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First Presbyterian narrowly votes to stay with denomination.
Houston Chronicle ^ | February 23, 2014 | Mike Tolson |

Posted on 02/23/2014 11:28:04 PM PST by Cincinatus' Wife

A hard-fought effort to move one of Houston's iconic Christian churches from its long-standing denomination to a new, more conservative group narrowly failed Sunday, with the congregation voting heavily in favor of the move but falling short of the supermajority needed for approval.

The leadership of First Presbyterian Church, which was established shortly after Houston's founding, had unanimously endorsed the move from Presbyterian Church USA to the breakaway denomination called ECO, A Covenant Order of Evangelical Presbyterians. The senior pastor, his staff, and the elected leaders from the congregation argued that PCUSA, the nation's largest Presbyterian body, had become too liberal and had drifted from the church's theological foundation. But the final count fell 36 votes short out of 1,681 ballots cast.

"This is the toughest possible outcome in many people's minds,"...............

(Excerpt) Read more at chron.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Extended News; News/Current Events; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: abortion; celebratesin; christianity; cultureofcorruption; eco; gayministers; homosexualagenda; houston; israel; pcusa; religion; samesexmarriage

1 posted on 02/23/2014 11:28:05 PM PST by Cincinatus' Wife
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To: Cincinatus' Wife

Ugh, why stay on the dying tree?


2 posted on 02/23/2014 11:31:48 PM PST by Viennacon
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To: Cincinatus' Wife

Why on earth would one stay in a church one fundamentally disagrees with?

Leave!


3 posted on 02/23/2014 11:38:32 PM PST by DakotaGator (Weep for the lost Republic! And keep your powder dry!!)
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To: Cincinatus' Wife

It is well known that Gaystapo members will infiltrate these meetings to perpetrate voter fraud to jam up these decisions. And they likely have facilitators within the church’s ranks.


4 posted on 02/23/2014 11:41:51 PM PST by fwdude ( You cannot compromise with that which you must defeat.)
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To: Viennacon; DakotaGator

It would seem that people are taking a stand where they can.

They’re tired of the Left taking over everything in order to advance their agenda.


5 posted on 02/23/2014 11:43:44 PM PST by Cincinatus' Wife
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To: Cincinatus' Wife
Understand and applaud their “taking a stand”. They lost.

Now the best thing they can do is leave en masse. To stay is to support the very thing they abhor. Time to shift to a church which supports their values instead of spitting in their faces.

6 posted on 02/23/2014 11:53:28 PM PST by DakotaGator (Weep for the lost Republic! And keep your powder dry!!)
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To: Gamecock
No barb intended, but why the ed ECO, A Covenant Order of Evangelical Presbyterians? Aren't there the OCP and PCA?
7 posted on 02/24/2014 12:06:40 AM PST by Cronos (Obama’s dislike of Assad is not based on Assad’s brutality but that he isn't a jihadi Moslem)
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Comment #8 Removed by Moderator

To: Cincinatus' Wife
The senior pastor, his staff, and the elected leaders from the congregation argued that PCUSA, the nation's largest Presbyterian body, had become too liberal and had drifted from the church's theological foundation. But the final count fell 36 votes short out of 1,681 ballots cast.

And who says that attendance at church/voting never changes anything.

9 posted on 02/24/2014 2:35:35 AM PST by a fool in paradise ("Health care is too important to be left to the government.")
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To: Cincinatus' Wife

The outcome of staying in a liberal church is predictable.


10 posted on 02/24/2014 2:49:19 AM PST by sr4402
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To: Cronos

I think that is a breakaway group that is only slightly more conservative than the PCUSA. They left the PCUSA but don’t want the theological rigor of the PCA, OPC, or even the EPC. I’ll have to do some reasons to confirm that.


11 posted on 02/24/2014 3:13:41 AM PST by Gamecock (Grace is not opposed to human activity. It's opposed to human merit. MSH)
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To: sr4402; All
Creation Care network: Global warming - environmentalism/socialism's infiltration into churches

National Religious Coalition on Creation Care

More at NRCCC: Long-term member of Creation Care science advisers NASA's James Hansen sends message to NRCCC on the importance of stopping the Keystone XL Pipeline

12 posted on 02/24/2014 3:14:00 AM PST by Cincinatus' Wife
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To: Cronos

They want to continue ordaining women is the big reason.


13 posted on 02/24/2014 4:00:26 AM PST by armydoc
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To: Cronos

perhaps they weren’t invited to OCP or PCA


14 posted on 02/24/2014 4:05:49 AM PST by xzins ( Retired Army Chaplain and Proud of It! Those who truly support our troops pray for victory!)
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To: Cronos

After a little more reading it appears that they want to keep the PCUSA, but without the gay issue.

They will continue the other liberal policies, such as women being ordained as ministers.


15 posted on 02/24/2014 5:07:18 AM PST by Gamecock (Grace is not opposed to human activity. It's opposed to human merit. MSH)
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To: Viennacon; Cronos
So here is my take.

x number of members have had enough and realize that the PCUSA is apostate. They voted to leave.

y realize that there is a problem but don't feel comfortable with change and thing they can fight off the wolves howling at the door.

z are apostate and are died in the wool PCUSA and are lock step with what this denomination are doing.

Y and Z, whether Y recognizes it or not, have crawled into bed together and as a result that church will continue to spiral out of control.

16 posted on 02/24/2014 5:12:08 AM PST by Gamecock (Grace is not opposed to human activity. It's opposed to human merit. MSH)
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To: Cronos

There are.
Wondering about this too......I’ m PCA and our denomination separated from the USA mainline 30 plus years ago.
Whyever would this pastor remain in an apostate church?


17 posted on 02/24/2014 5:32:53 AM PST by Guenevere
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To: Gamecock

ok, to me (as you would say of course! :) it makes more sense for a united, conservative church


18 posted on 02/24/2014 7:26:46 AM PST by Cronos (Obama’s dislike of Assad is not based on Assad’s brutality but that he isn't a jihadi Moslem)
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To: armydoc; Gamecock; xzins
amrydoc " they want to continue ordaining women" --> idiots.

They really think that in a few years they won't say "ok, why not homosexuals?"

Darn that slippery slope. This is a lesson for all of us. each little step looks so easy: "why not divorce", "why not legalise hom sexua lity"? and then wa-bang we get to here.

19 posted on 02/24/2014 7:28:29 AM PST by Cronos (Obama’s dislike of Assad is not based on Assad’s brutality but that he isn't a jihadi Moslem)
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To: Gamecock

exactly. Are “Y” so idiotic that they don’t see the path cleared laid out? It’s been repeated so many times by so many denominations. Idiots


20 posted on 02/24/2014 7:29:37 AM PST by Cronos (Obama’s dislike of Assad is not based on Assad’s brutality but that he isn't a jihadi Moslem)
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To: Gamecock

Where does “1st Pres” stand on corporate decisions by PCUSA to stand with Palestinians in calling for divestment from Israel?


21 posted on 02/24/2014 8:40:11 AM PST by a fool in paradise ("Health care is too important to be left to the government.")
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To: a fool in paradise

I dunno, not a member.


22 posted on 02/24/2014 8:41:04 AM PST by Gamecock (Grace is not opposed to human activity. It's opposed to human merit. MSH)
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To: Cincinatus' Wife

Wasn’t there an scandal about a decade or so ago where a minister there had an adulterous affair? I didn’t hear too much about it but I thought he had to step down in shame.

Having an active homosexual minister would be hypocritical, celebrating the sins of one while denouncing another for being a sinner.


23 posted on 02/24/2014 8:43:26 AM PST by a fool in paradise ("Health care is too important to be left to the government.")
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To: Gamecock
Me neither, but I'm interested in Presbyterian churches around town that reject PCUSA’s platform that looks much like CPUSA’s.

With $100million in holdings, PCUSA didn't want to lose a member church like First Presbyterian.

24 posted on 02/24/2014 8:46:22 AM PST by a fool in paradise ("Health care is too important to be left to the government.")
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To: Cincinatus' Wife

If it’s that close, a large minority are being forced to “eat it”! Break away, and buy the church back when it goes bankrupt.


25 posted on 02/24/2014 9:40:05 AM PST by SgtHooper (If at first you don't succeed, skydiving is not for you.)
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To: Cronos

Yes, the biblical hermeneutic that gets you to ordaining women is the same one that gets you to condoning homosexuality


26 posted on 02/24/2014 11:41:56 AM PST by armydoc
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To: armydoc

PCUSA’s problem wasn’t ordaining women. It was Louisville’s insistence that churches have quotas. Prebyterians have always been independent minded. If a church wanted a gay pastor, they didn’t want anyone telling them they couldn’t have one.

The Lutherans had a pastor who abandoned his wife and children to take up with his gay lover. And they made him a Bishop!!


27 posted on 02/24/2014 11:48:29 AM PST by AppyPappy
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To: Cincinatus' Wife

Everything is liberal in downtown Houston. No surprise


28 posted on 02/24/2014 1:52:15 PM PST by Theodore R. (Alas: TX Republicans to endorse Cornball and George P! Stay tuned March 4)
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To: Cincinatus' Wife

Sad that this was even close


29 posted on 02/24/2014 1:54:21 PM PST by GeronL (Vote for Conservatives not for Republicans!)
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To: Cincinatus' Wife

More than half voted for the change, maybe they should look for a new church to join?


30 posted on 02/24/2014 1:55:06 PM PST by GeronL (Vote for Conservatives not for Republicans!)
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To: DakotaGator

The men stay because the wives, with their social network in church, insist that they do. It’s about social networking, not the gospel.


31 posted on 02/24/2014 1:55:17 PM PST by Theodore R. (Alas: TX Republicans to endorse Cornball and George P! Stay tuned March 4)
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To: Theodore R.

Understand. Sadly, that is why decency loses.


32 posted on 02/24/2014 7:30:22 PM PST by DakotaGator (Weep for the lost Republic! And keep your powder dry!!)
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