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FBI suspected iconic 1964 Ali-Liston fight was rigged by mob
The Washington Times ^ | 2/24/2014 | By Thom Loverro

Posted on 02/24/2014 9:00:19 PM PST by Mariner

Fifty years ago today, Muhammad Ali “shocked the world” and beat one of the most fearsome fighters ever to put on a pair of boxing gloves, heavyweight champion Sonny Liston.

But what if that storied fight was not what it seemed?

It happened Feb. 25, 1964, at the Miami Beach Convention Center. The film clip and sound bite have now become part of the American story — Liston quitting his stool before the eighth round, a young Cassius Clay, as Ali was known then, bouncing around the ring, waving his hands, yelling to the reporters at ringside who thought he would be killed by the more veteran boxer. “I’m king of the world! I’m king of the world!” Ali proclaimed.

Sports Illustrated named it the fourth-greatest sports moment of the 20th century. The fight also is the foundation of the Muhammad Ali story: the three-year heavyweight championship reign of dominance, followed by his three-year exile as he fought the Vietnam War draft. The Ali-Joe Frazier fights, the upset over George Foreman in Zaire, the reconstruction of Ali from a pariah to a national treasure. All of it begins with a brash Clay “shocking the world.”

(Excerpt) Read more at washingtontimes.com ...


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; Extended News; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: ali; boxing; cassiusclay; fbi; liston
I say that IF Liston took a dive, her sure got hit HARD on the way down.
1 posted on 02/24/2014 9:00:19 PM PST by Mariner
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To: Mariner

No surprise here. I always suspected that most of Cassius Clay’s big fights were rigged.


2 posted on 02/24/2014 9:06:36 PM PST by BenLurkin (This is not a statement of fact. It is either opinion or satire; or both.)
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To: BenLurkin
You don't think he knocked all those guys out?

You think Joe Frazier agrees with you? George Foreman?

3 posted on 02/24/2014 9:09:10 PM PST by Mariner
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To: Mariner

This ought to be good.


4 posted on 02/24/2014 9:11:35 PM PST by Lurkina.n.Learnin (This is not just stupid, we're talking Democrat stupid here.)
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To: Mariner

5 posted on 02/24/2014 9:11:46 PM PST by Michael.SF. (I never thought anyone could make Jimmy Carter look good in comparison.)
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To: Mariner

Angelo Dundee (Clay’s trainer)said that he couldn’t order up a better opponent from the Sears catalog for the young, swift Cassius. Liston was a slow, plodding big roundhouse puncher who was never extended more than a few rounds in years. He couldn’t hit Clay with a screen door.


6 posted on 02/24/2014 9:12:23 PM PST by Zuse
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To: Mariner

The big question in my mind is what did Howard Cosell know and when did he know it. Cosell made a name for himself pimping Cassius Clay to the American public — and seemed to think that the entire “rope-a-dope” fiasco was great fun. Didn’t bother Howard a bit when Clay weaseled his way out of serving his country.


7 posted on 02/24/2014 9:12:58 PM PST by BenLurkin (This is not a statement of fact. It is either opinion or satire; or both.)
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To: Mariner

Agreed. And what was the point of trying to blind Clay with the ointment if he knew he planning to throw the fight?


8 posted on 02/24/2014 9:13:17 PM PST by GrootheWanderer
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To: Mariner

A prize fight fixed by organized crime in America? What next?


9 posted on 02/24/2014 9:14:47 PM PST by 2ndDivisionVet (I will raise $2M for Sarah Palin's next run, what will you do?)
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To: BenLurkin
"Didn’t bother Howard a bit when Clay weaseled his way out of serving his country."

Is this the origin of your refusal to recognize his talent?

That's like saying Kate Upton is ugly because she cast her first vote for Obama.

10 posted on 02/24/2014 9:16:09 PM PST by Mariner
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To: Mariner
They really should have investigated the Second Ali-Liston fight in May 1965. Liston clearly took a dive in the first round. Funny they wasted their time on the first fight, in which Liston took an unexpected beating. My guess is this is all unearthing of misinformation which an inept and compromised FBI swallowed uncritically.
11 posted on 02/24/2014 9:17:23 PM PST by hinckley buzzard
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To: Mariner

Or, John Lennon couldn’t sing because he was a commie.


12 posted on 02/24/2014 9:17:34 PM PST by Mariner
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To: Mariner

Well, I don’t know...are her famous assets real — or are they Memorex?

;^)


13 posted on 02/24/2014 9:18:11 PM PST by BenLurkin (This is not a statement of fact. It is either opinion or satire; or both.)
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To: BenLurkin

They jiggle real:)


14 posted on 02/24/2014 9:18:46 PM PST by Mariner
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To: Mariner

John Lennon was a no talent hack. And no, he couldn’t sing for a damn— even if he’d been part of “Up With People.”

(I’m really grouchy today. Need to catch up on my Metamucil)


15 posted on 02/24/2014 9:19:57 PM PST by BenLurkin (This is not a statement of fact. It is either opinion or satire; or both.)
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To: Mariner
I know I will catch hell for this: Clay (or was he Ali by then?) gave up his crown for his beliefs.

The man put his money where his mouth is, no arguing that, and that says a lot about him.

16 posted on 02/24/2014 9:20:22 PM PST by Michael.SF. (I never thought anyone could make Jimmy Carter look good in comparison.)
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To: Mariner; All
"FBI suspected iconic 1964
Ali-Liston fight was rigged by mob"


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17 posted on 02/24/2014 9:21:34 PM PST by musicman (Until I see the REAL Long Form Vault BC, he's just "PRES__ENT" Obama = Without "ID")
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To: Mariner

I’m all in favor of that!


18 posted on 02/24/2014 9:22:34 PM PST by BenLurkin (This is not a statement of fact. It is either opinion or satire; or both.)
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To: Michael.SF.
"gave up his crown for his beliefs"

I have no problem with a GENUINE Conscientious Objector.

It's the the fraudulent pu$$ies that I would line against the wall and shoot.

19 posted on 02/24/2014 9:23:19 PM PST by Mariner
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To: Mariner

This is not a new allegation.


20 posted on 02/24/2014 9:25:44 PM PST by Bratch
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To: BenLurkin
John Lennon was a no talent hack.

Paul alone was boring, pop schmaltz.

John alone made yoko look better.

Together though, the two were a not a bad team.

21 posted on 02/24/2014 9:28:55 PM PST by Michael.SF. (I never thought anyone could make Jimmy Carter look good in comparison.)
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To: Bratch
Would you let him hit you for a million bucks? I mean, hit you as hard as he hit Liston?

Joe Frazier spent 3 weeks in the hospital recovering from a fight with Ali...and Ali spent 10 days from the same fight.

22 posted on 02/24/2014 9:29:23 PM PST by Mariner
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To: Michael.SF.
Ben is the only human on the planet that thinks John Lennon couldn't sing.

I think he's just messin' with us as no rational person could be of that opinion.

23 posted on 02/24/2014 9:31:40 PM PST by Mariner
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To: Mariner

any friend of Jim Healy’s is a friend of mine.


24 posted on 02/24/2014 9:35:36 PM PST by Michael.SF. (I never thought anyone could make Jimmy Carter look good in comparison.)
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To: Michael.SF.

25 posted on 02/24/2014 9:50:15 PM PST by Bratch
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To: Mariner
I graduated from HS in 64. (Everything seems to have happened in that year.} My fav was Joe Frazier. He put Clay where he is today. In La La land. Of coarse Joe's dead too. It was a great sport of the past. No normal person would participate in this sport today. Liston may have been a diver but the Clay/Frazier fights were some of the best ever.
26 posted on 02/24/2014 10:03:02 PM PST by deweyfrank
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To: Mariner

Jack Dempsey would have given Ali a fight. It’s fun to speculate.


27 posted on 02/24/2014 10:59:13 PM PST by Argus
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To: Bratch

My life has been an endless series of major setbacks and disappointments since seeing the Beatles in Concert in 1966.


28 posted on 02/24/2014 11:11:36 PM PST by urbanpovertylawcenter (the law and poverty collide in an urban setting and sparks fly)
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To: Mariner
Why is it the job of the tax payer supported Federal Bureau of Investigation to ensure that price fights are safe places for gamblers to bet?


29 posted on 02/25/2014 3:19:08 AM PST by nathanbedford ("Attack, repeat, attack!" Bull Halsey)
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To: Argus

Yea, but Dempsey was knocked out by J Paul Getty in a gym in LA when Dempsey was starting his career.
Dempsey then told Getty to become a pro-boxer, while Getty asked Dempsey to join him in the oil business.
Funny how things turnout.


30 posted on 02/25/2014 5:04:22 AM PST by ozdragon
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To: Mariner

Some impulse led me to bet $5.00 on Clay in that fight. Everyone thought I was crazy, including me.


31 posted on 02/25/2014 5:09:15 AM PST by billhilly
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To: BenLurkin

I agree with you about Lennon, but Ali was the real thing. He was also not the first to refuse to serve in the military.


32 posted on 02/25/2014 5:18:03 AM PST by billhilly
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To: Mariner

I was only a baby when this fight happened, but I love watching the old films of it.

It sure looks as though Liston took a dive maybe... or rather, that he was just old and tired. -is my opinion. Clay was a YOUNG, healthy lion back then. I think even if it were held in private on the up and up, Clay would’ve beat Liston.
Just because he was obnoxious and a draft dodger doesn’t take away his talent as a fighter. He was amazing to just watch in the ring.

As for the Lennon haters, say what you want. Lennon had quite a few awful years and awful records during the 70’s, but he had more talent in his pinky than today’s ‘stars’ have in their entire lives. Go listen to early Beatle records and remember that these were just 4 local kids who got a band together. They changed the face of music.
I think Clay/Ali changed the face of boxing in the same way.

sermon over. ;-)


33 posted on 02/25/2014 6:21:30 AM PST by joethedrummer
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To: Mariner

It’s OK. I’m used to being the only person on the planet to have certain various viewpoints.


34 posted on 02/25/2014 6:23:56 AM PST by BenLurkin (This is not a statement of fact. It is either opinion or satire; or both.)
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To: Mariner
If any fight was rigged, it was the rematch in Lewiston, ME where Liston fell in the first round to a "phantom punch". That's where the iconic photo was snapped of Clay triumphant over the fallen Liston.

But if it was rigged it was because the thuggish Liston owed gambling debts, not because they had any hooks in Clay who was smart enough to have never become immersed in the underworld of boxing. If Clay/Ali was "owned", he never would have taken such unpopular stands as converting to Islam and avoiding the draft which reduced his earning potential.

Replays of both Clay/Liston fights exist to this day so people can view them and make up their own minds. I can imagine Liston being told to take a dive in the rematch but I think Liston was simply unprepared for the speed, skill and psych job that Clay had prepared for Sonny, particularly in the Miami match.

35 posted on 02/25/2014 8:17:55 AM PST by OrangeHoof (2001-2008: "Dissent Is Patriotism!" 2009-2016: "Dissent Is Racism!")
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To: Mariner

In my old age I can choose to not recognize whatever I want. I don’t put accolades on any commie or liberal colostomy bag, I don’t care what they do/did.


36 posted on 02/25/2014 9:33:29 AM PST by Resolute Conservative
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To: Mariner

If you watch that footage carefully, Liston’s feet are lifted off the ground by the force of the punch to his chin. Clay nailed him but good. Maybe the mob thought they fixed it. But noone gets up from that punch.


37 posted on 02/25/2014 10:53:27 AM PST by ModelBreaker
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To: Mariner

What difference at this point does it make?

With no apologies to her Heinous, Hillary.


38 posted on 02/25/2014 11:00:30 AM PST by Westbrook (Children do not divide your love, they multiply it.)
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