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Concealed-carry Milwaukee gunman who claimed self-defense is sentenced
Milwaukee J-S ^ | 28 feb 2014 | Bruce Vielmetti

Posted on 02/28/2014 5:57:39 AM PST by rellimpank

A Milwaukee man who used his legal, concealed handgun to kill an acquaintance who started a fight with him was sentenced Thursday to 18 years in prison.

A jury last month rejected Phillip K. Green's claim of self-defense in the fatal shooting of Ernest Banks during a men's night out in May and found him guilty of first-degree reckless homicide while armed.

Other witnesses confirmed that Banks, 26, had initiated the fight and was the aggressor, but also that he was unarmed and two other men in the group had tried to get between him and Green when Green, 40, fired a single fatal shot.

Banks' family had asked Milwaukee County Circuit Judge Jeffrey Wagner to impose the maximum sentence of 40 to 45 years. Banks' brother, mother and wife spoke movingly about his role as provider and father to four boys.

Assistant District Attorney Grant Huebner said it was "not a max case." He said the fact Green has no criminal record, called 911 after the shooting and cooperated with investigators suggested a sentence of 20 to 25 years would be appropriate.

(Excerpt) Read more at jsonline.com ...


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Crime/Corruption; News/Current Events; US: Wisconsin
KEYWORDS: banglist; rkba
--and this is the first real "crime" I have seen in the media committed by a Wisconsin concealed weapons permittee--one in 200,000-
1 posted on 02/28/2014 5:57:39 AM PST by rellimpank
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To: afraidfortherepublic

—ping—


2 posted on 02/28/2014 5:58:38 AM PST by rellimpank (--don't believe anything the media or government says about firearms or explosives--)
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To: rellimpank

Statistically it has to happen once in a while. The “mens night out” implies drinking. Failure in judgement to take along a weapon.


3 posted on 02/28/2014 6:01:27 AM PST by ThunderSleeps (Stop obarma now! Stop the hussein - insane agenda!)
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To: rellimpank
--and this is the first real "crime" I have seen in the media committed by a Wisconsin concealed weapons permittee--one in 200,000-

And the enemedia will blare his name far and wide.
The lesson: While armed in public, don't let your pride make stupid decisions for you.
4 posted on 02/28/2014 6:02:07 AM PST by RandallFlagg ("I said I never had much use for one. Never said I didn't know how to use it." --Quigley)
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To: ThunderSleeps
The “mens night out” implies drinking. Failure in judgement to take along a weapon.

Indeed. I'd sooner drive with a few pops under my belt than carry a firearm.

5 posted on 02/28/2014 6:04:58 AM PST by Bloody Sam Roberts ("The further a society drifts from truth the more it will hate those who speak it." - George Orwell)
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To: rellimpank

While carrying, I avoid any and all arguments or situations that would lead to them. Of course, you should never drink either. I don’t know all the circumstances that led to this man’s conviction but the jury did not think he was justified in the shooting. Some people behave more aggressively while armed. That is not a smart thing to do.


6 posted on 02/28/2014 6:14:27 AM PST by 3Fingas (Sons and Daughters for Freedom and Rededication to the Principles of the U.S. Constitution)
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To: RandallFlagg

Does anyone know the facts in this case? Aside from being perhaps intoxicated and armed, which I believe is a violation of the law in Wi, what happened wherein a guy was accosted and shot the attacker yet was charged with a crime??


7 posted on 02/28/2014 6:18:46 AM PST by Mouton (The insurrection laws perpetuate what we have for a government now.)
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To: ThunderSleeps

Wisconsin Law

Taverns. A licensee may carry a handgun
into a tavern, bar, or other establishment in
which alcohol beverages may be consumed,
but only if the licensee is not consuming alcohol
while on the premises.


8 posted on 02/28/2014 6:25:17 AM PST by Atlas Sneezed ("Income Inequality?" Let's start with Washington DC vs. the rest of the nation!)
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To: Mouton

More here:
“Description: The State of Wisconsin charged Phillip K. Green, age 40, with first-degree reckless homicide while armed with a deadly weapon during a fight with an unarmed friend.

Defendant claimed the shooting was justified because he feared for his life after being beaten by one of the three men with whom he had gone bar hopping.

Defendant had a permit to carry a concealed weapon and waited for police to arrive after the shooting in the alleged belief that he had acted in self defense.”
http://www.morelaw.com/verdicts/case.asp?n=&s=WI&d=64454


9 posted on 02/28/2014 6:28:52 AM PST by RandallFlagg ("I said I never had much use for one. Never said I didn't know how to use it." --Quigley)
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To: Bloody Sam Roberts

Indeed. I’d sooner drive with a few pops under my belt than carry a firearm.


Ah, but driving requires skill and coordination to avoid endangering the public. Carrying requires none of that.

The only concern is the judgement of the carrier not to draw the gun.

Guys that do are the same guys who get into bar fights. Some of us simply never will because we don’t have the temperament.

Lawful or not, I reserve the right to self defense and defense of my loved ones whether or not I’ve had a few.

Anyone who disagrees may tell me whether they will resist a home invader with a firearm at home even if they’re had enough drinks that they know they’d be illegal to drive.

I’m also willing to take the consequences if caught carrying while drinking (loss of permit) or in a self defense situation (liability for missed shots, perhaps alive in prison instead of a dead free man).


10 posted on 02/28/2014 6:29:52 AM PST by Atlas Sneezed ("Income Inequality?" Let's start with Washington DC vs. the rest of the nation!)
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To: Atlas Sneezed

In Colorado, you can carry into a bar, and you can drink in a bar. You just can’t be DRUNK in a bar. The non-carrying guys at my job were kinda surprised when I told them this.


11 posted on 02/28/2014 6:30:13 AM PST by RandallFlagg ("I said I never had much use for one. Never said I didn't know how to use it." --Quigley)
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To: rellimpank

I believe Wisconson’s law follows Michigans CPL law, which is a zero tolerance for blood alcohol while carrying.


12 posted on 02/28/2014 6:31:10 AM PST by Yo-Yo (Is the /sarc tag really necessary?)
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To: rellimpank

Too much TV, I’ve no doubt the man wasn’t trying to kill the other guy. Just teach him a lesson. According to TV we can shoot people and they just spend a few day’s in the hospital and get out and everything’s all okay.

If there’s a case where civil damages are warranted, this is it. 18 years parole in 10 and all the money the family can sue for.


13 posted on 02/28/2014 6:35:55 AM PST by Usagi_yo (Standardization is an Evolutionary dead end.)
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To: RandallFlagg

This event helps illustrate why drunkenness is a mortal sin.


14 posted on 02/28/2014 6:46:52 AM PST by Repent and Believe (Promote good. Tolerate the harmless. Let evil be crushed.)
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To: rellimpank

Clear case of self defense and the guy is getting rail-roaded.


15 posted on 02/28/2014 7:08:49 AM PST by Durus (You can avoid reality, but you cannot avoid the consequences of avoiding reality. Ayn Rand)
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To: Usagi_yo
Too much TV indeed.
"I’ve no doubt the man wasn’t trying to kill the other guy. Just teach him a lesson".

Are you kidding me?! That is exactly what self defense is all about. Did you read the story just a couple days a go where a guy died from a single punch? Things like that happen all the time. Detached retina so you can't see the same ever again? Just some guy trying to teach you a lesson right? Dislocated jaw that never heals quite right? Teeth knocked out of their sockets? Broken Orbital socket? Broken rib? These are all serious injuried that can result in permanant pain and discomfort all from a single punch.

As once free citizens we were not required to take a beating to prove that Government has the monopoly of force. Now that is all that is happening. We are quickly getting to the point where can't legally defend ourselves from any aggressor.

16 posted on 02/28/2014 7:21:31 AM PST by Durus (You can avoid reality, but you cannot avoid the consequences of avoiding reality. Ayn Rand)
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To: FReepers
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17 posted on 02/28/2014 7:33:45 AM PST by DJ MacWoW (The Fed Gov is not one ring to rule them all)
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To: Durus

Dude, I’m attributing too much fantasy TV violence for the cavalier attitude of why somebody would pull out a gun and shoot somebody they were fighting when that person was being restrained vis-a-vis they don’t understand exactly how much damage they can do. It’s the Wile E. Coyote syndrome.


18 posted on 02/28/2014 8:02:36 AM PST by Usagi_yo (Standardization is an Evolutionary dead end.)
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To: Usagi_yo
You should be attributing too much fantasy TV violence for the cavalier attitude of "I'm just going to beat someone up" because they don't understand how much damage they can do.

It used to be clear cut legally that if one initiated violence on a party then anything said party did to stop the violence is completely justified (assuming no third parties are injured in the process).

19 posted on 02/28/2014 8:20:48 AM PST by Durus (You can avoid reality, but you cannot avoid the consequences of avoiding reality. Ayn Rand)
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To: rellimpank; Hunton Peck; Diana in Wisconsin; P from Sheb; Shady; DonkeyBonker; Wisconsinlady; ...

Concealed carry conviction

FReep Mail me if you want on, or off,this Wisconsin interest ping list.


20 posted on 02/28/2014 12:17:21 PM PST by afraidfortherepublic
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To: Atlas Sneezed

Same in Colorado


21 posted on 02/28/2014 6:50:00 PM PST by ThunderSleeps (Stop obarma now! Stop the hussein - insane agenda!)
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To: Mouton

I was a juror in this case. The reason for the conviction was the fact that he was with friends and acquaintances. When the argument started, it escalated to a fight. One person was holding back the victim while another was trying to hold back Mr. Green. He had a choice to stop, or leave. He chose to pull out a weapon and fire at Mr. banks in anger around those holding him back. His life was not in danger. He had no scars on him that showed he was in danger of his life. It was a hard decision to make to sentence a young man. The jurors spent two days going over every detail given to us during the trial. The fact that it was conceal and carry was not considered other than what is the law for conceal and carry in Wisconsin. Green was a passenger in the car. He chose to take his weapon out of his own car and take it along. He did have one drink while at one of the bars which is not allowed with conceal and carry. It was a decision in the heat of the moment that caused a young man’s life. No winners here. A family lost a loved one and another family will not have an opportunity to share their life with the other. I only hope the family of Mr. Banks felt justice is served even though they will not have their loved one. Truly a sad situation.


22 posted on 05/14/2014 6:31:15 PM PDT by anotherjuror
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