Skip to comments.'GREEN BULLETS' OVERTAKING LEAD THANKS TO EPA, STATE REGS, MILITARY
Posted on 12/22/2013 9:22:03 PM PST by lowbridge
As Breitbart News reported on December 1, EPA regulations led to the closing of the Herculaneam lead smelter in Herculaneum, Missouri, which is expected to push up prices for traditional lead ammo.
On top of this are regulations like the recent statewide lead ammo ban in California. Signed by Governor Jerry Brown (D) on October 11, this ban forces hunters to seek out nontraditional alternatives for their ammunition. In this way, the ban mandates "green bullets" by default.
Moreover, as Fox News reports, the military has set 2018 as its target date to have troops operating lead-ammo-free. "Green bullets" have been under testing at Picatinny Arsenal since 2010, and the Army plans to issue "a lead-free version of the 7.62 mm rounds fired from M-14 rifles... in 2014." The Army already switched to a greener 5.56 mm "enhanced performance round" in 2010.
(Excerpt) Read more at breitbart.com ...
So how much for copper bullets?
One should always keep the “environment” in mind while killing his enemies.
That’s what I thought also.
Kill them with kindness.
Give them some hot coco.
So thanks to the envirowackos, the military now has a more lethal bullet? Awesome!
I read an obscure article somewhere with someone in management at an ammo producer, and they said the smelter in question only processed raw lead ore, but that most ammo producers get their lead from recyclers, so the actual price of ammo was not likely to be impacted at all.
I think that since we’re already burning corn in our fighting machines, asparagus tips would make some pretty nifty, “environment friendly” bullets.
red Steel wrote:
“So how much for copper bullets?”
I’m not sure if this is a caliber you have something in, to chamber this stuff:
30 bucks a box for 20!!
Me? I’m going ‘further old school’. I already shoot just plain wadcutters and semi-wadcutters in my .38’s. No plus-p, or super-duper catridges, just 148 wc’s and 158 swc’s, no HP’s, either. Once I’m done with that, I’m getting what Winchester 130 FMJ’s I can. Used to work for me, when I wore a Model 15 on airbase security detail. They are flat nose, and not round nosed. I don’t figure to be shooting at folks wearing ak-rifle magazine pouch vests, so they do work fine. I’m on a budget, so 30 for 20 doesn’t work for me.
Got a lot of green tip on hand for kevlar-hided varmints.
Enhanced performance my foot. If they were better, they would have switched to them before the EPA made them switch.
tungsten-steel core all the way baby!
How many kgs of Pb are used for battery production vs ammo?
Going spear next deer season.
Bastiges ran right by where I was sitting. three feet away and didn't even know I was there.
And yet many FReepers said the EPA closing down a lead smelter would have no impact. Enjoy shooting your bio-degradable bullets...
I think that since were already burning corn in our fighting machines, asparagus tips would make some pretty nifty, environment friendly bullets.
Aw, heck yes, but don't forget the cherry pit .30 caliber rounds or the peach pit 12-bore slugs. They're still available for invisible plastic Glock AK-47 sniper assault fully automatic weapons of war and mass destruction, complete with invisible high capacity magazines that hold nineteen jillion rounds of cop killer asparagus tips, cherry pits, and peach pits brought to you by the born again Christian right wing gun lobby militia.
(I hope I didn't leave anything out.)
a penny a piece if you make them yourself?
It’s obvious that these ying yangs have never been on a battlefield. I’m just guessing here but it would seem to me that lead bullets would be the least of the “environmental” problems.
This is true. This panic is fanned by the same kind of morons that left the market in 2008 and secured their losses, tin foil hats, etc, etc.
That’s not a bad idea. I wonder, how long until someone introduces a reasonably priced copper bullet lathe capable of “turning out” large volumes of solid copper ultra high ballistic coefficient projectiles? that’s the future right there. Such projectiles would be much more accurate and much more deadly than what they would be replacing. A shooting club could even chip in for the machine and share the costs and benefits of ownership until the price comes down.
save your pennies, boyos.
Look up the properties of the depleted uranium in tank rounds and I have a hard time convincing myself that taking lead out of bullets is necessary.
Poisonous, pyrophoric (bursts in flame on contact with air) and radioactive, it is stuff from hell.
Solid copper bullets chew up rifle barrels.
Polish light ball from 1953.
I believe the ATF nipped that in the bud by classifying solid copper bullets as armor piercing.
The lead to be recycled had to come from somewhere. All copper bullet? Expensive and possibly hard on the barrel. This will affect supply and price. Hardest hit will be the bullet casters, the ones that know how to make bullets when the SHTF. Very hard time finding wheel weights now which are great for casting...of so I’ve heard...not that I do anything like that.
Because Depleted Uranium is sooo much better than lead....
When the feds come to take your gold like FDR did back in the 30’s give it back to them as quickly as you can... at 1200+ FPS....
[ Look up the properties of the depleted uranium in tank rounds and I have a hard time convincing myself that taking lead out of bullets is necessary.
Poisonous, pyrophoric (bursts in flame on contact with air) and radioactive, it is stuff from hell. ]
Chemically Uranium is quite toxic by itself never mind the radioactivity which is far higher than most isotopes of lead...
Most all heavy metals are toxic, save: Gold, Silver, and, Bismuth...
No one wants to spend the money on Gold and Silver... and Bismuth is not as malleable for bullets as lead...
So how much for copper bullets?
a penny a piece if you make them yourself?
Only if they are 1982 or older. Otherwise you’re shooting 95% zinc.
Wrong. Barnes X are great bullets and made out of copper. Lots of others coming out now too.
Silver bullets? Good for werewolves too.
“Im going further old school. I already shoot just plain wadcutters and semi-wadcutters in my .38s. No plus-p, or super-duper catridges, just 148 wcs and 158 swcs, no HPs, either. Once Im done with that, Im getting what Winchester 130 FMJs I can. Used to work for me, when I wore a Model 15 on airbase security detail. They are flat nose, and not round nosed. I dont figure to be shooting at folks wearing ak-rifle magazine pouch vests, so they do work fine. Im on a budget, so 30 for 20 doesnt work for me.”...
I used to do that before the boat sank with all my firearms AND ammo. It was a sad day indeed!
Well, Okay. Where can I get some depleted uranium?
Armor piercing bullets are not illegal.
Maybe hollow points will literally mushroom on contact. Or broccoli head.
Tell us more about spear hunting deer. I am seriously interested!
How then do you explain the notice on Barnes' website?
Certain Barnes Banded Solids are currently under review by the ATF making them unavailable. Please Click Here to learn more.
References the law at the link.
In a nutshell, it is illegal to import, manufacture, export, etc. It is NOT illegal to own, buy,sell, or shoot it.
I have a couple of AP bandoliers for the Garand. You can buy surplus in many places online.
It seems to be that part about being illegal to manufacture AP is behind the ATFs action against Barnes copper bullets.
Forty years ago, when the first anti-lead laws began, I knew the ultimate aim was ammo. Bobby Kennedy had been shot a few years before and America was still in the throes of an anti-gun panic.
All this enviro crap will be thrown in the trash the instant the US goes into a war of National Survival, like WWII.
Yes, that’s it in a nutshell. The ATF is entirely political and most capricious in its findings. They take law and stretch its interpretations to some of the most ridiculous left-sided rules one can imagine. They purport solid copper is armor piercing, yet still allow the manufacture and sale of XM855 (SS109) 5.56 mm Penetrator rounds on the commercial market (I bought two 420 rd cans of it from Walmart!).
I feel your loss.
After Katrina, I’ve moved to an ‘above sea level location’, on the hill, upstairs.
Dear atomic dog,
Communist politics are what they are. The nuts-and-bolts of war have always centered around the ground guy and his rifle. I have shot the 7.62x54R. I agree with your point. I have also shot .303 English, 7.62x51, 7.62x39, 5.56 and 5,45. All valid designs, all very well made and are good ‘GI timex’ pieces.
At this point in time, the only rifle design I would be on the outlook for, is a lever action rifle with a loading gate in a pistol chambering, maybe .45LC.
I wasn’t aware of that. I’m surprised I haven’t seen something from the NRA in my email. It’s outrageous.