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Oklahoma Won't Apply for Constitutional Convention, Votes Not There | Article V
The New American ^ | 13 March 2014 | Joe Wolverton, II, J.D.

Posted on 03/13/2014 5:42:36 PM PDT by VitacoreVision



The Oklahoma state House of Representatives decided not to apply for a constitutional convention.

Oklahoma Won't Apply for Con-Con, Votes Not There

13 March 2014

After a close battle that featured several late nights, the Oklahoma State House of Representatives has decided not to vote to apply for a constitutional convention (con-con) under the authority of Article V of the Constitution. Put simply, the votes needed to approve the con-con application were not there, and it's now dead for this year's legislative session in Oklahoma.

This is a crucial victory in the struggle to protect the Constitution and the fundamental liberties it protects from the possible ravages that could result from a second constitutional convention.

Dr. Mike Ritze, a key member of the constitutionally minded bloc of the Oklahoma House of Representatives who successfully derailed the Con-Con locomotive in the Sooner State, told The New American that the fight was close and the hour was late, but in the end, a majority of his colleagues decided “they did not want to open the Pandora’s box of a con-con.” Ritze supports state nullification of unconstitutional federal laws as the far safer approach for reining in the federal government.

The good doctor’s sense of the threat to freedom posed by an Article V convention is right. Historically, constitutionally, and legally such a convention as is being promoted by many on the Right and the Left is unsafe and built on the weak foundation of the hope that delegates to such a convention would preserve the Constitution as we know it today.

Opponents like Dr. Ritze, however, prefer to follow the sound advice of Thomas Jefferson, who wrote in the Kentucky Resolution of 1798, “In questions of power then, let no more be heard of confidence in man, but bind him down from mischief by the chains of the constitution.”

Advocates of an Article V convention counter that there are safeguards built into the process that would ultimately protect the Constitution from amendments that could repeal the Bill of Rights.

The problem with such comforting promises, however, is that a con-con would not be peopled with delegates devoted to keeping the core principles of the Constitution intact. Rather, there are billions being spent by George Soros and other admitted socialists and progressives who admit to aiming at making fundamental changes to the Constitution should an Article V convention actually occur.

The New American has covered the manifold menaces lurking within the Article V con-con movement. Ritze reports that many of these articles and other materials produced by The New American were instrumental in convincing his colleagues in the Oklahoma House to choose not to call for a con-con.

Of course, the claim that without such a convention the country will soon fall into ruin and annihilation was the very attitude anti-Federalists once called "the argument of tyrants."

Friends of the Constitution congratulate Dr. Ritze and his fellow representatives for their wise decision to protect the Constitution from tinkering by those anxious to take a wrench to the delicate gears of our Republic.

The battle is not over, however. Legislatures in several states are considering similar bills supporting calls for a con-con of one sort or another. Liberty minded citizens in every state, therefore, are encouraged to contact their state representatives and senators, informing them of their opposition to an Article V con-con and to familiarize these lawmakers with the significant and irreparable harm that such a convention could do to our Constitution and the liberties it protects.


TOPICS: Government; News/Current Events; Politics/Elections; US: Oklahoma
KEYWORDS: articlev; concon; conventionofstates; demagogicparty; memebuilding; oklahoma; partisanmediashill; partisanmediashills

1 posted on 03/13/2014 5:42:36 PM PDT by VitacoreVision
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To: Jacquerie; Baynative; Hostage

Article V ping.


2 posted on 03/13/2014 5:43:42 PM PDT by Publius ("Who is John Galt?" by Billthedrill and Publius now available at Amazon.)
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To: Publius

well, I am glad they did not have the votes for a Constitutional Convention or “Con-Con”.
I am disappointed that they will not be applying to the Convention of States for the purpose of proposing amendments to the Constitution.


3 posted on 03/13/2014 5:51:01 PM PDT by dontreadthis
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To: VitacoreVision

What is it about the terms Article V Convention and Convention of the States that makes certain people turn into dolts who just can’t get it through their thick heads that neither term sounds like, looks like, or means constitutional convention. Sheesh!


4 posted on 03/13/2014 5:51:21 PM PDT by ForMyChildren
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To: dontreadthis

It’s not over, yet.


5 posted on 03/13/2014 5:53:32 PM PDT by Oklahoma
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To: ForMyChildren
Here's my usual boilerplate.

The amendatory process under Article V consists of three steps: Proposal, Disposal, and Ratification.

Proposal:

There are two ways to propose an amendment to the Constitution.

Article V gives Congress and an Amendments Convention exactly the same power to propose amendments, no more and no less.

Disposal:

Once Congress, or an Amendments Convention, proposes amendments, Congress must decide whether the states will ratify by the:

The State Ratifying Convention Method has only been used twice: once to ratify the Constitution, and once to ratify the 21st Amendment repealing Prohibition.

Ratification:

Depending upon which ratification method is chosen by Congress, either the state legislatures vote up-or-down on the proposed amendment, or the voters elect a state ratifying convention to vote up-or-down. If three-quarters of the states vote to ratify, the amendment becomes part of the Constitution.

Forbidden Subjects:

Article V contains two explicitly forbidden subjects and one implicitly forbidden subject.

Explicitly forbidden:

Implicitly forbidden:

I have two reference works for those interested.

The first is from the American Legislative Exchange Council, a conservative pro-business group. This document has been sent to every state legislator in the country.

Proposing Constitutional Amendments by a Convention of the States: A Handbook for State Lawmakers

The second is a 1973 report from the American Bar Association attempting to identify gray areas in the amendatory process to include an Amendments Convention. It represents the view of the ruling class of 40 years ago. While I dislike some of their conclusions, they have laid out the precedents that may justify those conclusions. What I respect is the comprehensive job they did in locating all the gray areas. They went so far as to identify a gray area that didn't pop up until the Equal Rights Amendment crashed and burned a decade later. Even if you find yourself in disagreement with their vision, it's worth reading to see the view of the ruling class toward the process.

Report of the ABA Special Constitutional Convention Study Committee

6 posted on 03/13/2014 5:53:39 PM PDT by Publius ("Who is John Galt?" by Billthedrill and Publius now available at Amazon.)
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To: Oklahoma

how so?


7 posted on 03/13/2014 5:55:05 PM PDT by dontreadthis
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To: VitacoreVision

“victory?”

i call it a disaster.


8 posted on 03/13/2014 6:00:28 PM PDT by dadfly
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To: VitacoreVision; All
This is a crucial victory in the struggle to protect the Constitution and the fundamental liberties it protects from the possible ravages that could result from a second constitutional convention.

The above statement seems to be based on the constitutional myth that the product of a con-con is a new amendment to the Constitution. But the product of a con-con is actually a proposed amendment to the Constitution which the states can then then choose to ratify or ignore.

9 posted on 03/13/2014 6:00:39 PM PDT by Amendment10
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To: Oklahoma

No, it’s not. They will come around to a CoS.


10 posted on 03/13/2014 6:05:29 PM PDT by Blood of Tyrants (Haven't you lost enough freedoms? Support an end to the WOD now.)
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To: VitacoreVision

“... the Oklahoma State House of Representatives has decided not to vote
to apply for a constitutional convention under the authority of Article V of the Constitution ...”
-
Somebody does not know what the hell they are talking about.
I don’t know if it is the author, the author’s sources,
or the Oklahoma House of Representatives.


11 posted on 03/13/2014 6:22:18 PM PDT by Repeal The 17th (We have met the enemy and he is us.)
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To: Oklahoma
"It’s not over, yet."

It certainly isn't. Right now there is a lot of confusion between the meaning of a Constitutional Convention and the Convention of States. AS people learn and explore the disaster being put upon us by a runaway government, I think they will come around.

The real damage to this country is being done by a congress that applauds the usurpation of their powers and constitutional responsibility by this president. I wonder what they think of the precedents he is setting and what could happen under a future president with even more destructive or oppressive tendencies.

12 posted on 03/13/2014 6:24:10 PM PDT by Baynative (Got bulbs? Check my profile page.)
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To: VitacoreVision

Let it V, Let it V...


13 posted on 03/13/2014 6:24:46 PM PDT by VRW Conspirator ( 2+2 = V)
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To: dontreadthis

We will keep trying.


14 posted on 03/13/2014 6:25:43 PM PDT by Oklahoma
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To: Oklahoma

happy to hear that


15 posted on 03/13/2014 6:30:49 PM PDT by dontreadthis
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To: Oklahoma

It aint over until we revolt.


16 posted on 03/13/2014 6:31:30 PM PDT by unixfox (Abolish Slavery, Repeal the 16th Amendment)
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To: VitacoreVision

“This is a crucial victory in the struggle to protect the Constitution and the fundamental liberties it protects from the possible ravages that could result from a second constitutional convention.”

IDIOTIC. Stupidity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.

If any of the conservative Justices on SCOTUS are replaced by creatures like Soto-Mayer, the chaos created by the Warren Court will seem like small change. The morons who consistently get elected to office pull the same kind of crap year after year - inflating the budget, eroding our rights, etc and they are elected again and again. Spending is out of control.

We are NOT talking a “Constitutional Convention” as the drones in John Birch keep saying. A Convention of the States is a convention directed at SPECIFIC PREDETERMINED ISSUES. Anything else - such as finagling with the Bill of Rights is off the table. Read The Liberty Amendments by Mark Levin. He is a constitutional scholar and worked in the Reagan Administration. HE supports the Convention of the States.

Unless we take drastic steps to address serial office holders, judicial abuse, and the budget, the nation as we know it will soon cease to exist and THAT is what a Convention of the States will do - take power on key issues out of the hands of Congress, the Courts and the President, ALL of whom have long demonstrated they are unfit to carry out the responsibilities with which they are charged under the Constitution.


17 posted on 03/13/2014 6:40:58 PM PDT by ZULU (Si vis pacem, para bellum)
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To: VitacoreVision

Article V allows for an amendatory conference by the states, not a “con-con”. There is no provision for a second constitutional convention; these guys know this, and they just want to thwart the process. Business as usual is NOT an option when the Federal government is wild, unlawful, and rogue.
Article V is really the only peaceful means we have left. After that, it’s secession, then CW2, coup d’etats, and tyranny.


18 posted on 03/13/2014 6:47:08 PM PDT by grumpygresh (Democrats delenda est. New US economy: Fascism on top, Socialism on the bottom.)
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To: Publius; The_Media_never_lie
Thank you for re-posting your #6. Both of the documents you link to are easily downloaded and provide important information.

You may recall a map posted on this forum several years ago that showed the overwhelming number of Republican counties across the U.S. It would seem all that is necessary is for those counties to convince a number of state governments to get on with it.

19 posted on 03/13/2014 6:59:35 PM PDT by frog in a pot (We are all "frogs in a pot" now. How and when will we real Americans jump out?)
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To: Publius
The editorial spin in this article is fascinating to read. The author is clearly a supporter of stopping the movement, and his laudatory words in praise of those who stopped it really stand out.

-PJ

20 posted on 03/13/2014 7:11:49 PM PDT by Political Junkie Too (If you are the Posterity of We the People, then you are a Natural Born Citizen.)
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To: VitacoreVision

Good. Wanna kill the Constitution? Have this convention.


21 posted on 03/13/2014 7:40:54 PM PDT by RIghtwardHo
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To: Publius

So Ritze’s scare tactics were successful in persuading OK representatives that a CON-CON would ‘ravage’ the Bill of Rights and especially given Soros’ billions the entire Constitution would be at risk.

Sounds like what is needed is a leader who can educate legislators to the reality that 2/3s of legislatures are required to propose an amendment and 3/4s are required to ratify a proposed amendment.

For Soros to accomplish an overthrow of the US Constitution by rewriting it he would need to buy off thousands of legislators in each state. Somehow I don’t think our United States is that far gone yet, at least not at the state levels.


22 posted on 03/13/2014 8:03:00 PM PDT by Hostage (ARTICLE V)
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To: RIghtwardHo

You need to educate yourself about Article V Convention of the States
and not be one of those who spread disinformation.


23 posted on 03/13/2014 8:29:18 PM PDT by Repeal The 17th (We have met the enemy and he is us.)
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To: Resolute Conservative; VerySadAmerican; Nuc 1.1; MamaTexan; Political Junkie Too; jeffc; 1010RD; ...

Bump in the road to constitutional restoration, Article V Ping!


24 posted on 03/14/2014 2:05:31 AM PDT by Jacquerie (A senate of the states will not seat judges hostile to the tenth amendment. Article V.)
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To: Publius; dontreadthis; ForMyChildren; Oklahoma; Blood of Tyrants; Baynative; ZULU; ...
I did a little web search on Rep Mike Ritze.

There's no doubt he's conservative.

It appears he has hitched his wagon to the dead horse of nullification. For some reason, proponents of nullification recoil from Article V and paint us as George Soros worshipers whose dark objective is to surreptitiously undermine that which no longer exists, the 1787 constitution.

If you haven't, check out the link within the column by lawyer Joe Wolverton. Among his distortions in supposed support of the Constitution, he cites a quote from the Anti-Federalist Centinel! The intent is to slam us as blind followers of Mark Levin and COS.

Wolverton is smooth and dangerous. We should follow and respond to this guy whenever possible.

25 posted on 03/14/2014 2:42:44 AM PDT by Jacquerie ("Con-con" is for dumb-dumbs. Support an Article V state amendment convention.)
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To: Jacquerie
Oh, and notice that Wolverton is a bircher.

COS posted a point by point refutation a few weeks ago. Good ammo for us.

26 posted on 03/14/2014 2:49:17 AM PDT by Jacquerie ("Con-con" is for dumb-dumbs. Support an Article V state amendment convention.)
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To: Jacquerie
Chwecked out Wolverton:

http://www.utahtalkradio.com/Wolverton-Joe.html

Looks like he is a genuine conservative, like the members of the JBS, but really feels the Convention of the States is the wrong way to go.

I disagree with him adamantly on the Convention of the States, but appreciate his concerns.

This is why we conservatives are always at cross-ends in trying to defeat the left. They are a monolithic movement of insentient drones. We are composed of people who think and people who think will tend to disagree.

I hope and pray that Oklahoma's action can be reversed as I truly believe that only by amending some selected parts of the Constitution to address abuses the Founding Fathers could never have conceptualized, can e save our republic.
At the same time, I do not reject nullification. I feel these are both useful tools in dealing with the statists and Bolsheviks who are opposing us in the Federal Government.

27 posted on 03/14/2014 6:32:49 AM PDT by ZULU (Si vis pacem, para bellum)
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To: ZULU

I don’t see nullification resolutions alone as doing harm. Nullification is useful to the extent it expresses the will of a state.

For some reason, many who support nullification are typically against and horribly mistaken in their opposition to Article V.


28 posted on 03/14/2014 7:43:09 AM PDT by Jacquerie ("Con-con" is for dumb-dumbs. Support an Article V state amendment convention.)
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To: RIghtwardHo

Educate yourself... You sound like you are from DU...

There are GREAT resources up thread that explain it’s not a “con-con”... ANYTHING out of the COS has to be ratified by 38 states to become PART of the constitution...


29 posted on 03/14/2014 7:53:03 AM PDT by bfh333 (William Wallace was right! ~~~ FRRRREEEEEEEEEEEDOM ~~~)
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To: Jacquerie

When ONE Governor STOPS taking a PENNY from DC & more importantly STOPS sending taxes TO Washington AND mobilizes their States National Guard then get back to me on Nullification...


30 posted on 03/14/2014 8:06:08 AM PDT by bfh333 (William Wallace was right! ~~~ FRRRREEEEEEEEEEEDOM ~~~)
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To: Jacquerie

Conservatives eat their own.


31 posted on 03/14/2014 8:53:51 AM PDT by ZULU (Si vis pacem, para bellum)
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To: VitacoreVision

*sigh*-bump


32 posted on 03/14/2014 12:45:39 PM PDT by TEXOKIE (We must surrender only to our Holy God and never to the evil that has befallen us.)
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