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Kansas' anti-gay bill: another attempt to force warped Christianity on others
The Guardian ^ | February 17, 2014 | Jill Filipovic

Posted on 02/18/2014 8:05:47 PM PST by 2ndDivisionVet

Conservatives keep trying to use America's religious freedom as a way to limit everyone else's rights.

Last week, the Kansas House of Representatives passed a bill (pdf) that would have broadly legalized discrimination against gays and lesbians. Luckily, after national outrage, the bill was halted. But the fight isn't over: the bill's reliance on religious freedom to justify discrimination is a sign of right-wing efforts to come.

The bill's scope was impressive in its expansiveness: Kansans would have been able to legally refuse to provide just about any service to anyone whose relationship they dislike for religious reasons, and could have refused to provide services "related to" any relationship they dislike for religious reasons. The bill specifically enumerated adoption, foster care, counseling, social services, employment and employment benefits, as well as the general categories of "services, accommodations, advantages, facilities, goods, or privileges", as permissible areas for discrimination.

In other words, under the bill, any individual Kansan could have hung a "No Gays, No Lesbians, No Dogs" sign on the door of his restaurant. Any individual Kansan could have refused to hire someone, serve someone a drink, rent someone an apartment, sell someone a pair of pants or accommodate someone at a hotel if that someone is gay. Any employer could even have refused to extend insurance coverage to a gay employee's husband or wife if he thinks same-sex marriage is wrong. Even government employees paid with everyone's tax dollars would have had carte blanche to discriminate – social workers don't have to work with gay couples, police officers don't have to come to the assistance of a gay person in need....

(Excerpt) Read more at theguardian.com ...


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Constitution/Conservatism; Culture/Society; Government
KEYWORDS: homosexualagenda; kansas; lavendermafia; samesexmarriage

1 posted on 02/18/2014 8:05:47 PM PST by 2ndDivisionVet
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

It’s a private business, you commie Guardianistas.

Kansans, you should pressure your legislature to MOVE THESE PROTECTIONS FORWARD!


2 posted on 02/18/2014 8:11:38 PM PST by Viennacon
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To: Viennacon

Can businesses hang a “No Christians” sign on the door?


3 posted on 02/18/2014 8:12:54 PM PST by christx30 (Freedom above all.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Why do the liberals decry efforts to “force” what they call a warped view of Christianity on others, while they are forcing homosexual marriage and other aspects of the “gay” agenda on all of us through the courts?

So, are you only forcing something on others if you are coming from a conservative or religious point of view, but forcing a liberal view is not officially being forced on people??? What am I missing???


4 posted on 02/18/2014 8:12:55 PM PST by Dilbert San Diego (TH)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

“under the bill, any individual Kansan could have hung a “No Gays, No Lesbians, No Dogs”

keep the dogs, the rest of the animals however..


5 posted on 02/18/2014 8:14:36 PM PST by max americana (fired liberals in our company last election, and I laughed while they cried (true story))
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

So in other words, only religious people should be discriminated against, but not gays. sheesh.


6 posted on 02/18/2014 8:14:58 PM PST by PrairieLady2
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

The Guardian... don’t they have a queen’s ass to kiss? “Royalty”... what’s wrong with these people?


7 posted on 02/18/2014 8:15:18 PM PST by Ray76 (How modern liberals think: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eaE98w1KZ-c)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

If people are behaving themselves, how would a service provider know if people are straight, gay, or whatever? Why would they turn away business? Another niche for obtrusive government?


8 posted on 02/18/2014 8:15:31 PM PST by The_Media_never_lie (The media must be defeated any way it can be done.)
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To: Viennacon

The higher disease rate and lower life expectancy of gays are a product of Christianity. Wow, I’ll have to remember that!


9 posted on 02/18/2014 8:15:31 PM PST by JimSEA
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Even if fairly gun friendly states like Arizona a private business or private home may ban firearms even if the gun owner has a permit.

It would seem if a business can suspend the second amendment right, which is quite clearly spelled out, they should be able to ban make believe rights as well.


10 posted on 02/18/2014 8:17:06 PM PST by Random Access
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

I’m looking for an “article” where Little Jilly addresses that “warped” Islam.


11 posted on 02/18/2014 8:17:51 PM PST by FlingWingFlyer (As government expands, liberty contracts. - President Ronald W. Reagan)
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To: FlingWingFlyer

Don’t hold your breathe while you look.


12 posted on 02/18/2014 8:19:03 PM PST by 2ndDivisionVet (I will raise $2M for Sarah Palin's next run, what will you do?)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Christians are soooo warped!

13 posted on 02/18/2014 8:19:28 PM PST by Baynative (Got bulbs? Check my profile page.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

freedom of association does not require any religion


14 posted on 02/18/2014 8:19:52 PM PST by GeronL (Vote for Conservatives not for Republicans!)
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To: FlingWingFlyer

Since she also works for Al Jazeera, don’t expect any.


15 posted on 02/18/2014 8:20:39 PM PST by Olog-hai
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

The only people forcing anything on anyone are gays. If a business owner turns them down as a result of conflict of conscience, Gays can always go elsewhere. There are plenty of people who put money first who are happy to serve gays. Why should gays be allowed to force their immorality on people who want nothing to do with it? Let gays start their own cake and wedding businesses, catering to gay couples, and let them refuse to serve whomever they please. If culturally ignorant leftists want to celebrate their unity with gays, let them use gay services. Christians don’t care.


16 posted on 02/18/2014 8:22:15 PM PST by pallis
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
Don't think these folks are as crazy as they sound when expressing their pretzel logic.

They know it's total BS.

Their goal is to establish a meme within the ignorant and stupid...which they cultivate into a cultural norm...and VOTES.

They are about as low as humans get.

17 posted on 02/18/2014 8:22:21 PM PST by Mariner (War Criminal #18)
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To: christx30

A private business? Yes. If a Muslim runs a restaurant and does not wish to serve me, I’ll go elsewhere. If a Hindu runs a juice bar and does not wish to serve me, I have no right to compel him to do so with force.

It is BASIC liberty to have the freedom to refuse to provide a product or service.


18 posted on 02/18/2014 8:23:51 PM PST by Viennacon
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
One last note on this matter:

It's just like firing someone in the modern era. You NEVER tell them they are fired "for cause" and you NEVER give them a reason why you're letting them go, except their job has been eliminated.

If somebody doesn't want to serve homo's, they just should not say it's because they're homo.

19 posted on 02/18/2014 8:26:02 PM PST by Mariner (War Criminal #18)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
Anyone with some free time should search “Pat Condell” on youtube.He's a Brit who's not only “spot on” regarding The Religion of Pieces but also has some worthwhile comments about The Guardian.
20 posted on 02/18/2014 8:27:49 PM PST by Gay State Conservative (Obama: "I can do whatever I want")
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

I am amazed at the number of people who do not understand the difference between refusing to celebrate an anti-religious event and serving people who you might find personally objectionable.

If you work in a field that can be used to further the homosexual agenda (like a baker who makes wedding cakes), you are currently REQUIRED to surrender your right to free exercise of religion, should a homosexual request you to serve their agenda.


21 posted on 02/18/2014 8:29:16 PM PST by MortMan (Is a delayed shower a "stay of exablution"?)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

I was trying to get through the comments on the website. Gave up. The vitriol towards Biblical Christians is astounding. The Devil knows his time is short, and he’s not happy about it at all.


22 posted on 02/18/2014 8:33:11 PM PST by Dogbert41 (Up yours NSA !)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

***n other words, under the bill, any individual Kansan could have hung a “No Gays, No Lesbians, No Dogs” sign on the door of his restaurant. Any individual Kansan could have refused to hire someone, serve someone a drink, rent someone an apartment, sell someone a pair of pants or accommodate someone at a hotel if that someone is gay.***

I thought Jill Filipovic was going to give us some bad news.


23 posted on 02/18/2014 8:40:30 PM PST by Paulie (Buy local, bank local, exert your influence locally; the left will fold like a cheap suit.)
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To: Dogbert41

God needs His warriors here on earth , active , now


24 posted on 02/18/2014 8:41:16 PM PST by LeoWindhorse
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Overreaction much.

The Bill’s supporters need to run ads featuring the businesses punished for practicing their Faith by gays who claim their “marriage” won’t impact heterosexuals.


25 posted on 02/18/2014 8:52:23 PM PST by RginTN
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To: Viennacon
It is BASIC liberty to have the freedom to refuse to provide a product or service.

Which is why the FedGov doesn't want you to have it.

26 posted on 02/18/2014 9:02:29 PM PST by OneWingedShark (Q: Why am I here? A: To do Justly, to love mercy, and to walk humbly with my God.)
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To: christx30
Can businesses hang a “No Christians” sign on the door?

No. Religion, race, sex and national origin are protected classes under the Civil Rights Act of 1964. (Sexual orientation is not protected under federal law, but is under the laws of some states.)

27 posted on 02/18/2014 9:03:30 PM PST by Lurking Libertarian (Non sub homine, sed sub Deo et lege)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet; All

It’s hard to single out a starting point to critique that article.

To begin with, Christians need to remember not to be a stumbling block (are you listening Wesborough Baptist Church?) for people who are struggling with homosexuality and/or being bullied by pro-gay activists and would be receptive to the good news of Jesus. This is evidenced by 1 Corinthians 6:9-11 which indicates that certain members of that church had formerly been involved in same-sex sexual relationships, but had evidently repented and accepted God’s grace to turn their lives around.

Regarding the article referenced in the OP, take Christian cake-makers for example. Wouldn’t competing, non-Christian bakeries appreciate their competitive edge concerning their willingness to make cakes for anybody who patronized their business?

Also, one state shouldn’t care what businesses in another state are doing as long as everybody respects everybody else’s constitutionally enumerated rights.

Also, how was the so-called national rage determined? Or is that just a pro-gay media fabrication to give gays a safty in numbers feeling?

As mentioned in related threads, the states have never amended the Constitution to protect so-called gay rights. So the states are free to make laws which discriminate against the gay agenda, as long as such laws don’t also unreasonably abridge constitutionally enumerated rights.


28 posted on 02/18/2014 9:14:35 PM PST by Amendment10
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

ALL “anti-discrimination” laws are unconstitutional viewpoint discrimination when applied to private businesses or individuals, because the law must subjugate one party’s views under the other. The ONLY option is for the government to stay completely out of it, letting people run their businesses into which they’ve invested their own fortunes, time and massive efforts, all at the great risk of unknown success or failure.


29 posted on 02/18/2014 9:27:03 PM PST by fwdude ( You cannot compromise with that which you must defeat.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Clearly, Jill Filipovic is a perfect example of the fact that when enough people cover themselves in horse sh*t, the whole planet begins to praise sh*t.


30 posted on 02/18/2014 9:42:14 PM PST by Jack Hammer
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To: fwdude

Except of course, the civil rights mandates on private businesses from 1964 have withstood all constitutional challenges.

Of course the vast majority of people have no issues with government saying you cannot discriminate in a business on the basis of RACE, COLOR, NATIONAL ORIGIN, RELIGION, GENDER, or DISABILITY (since the ‘90s). But of course piggybacking the FAKE category of “sexual orientation” (since when does a chosen sexual behavior make you a minority?) onto that laundry list is extremely easy for the courts to do, even though, by default....it automatically discriminates against people of religion.


31 posted on 02/18/2014 10:01:30 PM PST by AnalogReigns (Real life is ANALOG!)
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To: christx30

“Can businesses hang a “No Christians” sign on the door?”

I would certainly hope so, since it’s called freedom of association or just plain freedom. The Supreme Court likely disagrees, but they don’t exactly have a very good record of protecting constitutional rights beyond abortion (which isn’t really a constitutional right in the first place, but they claim it is and act as though it’s the SUPREME right).

BTW, I’m a Christian, and I have no problem with anti-Christian bigots who don’t want my business. I’ll simply take that business elsewhere. That’s what people do in a free country. Liberty gets messy of course. Some people might even get offended, but freedom is worth a bit of offense from time to time.

Also, the constitution was written to restrain GOVERNMENT, not private citizens; therefore, the government is absolutely prohibited from showing favoritism or discriminating against anyone on the basis of constitutionally protected differences like race, sex, or religion.

Those prohibitions were never intended to apply to private citizens conducting business on their own property of course. Your rights do not give you the right to force me to associate with you on my property.


32 posted on 02/18/2014 10:16:26 PM PST by CitizenUSA (Sodomy and abortion: the only constitutional rights cherished by Democrats.)
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To: Random Access

You’re absolutely right. Your 2nd Amendment rights do not give you the right to carry weapons on other people’s private property, although private citizens have limited ability to enforce a gun ban beyond maybe asking you to leave.

The constitution was written to restrain government, not We the People. The 2nd Amendment applies to government in that it—the government—cannot infringe on our right to bear weapons. The thought of gun restrictions on private property was probably never even contemplated at the time as that has nothing to do with a restriction meant for the federal government.

The constitution was clearly and wisely written to put the federal government in a straight jacket of enumerated powers. It wasn’t meant to restrain We the People, because our rights are God-given, i.e. greater than the government’s.


33 posted on 02/18/2014 10:28:53 PM PST by CitizenUSA (Sodomy and abortion: the only constitutional rights cherished by Democrats.)
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To: pallis

You make some excellent points. If homosexuals want to be a constitutionally protected class, all they have to do is pass a constitutional amendment. They are trying to go around that of course by claiming equal treatment under the laws. Why? Because they don’t have anywhere near enough supporters to pass a constitutional amendment. Nevertheless, that’s how it’s done in a nation of laws.

BTW, if they choose to subvert the law and constitution like they’re currently doing by getting judges to overturn laws like super legislators, then the homosexualists deserve as much derision and push back as we can give. Barbarians don’t deserve any respect, and that’s exactly what they are.


34 posted on 02/18/2014 10:36:47 PM PST by CitizenUSA (Sodomy and abortion: the only constitutional rights cherished by Democrats.)
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To: christx30

No. Only government is allowed to do that.


35 posted on 02/18/2014 10:39:54 PM PST by Ackackadack
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To: Lurking Libertarian

A business couldn’t legally ban Christians, but the Civil Rights Act of 1964 is clearly unconstitutional. The government can’t amend the constitution via law, and those class protections restrain government, not citizens. The 14th Amendment extended those protections to states (state governments), but again, nowhere in the constitution does it say I can’t discriminate on the basis of sex, race, or religion so long as I’m not acting in government capacity, like an official.

If I’m wrong, please point me to the area of the constitution that limits my right to associate or not associate with whoever I want.


36 posted on 02/18/2014 10:48:22 PM PST by CitizenUSA (Sodomy and abortion: the only constitutional rights cherished by Democrats.)
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To: AnalogReigns

Just because most Americans agree with the Civil Right Act, it doesn’t mean the act is constitutional. I fully understand that’s where we stand today, but the Supreme Court has rewritten the constitution in virtually every area. That doesn’t make it right, but it is the way things are done these days.

I should add that whenever the Supreme Court tries to act as a super legislature, it simply creates further malfeasance and chaos. If, on the other hand, it stuck with strictly interpreting the law, then we could still join together on issues that have overwhelming public support (like the right of government to force you to do business with people you don’t want) and amend the constitution.

An amendment isn’t easy of course, but it practically guarantees broad support for whatever is passed. It also eliminates a lack of respect for law and continual conflict created by courts who make up the law as they go.


37 posted on 02/18/2014 10:56:20 PM PST by CitizenUSA (Sodomy and abortion: the only constitutional rights cherished by Democrats.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Kansas’ anti-gay bill: another attempt to resist warped progressive ideology from being forced on the moral majority.


38 posted on 02/18/2014 11:43:52 PM PST by clearcarbon
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
Dear Jill,

Is it an inability to understand or a refusal?

An American Expat in Southeast Asia

39 posted on 02/19/2014 12:08:52 AM PST by expatguy (Donate to "An American Expat in SE Asia")
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To: christx30

If the law passed? Yes. Unless they write it to only protect Christian Kansas.


40 posted on 02/19/2014 12:39:22 AM PST by AnAmericanInEngland
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
Normal people must be forced to accept those who sodomize each other,
and spread their diseases. Immorality cannot be tolerated in a civil society
and Homosexuality is as immoral as it gets. They will all burn in hell no matter
how many people they force to accept their Perversion! And yes, I can judge them,
I just cannot sentence them to hell, God will take care of that.
41 posted on 02/19/2014 4:19:40 AM PST by MaxMax (Pay Attention and you'll be pissed off too! FIRE BOEHNER, NOW!)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

These whiners don’t know how good they’ve got it here. In countries controlled by that other religion, a girl can be stoned to death for having a Facebook page.


42 posted on 02/19/2014 4:26:11 AM PST by al_c (Obama's standing in the world has fallen so much that Kenya now claims he was born in America.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Sure...the Christians are warped.....never mind the fudge packers.....how the hell did we get to this????


43 posted on 02/19/2014 5:10:47 AM PST by ontap
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To: christx30

Not yet—but they can send their private army Either the gay activists —or the ACLU and it’s umbrella of anti-American activists in to threaten a long and costly legal case where the Christian can expect to go before a hostile and anti-Christian Judge.


44 posted on 02/19/2014 5:15:28 AM PST by StonyBurk (ring)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Does Spok remember American history—how same sex behavior/Sodomy was a Crime of Infamy worthy of death. When the First Amendment protections applied only to Christians? — When Marriage was defined by the Courts as the union for life of one man and one woman in the holy estate of Matrimony-when the Rights of Conscience were protected by Law — and Sundays under our US Constitution and by Law a Dies Non —When congress was not ashamed to petition the President to proclaim National Days of Prayer and Thanksgiving-and/or National Days of Humiliation ,Fasting ,and Prayer as the situation merited.Does this Gay Activist of the Gaurdian know anything about American history?Or is she a product of American Progressive Education?


45 posted on 02/19/2014 5:22:28 AM PST by StonyBurk (ring)
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To: CitizenUSA
If I’m wrong, please point me to the area of the constitution that limits my right to associate or not associate with whoever I want.

The U.S. Supreme Court upheld the constitutionality of the Public Accommodations Act of 1964 (part of the Civil Rights Act of 1964) as a valid exercise of Congress's power to regulate interstate commerce, on the theory that racial discrimination in hotels and restaurants in the south limited the ability of blacks to travel to those states.

46 posted on 02/19/2014 9:43:08 AM PST by Lurking Libertarian (Non sub homine, sed sub Deo et lege)
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To: Lurking Libertarian

The commerce clause has been used to perpetuate more unconstitutional crap than any other words in the Constitution.

Freedom of association is a basic freedom.


47 posted on 02/19/2014 10:35:08 AM PST by jimt (Fear is the darkroom where negatives are developed.)
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To: jimt
Freedom of association is a basic freedom.

In personal matters, certainly. In business, not so clear; even at English common law, certain businesses (inns, ferry boats, stagecoaches) were required to serve "any peaceable subject of the King" who paid the posted rate.

48 posted on 02/19/2014 10:45:15 AM PST by Lurking Libertarian (Non sub homine, sed sub Deo et lege)
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