Posted on 01/05/2014 11:50:49 AM PST by FBD
Jurors in the trial of two former Fullerton police officers accused of beating a mentally ill homeless man to death will probably be told to disregard the opinions of witnesses who said the two acted within department policy.The admonition is expected to be part of jury instructions that are still being negotiated by attorneys in the trial over the beating death of Kelly Thomas.“You are ordered to disregard those opinions,” a draft of the admonition says. “It is up to you to determine whether the defendants used excessive or unreasonable force based on all the evidence that has been presented in this trial but you may not consider evidence that has been stricken.”The probable instruction results from prosecutors' attempts to challenge the testimony of two witnesses who said defendants Manuel Ramos and Jay Cicinelli acted, for the most part, within Fullerton Police Department policy.
(Excerpt) Read more at latimes.com ...
They (the Fullerton police dept.) definitely approved of this beating. The dept. sat on this case for months. They fought the release of the transit video, and now they’re fighting the release of records of these two officers. Their policies are wrapped in a culture of corruption.
They need to die slowly, ignominiously and screaming in pain for the foul hos that begot them. That’s justice.
Am i mistaken here? My read was that the prosecution wanted the personnel records of Ramos and Cicinelli, and the reason(s) they were fired. The defense and the city both fought that release, from my understanding.
Imagine saying...”they broke into the home and killed the family during the robbery.... but they learned this from their family environment. It was a product of their raising. Their father had modeled it for them. The gang they were in taught them to rob and steal. They weren’t smart enough to overcome their bad raising. It was acceptable in the culture they were raised and taught in. It was definitely okay for the people that had influence on thier lives.”
It does matter, because even if these two are convicted the other cops and managers will only double down unless you change them.
You just build bigger prisons for the rest of them. And after you throw these guys in prison you elect city officials who will fire the police chief etc.... or who will instruct the city attorney to press charges against the chief. That’s the way the system works.
Yeah, I don’t think that would fly. But it does in the LEO world, apparently.
Ya, agreed, the testimony was whack. It always seems odd to hear a judge say ignore what you just heard. For me, it would’ve colored my judgment inasmuch as it seems to be blatant covering up by friends in what should be positions of respect.
It will be interesting to see what kind of sentence will be meted out, if found guilty. Segregated prison housing?
I could be the one mistaken.
Either way — it demonstrates how trials are a farce.
What’s heard cannot be unheard. No matter what the judge’s instructions are. I don’t think it will play in the favor of the defense.
Agreed. Why are they allowing the personnel records to be hidden? Gotta be a liability issue for the city.
“He said that even though Thomas could be heard saying he couldn’t breathe and was apologizing to officers, Craig didn’t believe the officers should have gotten off him because Thomas continued to fight them.”
Or of course he was thrashing about as someone being denied air will do.
Bad news if there's ever an outfit that selects for amoral officers with so little regard for human life.
Maybe you've seen this video and related story about deadly dogs chasing cats despite being asked to back off by dispatch, or this story about how after an hour-long chase and 38 cop cars, a nut in a Corvette was gunned down, presumably for reckless driving! Never occurred to the cops to wait until the guy ran out of gas. They had aerial recon. There's no way the guy was going to get away...
It's "police" boys such as these who make up Brownshirts. A man with a conscience would have walked away long before shots were fired or beatings were commenced.
Our trial system is adversarial. I don’t know of any competent lawyer who would say otherwise.
Of course it is — but I have heard attorneys tell juries that they will be participating in a “search for the truth.”
I say by the time a beating becomes life threatening, you’ve long last the ability to resist. It just isn’t that easy to beat a person to death. It is a very willfull act.
” What’s disturbing is, these officers and
the police chief really didn’t believe they
did anything wrong.”
I’ve seen a lot of cop comments much as you say. They just can’t, or won’t see actions as wrong. Look at how defensive LE was of the newspaper ladies shot in the Dorner hunt.
” Or of course he was thrashing about as
someone being denied air will do.”
Nor will cops recognize that if you send the message that you aren’t taking prisoners today, all reason to try to surrender becomes worthless.
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