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Could Connecticut Gun Laws Spark Another Waco?
thetruthaboutguns.com ^ | 4/1/14 | Dan Zimmerman

Posted on 04/03/2014 9:24:00 AM PDT by Nachum

There’s been a lot of discussion among members of the Armed Intelligentsia lately about how Connecticut’s finest might proceed if they decide to confiscate unregistered guns from the state’s 100,000 or more newly-minted felons. The level of concern is evidenced by daily long comment threads, speculative posts by people who are not members of law enforcement, and even a couple of contributed opinions from the LEO community. The rational consensus seems to be that if the gun-grab order were given, cops would pinch a registration scofflaw at the grocery store, at work, on the road…anyplace other than his or her home where a Ruby Ridge-style tragedy might ensue. Here I propose the alternative–that LEOs might not in fact be that rational if and when the time comes . . .

You may have read or at least heard about Malcolm Gladwell’s lookback at Waco in the New Yorker last week. It’s part book review (siege survivor Clive Doyle’s memoir has just been published), part interview and part history. Gladwell reprises what most people now know–that the Branch Davidians weren’t violent and almost certainly weren’t involved in the illegal gun trade or any other criminal enterprise. He also provides a brief and interesting history of the group, which was founded some 80 years before David Koresh came along.

Gladwell’s main theme, though, is the thought process and mentality of the law enforcement officials toward the end of the two-month siege. And that should give us all pause.

The F.B.I., to justify its decision to bring about a sudden and violent end to the siege, believed that the Branch Davidians were dangerously in the thrall of Koresh; it feared a catastrophic act like the mass suicide, in 1978, in Guyana, of the cult leader Jim Jones and his followers in the

(Excerpt) Read more at thetruthaboutguns.com ...


TOPICS: News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: banglist; connecticut; gun; laws; waco
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To: from occupied ga

Davidians fired first through the wall of the building at ATF agents outside. The rest is history.


21 posted on 04/03/2014 10:30:44 AM PDT by Resolute Conservative
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To: Resolute Conservative
The rest is history.

As written by the side that wasn't the victim of genocide.

22 posted on 04/03/2014 10:32:22 AM PDT by from occupied ga (Your government is your most dangerous enemy)
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To: from occupied ga

Maybe, maybe not. End of discussion this topic has been beaten like Slick Willie’s Johnson.


23 posted on 04/03/2014 10:35:36 AM PDT by Resolute Conservative
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To: UriÂ’el-2012; from occupied ga; Ruy Dias de Bivar

Some folks will blame the ATF no matter what. Others will blame the Branch Davidians. I believe both sides screwed up. The ATF could have simply sent someone to peacefully knock, present the search warrant, and request compliance. The Branch Davidians could have submitted to the search warrant and/or surrendered after the first round of shooting.

There’s a Free Republic meme going around that ALL law enforcement are jack booted thugs. That’s not true, and I suspect a lot of it comes from the libertarians. I’m not saying there aren’t any jack booted thugs running around. There are. What I’m saying is there are good people in law enforcement, too.

Do I think we need to demilitarize the police? Oh, yeah. Do we need to crack down on the ATF and other federal agencies? Yes, definitely. Do we need to demonize and blame ALL law enforcement for the actions of some. No. We don’t.

Getting back to the point of this thread, I don’t know what I would do if I was a Connecticut gun owner. I believe in the rule of law, but what should I do when government itself becomes the lawbreaker (in this case, breaking the 2nd Amendment)? It’s a tough call, and I don’t blame gun owners who complied with the law or those who refused to comply. I wouldn’t raise a finger to help Connecticut confiscate anyone’s guns, but I don’t know if I would go so far as to disobey the law myself.


24 posted on 04/03/2014 10:40:09 AM PDT by CitizenUSA (Sodomy and abortion: the only constitutional "rights" cherished by Democrats.)
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To: mountainlion

Like barack said...Don’t boo...organize.


25 posted on 04/03/2014 10:40:49 AM PDT by RedwM
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To: thorvaldr

I think Waco actually precludes them from doing another Waco, especially with the current cultural climate in the US. It could spark the Civil War everyone speculates about.


26 posted on 04/03/2014 10:42:07 AM PDT by cuban leaf
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To: Resolute Conservative

If both sides wanted to defuse the situation after the shooting started, they could have and probably would have. That means one or both sides didn’t want to end it. We’ll likely never know which.


27 posted on 04/03/2014 10:43:43 AM PDT by CitizenUSA (Sodomy and abortion: the only constitutional "rights" cherished by Democrats.)
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To: Resolute Conservative

That’s a damn lie! Yes i’m callin for proof of who fired first. And the FBI “narrative” ain’t gonna work either.


28 posted on 04/03/2014 10:44:05 AM PDT by BigpapaBo (If it don't kill you it'll make you _________!)
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To: CitizenUSA

Yes, we do. None of the things you mention have as of yet been addressed in any meaningful way, and I suspect they never will unless forced. Further it is likely the number of good ones is far less than you believe.

Until such time as the good ones police their own we may as well treat them the same way they have been treating the citizens: No respect, guilty of something until proven otherwise, ignoring the laws themselves.

Us vs. them is their attitude, they have asked for this.


29 posted on 04/03/2014 10:56:43 AM PDT by KEVLAR (Liberty or Death)
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To: CitizenUSA
What I’m saying is there are good people in law enforcement, too

Probably a goodly number, but how do they react to the presence of the gestapo wannbes in their ranks? With silence. When every peasant shot and killed is a "good shoot"* how do you separate the thrill killers with a badge vs the honest cops?

*In the last ten years only two incidents resulted in criminal prosecution of police for killing citizens. One was the danziger bridge incident in New Orleans, and two the Kathryn Johnson incident in Atlanta. In neither case were the police prosecuted for murder, but things like violation of oath of office which calrries a much lesser sentence.

30 posted on 04/03/2014 10:58:10 AM PDT by from occupied ga (Your government is your most dangerous enemy)
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To: BigpapaBo

If you say so inspector gadget, were you there? I didn’t think so.


31 posted on 04/03/2014 10:59:06 AM PDT by Resolute Conservative
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To: Nachum
More likely to spark another Poland.
32 posted on 04/03/2014 11:00:38 AM PDT by E. Pluribus Unum ("A man who damns money obtained it dishonorably; a man who respects it has earned it." --Ayn Rand)
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To: Resolute Conservative

So you were there?


33 posted on 04/03/2014 11:03:21 AM PDT by MileHi
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To: circlecity

My first thought exactly. For what would the pinch them? For having purchased a firearm at some point in the past? That’s propable cause that they’re currently in possession of a prohibited firearm? Oh, please.


34 posted on 04/03/2014 11:05:22 AM PDT by andyk (I have sworn...eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man.)
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To: CitizenUSA

“I must have been dreaming when I saw the Branch Davidians shooting at the ATF agents”

I saw that too! Odd that the agents were hiding behind vehicles that miraculously had intact window glass in the fusillade of bullets from the compound.


35 posted on 04/03/2014 11:08:48 AM PDT by DBrow
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To: CitizenUSA; Ruy Dias de Bivar; UriÂ’el-2012; from occupied ga
when they attempted to execute a search warrant for illegal weapons.

And I will also add:

This did not happen in Waco, it happened in Mt. Carmel. David Koresh and the Mc Lellan County Sheriff knew each other and often saw each other in Town. (And IIRC that morning.) All the fedstupids had to do was go through the proper channels (County Sheriff) and there would have been a much better outcome in this mess (caused by the feds) ALL the Branch Dravidian's did was RETURN DEFENSIVE FIRE AFTER the feds started it.

There were NO ILLEGAL WEAPONS!!!

Last I knew the burned to a crisp “arsenal” was still in the Texas DPS vault in Austin and NO MEDIA/LAWYERS/PUBLIC were allowed access to the “evidence”

And even at that The Davidian's were a Class III Firearms Dealer- so Full Auto is NOT an issue here.

And before you pull out the "grenades" delivered by UPS they were INERT!!!

The Front Door had ALL INCOMING rounds in it and was conveniently burned in the final assault by the feds when they pumped CS Gas into the building (with a TANK!) and tossed in an Incendiary to torch the place to destroy evidence.

Shall I continue?

36 posted on 04/03/2014 11:10:24 AM PDT by mabarker1 (Please, Somebody Impeach the kenyan!!!!)
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To: Resolute Conservative

since you chose to wear your butt on your shoulders...let’s ax this....what were the dividians guilty of ?


37 posted on 04/03/2014 11:12:16 AM PDT by advertising guy ( <------------- lotta white in here ------------>)
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To: Resolute Conservative

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/3140446/posts?page=17#17


38 posted on 04/03/2014 11:12:17 AM PDT by Uri’el-2012 (Psalm 119:174 I long for Your salvation, YHvH, Your teaching is my delight.)
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To: Resolute Conservative
Davidians fired first through the wall of the building at ATF agents outside.

BULL$H!T

The rest is history.

That part you got right.

39 posted on 04/03/2014 11:15:03 AM PDT by mabarker1 (Please, Somebody Impeach the kenyan!!!!)
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To: Nachum

Unlike Waco there will be many causalities on the government side also if this unconstitutional law continues.


40 posted on 04/03/2014 11:19:08 AM PDT by Logical me
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