Posted on 01/10/2014 8:28:53 AM PST by SeekAndFind
Drug addicts are not master thieves. They are very limited in their ability get money by theft.
They usually don't think very clearly. Plus, people can usually spot them from a mile away and recognize them and prepare to prevent theft. Drug users usually get arrested quickly and then identify other drug users and drug dealers.
“You are very unrealistic in your belief that drug addicts have some enormous ability to make money.”
I never said they could make millions, just that they weren’t limited by their own budget. An addict is not just going to give up if the price goes up, they are going to steal more, scam more, and prostitute themselves more to get the money, if they can. If all else fails, they’ll try to steal the drugs instead of paying for them.
What I think is unrealistic is thinking that just arresting dealers is going to price people out of the market. We’ve been doing that aggressively for what, 40 plus years now? You can’t argue the sentences are not harsh, or the budgets for enforcement are paltry. How much more of an effect can we hope to squeeze from enforcement?
they don’t have to be master thieves, they’re DEDICATED thieves, and motivated. The simple fact is in a world where most people go to work leaving empty houses being a thief is pretty easy, get in the backyard, break a window, go in, empty the house. Sorry but they aren’t that easy to spot, and they don’t get arrested that often. My nephew-in-law is a junky who has supported his habit mostly through theft, during the course of the family slowly but surely accepting that there’s a scumbag among we opened one of his dresser drawer and it had THOUSANDS of pawn slips. He’d been robbing the neighborhood blind for years, and the only thing he’s EVER been arrested for is getting caught with paraphernalia, which is punished by a fine, that he doesn’t pay. If the price of heroin tripled it would just mean more of David’s neighbors’ stuff would wind up at the pawn shop.
“What I think is unrealistic is thinking that just arresting dealers is going to price people out of the market”
It is not just the actual price of drugs, it is the lack of availability. Drug addicts usually don’t have strong work ethics and having to search through dangerous areas and pay a higher price is a lot more effective than you think.
In many areas incompetent, corrupt politicians are in charge. The drug laws are not enforced. People look the other way. That is the situation where drug dealing is widespread.
Arrest them. Take their drugs. Take their money. It works.
I know someone who was in the wrong place at the wrong time this week. He “gave a ride” to a cousin to a certain house and was soon surrounded by armed men in plain clothes. They arrested someone with a lot of cocaine or some such. They detained and questioned everyone else.
He said his first real instinct, which he overrode, seeing a man pull a gun on him from outside the car was to run him over. He had no idea they were cops at the time, they did not announce that.
It would be great if what you say is true, but I just can’t believe it. Even in countries that are much harsher than we ever could be, where there are public executions for dealers and traffickers, they can’t solve this problem through enforcement.
So the family and the neighbors are clueless and unable to defend themselves while this drug addict breaks windows to break into their houses, steals them blind and takes things to get pawned. I assume the drug addict does not have a job.
I don't mean to be rude but either your story is untrue or your family and neighbors are incredibly naive. If everyone in the world was as naive as your family and your neighbors then maybe your theory would bear scrutiny. Most people would have figured this out much sooner and would have had him arrested.
Just because countries have harsh laws on the books and execute a few drug dealers does not mean that government officials are involved in the drug trade. The executions are often competitors to the government drug traffic.
And he was a thief before he was a junky, takes money to get a drug habit. Certainly a big chunk of it was the family not taking the raising of him seriously and kicking him out of the house.
How are the neighbors supposed to know? They go to work, they live their life, one day they go into the storage shed and stuff they could have sworn was there isn’t. They don’t know when it disappeared, and they don’t know who took it. House “cleanings” are pretty rare, though they’ll happen, mostly it’s about grabbing enough stuff for one fix and getting out. Of course even when they do “clean” a house it’s a basic suburban neighborhood, there’s thousands of other houses within walking distance, and a “cleaned” house can provide enough dope for months.
You’re living in the land of theory, out here in the land of reality you’ll NEVER price junkies out of the market.
I don't want to argue, families and neighbors are victims of drug users.
It is not just the price, it is the lack of availability.
If your nephew-in-law had been arrested and sent to prison it would have solved a lot of the problems. It would have helped if your family had taken the thousands of pawn slips and turned him in.
It would have been great if he’d been sent to prison, but one thing I’ve learned with his situation is the bar to actually go to prison is pretty high. He gets fined a lot and doesn’t pay them. Pawn slips won’t get him sent to jail, probably most of those people didn’t even realize their stuff was stolen, and even if they did they didn’t have the serial numbers, so there’s no way to say this circular saw is their circular saw.
Part of the problem with trying to end drug problems at the dealer is that you make it more profitable, and when it’s more profitable more people want to enter the business. Dealers like it when other dealers get busted, it’s good for business.
“the bar to actually go to prison is pretty high”
Part of the problem is that the law is not enforced. I agree. I think he should have been arrested and sent to prison.
“Dealers like it when other dealers get busted”
Don’t just arrest other dealers, arrest all dealers. If you increase the probability that they will be arrested, all their assets will be seized and thay will face a long prison term it will help.
Arrest them. Take their drugs. Take their money.
In order to arrest them first you have to catch them. Black market economies are hard to bust up. When there’s a demand and a supply there will always be sellers.
And we are going to avoid the same pitfalls how exactly?
“Black market economies are hard to bust up. When there’s a demand and a supply there will always be sellers.”
I agree.
But make it as difficult as possible for them to succeed and profit. Make the risk as great as possible. Arrest as many as we can. Take their money and seize their assets.
“And we are going to avoid the same pitfalls how exactly?”
As long as there are corrupt and incompetent people running the government bad things will happen.
Because our Drug Warriors are such honest, upstanding, incorruptible heroes, we don't have that problem!
The Governor and all of the hippie scumbags that pretend to be LE in Burlington can't pick out the dope dealers from the local citizenry?
The Governor and his kind are lunatics that ought to be locked up.
Real cops could take care of the Heroin problem in Burlington in 30 days.
If there's heroin in Vermont and Missouri its because LE isn't doing it's job.
The Governor of Vermont is a demented socialist asshole, and the blood of every kid that dies of an overdose is on his hands.
It's not just the welfare. I live in Vermont and even a few years ago it wasn't a big deal to keep your doors unlocked at nigh. A bank or store robbery here was BIG news. Now break-ins and robberies are an everyday thing.
We've tried the war on drugs for 40 years now and it is hard to see how it has even put a dent in the sale and use of drugs. I'm no fan of Shummy the Nose but I'd be willing to try something else.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.