks of 0’s unmasked hatred for Americans would brought all the patriots to a boil.
Your opinion and your opinion ALONE.
We are NOT a small minority and I REJECT this thinking outside of the box nonsense.
They had no one to vote for.
I STAND by my postions.
What has been going on in regards to Obamacare is WAKING people up BIGTIME to the TRUTH about Obama, PERIOD.
Oh, so I should shut up because I have less time in service than you (a whopping three and a half years); please elucidate how that makes my comment on you less valid.
No, your critics (that “small group of sad kids”) don’t hate your guts. We just think that you are not very intelligent. For example, anyone who would proclaim that he became a dad at age 65 could not have much on the ball.
And lastly, this comment, which reinforces the last one: “there is no way that I could live there on my small social security (sic).” Couldn’t make a lot of money or do much in the way of planning, I see.
“I STAND by my postions.”
Dear, I salute you and wish you best of luck.
I do understand your suffering, but please do not criticize me for not sharing the pain. I am a simple old man in retirement.
You keep leaving Conyers off when you mention that bill. Amash doesn't on his official website.
That is a good question but a slong as the country club surrender monkeys are going to pasa amnesty then we sure will be if we are not already.