Skip to comments.FP&L – No “Choice” of Meters for 36,000 Floridians (Smart Meters)
Posted on 03/09/2014 6:00:09 AM PDT by dontreadthis
By now many of you that refused the installation of FP&Ls smart meters have received a Dear Customer letter telling you that you have a choice of meters. The letter goes on to say that if you dont take their smart meter that you will be charged $95 upfront and $13/month to retain your old meter. If you havent received such letter, you will shortly.
On January 7, 2014 the Florida Public Service Commission (FPSC) approved this deal. Although, it is being contested by two separate citizen petitions (one of which I am leading), the rules state that FP&L can continue as planned with the stipulation that fees collected are subject to refund. That is, if the FPSC Order is overturned, they must return the fees charged to the customers.
Why the fees? Well you resistors are cost causers. It is a long-standing principle that is invoked at will when they want to get you to comply with the game plan. In 1987/1988 they invoked the same principle when they transferred the ownership of meter enclosures and associated cost burdens (maintenance/replacement) to you the customer. The order (PSC Order # 18893) stated that:
Since self-contained meter enclosures are not a part of the utility function, but simply house the meter itself, their costs should be borne by the customer when the structure is initially wired for electric service or when it must be replaced due to obsolescence or wear. The burden of maintaining and repairing the enclosures must likewise rest with the customer. A smart meter is not simply a meter but contains lots of additional components that are part of the utility function. It establishes a wireless Neighborhood Network and sends messages back and forth amongst neighbor meters, remotely disconnects services and monitors your usage.
(Excerpt) Read more at drrichswier.com ...
FPL should be burned to the ground. Worse utility in the US IMO.
I have a very nice, but low end rental unit. I found out that ALL of the tenants had lied about their self-reported power usage and my rental was on the mandatory reading list. (Meaning the company sent somebody special each month to read the meter.)
What’s the difference to the user if a meter reader comes by each month or the meter itself reports? I know I was grateful to get one as I didn’t have to drive 80 miles home from a work assignment just to read the meter.
I would like someone to explain to me how a smart meter “remotely disconnects services”.
Gone are the days of meter readers walking around gathering info. Embed a smart chip in the unit, and all details automatically updated at power plant. Technology = more job loss. Profit from it with SWIR- Sierra Wireless and CKSW - Click Software.
Maybe by sending a command that opens a relay inside the meter or associated apparatus
My mom worked for utility billing in their city. After smart meters were installed, she shut people off with the tap of a computer key.
In this day and age of competition in utility providers, you can always tell Florida Power & Light to pound sand and retain another utility on contract to provide the kWh and load demand.
Why is this even problem?
I have written many RF safety plans and for the life of me cant figure it out. The only cases that I see that could be a problem would be if a customer had a meter on the back porch and sat a foot and half underneath it continually.
Old microwave ovens are a different story.
If you want to have fun, identify the operating system and dump the IP addresses to the neighbors you don't like. You can either get on thru an ethernet connection or serially with a RS232 cable and a laptop.
There should be a comm port under a plate somewhere on the meter.
We have three smart meters, in order to shut off the entire house there would have to have a 250 amp contactor I them. A contactor that big would be twice the size of the meter!
All these meters do is report usage.
Why the disaffection with smart meters? You want juice, you get metered.
The meter belongs to the power company. They provide the juice, they own the meter. It is simply not a customer decision.
The meters have contacts in them that can shut off 250 amps?? I find that hard to believe.
I had a “saver switch” attached to my air conditioner compressor that allowed my utility to disconnect the cooling unit during peak usage in the summer in exchange for a few dollars credit on my bill. The unit came with the house and I never authorized its connection. Last year the utility company changed the unit for a new one...again without my permission. I hadn’t noticed any credit on my bill for years and was always concerned that the “save switch” benefited the utility not the customer. I protested that they had installed this equipment on my air conditioner without my permission and told them I would sue them for any damage to my equipment that resulted. I also filed a complaint with the state Public Utilities Commission. The switch was promptly removed and last summer I noticed a significant improvement in the cooling of my home and LOWER utility bills. While I was assured that the new switch only affected my air conditioning, I do not want anything on my home that gives some outside entity control over how cool or warm I keep my home. I remember Obama telling us that we can no longer keep our thermostats at 72 degrees and do not want to facilitate government jackboots from taking control of my thermostat.
Smart meters constantly emit RFs. They have been known to cause fires. They are exempt from UL testing because the utility companies are essentially and offshoot of the government. They are known to cause multiple medical problems such as palpitations, tinnitus, sleep disruption, anxiety, et al. They allow the utility to track your electric usage which means the utility can decide to reduce or shut off your power if they deem it necessary. It is invasive and intrusive. Google smart meters are unhealthy and see what pops up. Just more government-sanctioned control on the masses.
There are various kinds of smart meters.
1) Some just transmit electric usage, to avoid having to have a person physically come over to read it.
2) Some additionally have remote control features, which allow the attachment of remote-controlled plugs to things like your central air conditioner, that allow the utility to remotely shut it off if they have a brown-out condition.
The Florida meters under discussion seem to be type 1. However, there is nothing stopping them from being turned into type 2 at some point in the future. What would happen is that customers would be offered a "discount" if they allowed their major appliances to be put on controlled circuits. A lot of people don't like the idea of their power being controlled like that.
“smart appliances” are smart meter friendly.
That is NOT true. I work for one of the largest manufacturers of electric meters in the world. They are very proud of their cutoff design. They are made to operate only a few dozen times, so the design requirements are quite different from a contactor that has a lifetime of many thousands of cycles.
Yes they can be shut down with a key stroke. I’ve seen mom do it. Additionally, residents can sign up for a program where the smart meter automatically adjusts the temp during its perceived peek usage time. If the system determines that the peek usage during a summer day happens to be 2 pm, it will automatically increase the thermostat by two degrees. The same in the winter, just the opposite direction on the thermostat.
just a heads up,
If you’re electric supply is spotty do not call F.P.L. to complain,
Call the Florida Public Service commission and make a complaint.
That way F.P.L. will act on said complaint instead of just filling up file #13,
Not too sure why but F.P.L jumps when PSC gets involved.
Everything I’ve read on “smart meters” so far show that they read usage and transmit those reading via WiFi technology. They cannot remotely be triggered on and off - human still go to the meter for shutoffs and reconnects. When used in conjunction with “smart thermostats” your appliances can be remotely controlled.
And then they decide that everyone needs to raise their AC thermostats to 85 degrees to save power, or during the winter, everyone’s thermostat gets lowered to 60 degrees for 12 hours a day and they flip a switch and make it so. I would have a problem with that.
“Smart meters constantly emit RFs”
No. They emit at well under 5% duty cycle for ones I’ve looked at.
“They are known to cause multiple medical problems such as palpitations, tinnitus, sleep disruption, anxiety, et al.”
Perhaps in people who have not paid their electric bill, but there is no physical effect on people from a “smartmeter”
“They allow the utility to track your electric usage which means the utility can decide to reduce or shut off your power if they deem it necessary.”
This is true. The real reason for “smartmeters” is to eliminate manual meter reading allow them to implement schemes, such as time-of-day usage to charge you more money.
It also helps in tracking down outage locations.
” Google smart meters are unhealthy and see what pops up.”
Yes, and you’ll all manner of hysteria with no basis in fact over traditional type meters.
“Just more government-sanctioned control on the masses.”
Yeah, but mostly clearing the way to charge you differently/more for your power usage.
Object or not - but do it for the right reasons not some made up crap you find on Google.
Here in Tampa (Teco Energy, not FPL) we have/had type 2 as an option, but they are really pushing for type 1. The idea is they want to be able to sell power at different rates at different times of the day.
You are sadly misinformed.
Smart meters constantly emit RFs. No they do not, the duty cycle is less that 10%
They have been known to cause fires- So has any electrical device.
They are exempt from UL testing- UL testing is not a government function, it is a private choice made by the manufacture. They must comply with the FCC regulations 512. If they do not they are illegal and the FCC would drive them out of business. (The FCC seems to enjoy doing so)
They are known to cause multiple medical problems such as palpitations, tinnitus, sleep disruption, anxiety, et al. This is without scientific basis. Please describe the mechanism by which the body will detect 850 MHz, ~ 2048 MHz if you find one you will be rich because you have invented something very desirable.
They allow the utility to track your electric usage which means the utility can decide to reduce or shut off your power if they deem it necessary. Yup sure does, thats the whole purpose of the exercise.
It is invasive and intrusive. You dont have to take their power, you can generate your own if you wish.
Do you also want to ban DiHydrogen Oxide ?
No I have never worked for any of these companies.
I had a typo that should be NIC514.
Fact between 6 and 7 percent of all electrical power generated in the US is lost due to losses in the distribution system. This is literally millions of kWhr’s of energy wasted each year.
The smart-meters allow the utility to perform an inverse solution to determine if a component in the system is failing so it can be replaced. This reduces the waste.
“their power being controlled”
The power being provided is not theirs.
They are customers. If they don’t like the product they can get it somewhere else. They can for instance purchase generators.
There is something stopping them. That is ordinary business sense. People hate change and dream up all sorts of artificial nonsensical stumbling blocks to retard it.
PSC complaints affect rate increases..at least they did with telco
Misinformed? No, I have spent years researching smart meters and talking to people about the perils of them.
I know of more than a dozen well-educated, reasonable, credible, and honest individuals who have all had multiple health and sleep problems since smart meters were installed in their homes. Six of them have had the smart meters removed after years of fighting with the utility and guess what? Their problems ended. Just because you do not have symptoms does not mean that the thousands of others who are all complaining of various degrees of issues are without validity. The one common element is the smart meter. I will trust my own judgement and not that of the utility or the government for my safety and health. Some people are sensitive to certain stimuli. Why is someone with a peanut allergy can go into an allergic reaction requiring hospitalization for just touching a spot of peanut dust and most others do not? Because some people are more sensitive to things than others.
Most electronic devices do not cause fires. In fact, UL ratings are for us consumers to have an assurance that the device that we buy or use meets certain standards.
Any commercial entity wants to get a UL rating. They are a credible thing to put on one’s product. Smart meter companies made sure that they are exempt from this testing. Many smart meters are manufactured in China where they could not give a crap about anything related to quality or safety.
Smart meters allow the government and the utility to track the user’s usage. I do not want, nor am I comfortable having some big brother entity tracking my usage so it can be determined when I sleep, when I am at work or when I am away. This whole BS about more efficient usage is garbage. It is about control.
I have a device that tracks RFs, and when I measure my smart meter, it emits signals all day long not 10% of the day.
I have electricity supplied by my utility, and the contract is that I pay for what I use. It is not for some behind the curtain entity to determine what I use. That’s for me to decide. I meant to tell Santa Claus that I wanted a power generator for Christmas, but forgot. So for now, I have to rely upon the power company. And no, I cannot generate my own because my government will not allow me to without licenses, permits and more money. The power company will not allow me to net meter either so I am, unfortunately, subject to the whims of my power provider.
Where in my comment did I allude that I wished to ban water?
too many complaints, not as high a request hike as requested, just a very large percentage of said.
We should expect to see this type of letter soon:
According to your smart meter you are using more energy than our more unfortunate citizens. To correct this energy inequality, a “individual shared responsibility charge” will be added to your bill to provide subsidies to those who cannot afford to keep their homes cool or who have smaller homes than yours.
In addition, to protect the electric grid from over-usage that might cause brownouts, after your meter records the new “maximum allowable energy limit” for your residence, it will automatically shut down the electricity delivered until your daily usage falls within the approved limits of our shared use of the energy grid to produce equality of service.
Have a nice day.
>> They are known to cause multiple medical problems such as palpitations, tinnitus, sleep disruption, anxiety, et al.
Known to whom? Art Bell?
They have a monopoly, I have no choice but to use THEM for “my juice” therefore now I have no say in how much of my activity they can “monitor”. You want them to do that for you, fine, not me. Got it.
You buy power. Paranoia should not be a factor in the transaction.
Yep, it’s coming. I just jumped the gun a few years in Castigo Cay.
There is something stopping them. That is ordinary business sense. People hate change and dream up all sorts of artificial nonsensical stumbling blocks to retard it.
When a business is given a monopoly by the government then the rules have to change. I know you said people can buy a generator but there is about a 0% chance that any suburban or urban area is going to allow you to actually run a generator 24/7.
I have no problem with smart meters (I have one) but monopolies are evil.
Wouldn't it be nice to live in such a place?
So sorry... then there are certain States that have no income tax.
I bow to the Master Prophet. You’re damn dead on point in your books and predicting events is a hell of a lot more impressive than merely commenting on them after the fact.
So far you’ve been right about energy control in Florida a la Castigo Cay.,
Confiscation of guns with resistance via massive civil disobedience in Connecticut a la “Enemies Foreign & Domestic”
Every day sees some vestige of the Reconquista occurring in the US, including spineless liberal politicians giving away the country a la Enemies Domestic.
I missed downloading the last of your trilogy, but will get it this week to find out what else will happen to our country.
I have exactly the same health problems I had before a smart meter was installed in my home.
It didn’t cure any of them.
So to answer your question, it can be limited to or from anything ranging from a half amp all the way to 1000 amps. So remember wherever they refer to "motor" it refers as well to your household service if needed.
P031 [Motor Nameplate Volts] Set to the Value on the motor nameplate rated Volts. 20 to Drive Rated Volts 1 VAC Based on Drive Rating
P032 [Motor Nameplate Hertz] Set to the Value on the motor nameplate rated Frequency. 15 to 400 Hz 1 Hz 60 Hz
P033 [Motor Overload Current] Set the maximum allowable motor current. 0.0 to (Drive Rated Amps x2) 0.1 Amps Based on Drive Rating
P034 [Minimum Frequency] Sets the lowest frequency that the drive will output continuously. 0.0 to 400 Hz 0.1 Hz 0.0 Hz
P035 [Maximum Frequency]
Sets the highest frequency that the drive will output continuously. 0.0 to 400 Hz 1 Hz 60 Hz
P036 [Start Source] Sets the source that will be used to start the drive. 0 to 6 0 = Keypad 1 = 3 Wire 2 = 2 Wire 3 = 2 Wire Level Sensor 4 = 2 Wire High Speed 5 = Communication Port 6 = Momentum FWD/REV 0 P037 [Stop Mode]
Sets how the drive will be stopped. 1Stop input also clears active fault. 0 to 9 0 = Ramp, CF 1 1 = Coast, CF 1 2 = DC Brake, CF 1 3 = DC Brake Auto, CF 1 4 = Ramp 5 = Coast 6 = DC Brake 7 = DC Brake Auto 8 = Ramp + Emerg. Brake, CF 9 = Ramp + Emerg. Brake 0
P038 [Speed Reference] Sets the source of the speed reference to the drive. 0 to 7 0 = Drive Potentiometer 1 = Internal Frequency 2 = 0-10V input 3 = 4-20mA input 4 = Preset Frequency 5 = Communication Port(BINGO-HERE IS WHERE THEY CONTROL YOU) 6 = Step Logic 7 = Analog In Multispeed 0 1 (IP66, Type 4x)
P039 [Acceleration time 1] Sets the rate of acceleration for all speed increases 0.0 to 600 Secs 0.1 Secs 10.0 Secs P040 [Deceleration time 1 Sets the rate of deceleration for all speed decreases 0.0 to 600 Secs 0.1 Secs 10.0 Secs P041 [Reset To Defaults]
Resets all drive parameters to factory defaults. 0 or 1 0 = Idle State 1 = Reset Defaults 0 P042 [Voltage Class]
Sets the Voltage Class of 600V Drive 2 or 3 2 = Low Voltage (480V) 3 = High Voltage (600V) 3
P043 [Motor Overload Retention] Enables/Disables the motor overload Retention function 0 or 1 0 = Disabled 1= Enabled 0 1. Once at desired group press the enter key. 2. Navigate to the correct parameter using the up or down arrow once found press enter. 3. To edit this value press enter and use up & down arrows to edit to move to next digit to left use select key. 4. Once value has been select press enter to confirm and press esc key to return to menu 4. How to change a parameter value. 5. List of basic parameters to set up drive for use. = Stop the drive before changing the parameter
These are based on my choices, not a smart meter. I could potentially pull over 1,000 amps if things turned on willy-nilly based on unthinking useage patterns. Instead my computer bits with a value tag and compare and limit tables. I can run all the same equipment efficiently and never exceed 250 AMPS IF I CHOOSE! It has nothing to do with smart meters. They have no idea.
The dishwasher waits to run if the hot tub is running.
The pool pump shuts off if the hot water heater turns on.
The air conditioning / heating can be assigned priority. If the outside air temperature goes below freezing, my pool pumps take priority in switching.
It's all really simple and requires an ethernet connection loop in your house. A desktop or a PLC rack can do it for you. Maybe a days worth of programming.
Relays are easily defeated
Smart meters are unhealthy to the occupants of the home. I let them put one in (meter is behind master bedroom of our home) and experienced sleepless nights and other health problems. I opted out and had them install the old meter type. My electric bill with smart meter increased by approximately 15 percent... since getting the old meter back...I am right at past usage. I did however get a bit of flack from SCE... over-billing and lack of cooperation with dispute of the bill. I think they ripped me off for about 75 bucks over that dispute, but they refuse to work with you, they don’t have to and they know it. Smart meter is all about challenging your lying eyes. Give me the old meter technology on anything.. new tech is manipulated much too easily..
I’m still at home base, I thought I’d be off on the ocean weeks/months ago. So I might do another Kindle freebie for all of my books before I go. I have to check how many “free” days I have left on the Kindle promos. If I do it, it’ll be this week but it won’t be heavily promoted. Just a few notices on FB and maybe on FR and Western Rifle Shooters.
“explain to me how a smart meter remotely disconnects services.
The power company does quality-of-service on customers. They will limit or shutoff service to some customers to provide electricity to business customers when power is strained. No more brown outs, replacing inefficient transformers or lines. They simply dial-down the customers as needed and upgrade their equipment when it suits them.
Hope you will stay on the internet for email and such instead of completely dropping off the information grid a la Castigo Cay.
I’ll try. But I’m not taking a sat phone or other long range internet comms. I’ll get wifi when and where it’s available.
I think the reason they are worried is that the meters might be giving off radiation.
I suggest tin foil....