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How will things change in Crimea if it joins Russia?
Washinton Post ^ | 3.15.2014 | Tiffany Harness

Posted on 03/16/2014 12:31:40 PM PDT by mac_truck

Let’s start with money matters. Who will pay the pensions of retirees who paid into the Ukrainian system?

Voters are being told that Russia will assume the obligations for all pensions, with a big leap in benefits. For example, the average monthly pension in Russia is said to be about $270, almost double the $150 paid in the average Ukrainian’s monthly pension. And the retirement age will drop by five years, to 60 for men and 55 for women.

And what about schools?

Schoolchildren are expected to get new history books with a more outsize section on Russian history and its version of events, such as World War II, which Russians and Crimeans refer to as the “Great Patriotic War.” Officials say that for the next year, at least, Crimeans will be allowed to enroll at Russian universities without taking an entrance exam. Next year, they will have to take the regular Russian enrollment exam.

Will people working in government offices, schools and hospitals lose their jobs?

Authorities have vowed that nobody who is doing satisfactory work will be fired, and most will get raises.

(Excerpt) Read more at washingtonpost.com ...


TOPICS: Foreign Affairs; Front Page News; News/Current Events; Russia
KEYWORDS: constitution; crimea; crimeacrisis; crimeareferendum; putinsbuttboys; russia; secession; surrendermonkeys; ukraine; viktoryanukovich; yuliatymoshenko
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Interesting article about the practical aspects of the impending Crimea separation
1 posted on 03/16/2014 12:31:40 PM PDT by mac_truck
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To: mac_truck

I guess we’ll be entering a brave new world tomorrow! These are issues that have never been faced before in human history. /sarc


2 posted on 03/16/2014 12:38:17 PM PDT by Cowboy Bob (They are called "Liberals" because the word "parasite" was already taken.)
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To: mac_truck

Its all about the money, stupid.

Crimean voters look on Russia as Sugar Mommy. They’d be stupid not to take Moscow up on all the ka-ching, ka-ching, ka-ching, coming in.

Future generations will decide if it was folly or a sound investment.


3 posted on 03/16/2014 12:43:42 PM PDT by goldstategop (In Memory Of A Dearly Beloved Friend Who Lives In My Heart Forever)
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To: mac_truck
"I've seen the future and it works."

Spin another fairytale.

4 posted on 03/16/2014 12:47:34 PM PDT by elhombrelibre (Free Ukraine. Free Venezuela. Free Syria. Free Iran. Free the USA.)
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To: mac_truck
"If you like your Crimea, you can keep it. Period!"
- V. Putin
5 posted on 03/16/2014 12:54:09 PM PDT by eCSMaster ("It is not the color of his skin, ... it is the blackness that fills his soul")
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To: eCSMaster

A very expensive welcoming present for Russia. The vote was the fun part; now the bill is coming due.


6 posted on 03/16/2014 12:56:36 PM PDT by goldstategop (In Memory Of A Dearly Beloved Friend Who Lives In My Heart Forever)
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To: mac_truck

Nice - the Post’s biggest worry is whether the entitlements will keep being paid!


7 posted on 03/16/2014 12:58:00 PM PDT by jtal (Runnin' a World in Need with White Folks' Greed - since 1492)
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To: mac_truck

Obama will be devastated, deeply saddened and he will impose a red line.


8 posted on 03/16/2014 1:05:09 PM PDT by ThePatriotsFlag ("There never was a democracy yet that did not commit suicide." - Thomas Jeffersony")
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To: goldstategop

“A very expensive welcoming present for Russia. The vote was the fun part; now the bill is coming due.”

In the long term, this is an investment with the likelihood to pay off, big-time.

A secure blue-water port for Russia’s growing oil and gas exports is huge in itself. And the new Kerch Straights Bridge will be a combination car and rail connection to the Russian Mainland.


9 posted on 03/16/2014 1:07:32 PM PDT by tcrlaf (Well, it is what the Sheeple voted for....)
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To: goldstategop
Crimean voters look on Russia as Sugar Mommy. They’d be stupid not to take Moscow up on all the ka-ching, ka-ching, ka-ching, coming in.

Yes, especially when the flip side of the coin is EU/IMF imposed Greek-style austerity.

10 posted on 03/16/2014 1:09:44 PM PDT by mac_truck ( Aide toi et dieu t aidera)
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To: tcrlaf

No more having to pay Ukraine rent on the Navy base in Sevastopol.

If its turned it into a few trade zone like Kaliningrad Oblast, it could even become a lucrative cash cow for Russia.

And Crimea again would become a summer playground for the Russian elite.


11 posted on 03/16/2014 1:10:25 PM PDT by goldstategop (In Memory Of A Dearly Beloved Friend Who Lives In My Heart Forever)
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To: goldstategop

Are you this delusional to think Putin a Soviet KBB agent had an actual vote?
These people have tanks and men wearing black masks in thecstreets all around them !
The outside media was barred from the voting areas!

The Russians killed or imprisioned millions of Ukraines , turks, greeks in the last century in this region.

Reading your non stop pro Putin propaganda is surreal.
Are you kidding us with your crazy posts.


12 posted on 03/16/2014 1:33:21 PM PDT by ncalburt ( Amnesty-media out in full force)
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To: goldstategop
Zero will pay for Russia's Crimean venture and portray it as a goodwill gesture of heroic proportions...Here I Come to Save the Day!!
13 posted on 03/16/2014 1:38:15 PM PDT by Rudder
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To: goldstategop

http://news.nationalpost.com/2014/03/15/russias-propaganda-war-on-ukraine-reaches-soviet-levels-ahead-of-crimea-vote/

this is the Putin Soviet propaganda your peddling here !


14 posted on 03/16/2014 1:43:22 PM PDT by ncalburt ( Amnesty-media out in full force)
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To: goldstategop

Not sure the people have a choice...sure they are letting people vote but really the election is corrupt and with Russian troops right there who could really stand up and say anything against what is happening?

All the promises sound familiar though...how people will all be so much better off...we keep being told the same thing...


15 posted on 03/16/2014 1:47:02 PM PDT by Tammy8
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To: mac_truck

16 posted on 03/16/2014 1:48:28 PM PDT by SoFloFreeper
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To: mac_truck

This article paints a rosy picture for the 58% ethnic Russians. Sucks if you aren’t. The per cent Russian also gives a measure of the fairness in the vote. But that was never the point was it. FWIW the other Ukrainian provinces don’t go above 39% ethnic Russian. 17.8% Russian overall with the western provinces having 2% to 4%.


17 posted on 03/16/2014 2:02:29 PM PDT by JimSEA
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To: jtal

“Nice - the Post’s biggest worry is whether the entitlements will keep being paid!”

Well spotted, and good point.


18 posted on 03/16/2014 2:10:10 PM PDT by OldNewYork
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To: JimSEA

Exactly. Its a mostly ethnic Russian province.

Latest projection is 95.5% for joining Russia!

If it had been below a “9” I would have been colored surprised.


19 posted on 03/16/2014 2:18:30 PM PDT by goldstategop (In Memory Of A Dearly Beloved Friend Who Lives In My Heart Forever)
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To: jtal

I also notice they take the Russian “promises” of manna at face value, without the slightest question.

Even in Europe, it’s all about the Gibsmedat.


20 posted on 03/16/2014 2:20:36 PM PDT by Cyber Liberty (H.L. Mencken: "The urge to save humanity is almost always a false front for the urge to rule.")
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To: mac_truck

Well, for one, the hordes of Russian sailors new to this warm-water port will demand thousands of comfort women and plenty of vodka bars.


21 posted on 03/16/2014 2:42:10 PM PDT by Jack Hammer
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To: mac_truck

Russia’s elite have been in Crimea since 1774, first in battle than as annexation by Catherine the Great in 1783. There are approximately 7 palaces of the Czars in Crimea. Come now how much different will Crimea be. Currently the Ukraine is financially broke> It is a no brainer for the Russkies in Crimea to go the way of Russia. ( I do not believe they will benefit Russia is financial strapped itself).


22 posted on 03/16/2014 2:50:12 PM PDT by hondact200 (Candor dat viribos alas (sincerity gives wings to strength) and Nil desperandum (never despair))
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To: goldstategop

Who is voting besides the ethnic Russians? It is a majority Russian Province with 42% others - a significant number. Who is doing the counting? The deal stunk for non Russians. But then, I suppose that is the point.

We’ll see which Provence is next. The greatest Russian ethnic population outside Crimea is just under 40%. Yet, the Russians are giving every appearance of going into Donetsk to rescue their fellow Russians.


23 posted on 03/16/2014 3:19:06 PM PDT by JimSEA
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To: goldstategop

Assuming, of course, Putin doesn’t start a war with Ukraine or Crimean Tatars, because you know what a magnet to tourism and trade a war zone is.

Also, Putin invested billions into Sochi, so he needs the people to go there, not Crimea. Three quarters of tourists were coming from Ukraine. There was nothing stopping Russians from coming, instead they went to Greece, Turkey, Cyprus etc.


24 posted on 03/16/2014 3:30:53 PM PDT by Ivan Mazepa
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To: mac_truck

Narva, Estonia: about 87 % ethnic Russian. Just sayin.


25 posted on 03/16/2014 3:37:01 PM PDT by Dagnabitt (Amnesty is Treason. Its agents are Traitors.)
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To: ncalburt

buzz off you twit!


26 posted on 03/16/2014 4:21:39 PM PDT by mac_truck ( Aide toi et dieu t aidera)
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To: mac_truck

California is how many percent Mexican now? These scum MFers that intentionally changed the face of America to purposely divide us with their open borders, the 1965 Immig Act, gun control for average Americans, and all intentionally to keep us divided while they all get richer, may need held to account too for their anti-USA positions.


27 posted on 03/16/2014 5:12:29 PM PDT by apoliticalone
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To: mac_truck

Nothing will change....Borders have shifted all the time in that part of the world.


28 posted on 03/16/2014 5:13:09 PM PDT by dfwgator
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To: JimSEA

The major failure of that stupid, worthless Budapest Memorandum (Clinton signed it, ‘nuff said), was the failure to recognize that Russia would never give up claims on The Crimea.


29 posted on 03/16/2014 5:15:20 PM PDT by dfwgator
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To: apoliticalone

We did it in Kosovo, now it’s Russia’s turn to show that two can play that game.


30 posted on 03/16/2014 5:16:23 PM PDT by dfwgator
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To: Dagnabitt
Narva, Estonia: about 87 % ethnic Russian. Just sayin.

Good point...I believe the PM of Estonia just announced his retirement also.

31 posted on 03/16/2014 5:17:56 PM PDT by mac_truck ( Aide toi et dieu t aidera)
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To: Dagnabitt

“Narva, Estonia: about 87 % ethnic Russian. Just saying.”

If you look at a listing of the countries that the Russians see as enemies, Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania and Poland are right at the top. Putin remains popular if he “protects” ethnic Russians. We are pretty high on the hate list as well which explains the “turn to ash” rhetoric of the Russian press. Cold War II has already started but we don’t understand.


32 posted on 03/16/2014 5:35:05 PM PDT by JimSEA
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To: Cyber Liberty

Looks like the Gimmes exist in every nation.

Now why would anyone vote in Communism for free stuff. /s


33 posted on 03/16/2014 6:40:51 PM PDT by berdie
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To: JimSEA
I would think that the economy in fiscally-tight EU-member Estonia is better than in basket-case Ukraine. So there should be less (non-emotional) reason for local Russians to want to break off to Mother Russia.

Plus I think the Estonian government would fight - with bullets (even with the full knowledge that their NATO membership is of dubious worth with Barky Hussein in the White House) .

34 posted on 03/16/2014 8:17:18 PM PDT by Dagnabitt (Amnesty is Treason. Its agents are Traitors.)
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To: JimSEA

No ethnic Russians in Poland.


35 posted on 03/16/2014 8:19:11 PM PDT by dfwgator
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To: mac_truck

Totalitarian states survive through expansionism. The Soviet Union, with its bankrupt economic model, had to retain Eastern Europe after World War II to survive. Any portable assets in these countries from gold and currency to raw materials to art and antiquities to industrial plants were sent east to Moscow. Whole factories were disassembled and shipped back to the USSR then reassembled. Stalin emulated the Czars as does Putin. When military conquest becomes risky many forms of subversion can be applied to any small country bordering Russia.


36 posted on 03/16/2014 8:39:22 PM PDT by Brad from Tennessee (A politician can't give you anything he hasn't first stolen from you.)
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To: dfwgator

No but Russians hate Pols anyhow.


37 posted on 03/16/2014 8:52:16 PM PDT by JimSEA
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To: JimSEA
No but Russians hate Pols anyhow.

And the Poles return the favor...Remember if confronted with a German and a Russian soldier, the Pole shoots the German first, business before pleasure.

38 posted on 03/16/2014 8:53:26 PM PDT by dfwgator
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To: mac_truck

If it helps destroy the European Union, great!


39 posted on 03/16/2014 8:58:35 PM PDT by dalereed
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To: mac_truck

They can expect a very controlled and one sided media and opposition politicians and business people arrested on bogus charges and others to die mysteriously


40 posted on 03/16/2014 10:20:59 PM PDT by GeronL (Vote for Conservatives not for Republicans!)
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To: goldstategop

Voters were told.... Doesn’t mean it will happen. They can’t do nothing about it now.


41 posted on 03/16/2014 10:22:58 PM PDT by GeronL (Vote for Conservatives not for Republicans!)
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To: ncalburt

Putin seems to give a lot of people a thrill up their leg, it sickens me.


42 posted on 03/16/2014 10:40:01 PM PDT by Impy (RED=COMMUNIST, NOT REPUBLICAN)
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To: goldstategop

Russians in Crimea have long gone to Russia to work because of the vast wage differences.

The one thing I’ve read over and over again is Crimea wasn’t exactly treated well by the Ukranian Gov., no matter who was in office. So the Russians were more than happy to vote for Russian standards...

Gas 60% less in itself would be substantial savings to a family. And the military differences are astounding.

However, if the Ukrain’s can get their act together...years down the road, they MAY be in a better place themselves...but I tend to doubt it. All this money flowing from IMF, World Bank and the US etc. are LOANS. to Ukraines already bankrupt country. Unless business and industy go there few will do better as I see it ...even in the long run.

Most nations in that area under EU are not doing well at all after joining Nato etc....certainly not in the ways the people were led to believe would be.

As usual politicans and the Globalists talk big...follow through is another matter altogether.


43 posted on 03/17/2014 12:08:01 AM PDT by caww
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To: mac_truck

I’ve run into these guys as well on threads....when any ‘understand’ the situation in Ukraine and the steps Putin takes, right or wrong, they always call people Commies or Putin Boot Lickers and the like when they post anything other than what comes from MSM... God forbid if it comes from any other than that which supports their position.

It’s no secret the USA has focused on Putin bashing....everybody knows this. They do so because it shields them from what they’re doing and keeps people distracted from Obama’s agenda.

However, I do think those posting concerning the ‘details’ of Putins moves, with an understanding of how and why he works as he does,how he has in the past, and relates this to the moves he’s making now..... are worth the read.

It pays to have a broad understanding of both sides....if you can ignore the violence and thugs pulling things off in Ukraine, and all sides are using them....and instead look at the whole picture...you’re always better off..

Understanding Putins moves is not the same thing as supporting him...they don’t get that.


44 posted on 03/17/2014 12:22:26 AM PDT by caww
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>> if it joins Russia?

Is that an option?


45 posted on 03/17/2014 1:20:34 AM PDT by Gene Eric (Don't be a statist!)
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To: dalereed
If it helps destroy the European Union, great!

I agree Dale. European style socialism is on the march in the United States and poses a grave threat to our individual liberties.

46 posted on 03/17/2014 5:48:43 AM PDT by mac_truck ( Aide toi et dieu t aidera)
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To: caww
Gas 60% less in itself would be substantial savings to a family.

Cheaper gas, better wages, better pensions, a flat tax on income...there's going to be a sharp contrast to the standard of living in Crimea opposed to Ukraine proper going forward. Not to mention the warmer weather and a more stable civil society.

47 posted on 03/17/2014 6:08:51 AM PDT by mac_truck ( Aide toi et dieu t aidera)
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To: mac_truck; caww

“Gas 60% less in itself would be substantial savings to a family.

‘Cheaper gas, better wages, better pensions, a flat tax on income...there’s going to be a sharp contrast to the standard of living in Crimea opposed to Ukraine proper going forward. Not to mention the warmer weather and a more stable civil society.”’

Putin will probably let the Ukraine continued to get Greeced by $oreA$$es EU Thugs. After another 5 years, they will probably be wanting to leave the EU and the Greecing.


48 posted on 03/17/2014 10:18:50 AM PDT by Grampa Dave ( Too bad Obama does not take OUR borders as seriously as he does the Ukraine!)
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To: GeronL
They can expect a very controlled and one sided media and opposition politicians and business people arrested on bogus charges and others to die mysteriously

Oh... so it will be just like the U.S. ?

49 posted on 03/17/2014 12:55:15 PM PDT by UCANSEE2 (I just messed up my tagline. Sorry for the inconvenience.)
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To: UCANSEE2

Lol

The oil companies there are going to become part of Gazprom soon enough


50 posted on 03/17/2014 12:57:30 PM PDT by GeronL (Vote for Conservatives not for Republicans!)
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