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The Real German Warning for Cold War II (Pat Buchanan)
The American Conservative ^ | March 7, 2014 | Pat Buchanan

Posted on 03/07/2014 7:28:25 AM PST by Colonel Kangaroo

In assessing the motives and actions of Vladimir Putin, Hillary Clinton compared them to Adolf Hitler’s. Almost always a mistake. After 12 years in power, Hitler was dead, having slaughtered millions and conquered Europe from the Atlantic to the Urals. And Putin? After 13 years in power, and facing a crisis in Ukraine, he directed his soldiers in the Crimea to take control of the small peninsula where Russia has berthed its Black Sea fleet since Napoleon. To the Wall Street Journal this is a “blitzkrieg.”

But as of now, this is a less bloody affair than Andrew Jackson’s acquisition of our Florida peninsula. In 1818, Gen. Jackson was shooting Indians, putting the Spanish on boats to Cuba and hanging Brits. And we Americans loved it.

Still, there are parallels between what motivates Putin, a Russian nationalist, and what motivated the Austrian corporal. Hitler’s war began in blazing resentment at what was done to Germany after Nov. 11, 1918. The Kaiser’s armies had defeated the Russian Empire, and the Italians at Caporetto, and fought the Western Allies to a stand still in France, until two million Americans turned the tide in 1918. When Berlin accepted an armistice on President Wilson’s Fourteen Points, not a single Allied soldier stood on German soil.

But, at Paris, the Allies proceeded to tear a disarmed Germany apart. The whole German Empire was confiscated. Eupen and Malmedy were carved out of Germany and given to Belgium. Alsace-Lorraine was taken by France. South Tyrol was severed from Austria and given to Italy. A new Czechoslovakia was given custody of 3.25 million Sudeten Germans. The German port of Danzig was handed over to the new Poland, which was also given an 80-mile wide strip cut out of Germany from Silesia to the sea, slicing her in two. The Germans were told they could not form an economic union with Austria, could not have an army of more than 100,000 soldiers, and could not put soldiers west of the Rhine, in their own country. Perhaps this Carthaginian peace was understandable given the Allied losses. It was also madness if the Allies wanted an enduring peace. Gen. Hans Von Seeckt predicted what would happen. When we regain our power, he said, “we will naturally take back everything we lost.” When Hitler came to power in 1933, he wrote off the lands lost to Belgium, France and Italy—he wanted no war with the West—but set out to recapture lost German lands and peoples in the East. He imposed conscription in 1935, sent his soldiers back into the Rhineland in 1936, annexed Austria in 1938, demanded and got the return of the Sudeten Germans from Czechoslovakia at Munich in 1938. He then sought to negotiate with the Polish colonels, who had joined in carving up Czechoslovakia, a return of Danzig, when the British issued a war guarantee to Warsaw stiffening Polish spines. Enraged by Polish intransigence, Hitler attacked. Britain and France declared war. The rest is history.

What has this to do with Putin? He, too, believes his country was humiliated and shabbily treated after the Cold War, and sees himself as protector of the ethnic Russians left behind when the Soviet Union came apart. Between 1989 and 1991, Mikhail Gorbachev had freed the captive nations of Eastern Europe, allowed the Soviet Union to dissolve into 15 nations, and had held out a hand of friendship to the Americans. What did we do? Moved NATO right onto Russia’s front porch. We brought all the liberated nations of Eastern Europe into our military alliance, along with three former Soviet republics. The War Party tried to bring Georgia and Ukraine into NATO, which was established to contain and, if necessary, fight Russia. Had they succeeded, we could have been at war with Russia in 2008 over Georgia and South Ossetia, and today over Crimea.

Now we hear new calls for Ukraine and Georgia to be brought into NATO. Are these people sane? Five U.S. presidents who faced far more violent actions by a far more dangerous Soviet Union—Truman, Ike, JFK, Johnson, Reagan—refused even to threaten force against Russia for anything east of the Elbe river. These presidents ruled out force during the Berlin Blockade of 1948, the Hungarian Revolution of 1956, the building of the Berlin Wall in 1961, the Warsaw Pact invasion of Czechoslovakia in 1968, and the smashing of Solidarity in Poland in 1981. Yet, today, we are committed to go to war for Lithuania and Estonia, Obama is sending F-16s to Latvia where half a million Russians live, and the War Party wants Sixth Fleet warships moved into the Black Sea.

If there is a Cold War II, or a U.S.-Russia war, historians of tomorrow will as surely point to the Bushes and Clintons who shoved NATO into Moscow’s face, as historians today point to the men of Paris who imposed the Versailles treaty upon a defeated Germany in 1919.


TOPICS: Foreign Affairs; Russia
KEYWORDS: americafirster; buchanan; nato
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More common sense from Buchanan. NATO has as much business on the borders of Russia as the Warsaw Pact would having Mexico as a member.
1 posted on 03/07/2014 7:28:25 AM PST by Colonel Kangaroo
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To: Colonel Kangaroo

I personally think the whole thing is a waste of our time and just distracts us from our more important issues right here at home.


2 posted on 03/07/2014 7:31:45 AM PST by cripplecreek (REMEMBER THE RIVER RAISIN!)
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To: All

We nominated the wrong man in 1992. And we’ve not elected an outstanding president since.


3 posted on 03/07/2014 7:33:21 AM PST by Colonel Kangaroo
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To: cripplecreek

The real dangers we face are domestic and moral, not foreign.


4 posted on 03/07/2014 7:36:52 AM PST by Colonel Kangaroo
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To: Colonel Kangaroo

No, they are both. Especially since both are intertwined.


5 posted on 03/07/2014 7:38:02 AM PST by Olog-hai
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To: Colonel Kangaroo

9/11 wasn’t just a sideshow.


6 posted on 03/07/2014 7:41:46 AM PST by onedoug
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To: Colonel Kangaroo

Our nation is collapsing, financially and morally. This is our battle and we are losing.


7 posted on 03/07/2014 7:43:22 AM PST by LowTaxesEqualsProsperity
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To: Colonel Kangaroo

Basic cold, hard reality appears to be that the British started WW-II...


8 posted on 03/07/2014 7:43:59 AM PST by varmintman
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To: cripplecreek

Which means it is perfect for a president who needs to distract everyone from his domestic disasters and other foreign disasters. Beware of the coward in power, for he must needs be seen as being manly.


9 posted on 03/07/2014 7:48:22 AM PST by Pecos (The Chicago Way: Kill the Constitution, one step at a time.)
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To: Pecos

The Ukraine thing is something that a real president would have seen and worked to head off by diplomatic means.

Instead president Candyass sat in the White House sniping at Russia over gay rights.


10 posted on 03/07/2014 7:50:40 AM PST by cripplecreek (REMEMBER THE RIVER RAISIN!)
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To: Colonel Kangaroo

You can always trust Pat Buchanan to side with America’s adversaries. And this is probably the key factor that prevented him from gaining much traction with the GOP. It’s one thing to understand the other side’s motivations, but quite another to support their interests against America’s. But that’s what Buchanan’s been doing for decades now.


11 posted on 03/07/2014 7:53:02 AM PST by Zhang Fei (Let us pray that peace be now restored to the world and that God will preserve it always.)
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To: LowTaxesEqualsProsperity

“This is our battle and we are losing.”

It’s the American political character to not recognize a problem until it’s life or death. Until that point domestic squabbling is MUCH more important. What’s still at the top of Obama’s agenda? Obamacare, golf and vacations. (Oh, and anything for blacks, gays, Hispanics, etc.)

This has been okay when we were separated by oceans and months from any danger. Now, danger is just 26 minutes from any position you can name.


12 posted on 03/07/2014 7:53:31 AM PST by Gen.Blather
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To: Colonel Kangaroo
1988..(NE lib.) GHWB, set about dismantling (almost) everything RWR did.
His "Thousand point of lights" was his beginning..
(he didn't do much to advance the goals of the Republican Party)

13 posted on 03/07/2014 7:53:58 AM PST by skinkinthegrass (The end move in politics is always to pick up a gun..0'Caligula / 0'Reid / 0'Pelosi)
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To: cripplecreek
Or realized that doing anything meaningful was more than a tad out of reach and avoid embarrassing himself and the country. But then every time either of his Secretaries of State has opened her/his mouth, the country has lost a step or two on the world stage.
14 posted on 03/07/2014 7:54:14 AM PST by Pecos (The Chicago Way: Kill the Constitution, one step at a time.)
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To: Zhang Fei

Precisely.


15 posted on 03/07/2014 7:55:16 AM PST by Olog-hai
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To: Zhang Fei
You can always trust Pat Buchanan to side with America’s adversaries.

Do you find being an idiot painful?

16 posted on 03/07/2014 7:55:48 AM PST by varmintman
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To: onedoug

If we had not elected asleep at the wheel internationalist meddlers since Reagan, I doubt 9-11 ever happens.


17 posted on 03/07/2014 7:56:18 AM PST by Colonel Kangaroo
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To: skinkinthegrass
Depends on what the goals of the Republican Party were. Judging by the establishment's attack on Reagan back when he challenged Ford, those have not been typically conservative.
18 posted on 03/07/2014 7:56:39 AM PST by Olog-hai
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To: varmintman

ibtz.


19 posted on 03/07/2014 7:57:05 AM PST by Olog-hai
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To: Colonel Kangaroo
Now we hear new calls for Ukraine and Georgia to be brought into NATO. Are these people sane? Five U.S. presidents who faced far more violent actions by a far more dangerous Soviet Union—Truman, Ike, JFK, Johnson, Reagan—refused even to threaten force against Russia for anything east of the Elbe river. These presidents ruled out force during the Berlin Blockade of 1948, the Hungarian Revolution of 1956, the building of the Berlin Wall in 1961, the Warsaw Pact invasion of Czechoslovakia in 1968, and the smashing of Solidarity in Poland in 1981.

And I'll bet Palaeo Pat called them traitors and commies and beat the war drums every single time.

I'm not advocating US interference in the Ukraine/Russia impasse; I'm merely pointing out Pat's hypocrisy.

20 posted on 03/07/2014 7:58:25 AM PST by Zionist Conspirator (The Left: speaking power to truth since Shevirat HaKelim.)
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To: cripplecreek
The Ukraine thing is something that a real president would have seen and worked to head off by diplomatic means.

It should have been solved in 1994, but Clinton and Yeltsin blew it.

21 posted on 03/07/2014 7:58:50 AM PST by dfwgator
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To: Colonel Kangaroo
What has this to do with Putin? He, too, believes his country was humiliated and shabbily treated after the Cold War, [...]

Shabbily treated? By whom? The Soviet Empire imploded. Its inhabitants rebelled. No foreign troops threatened it. No outside terms were dictated. No ignominious treaties were forced on it.

Regards,

22 posted on 03/07/2014 8:00:40 AM PST by alexander_busek (Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.)
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To: varmintman

Nice defense of national socialism.


23 posted on 03/07/2014 8:03:21 AM PST by Olog-hai
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To: dfwgator

If Yeltsin were sober he probably wouldn’t have ever given up the Crimean. Giving up Russia’s only deepwater year round port was about as dumb as it gets. Its the sort of thing Obama would do.


24 posted on 03/07/2014 8:03:25 AM PST by cripplecreek (REMEMBER THE RIVER RAISIN!)
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To: Colonel Kangaroo

Pat does a good job of instructing us where the many fault lines in Europe lie.

The borders of countries in Europe and Russia have changed countless times in just the time the United States has been in existence.

What is happening in the Ukraine is not black and white. I don’t know who the good guys are, who the bad guys are, or what the difference is.

All I know, is that after the debacles that our political elite made out of military victories in Iraq and Afghanistan,I am done saving the world. After 70 years of sacrifice, America has done enough.

Let the European Union send their sons and daughters into the battle. It is on their doorstep, not ours.


25 posted on 03/07/2014 8:04:37 AM PST by exit82 ("The Taliban is on the inside of the building" E. Nordstrom 10-10-12)
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To: varmintman
Basic cold, hard reality appears to be that the British started WW-II

I'm a big fan of Buchanan, always have been. He makes arguments that others are afraid to make.

But I think he's wrong here. It was said of Napoleon that he didn't want all of Europe, just those parts that bordered his empire. And as his empire expanded, so did the number of countries that bordered it.

Same goes with Hitler. He didn't want to attack the West...yet. If Britain and France would have stayed out of the Polish conflict, perhaps Hitler would have first driven east. Moscow then Paris instead of Paris then Moscow.

26 posted on 03/07/2014 8:05:58 AM PST by Leaning Right (Why am I holding this lantern? I am looking for the next Reagan.)
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To: Leaning Right

Hitler wanted revenge on the French as much as Lebensraum in the East.


27 posted on 03/07/2014 8:06:49 AM PST by dfwgator
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To: alexander_busek

The war in Bosnia was a violation of promises made to Russia by George H.W. Bush (IIRC) to wit that there would be no NATO or other western incursions into former Soviet Bloc territory. Of course, this was part of the European Union’s push into that area, since after the Cold War the leadership of NATO was basically handed to them, and Clinton to a great degree was “leading from behind” (actually following).

And since Putin believes that the collapse of the USSR was the “greatest geopolitical catastrophe” of the previous century, he has been working feverishly to rebuild the USSR in his own image.


28 posted on 03/07/2014 8:06:50 AM PST by Olog-hai
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To: cripplecreek

I just wonder how much pressure the US put on Ukraine to give up their nukes?


29 posted on 03/07/2014 8:07:44 AM PST by dfwgator
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To: skinkinthegrass; Colonel Kangaroo
1988..(NE lib.) GHWB, set about dismantling (almost) everything RWR did.

And again, when you think about their track record since Nixon . . .

.

.


30 posted on 03/07/2014 8:08:52 AM PST by Jeff Chandler (Obamacare: You can't make an omelette without breaking a few eggs.)
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To: Leaning Right
And here I thought that the meaning of “Heute Deutschland, morgen die Welt” was unambiguous.
31 posted on 03/07/2014 8:09:01 AM PST by Olog-hai
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To: exit82

Our blood and money allowed Europe to recover from WWII. We don’t owe Europe or the world a thing. Woodrow Wilson’s century of American sacrifice should end.


32 posted on 03/07/2014 8:10:08 AM PST by Colonel Kangaroo
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To: Olog-hai

Hitler, in his mind, was fighting International Jewry, and any country that felt that was “run by Jews” was going to be an eventual target, including the USA.


33 posted on 03/07/2014 8:10:25 AM PST by dfwgator
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To: varmintman
Basic cold, hard reality appears to be that the British started WW-II...

No.

Adolph Hitler and his National Socialist "Third Reich" started WWII.

Britain and France may be fairly blamed for setting the stage for it. Britain in particular may be fairly blamed for permitting it (by inaction and pusillanimous conduct). But starting it?

Hitler started it. And Stalin was complicit.

34 posted on 03/07/2014 8:10:25 AM PST by NorthMountain
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To: dfwgator

Yes, and their declaration of war upon the USA was unprovoked and unrelated to any alleged actions by Britain anyhow.

Should he have been allowed to breach every treaty he made in the name of “peace” notwithstanding? I think not.


35 posted on 03/07/2014 8:12:35 AM PST by Olog-hai
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To: NorthMountain

Damn right Stalin was complicit, he knew signing the Non-Aggression Pact, and agreeing to carve up Poland with Hitler, would start the war in the West.

Then Stalin would bide his time, until all the armies bled themselves dry.

One thing he didn’t count on, France falling without much of a fight. He had to know then and there, it was only a matter of time before Hitler would come after him.


36 posted on 03/07/2014 8:13:07 AM PST by dfwgator
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To: Colonel Kangaroo

The last thing anyone wants is for those corrupt, antisemitic entities in Europe to take over as world police. Whether they realize it yet or not.


37 posted on 03/07/2014 8:13:52 AM PST by Olog-hai
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To: Olog-hai

We pretty much were going to be at war with Germany, no matter what.

Britain also declared war on Japan, after Pearl, so that automatically lifted any restrictions on aiding Britain, only a matter of time before the Germans attacked one of our ships, giving us the Casus Belli to declare war on Germany.


38 posted on 03/07/2014 8:14:56 AM PST by dfwgator
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To: dfwgator

I’m just waiting to see which new cold “warrior” in DC is first to declare that we need to give up just a little more freedom and a lot of money to protect us from the Russian horde.


39 posted on 03/07/2014 8:16:25 AM PST by cripplecreek (REMEMBER THE RIVER RAISIN!)
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To: Colonel Kangaroo

Yep. Of course the -tensions- of war keep our eyes focused on foreign threats to liberty, rather than the far more ominous domestic aggressors. That is something the Soviets exported lock, stock, and barrel to Versailles on the Potomac.


40 posted on 03/07/2014 8:18:26 AM PST by Psalm 144 (My citizenship is not here, Pharaoh.)
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To: Colonel Kangaroo
Good Read.

Distorting Russia -- How the American media misrepresent Putin, Sochi and Ukraine.

41 posted on 03/07/2014 8:19:34 AM PST by Theoria (End Socialism : No more GOP and Dem candidates)
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To: Olog-hai

When it comes to the issue of anti-Semitism, I’d favor Putin’s self-interested nationalism over the PC new age one world bigotry of the EU.


42 posted on 03/07/2014 8:20:11 AM PST by Colonel Kangaroo
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To: NorthMountain
What Buchanan is claiming is that the British were handing out war guarantees like Halloween candy and that, without that, some sort of a deal with the poles over Danzig would have most likely been reached.

That might have prevented any sort of a war between Germany and England/France. As for Russia, people I've spoken to who were living in Russia in the late 30s say it was on the edge of collapse at that time and that had Hitler simply waited ten years, he most likely could have picked up the pieces he wanted for free.

43 posted on 03/07/2014 8:21:31 AM PST by varmintman
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To: skinkinthegrass

You are absolutely correct. Almost every significant problem we have currently was seeded by that mewling fraud. He has worked hand in glove with each successive failure of a president to perpetuate his NWO nightmare.


44 posted on 03/07/2014 8:22:41 AM PST by Psalm 144 (My citizenship is not here, Pharaoh.)
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To: Colonel Kangaroo

American Moms and Dads contributed (officially) 116,516 sons to the Euro socialists/communists/work averse, big government, statists in WW I.

In WW II, American moms and dads contributed (officially) 405, 399 sons to a Euro population that we know today is so self loathing and pacifistic that they would not get out of bed, put on a uniform and fight the Russians if they were marching down their streets. Most of the nutless men would hide behind their many times brave mommys.

When will we ever learn? I totally agree with Buchanan on this one subject.
But, my objection is based upon the foregoing. These people (euros), as a population, and with too few exceptions, are just SORRY and not worth our sons dying for. The hell with them! LET THE RUSSKIES have them and, god only knows, they probably don’t want them! Who WOULD want them?! 521,915 of our FINEST kids donated (largely against their will (draft) to sorry, no good, morally rotten to the core and decadent/spineless Europe is enough! If the SOB’s won’t fight next time, they can’t have my grandson!!!

I have more respect for the Vietnamese and Afghans, YES, in some cases, they were all drugged up but by and large they would stand and fight and die en masse for their pathetic beliefs but Euros won’t . In this current bloodless fracas, they are already sucking up to the Russians by failing to offer ANY resisting response whatsoever other than to surrender to Putin demands. Ukraine troops are joining the Russian Army and the Ukraine Navy is surrendering battleships to the Russkies. With 180 guys, William Travis, in his late twenties, said a final good bye to his young son and fought 5,000 Mexicans to his death. My point: There are “peoples” that historically have habitated this earth that ARE/WERE patriots and WILL fight for their country!

AND IN THE CASE OF THE US, we have sacrificed hundreds of thousands of our sons to fight for “OTHER PEOPLE”.

Bottom line: no consideration of helping these inferior and worthless people (continental Euros, not the UK) by donating more American sons should ever be given. 521,915 is way past ENOUGH!! Bring the F15 drivers home now!

And, please spare me the “isolationist” arguments. I will not even respond to them.


45 posted on 03/07/2014 8:24:58 AM PST by Cen-Tejas (it's the debt bomb stupid!)
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To: dfwgator; varmintman; Olog-hai
It's also worth noting that in 1940 Hitler made plans to invade neutral Switzerland under Operation Tannenbaum. No way could such an action be justified by the Treaty of Versailles' inequalities.

An interesting read of this little-unknown operation:

Operation Tannenbaum

46 posted on 03/07/2014 8:25:08 AM PST by Leaning Right (Why am I holding this lantern? I am looking for the next Reagan.)
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To: varmintman
Basic cold, hard reality appears to be that the British started WW-II...

I'm not a Historian, but I think Winston Churchill would have agreed with you that "The Unnecessary War" was Britain's "fault," but probably not in the sense you think.

OTOH, I'm not surprised that Buchanan's fevered mind would come up with a way to blame Britain for Germany's invasion of Poland. I'll bet that, given time, he'll peg some action of the US that forced the Japanese to bomb Pearl.

47 posted on 03/07/2014 8:25:17 AM PST by Cyber Liberty (H.L. Mencken: "The urge to save humanity is almost always a false front for the urge to rule.")
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To: Colonel Kangaroo

I’d favor neither. The US has fought both and won; and then lost faith after succumbing to the temptations of both subdued enemies.

And Putin is very much internationalist insofar as his dream to rebuild the Soviet Empire.


48 posted on 03/07/2014 8:25:42 AM PST by Olog-hai
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To: Olog-hai

The war in Bosnia was a violation of promises made to Russia by George H.W. Bush (IIRC) to wit that there would be no NATO or other western incursions into former Soviet Bloc territory.


Yugoslavia was not Soviet Bloc. It was not in the Warsaw Pact and officially non aligned. Serbia got hammered by the west for backing those Bosnian Serb dirt bags.


49 posted on 03/07/2014 8:26:21 AM PST by lodi90
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To: varmintman

Sorry, still don’t agree. German armies marched because Hitler told them to. Hitler started WWII.

The abominable Treaty of Versailles more or less ensured that Hitler (or someone like him) would eventually want to restore Germany ... but that doesn’t excuse Hitler.


50 posted on 03/07/2014 8:27:22 AM PST by NorthMountain
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