Skip to comments.California gun parts store refuses to turn over customer list to federal officials
Posted on 03/15/2014 9:49:20 AM PDT by Olog-hai
The owner of a California store that sells gun parts to build rifles from scratch is refusing to turn over his customer list to federal officials.
Dimitrios Karras, owner of Ares Armor in Oceanside, told Fox5SanDiego.com that Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives agents are investigating his business because it sells AR-15 lower receivers, which contain the guns operating parts.
The company sold thousands of 80 percent receivers in with colors showing where the customer can drill, making it easier and cheaper to build. The ATF said the sales are illegal and demanded the company turn over the products and names of customers who purchased them, according to the report.
(Excerpt) Read more at foxnews.com ...
So they’ll raid it and take it.
If he’s smart, they’ll never find the list.
By ATF definition, an 80% receiver is NOT a receiver.
It is just a hunk of metal.
Also by ATF regulation, completing the receiver is NOT illegal, though it does have restrictions.
Hopefully the guy didn't machine right up to 80 percent or the Feds will find a toolmark somewhere that crosses the 80 percent threshold and weaver the guy.
If the list doesn’t exist anymore, “they” can’t get it ...
That is the problem with these regulations.
They nail people on technicalities.
The ATF 922 laws are almost impossible to fathom.
The only thing that would be more evil is a home printed polymer receiver. /s
Digital scans stored on an encrypted drive with hard copies stored waaaay offsite and underground.
Those facts are not in dispute, though I am sure a few nitwit reporters will get things wrong.
The issue at stake is a certain brand of polymer 80% receiver. The BATFE claims, despite the protests of much of the community, that this particular brand of polymer lower is really a complete lower rather than an 80% lower.
“By ATF definition”
They don’t have to follow even their own regulations.
The government is totally out of control.
If the President can nor obey laws that he asked to be made why can not we the people refuse to obey laws that we did not ask to be made?
A lot of these shops sell the 80% lowers and host build parties. I was supposed to attend one in Oceanside last year. I wonder if this shop did the same.
“Hopefully the guy didn’t machine right up to 80 percent or the Feds will find a toolmark somewhere that crosses the 80 percent threshold and weaver the guy.”
The 80% receivers in question are injection molded plastic. They were being made by a firm in Bakersfield, CA by the name of EP Armory ( who have already been raided by the thugs from the BATFE). The EP 80% receiver has a “plastic plug” in the fire control pocket that is a different color than the body of the receiver, making in easy to “create” a functional part with a Dremel. The ATF contends that the parts are illegal because they were “originally functional” and that the plugs made them “nonfictional” which they view as illegal. The problem they have is according to EP Armory, they mold the plug and then overmold the receiver and thus the part is never “functional.” It’s going to be interesting to see how the courts act. Also, one of the partners in Ares is an attorney who is very well versed in the 2A and state and federal gun laws. Finally, the City of National City, CA ( an interesting name in view of the fact that it’s run by a bunch of Marxists) is trying to force Ares to tae down their business sign on top pf their building because it depicts an AR-15. The city claims it’s violating their sign ordinance despite the fact that the sign structure itself has been on top of the building for years. Buy lots of popcorn, this is going to be fun to watch because Ares says that they have the money to fight both the ATF and the city.
“I was supposed to attend one in Oceanside last year. I wonder if this shop did the same.”
Could be, because Ares has a facility in Oceanside, and a separate machine shop where they host the build parties. They have a 45 minute YouTube video about their fight with National City. Fun to see how our Marxist government tramples on citizens rights when those citizens want to engage in a business that the government doesn’t “approve of.”
Nothing an executive order can't fix.
If a guy's whole point in buying an 80% receiver was to have something which the government had no record of, then he would be a fool to give the seller his name and address, or buy with anything other than cash.
This is the same shop where the local town demanded he remove his sign that had an AR15 on it. They threatened to close him down if he didn’t. I guess this is their way of doing it. Nice to have jackbooted thugs at your disposal.
Why is there a list in the first place?
“This is the same shop where the local town demanded he remove his sign that had an AR15 on it. They threatened to close him down if he didnt. I guess this is their way of doing it. Nice to have jackbooted thugs at your disposal.”
Separate issue. Both the BATFE and National City are messing with Ares.
“Also by ATF regulation, completing the receiver is NOT illegal, though it does have restrictions.”
Actually, its by reason of the Federal Firearms Act of 1968. my guess is that absent that legislation, the BATFE would be out rounding up all the “illegal” home made AR-15’s.
Ares should leave that liberal cesspool called Kalifornication.
“Ares should leave that liberal cesspool called Kalifornication.”
Well potty mouth, does that mean that FR should pack up and leave Fresno too? Why don’t you let us all in on where you live so we can make some crappy, illogical comments about it too. I try to refrain from that practice, but in your case, I’d gladly make an exception. Folks like the owners of Ares are standing and fighting, something you probably wouldn’t have the stomach for. We can all be glad that you were not around during the founding of our country, because my guess is that we would all still be British citizens. Must give you a “thrill down your leg” to trash millions of us decent folks who happen to live in California.
“Ares says that they have the money to fight both the ATF and the city.”
When I was running a contracting company I was told by two Pinellas county companies that the IRS seized all of their accounts and told them if they didn’t sign a contract (in this case not to hire contractors) that they’d hold onto the money until the companies bellied-up. So, the ATF or IRS could do the same here. (There is no law forbidding the hiring of contractors. The IRS simply doesn’t like it. This was in the early ‘90’s. They appeared to be targeting companies that made less than 5 million a year.)
Geeze........in case anyone had any doubt that our out of control government is trying to disarm the people-here is a story that proves it.
I like how the unmarked cop cap pulls a U turn in that video and pulls up as the guy was filming out on the street just as he was going into the store.
“I like how the unmarked cop car pulls a U turn in that video and pulls up as the guy was filming out on the street just as he was going into the store.”
Yeah, it’s sure gone way beyond “ my neighbor’s a cop and I am sure he’s there to protect us.” Did you see where the CT cop who threatened the guy who said “he would not comply” now has armed police guard because others have threatened him? The “threatener” get’s “threatened,” so he gets police protection. It’s like here in CA where cops personal automobile registrations are not a matter of public record. So the cops put all their cars on that list and no one ever gets a ticket, and they can roll through FasTrak toll booths, not have a transponder, and never get caught. It’s so bad here that there are more than a million people listed as “LEOs” who get the privilege of being “unlisted.”
“Separate issue. Both the BATFE and National City are messing with Ares.”
Seems rather coincidental especially considering the willingness of the justice department to attack people they disagree with.
Why would there have to be a customer list. Couldn’t you just walk in, pay cash without any paperwork?
I think the ATF got the judge to modify the RO. Either that, or we’re seeing the confiscations begin.