Skip to comments.The False Myth of the 80% Conservative
Posted on 03/23/2014 5:34:26 AM PDT by Moseley
The danger is this: In the USAs upcoming 2014 elections, Republican elites assume that everyone all now agrees that conservatives must support non-conservative candidates to win more elections. The GOP is operating on the belief that everyone is on board, simply because insiders have officially decreed it to be so.
However, the grassroots in the USA remains unconvinced. Worse, the Republican establishment has no plan for truly healing the actual wounds. Elites want to avoid change more fervently than they do want to win elections. Elites violated trust by advancing liberal policies in the U.S. Congress, but they wont apologize or reform. The GOP will do anything to win elections except change.
It simply doesnt matter what you or I think. Activists are going to sit on their hands whether you like it or not, whether I like it or not, unless the GOP fields conservative nominees. Elites can denounce such thinking all day long, but that changes nothing. So the Republican Party is heading into the 2014 elections with the establishment deceiving itself into thinking that grassroots volunteers agree with Party plans.
Also, the grassroots acts independently in the US. Washington insiders suffer from the delusion that the tea party follows tea party leaders. But the tea party came first. Self-appointed leaders later on tried to rush in front of the parade. Many tea party leaders are cooperative this year. But that does not mean grassroots activists, donors, and voters will fall into line with Republican Party strategists.
The crucial debate threatening to tear the GOP apart is this: Ronald Reagan said: Somebody who agrees with you 80% of the time is an 80% friend not a 20% enemy. Therefore, conservatives must bite their tongue and support Republican candidates and office-holders who are not conservative. Thats the thesis.
(Excerpt) Read more at canadafreepress.com ...
So how can Republican voters tell when a candidate truly is 80% conservative or when he is going to endorse a liberal Democrat? Ed Gillespie is the establishments great hope for taking back the Virginia US Senate seat. An establishment leader himself, John Warner stabbed Gillespie in the back. Gillespie is the former Chairman of the Republican National Committee and senior adviser to George W. Bush.
I dont think anyone expects or demands a 100% perfect conservative. I rub a lot of shoulders with tea party leaders and activists. What they want is to not be lied to and betrayed. Conservatives realize that 80% conservatives usually vote only 50% conservative once in office. The problem is betrayal.
For years, John Warner and Tom Davis were the quarterbacks for attacking Virginia conservatives. John Warner led the campaign to sabotage Ollie Norths nearly-successful campaign for U.S. Senate in 1994. John Warner arranged for Marshall Coleman to run as an independent. North lost by only 2.7% running as the Republican nominee while former Congressman Coleman took 11.4% running as an Independent
I understand the concept of the 80% Republican completely.
However, when that 20% disagreement extends to Amnesty, legalization, normalization or acceptance in any fashion that remotely includes citizenship, or when it includes wild capitulation to Democrats on debt, vastly inflate budgets and creates or perpetuates undeserved entitlements, they become 100% opposition to me.
And there isn’t even a Tea Party group, earnest or otherwise that could convince me to vote for it - EVER.
Who would you vote for?
Here in Georgia, I’m going to vote against my congressman who voted with John Lewis and Hank Johnson (Ds) on the Paul Ryan debt capitulation bill. He did this unapologetically after I’d told his office three times that unwarranted debt is one of my triggers (along with any Amnesty of any sort).
I will vote against him in the primary if he has an opponent. If not, I’ll not vote.
For the Senate seat traitor Chambliss is deserting, I’ll vote for any candidate that pledges no debt increases, no Amnesty, and who will pledge to NOT vote for McConnell for leader of anything.
I’m not a Republican, but it is in those races where I might find a viable conservative candidate, so that’s where I’ll vote. At the minimum, I can hopefully influence the reduction in RINOs Georgia sends to DC.
I agree with the 80% theory. But if the 20% are the items you mention I will not vote for that so called conservative.
Thank you. Good luck.
The Buckley Rule: Support the rightwardmost viable candidate
Do so in every primary and general election. Do so based on your own sound conservative principals, and not the sweet songs of paid political operatives.
Yeah - it's always better to vote against 80% of what you believe in and insure you get someone who is 99% against everything you believe in.
If Sun Tzu had written about warfare like that, he might have an entry that says, "If you cannot win 100% of every battle, you should stay off the field and fall on your sword because you are obviously unable to grasp the concept of fighting".
The problem is that ~80% of a politician’s votes are meaningless, on issues where they have no effect on the outcome, so they can vote in a way that burnishes their conservative credentials while doing nothing for the cause.
They can then vote 20% of the time in a way to undermine conservative principles, when it counts.
IMHO the 80% rule is old and no longer applies. Reagen was 80’s. Twenty five years in the history of politics in today’s world, is new normal, and those who are on the side of amnesty, debt, spending like a drunken sailor, and trust with no need to verify, do not ever need to be elected to dog catcher, much less a position of trust. They are the enemy, and anyone supporting them is also your enemy.
The hard part is convincing folks that not voting for Republican’s is as dangerous if not more so, than voting Democrat. There is a difference in fundamental beliefs in the two parties. Read the platform and hold your candidates feet to the fire, but do not allow another obama to sneak into office because four million whatever’s just couldn’t bring themselves to vote for the lesser enemy.
Perspective, and example says there is not a sane person alive who would make the case that Mitt Romney at his worst, would even hold a candle to the unconstitutional and illegal activities of the present occupant of the White House, and vacations would be none. There I’ve said it.
Who would you vote for?
I believe 80% of the posters on FR should run for president because they won’t find someone that will support 100% of their views. The democrats love these “activists” that sit on their hands while they keep putting their clowns in office.
Agreed. Reagan made a gee-gosh comment as a PRELUDE to negotiation and to reassure conservatives why he was compromising with Tip O’Neill to move the ball down the field, to gain some ground.
Reagan was NOT laying down a hard and fast rule to govern all campaigns for all time. He was referring to the compromises he cut with Tip O’Neill.
But the 80% figure — any measurement — is meaningless because votes are not all of equal importance.
1 vote may be so important that it outweighs all the other votes.
If the 20% where a Member of Congress diverges are the most important, then the other 80% don’t matter.
The implication is that the 80% agreement matters.
In reality, the RINO’s are voting liberal on the most damaging and most significant and most important issues, and voting conservatives on the LEAST significant issues.
In other words, the entire discussion assumes at all votes have the same value or importance.
The canard assumes that it is possible to measure such things. It isn’t.
The canard also assumes that votes are the only things that matter. They aren’t. An elected official can hurt conservatives and advance liberal policies in many ways other than voting on the floor of Congress.
Suppose a politician had a high conservative ranking based on votes, but campaigned for liberal democrats for office. Would you call that person 80% your friend?
Anyone who tells the truth, if that is possible. Smaller government, balanced budget, no amnesty (follow the law), eliminate many federal departments, quit killing the unborn, no quotas, no man/man or women/women marriages, and get evil off the throne and good off the gallows and back on the throne. Social issues are important for without them you have no decent nation.
Indeed. I can live with the 80% rule as far as politicians who share 80% of the following views (to pick 5, so that they can falter on one of these and hold fast on the others):
9th and 10th amendment
Closing many unconstitutional federal agencies.
Or, if a politician will fight to close 80% of the federal agencies I think should be shut, then I’ll support them.
If they will work to repeal 80% of the gun laws I think are unconstitutional, they have my vote.
If they will eliminate 80% of the unjustified power of the IRS and NSA, I’m for them.
the problem is ... what is the 20% they disagree with us on?
support for abortion
against gun rights
amnesty for illegal aliens
support for sodomites
Then they might as well be democrats.
I will never support anyone who differs much from me on one of the above issues, I don’t care if I agree with 99% of everything else they believe in
That’s what the little American voters cannot understand: the politician is out for himself, but our uninformed think the politician he recognizes is “on my side”.
20% disagreement extends to Amnesty
What will your side do to earn my vote, rather than simply expect it?
So would you eat a slice of cake that had in its ingredients 20% dog shit?
It's also helpful to check if they've made the "right" enemies. However, that doesn't guarantee that they won't get sucked in to the good ole boys vortex.
Very well said. Perhaps we should add another rule to the mix: Do not do what the Democrats want you to do.
I am not suggesting amnesty but we’re not going to be sending 20,000,000 back. We’ve got to be real.
Might as well legalize all sin, as we know we can’t stamp it out.
Very well said. Perhaps we should add another rule to the mix: Do not do what the Democrats want you to do.
Democrats should send all those “activists” that sit on their hands “Thank You” letters.
80% of what I want is sure better than 0% (this would be Hussein Obama). I will admit that I would still never vote for a pro-abortion candidate. I will draw the line there.
Might as well legalize all sin, as we know we cant stamp it out.
80% of what I want still beats the hell out of 0%. Personally, I don’t believe I’ve ever met someone I agree with 100% of the time.
Me either, which is why I won’t support any open-borders shill. Politicians claiming to be conservatives but supporting amnesty know they will NEVER have to deliver on their conservative promises. Other stands are negotiable.
Amnesty or anything remotely like it is a deal-breaker.
IMHO, the more fundamental problem is a population rejecting God. Conservatives who reject God are likely to accept any legalistic alternative to failed consequences.
I’ve started meeting more 30 year conservatives who take the position regarding totalitarianism, communism, and socialism as viable alternatives to democracy. Their attitude is “just get over it”.
Total nonsense. We have deported millions before and we can do it again. Every other country in the world deports illegals. It’s only a matter of increasing the rate of deportations and making it harder to sneak across the border or overstay one’s visa.
If we give amnesty to the illegals who are here now, America is done.
ANYTHING LESS THAN DEPORTATION IS AMNESTY.
The Buckley Rule: Support the rightwardmost viable candidateAs we live in an imperfect world, only God being perfect, that's what I do. And I do it based on what I believe.
Screw that cr@p! I vote as I damn well please and whoever I damn well please and ALL the so called “leaders” can kiss my @ss. “Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me.”
I could handle 80%, the problem with recent candidates is they’re 0%.
It’s the same with me.
Another thing I do is never stay home and pout on election day because my perfect candidate is not on the ballot. To do so would be to dishonor all of those Americans who have fought to defend and preserve our liberty and our rights.
Romney cleaned up with Independents.
He not only lost to Jimmy Carter’s second term, he is the first candidate to win hugely with Independents, and lose the election.
Mitt Romney returned to his pro-abortion position after winning the nomination, and came out against the party's pro-life platform, and ran pro-choice ads in Ohio, Virginia, and Wisconsin.
A candidate need not be “perfect.” Loyalty to conservative ideals isn’t “perfect” and isn’t too damned much to ask.
Heck, I’d settle for “mediocre.”
We should try.
I disagree: THey still get the 80% ACU rating. It's that the 20% always seems to be on the votes for which they are needed the most. McQueeg is like that...he rolls over for the Rats right when we need him the most. That's "betrayal." Flake the flake set himself upon that path the instant the vote count declared him the winner in the November.
Those who see voting as an obligation of good citizenship. Those who understand and practice the Buckley Rule. Those who appreciate and respect the rights they have as Americans.
If you don't count yourself in that number I will not insult you because of it. Go your own way, stay home. The Republic will survive without you.
>>There is a difference in fundamental beliefs in the two parties. <<
Oh really? I notice there is a strong push to repeal Obamacare and balance the budget. Actually both parties are against these issues, strongly against them. I laugh when McCain support Obama and FReepers get upset. Where’s the party line? According to McCain, Lindsey, Issa and Boehner it is across the aisle.
I went to the Independent side of the voting line years ago. Republicans don’t carry enough KY Jelly for me to withstand being cornholed twice weekly.
because the GOP is not an opposition party, but a red herring party intended to fool people into thinking that someone in the establishment still represents them. They'd like to keep up this illusion going until the fundamental transformation is complete.
If the "moderate" Republican uses that 20% opposing votes to: