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US Navy 'game-changer': converting seawater into fuel
economic times ^ | 7 Apr, 2014, 08.00PM IST

Posted on 04/07/2014 9:18:38 AM PDT by DeaconBenjamin

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To: BJ1

I think the single gun is a giveaway that there is something far more powerful on these ships. Probably scalar weapons, probably using the large flat transmissive surfaces on the sides of the upper superstructures.


41 posted on 04/07/2014 10:39:17 AM PDT by Talisker (One who commands, must obey.)
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To: Steely Tom
"Where do they get the carbon?"

From the same source as they get the energy---magic. Obama has used his pen and phone to overrule the First Law of Thermodynamics.

42 posted on 04/07/2014 10:45:02 AM PDT by norwaypinesavage (for)
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To: Resolute Conservative
And as soon as it is shown to be viable we will give it away to every other country. We cannot have an advantage...

If NASA gets their hands on it, they will give it to the Muslims. If Democrats are in charge, they will trade them campaign donations.

43 posted on 04/07/2014 10:51:22 AM PDT by LoneRangerMassachusetts (The meek shall not inherit the Earth)
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To: SampleMan

The last diesel electric sub was built when? Early to mid 50s maybe if that late.


44 posted on 04/07/2014 10:51:40 AM PDT by wally_bert (There are no winners in a game of losers. I'm Tommy Joyce, welcome to the Oriental Lounge.)
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To: Hostage

Sounds much more promising than some of the “green fuels” the Air Force was working on a couple of years ago. I remember reading some of the press releases about the renewable jet fuel being used in various aircraft, then someone did a little digging and discovered the “green” version of JP8 goes for $60 dollars a gallon.

http://hotair.com/archives/2013/05/03/not-to-worry-dod-still-buying-59gallon-green-jet-fuel-despite-sequester/

In case you’re wondering, the regular stuff, refined from good ol’ crude oil, is available for under $4 a gallon.


45 posted on 04/07/2014 11:03:35 AM PDT by ExNewsExSpook
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To: BitWielder1

This inversion of the laws concerning the conservation of energy puzzled me as well.

Simply unlocking CO2 and hydrogen from seawater is highly energy-intensive, and it has to come from SOMEWHERE. CO2 and hydrogen CAN be turned into fuel, through something called the Fischer-Tropsch process, but to proceed on an efficient basis, it requires a relatively high temperature to assure the carbon dioxide transforms into carbon monoxide, then the reaction can continue in the direction of forming hydrocarbon fuels.

The chemistry has been widely studied for 80-some years, and was put to use by the Third Reich in its dying days, to supply fuel for the Wehrmacht, after they had been denied access to oil fields in Romania and elsewhere. But the Germans still had a lot of coal, which was their base resource, and the process of making “syngas” had been well established many years before.

THERE IS NO COAL FLOATING AROUND IN THE OCEAN, but there may be a lot of organic matter there, which would be the source of the carbon necessary to make the carbon monoxide feedstock. Water, of course, is composed of hydrogen and oxygen, but it still takes considerable power to unlock that source.


46 posted on 04/07/2014 11:08:10 AM PDT by alloysteel (Selective and willful ignorance spells doom, to both victim and perpetrator - mostly the perp.)
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To: alloysteel
That's a thought. Scooping up any organic matter and converting it to fuel may be a better bet than CO2 + H2O + Lots Of Energy = Fuel + O2.

47 posted on 04/07/2014 11:12:33 AM PDT by BitWielder1 (Corporate Profits are better than Government Waste)
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To: DeaconBenjamin

They are replacing decks with corn rows to grow biofuels. Makes about as much sense with this government in charge.


48 posted on 04/07/2014 11:16:01 AM PDT by Organic Panic
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To: Hostage
True but we’re talking about US Navy Research, not the federal government. Our military research is awesome!

A friend of mine had a bumper sticker one time that read:
"Navy Nukes Are Built Better Than Jane Fonda."

49 posted on 04/07/2014 11:16:19 AM PDT by Bloody Sam Roberts (Truth sounds like hate...to those who hate truth.)
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To: wally_bert

Last diesel sub commissioned was USS Blueback (SS-581) in 1959.


50 posted on 04/07/2014 11:35:59 AM PDT by SampleMan (Feral Humans are the refuse of socialism.)
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To: BitWielder1

Just a small expansion on this “organic matter” and its conversion into feedstock for the synthesis of hydrocarbon fuel:

There is a technology called “Plasma arc trash reduction”, a process by which ALL forms of trash are reduced to their constituent atomic structure, then the heat generated by this process is used to drive electric power generation. The primary products of this process are “syngas”, a mixture of carbon monoxide and hydrogen, both of which are excellent fuels that may be used to drive the generation of electric power, and a silica slag which contains practically all other components of whatever went into the trash stream.

Once up and running, the operating temperature of the plasma torch is about 33,000 degrees F., about three times the temperature of the sun’s surface. The syngas generated is about 2,200 degrees F., and is passed over a heat exchanger to generate superheated steam (diverted to the generation of electricity), in the process of cooling it. Once cooled, the stream of hydrogen and carbon monoxide may be separated, yielding up pure hydrogen which may be used to power a fuel cell, or burned directly in the presence of oxygen to yield a very hot flame, which may be used to further produce power through the medium of superheated steam. Carbon monoxide itself is an excellent fuel which when combined with oxygen, forms carbon dioxide, a safe, NON-POLLUTING fraction of our atmosphere, and one that is vital for the photosynthesis of oxygen and carbohydrates in green growing plants. The carbon dioxide may also be captured, cooled and compressed into either liquid CO2, or allowed to become “dry ice”, an intensely cold and solid form of CO2, and an important industrial product.

The hydrogen, of course, when combined with oxygen, becomes water vapor.

Now, if this sounds like “perpetual motion”, keep in mind that the system, once charged up and functioning (by creating the plasma arc in the first place), it is possible to generate from three to six times the power necessary to maintain the arc, so long as the trash stream continues to be fed into the reactor chamber. The surplus electrical energy produced then goes into converting any “syngas”, not consumed in generating additional electric power, into hydrocarbon fuel, among other byproducts.

Scoop up the floating debris on the ocean surface, divert all the existing waste into electric power, and reduce need for and dependence on fossil fuels. And not only the floating debris fields, the sewage sludge that is now dumped by ships at sea could go through this plasma arc, with the decomposed fecal matter adding its bit to the “syngas”.

I don’t see a downside. Most elegant solution.
And carbon-neutral to boot. NO fossil fuels are used once the cycle is started.

Can’t get greener than that.


51 posted on 04/07/2014 11:39:37 AM PDT by alloysteel (Selective and willful ignorance spells doom, to both victim and perpetrator - mostly the perp.)
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