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Large Scale Solar Energy Generation May Be Over As Soon As It Has Begun (Mojave Desert)
Earth Island ^ | 2/20/14 | Chris Clarke

Posted on 03/16/2014 7:48:16 AM PDT by Libloather

**SNIP**

In 2011, BrightSource had several other proposed projects on the table in the California desert. All of them would be much larger than Ivanpah, with more intense solar flux. Environmental activists started asking tough questions during hearings on these projects. For example, what would happen to birds, bats and insects that fly into that flux?

An answer came in late 2013 at Ivanpah. Mortalities from solar flux had been noted since testing began in March of last year. In October, a startling number of dead migrating birds on the site led federal wildlife biologists to a sad conclusion. The bright solar flux likely attracts insects, which attract small birds, which attract raptors: an entire food chain drawn into a zone of lethal solar flux. This ecological trap’s effect on migrating birds was especially troubling. Birds migrating from the Arctic to Central America pass through the Mojave: Ivanpah could conceivably depress bird populations across half a continent.

(Excerpt) Read more at earthisland.org ...


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Extended News; Government; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: climatechange; energy; globalwarming; globalwarminghoax; solar
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That momentum hasn’t changed. In its coverage of Ivanpah’s ribbon cutting, The New York Times suggested that the era of large desert solar might well be over. It’s just too much easier, cheaper and quicker to cover rooftops and landfills and other already disturbed landscapes with solar panels, which have no moving parts and are thus far cheaper to operate than turbines operating at high temperatures.

Wackos need extreme heat to turn turbines which will save the planet from global warming. The circle of death.

1 posted on 03/16/2014 7:48:16 AM PDT by Libloather
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2 posted on 03/16/2014 7:48:35 AM PDT by Libloather (Embrace the suck)
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To: Libloather

Redirecting the sun is not a good idea.


3 posted on 03/16/2014 7:49:18 AM PDT by Sacajaweau
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To: Sacajaweau

...and how many taxpayer dollars were “invested” in this (and similar) scam? It is no wonder that these eco-boy-wonders have helped get the deficit into the $20,000,000,000,000.00 range. Soon we’ll be talking a lot of money.


4 posted on 03/16/2014 7:53:39 AM PDT by hal ogen (First Amendment or Reeducation Camp?)
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To: Libloather

But the important point is that financial supporters of Obama and other democrats made a fortune building this boondoggle.

So, other than being inefficient power source and an ecological death machine, it has been a great success.


5 posted on 03/16/2014 7:54:54 AM PDT by Iron Munro (Albert Einstein: The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits)
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To: Libloather

No Power!
No Way!
No How!

They oppose it ALL!!

The “Dirt Good!, People Bad!” crowd want 6 BILLION people gone NOW!

When these elitists have either moved into caves or start offing themselves, I’ll take note.


6 posted on 03/16/2014 7:55:14 AM PDT by G Larry (There's the Beef!)
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To: Libloather

Unintended consequences


7 posted on 03/16/2014 7:55:42 AM PDT by Darren McCarty (Abortion - legalized murder for convenience)
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To: Libloather

It boils down to a centralized versus a de-centralized approach. Collectivists always opt for the centralized solution. I’m looking forward to the day when each home can install and use a device to generate its own electrical power that provides all the energy a family would need, without relying on a “grid.”


8 posted on 03/16/2014 7:55:42 AM PDT by MNnice
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To: Libloather

Looking at that photo, and the reflection over-shooting the tower (as seen on the hills behind), how soon until there is a brush fire started by this?


9 posted on 03/16/2014 7:55:48 AM PDT by T. P. Pole
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To: Libloather

Well if you have really stupid Idea and Obama is going to give you Billions to be really stupid ,go for it , LOL


10 posted on 03/16/2014 7:56:33 AM PDT by molson209 (Hillary Clinton)
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To: Libloather

How much energy does that gadget crank out at night? Perhaps we need to adjust Daylight Savings Time some more?


11 posted on 03/16/2014 7:59:56 AM PDT by upchuck (South Carolina Representative Trey Gowdy for Speaker of the House!!!)
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To: Darren McCarty

Great book.


12 posted on 03/16/2014 8:02:37 AM PDT by Gadsden1st
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To: Iron Munro
I get the impression that the bigger the failure, the more money Obama’s cronies rake in.
13 posted on 03/16/2014 8:02:48 AM PDT by Hillarys Gate Cult (Liberals make unrealistic demands on reality and reality doesn't oblige them.)
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To: Libloather

I would love a solar flux device in my backyard to turn flying insects into fried worm food. It would cut down on my chemical pesticide use. Yes it would kill minority good bugs as well but I pay the taxes on this little plot of land and want all of them dead.


14 posted on 03/16/2014 8:03:54 AM PDT by Reeses
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To: Hillarys Gate Cult

Just wait till these heavily subsidized companies want paid compensation for lost revenue “potential” if they are shut down.


15 posted on 03/16/2014 8:08:22 AM PDT by glyptol
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To: Libloather; Norm Lenhart; TADSLOS; Army Air Corps; GraceG

Nice Solar Plant.

We will Take it.


16 posted on 03/16/2014 8:08:49 AM PDT by KC_Lion (Build the America you want to live in at your address, and keep looking up.- Sarah Palin)
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To: Libloather

Amazing all the far-left clubs, i.e. Sierra Club, approved of this project while KNOWING the detriment it would cause to the environment and wildlife. Proves their opposition to most everything else is politically motivated and has nothing to do with ‘saving wildlife’.


17 posted on 03/16/2014 8:10:04 AM PDT by VeniVidiVici (Play the 'Knockout Game' with someone owning a 9mm and you get what you deserve)
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To: Gadsden1st

It is, although I wasn’t referring to Henry Bowman.


18 posted on 03/16/2014 8:15:35 AM PDT by Darren McCarty (Abortion - legalized murder for convenience)
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To: T. P. Pole
Probably this summer.

Idiots.

19 posted on 03/16/2014 8:17:36 AM PDT by Darren McCarty (Abortion - legalized murder for convenience)
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To: MNnice

I’m waiting for the day (that might come) when you paint 3 or 4 layers of “paint” on your roof and generate your own solar power.

Just walk into any Home Depot and pick up a few buckets of solar power in a DIY kit.


20 posted on 03/16/2014 8:18:49 AM PDT by Travis McGee (www.EnemiesForeignAndDomestic.com)
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To: Libloather

Gosh, what a surprise! When you concentrate large areas of sunlight, birds fly through it. Some one needs a federal grant to study this.


21 posted on 03/16/2014 8:21:19 AM PDT by norwaypinesavage (for)
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To: Libloather
And if they can scale up the technology for the liquid fluoride thorium reactor (LFTR), that could put a LOT of solar and wind power plants out of business.

Unlike conventional pressurized water reactors (PWR's) that use uranium fuel rods, LFTR's use commonly-found thorium-232 dissolved in molten fluoride salts, essentially a liquid nuclear fuel. And it's far safer to operate and the nuclear waste generated is very small in amount with a radioactive half-life of under 300 years. Small wonder why there is now serious research into LFTR technology, since once perfected, we have a fuel source that could potentially last for tens of thousands of years (not only is thorium-232 common on Earth, but there may be huge deposits on the Moon, too).

22 posted on 03/16/2014 8:22:16 AM PDT by RayChuang88 (FairTax: America's economic cure)
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To: Libloather
This sounds much worse than wind turbines, which had to get a waiver to kill eagles.

So much so, the wackos can't turn a blind eye to this one.

23 posted on 03/16/2014 8:22:47 AM PDT by MUDDOG
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To: Libloather

............well, LOL, I’m reminded here of the old saying “the enemy of my enemy is my friend”. Knowing as I do that BIG SOLAR is a con mans orgasm, I am always opposed even to the discussion. But, for a moment I thought The Sierra nuts were going to oppose this boondoggle gift of trillions to the Dems to reward their corrupt and felonious hangers on. That would make me queasy having these Sierra loons on my side.

But, alas, no problem, the Sierra criminals, when push came to shove, sold their souls to the higher bidder and supported this boondoggle because no doubt they were cut a billion or two back to sit down and shut up!

I think AMERICA is just TOO BIG to effectively manage its corruptors anymore. The corruptors like Gore and Sierra and the Dems and MSM are just too powerful and effective at manipulating the LIV’s and putting corrupt criminals in house and senate seats (led by Boehner and Reid).

I think the ultimate solution that eventually will be forced upon us by CIRCUMSTANCES is to break up into many small parts unified only on DEFENSE. Like Detroit, just bulldoze DC except for Arlington Cemetery and the museums.


24 posted on 03/16/2014 8:23:34 AM PDT by Cen-Tejas (it's the debt bomb stupid!)
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To: Libloather

The reason libs fail has a lot to do with their belief that the way things have been done is absolutely wrong and they have this need to reinvent the wheel. If they poured the same effort and money into improving the way things are done (producing power or many other things) at some point changes would indeed happen, but not the drastic sometimes bizarre overnight changes they seem to come up with as solutions.

Of course the other thing libs have learned along the way is if you throw large sums of money into things most don’t understand it makes it much easier to siphon of part/most/all of the money into various pockets.


25 posted on 03/16/2014 8:29:54 AM PDT by Tammy8
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To: Libloather

Looks like the huggers are fluxed again.


26 posted on 03/16/2014 8:32:02 AM PDT by x1stcav ("The past is a foreign country: they do things differently there.")
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To: KC_Lion

I’ll bet this one has a Tech named Fantastic, too.


27 posted on 03/16/2014 8:34:41 AM PDT by TADSLOS (The Event Horizon has come and gone. Buckle up and hang on.)
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To: T. P. Pole
Looking at that photo, and the reflection over-shooting the tower (as seen on the hills behind), how soon until there is a brush fire started by this?

IMHO, I don't think that those are reflections from the hills behind, but are instead a distortion event from the heated air at the center point as seen in two dimensions. It probably is like a semi-halo around the focus from the solar orientation.

28 posted on 03/16/2014 8:38:17 AM PDT by SES1066 (Quality, Speed or Economical - Any 2 of 3 except in government - 1 at best but never #3!)
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To: TADSLOS
And I am sure he will be just a Competent too....

I'll bet everyone of the Greenies have a Theoretical Degree in Physics.

29 posted on 03/16/2014 8:38:31 AM PDT by KC_Lion (Build the America you want to live in at your address, and keep looking up.- Sarah Palin)
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To: T. P. Pole
Looking at that photo, and the reflection over-shooting the tower (as seen on the hills behind), how soon until there is a brush fire started by this?

That's what it looks like, but it's actually the mirrors focused near the collector, in an "off" state, where they can quickly be angled into the collector for the "on" state.

You're seeing the distant hills through a donut of superheated air and dust edge on.

30 posted on 03/16/2014 8:39:16 AM PDT by null and void ( Obama is Law-Less because Republican "leaders" are BALL-LESS!!)
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To: KC_Lion

LOL


31 posted on 03/16/2014 8:39:45 AM PDT by TADSLOS (The Event Horizon has come and gone. Buckle up and hang on.)
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To: SES1066

Halo. That was the word I should have used.


32 posted on 03/16/2014 8:41:21 AM PDT by null and void ( Obama is Law-Less because Republican "leaders" are BALL-LESS!!)
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To: MNnice

“I’m looking forward to the day when each home can install and use a device to generate its own electrical power that provides all the energy a family would need, without relying on a “grid.””

That day is now! Just install a big ass generator and fill er up with diesel!


33 posted on 03/16/2014 8:50:12 AM PDT by Beagle8U (Unions are an Affirmative Action program for Slackers! .)
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To: T. P. Pole
--been past it several times since inception -

-I think that apparent reflection is a photo illusion---the "glow" when you drive by it appears to be right around the tower--it's a strange phenomenon to look at from the highway and doesn't appear to be on the hillside---

34 posted on 03/16/2014 8:54:59 AM PDT by rellimpank (--don't believe anything the media or government says about firearms or explosives--)
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To: Libloather

Is this reflectivity why it’s so damn cold?


35 posted on 03/16/2014 8:55:38 AM PDT by Jim Noble (When strong, avoid them. Attack their weaknesses. Emerge to their surprise. H)
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To: T. P. Pole
Looking at that photo, and the reflection over-shooting the tower (as seen on the hills behind), how soon until there is a brush fire started by this?

I don't think that reflection is a over-shoot that misses the tower, its more likely dust caught in the "beam" that is reflecting light.

36 posted on 03/16/2014 9:03:23 AM PDT by ClaytonP
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To: Libloather

I recommend searching for Ivanpah on google maps. Its over three equare miles of solar panels...the scale of this boggles the mind.

How anyone could think this is more environmentally friendly than a standard power plant is beyond me. I can’t even fathom tbe energy required to make all those panels.


37 posted on 03/16/2014 9:16:17 AM PDT by lacrew (Mr. Soetoro, we regret to inform you that your race card is over the credit limit.)
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To: G Larry

That is not true. There are millions of acres of fallow land where large scale solar can be installed and where the sun shines just as brightly. But it is not free BLM land.

The best solution however is to pass feed in tariffs that allow homeowners to be paid for the extra electricity they feed into the system. That is not presently allowed. Why?

Why should the utility company and companies like Bright Source be the only ones to profit off electricity generation. I won’t even ask for a government subsidy to install my solar system.

Your comments are wildly uniformed. They don’t oppose it all.


38 posted on 03/16/2014 9:17:39 AM PDT by gunsequalfreedom (Conservative is not a label of convenience. It is a guide to your actions.)
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To: Libloather

Turn liberals into batteries like on Matrix.


39 posted on 03/16/2014 9:21:14 AM PDT by DungeonMaster (No one can come to me unless the Father who sent Me draws him.)
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To: MNnice

That ability exists but is expensive.

Natural gas powered generators would do nicely

ditto nuclear packages


40 posted on 03/16/2014 9:21:50 AM PDT by bert ((K.E. N.P. N.C. +12 ..... History is a process, not an event)
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To: Libloather

Who cares whether some bald eagles or golden eagles are killed by Green Energy producers, but kill a little minnow in a creek? Perish the thought, they’d rather you die that the minnow.


41 posted on 03/16/2014 9:27:39 AM PDT by macglencoe (You see what the left hand is doing, but you should be watching the right hand.)
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To: VeniVidiVici
Sierra club, Building there street cred, one tortoise and bird at a time.
42 posted on 03/16/2014 9:33:27 AM PDT by justrepublican (Screaming like a "Vexatious requester" at a Wellstone memorial...........)
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To: Libloather

Well that was an excellent investment. /s


43 posted on 03/16/2014 9:37:02 AM PDT by PistolPaknMama
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To: gunsequalfreedom

ah..
“fallow land”....that birds don’t fly over?

“THEY” the Sierra Club, and the Population Control crowd DO OPPOSE IT ALL!

Not to mention that we could NEVER build enough of these solar farms to be more than a 5% solution for our energy needs.


44 posted on 03/16/2014 9:48:17 AM PDT by G Larry (There's the Beef!)
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To: Libloather

I suspect the real solar flux is the change in attitude about solar energy within the ecological fanatics themselves.

I’m still puzzled over how desert tortoises can be harmed by this, whatever their numbers. Tortoises don’t fly and if they manage to crawl under a giant mirror they’ll only be gaining some shade.

Unless they are drawn to the shade in huge numbers so that maintenance personnel can’t avoid them, are they truly endangered by this site—or is championing the cause of the desert tortoise just another attempt by the eco-Nazis to bamboozle the EPA?


45 posted on 03/16/2014 10:02:13 AM PDT by wildbill
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To: upchuck

“How much energy does that gadget crank out at night? Perhaps we need to adjust Daylight Savings Time some more?”

Indeed. One extra hour of daylight every day isn’t enough to save this turkey. Now, TWO extra hours of daylight, then maybe we’re on to something here! And the beauty of doubling the extra hours of daylight is it really doesn’t cost anything since the time-shifting infrastructure is already in place!


46 posted on 03/16/2014 10:05:41 AM PDT by catnipman (Cat Nipman: Vote Republican in 2012 and only be called racist one more time!)
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To: G Larry

I spent a lot of time on these issues and you don’t know what you are talking about.

Even from a conservative perspective you should favor solar to get us off foreign oil imports.

Not every issue is defined by a strict liberal vs conservative construct.


47 posted on 03/16/2014 10:55:59 AM PDT by gunsequalfreedom (Conservative is not a label of convenience. It is a guide to your actions.)
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To: catnipman

Thank you for stating that so much better than I did. Timeshifting, yeah, that’s the ticket.


48 posted on 03/16/2014 11:09:32 AM PDT by upchuck (South Carolina Representative Trey Gowdy for Speaker of the House!!!)
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To: gunsequalfreedom

My 1980 Grad Thesis was on Energy Policy through 2005.


49 posted on 03/16/2014 11:16:20 AM PDT by G Larry (There's the Beef!)
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To: Reeses

” my chemical pesticide use.”

I think that’s why I haven’t seen many butterflies and moths in the last several years. Too wide-spread use of lawn chemicals.


50 posted on 03/16/2014 11:25:14 AM PDT by Dr. Bogus Pachysandra ( Ya can't pick up a turd by the clean end!)
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