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Are you there God? It's me, Bartram (Libs want God back in school)
Philadelphia Daily News ^ | 04/13/2014 | Helen Ubinas

Posted on 04/13/2014 4:13:28 AM PDT by Kid Shelleen

--snip-- This was Thursday night and the two were part of a community meeting on the recent highly publicized violent incidents at the school, including a couple of lunchtime brawls and an assault on a conflict-resolution specialist by a 17-year-old student. Yes, a man charged to keep the peace got his skull fractured.

At the start of the meeting, God got a shout-out by one of the speakers. It probably wasn't a bad idea. Given the disagreements over what caused the problems at Bartram, and what it's going to take to fix them, divine intervention may be the only solution. And please, baby Jesus, keep what happened at Bartram from playing out at other understaffed and consolidated schools.

(Excerpt) Read more at philly.com ...


TOPICS: News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: faith; judeochristian; leftismoncampus; purge
Case study in failed liberal policies. (The school was named after John Bartram a world famous botanist and horticulturist. He must be turning in his grave.)
1 posted on 04/13/2014 4:13:28 AM PDT by Kid Shelleen
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To: Kid Shelleen

I graduated high school in 1970. We had a very large school - approximately 3000 students and we had two shifts. We did not have “resource officers”. We had zero shootings or stabbings. I did not know of one girl who was pregnant. Our school did not have a daycare for students’ babies. For the most part, we liked and respected our teachers. At the entrance of the school was the school seal in the floor. No one walked over it out of respect. I understand that today it is roped off so no one walks on it.

How far we as a society have fallen.


2 posted on 04/13/2014 4:25:41 AM PDT by ilovesarah2012
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To: Kid Shelleen
And please, baby Jesus, keep what happened at . . .

The mention of God makes them uncomfortable, so they respond with mocking . . . and the Philadelphia Daily News is considered a serious newspaper.

3 posted on 04/13/2014 4:28:55 AM PDT by Oratam
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To: Kid Shelleen

You did not include the link to the whole article. I’d like to read more about the poor man who got his skull fractured, I mean that’s more than a punch in the nose.


4 posted on 04/13/2014 4:35:26 AM PDT by jocon307
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To: ilovesarah2012
You forgot a few things. No metal detectors. No guards. No locked doors.

One thing we did have in abundance then that is in short supply today, shame. No one has it any more, from the president on down.

5 posted on 04/13/2014 4:35:33 AM PDT by Former Proud Canadian (Cruz/Palin 2016)
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To: Kid Shelleen; metmom; F15Eagle; pastorbillrandles
Godlessness has very real and terrible political, philosophical, and personal ramifications.

We are now Godless nation. Our courts, schools, and institutions have hunted down any scintilla of Him, and chased Him out.

The concept of "self" and selfish sin takes off like the Ebola virus unless we are constrained by that which is Holy. Rampant secularization has led to a loss of worship. We now have out of control pluralization, where our nation tells us there is no absolute truth, and all ideas must be given equal standing. In fact, the only ideas NOT given standing are God's standards.

Our politicians, leaders, and citizens act with ZERO sense of shame.

"If the foundations be destroyed, what can the righteous do?"

Psalm 11:3

The solution is what it always was: repent, ask God for forgiveness, and cry out to Him for His love and mercy.

Unless that is accomplished, no program, no amount of money, and political "savior" will make one bit of difference.

6 posted on 04/13/2014 4:38:01 AM PDT by SkyPilot
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To: Former Proud Canadian

I also forget teacher-student sex. If it went on, we sure didn’t know anything about it. Our schools, as well as our nation, are now cesspools.


7 posted on 04/13/2014 4:41:18 AM PDT by ilovesarah2012
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To: Kid Shelleen
Is there a link to an article?

The most important thing to understand is that **NO** school can be religiously neutral. Such a state of philosophic neutrality can not exist in the mind of any sentient being.

When government schools are godless they are teaching godlessness. The children MUST think and reason godlessly just to cooperate in the godless classroom.

Yet,... if government schools were to teach a God-centered worldview, what specific religious worldview should be chosen? And...Please remember that generic and lukewarm is offensive to many Christians. The Bible warns that Christ spits the lukewarm out of His mouth.

So?...How to solve the problem? Answer: IT CAN”T!

Solution: Begin the process of privatizing all education. Get the government ( on **ALL** levels) out of the education business!

8 posted on 04/13/2014 4:49:42 AM PDT by wintertime
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To: Kid Shelleen; jocon307; wintertime

http://www.philly.com/philly/education/20140413_God_help_Philly_s_public_schools.html


9 posted on 04/13/2014 5:07:28 AM PDT by facedown (Armed in the Heartland)
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To: SkyPilot

“”If the foundations be destroyed, what can the righteous do?”

Psalm 11:3

The solution is what it always was: repent, ask God for forgiveness, and cry out to Him for His love and mercy.

Unless that is accomplished, no program, no amount of money, and political “savior” will make one bit of difference.”

Also add, “believe” first as well even before repenting.


10 posted on 04/13/2014 5:08:58 AM PDT by Biggirl (“Go, do not be afraid, and serve”-Pope Francis)
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To: All
here is the link to the article. Sorry about that all.
http://www.philly.com/philly/education/20140413_God_help_Philly_s_public_schools.html


11 posted on 04/13/2014 5:09:48 AM PDT by Kid Shelleen (Beat your plowshares into swords. Let the weak say I am strong)
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To: Kid Shelleen

“And please, baby Jesus, keep what happened at Bartram from playing out at other understaffed and consolidated schools.”


After that I could read no further.

Our nation has moved away from God, rejected His Son, His only provision for the foregiveness of our sins.

He hasn’t gone anywhere, but reaches out to mankind, saying “Come to Me, all who are weary and heavy-laden, and I will give you rest. Take My yoke upon you, and learn from Me, for I am gentle and humble in heart; and YOU SHALL FIND REST FOR YOUR SOULS. (Matthew 11:28-29)

Because of people’s stubborness and unrepentant hearts, they are storing up wrath for themselves in the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God, who WILL RENDER TO EVERY MAN ACCORDING TO HIS DEEDS; (Romans 2:5-6, Ps. 62:12)

God is holy. He is real. His home is in heaven. Sin cannot and will not exist in heaven.

For believers in the Lord Jesus Christ, who have repented from their sins and believed in Him, it is said:

“God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us. Much more then, having now been justified by His blood, we shall be saved from the wrath of God through Him. For if while we were enemies, we were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, much more, having been reconciled, we shall be saved by His life.” (Romans 5:8-10)

And all true Christians have died with Christ,have been buried with Him, and have been raised up with Him to walk in newness of life. The new life in Christ is possible only by His and His Father’s presence within the person who has repented and believed, through the indwelling Holy Spirit.

Individuals live in nations, and we are individually called, but whenever sin has not been punished and has been allowed to continue, it grows and infests and takes over, and a whole nation will suffer the consequences. God’s dealings with Israel in the Bible give us all the information we need to look at our own “national sins” and to repent, by His mercy and grace.

Read Psalm 2:12.


12 posted on 04/13/2014 5:26:24 AM PDT by TurkeyLurkey
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To: Former Proud Canadian
One thing we did have in abundance then that is in short supply today, shame. No one has it any more, from the president on down.

Shame requires that one have grasped the concept of personal responsibility for one's actions.

Now, everyone is a victim, so he/she is not responsible for their actions. They can blame someone else. Hence, no shame.

13 posted on 04/13/2014 5:28:36 AM PDT by KosmicKitty (WARNING: Hormonally crazed woman ahead!!)
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To: KosmicKitty

I agree. I think it started with Clinton. Lack of shame, candor, humility, standards became the new normal. Your current leadership has taken this to a whole new level.


14 posted on 04/13/2014 5:30:49 AM PDT by Former Proud Canadian (Cruz/Palin 2016)
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To: Biggirl
The solution is what it always was: repent, ask God for forgiveness, and cry out to Him for His love and mercy.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Will God have mercy upon a nation whose parents **willingly** place their children in a godless school environment? These children **will** learn to think and reason godlessly. They must just to cooperate in the godless classroom.

Solution: We as a nation MUST shut down these godless, single-payer, and socialist-entitlement schools! We must begin the process of privatizing all education in this nation. Only in a private school can the child get a thoroughly God-centered education that is not generically lukewarm in its worldview.

Putting a generic and lukewarm God back into the government's single-payer schools is NOT a solution. What does Christ do with the lukewarm? He spits them out of His mouth!

Finally, why should God save this nation? As I drive through deep red counties and states in this nation I see the godless single-payer K-12 schools stuffed full to the brim with children of conservatives and Christians. If these Christians and conservatives removed their children the godless system of K-12 indoctrination would immediately collapse! Yet...They remain open.

I suppose free babysitting and team sports are powerfully addicting.

15 posted on 04/13/2014 5:36:46 AM PDT by wintertime
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To: Kid Shelleen
We Need God In America Again
16 posted on 04/13/2014 5:37:47 AM PDT by Servant of the Cross (the Truth will set you free)
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To: Former Proud Canadian
It started with the very first single-payer and socialist-entitlement schools in the mid-1800s to early 1900s. It only took one to three generations of single-payer government schools ( with its lukewarm and generic Protestantism) to give the nation the progressives Woodrow Wilson and Franklin D. Roosevelt.
17 posted on 04/13/2014 5:38:37 AM PDT by wintertime
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To: Servant of the Cross

That isn’t going to happen when the vast majority of the nation’s children attend godless and single-payer socialist-entitlement schools!

Why would God save a nation whose parents would willingly send their children into schools that teach children to think and reason godlessly? Its a millstone thing.


18 posted on 04/13/2014 5:40:21 AM PDT by wintertime
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To: wintertime
Will God have mercy upon a nation whose parents **willingly** place their children in a godless school environment?

This may be a "hard saying," but someone has to say it.

19 posted on 04/13/2014 5:40:46 AM PDT by St_Thomas_Aquinas ( Isaiah 22:22, Matthew 16:19, Revelation 3:7)
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To: St_Thomas_Aquinas

My heart is broken every time I drive by a godless K-12 single-payer school.

It’s like watching a train wreck in slow motion.


20 posted on 04/13/2014 5:45:03 AM PDT by wintertime
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To: SkyPilot

and ‘worship’ has become hip swaying, hand clapping pseudo rock n’ roll.


21 posted on 04/13/2014 5:49:41 AM PDT by knarf (I say things that are true .. I have no proof .. but they're true.)
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To: wintertime
Does God really love us ... Unconditionally?
22 posted on 04/13/2014 5:50:22 AM PDT by Servant of the Cross (the Truth will set you free)
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To: ilovesarah2012
I graduated high school in 1980, my experience was very similar to yours. No metal detectors, no guns, no knives, no pregnant girls, no daycare for student's babies and by the way -- no gay agenda being forced upon us either. If anyone was gay, they kept that shit to themselves like they should've.

No one suing the school for any "equal access" bullshit, no suing the school because a teacher physically stopped a fight from happening or yelling at a student to behave.

Back then parents backed the teachers if their kids screwed up in school and the punishment wasn't just a detention - we got punished at home too.

Yep, this country has gone to shit.

23 posted on 04/13/2014 5:50:59 AM PDT by usconservative (When The Ballot Box No Longer Counts, The Ammunition Box Does. (What's In Your Ammo Box?))
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To: ilovesarah2012
Young. female teachers started showing up when I was in high school ... about 1962/63

I remember battle ax Barron ... 5th grade .... not young, and heavy set

24 posted on 04/13/2014 5:53:22 AM PDT by knarf (I say things that are true .. I have no proof .. but they're true.)
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To: knarf

Gym Teacher Threesome Accusations Scandalize New York City High School

Three’s a crowd for one former New York City gym teacher.

According to court papers, 31-year-old Carisa Gaylardo, a former probationary physical education teacher at the Riverdale/Kingsbridge Academy in The Bronx, charges that her boss, Sofia Memos, gave her an unsatisfactory rating and ultimately fired her after Gaylardo turned down a request to spend some very intimate time with Memos and her boyfriend.

Gaylardo alleges that the 41-year-old Memos harassed her “by text message and in person to engage in an inappropriate romantic and salacious relationship with her and her boyfriend.”

The former gym teacher also purports that Memos told school officials that Gaylardo had a “flirtatious” relationship with a female student she’d been mentoring. That accusation was made in March 2013, just one month after Gaylardo “had rejected her advances,” the lawsuit says.

http://latino.foxnews.com/latino/news/2014/04/11/gym-teacher-threesome-accusations-scandalize-new-york-city-high-school/?intcmp=obinsite


25 posted on 04/13/2014 5:57:47 AM PDT by ilovesarah2012
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To: knarf; xzins
I have attended several different types of worship services. I grew up Roman Catholic, but I am not an evangelical Christian. Today, I worship at a church that has several different types of music services, from acoustic, to strings, to choir, to rock and roll.

We all worship differently - I believe the crux of it is not give Him worship. It is an act not for ourselves per se, but for God. He should be the focus. It is something He deserves.

However, I am with you in some way on this. Although I am no longer Catholic, some of the older, more majestic hymns such as "Holy Holy Holy" were more dignified in my opinion for who God is. And although I don't denigrate some for being outward with their hand or arm movements during worship, that just isn't the way I feel comfortable when approaching God. Again, I don't demean their approach - but to me, the dignity and reverence of approaching God merits a joyful approach, a reverent approach, and a personal approach.

The sometimes bombastic and frivolous approaches I sometimes see in other churches make me uncomfortable, because I feel there is something in them that puts the focus on the individual, rather than God. But again, the Bible speaks of dance and joy before the Lord, so I don't want to take that away. I try and always remember who God is. Jesus is personal to me, but He isn't trivial, nor should He be treated that way.

26 posted on 04/13/2014 6:07:58 AM PDT by SkyPilot
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To: knarf; xzins
Correction - the line : I grew up Roman Catholic, but I am not an evangelical Christian should read:

I grew up Roman Catholic, but I am now an evangelical Christian

27 posted on 04/13/2014 6:09:46 AM PDT by SkyPilot
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To: Servant of the Cross

Yes, God does love us unconditionally.

He has given us free will and will allow us to shoot ourselves in the foot. Sending children into godless schools has consequences.


28 posted on 04/13/2014 6:15:40 AM PDT by wintertime
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To: wintertime
My heart is broken every time I drive by a godless K-12 single-payer school. It’s like watching a train wreck in slow motion.

We have the same heart on this one. I feel it in my bones.

Even when I was in school, I used to ask myself, How can they teach us one thing in one class, and the opposite thing in another class? Who's in charge?

I couldn't find answers to these questions. I even tried suppressing the thoughts, but by the grace of God, that didn't work, either. Fortunately, I eventually came upon some strands of truth in my 20s and pursued them until I could put the entire picture together. The final piece of the puzzle was Gatto's "Underground History of American Education."

I once described my tortured relationship with schooling to a liberal public school advocate. She said, "Well, that was your problem." "What?" "You thought too much." I couldn't find words to respond. If that doesn't represent the triumph of modern schooling, what does?

I just think about the popular image of the "dark" medieval Scholastic period, with its classical curriculum that centered around grammar and logic, and today's grab-bag of nothingness.

29 posted on 04/13/2014 6:18:35 AM PDT by St_Thomas_Aquinas ( Isaiah 22:22, Matthew 16:19, Revelation 3:7)
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To: SkyPilot

Amen!


30 posted on 04/13/2014 6:24:09 AM PDT by pastorbillrandles (The choice isn't heaven or Hell. its heaven or the world)
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To: ilovesarah2012
Reading ... I think Carissa has her tastes ... and Sophia perceived them and thought a 3 way might work out, Carissa rejected Sophia, Sophia got pissed, accused Carissa ... and here we are.

imo

31 posted on 04/13/2014 6:34:48 AM PDT by knarf (I say things that are true .. I have no proof .. but they're true.)
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To: wintertime
Sending children into godless schools has consequences.

Absolutely. Thanks be to God we were able to send our children to faith-based private schools.

32 posted on 04/13/2014 6:36:13 AM PDT by Servant of the Cross (the Truth will set you free)
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To: Servant of the Cross
Absolutely. Thanks be to God we were able to send our children to faith-based private schools.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

You have done what is righteous and good for the salvation of your children's souls...BUT...their votes will be swamped by the tsunami of voters who were indoctrinated in the godless government schools.

God has given us free will and free will has consequences.

33 posted on 04/13/2014 6:45:48 AM PDT by wintertime
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To: facedown; Kid Shelleen

Thanks for the link.

No more info about the guy who got his head bashed, but it wasn’t really that kind of article.

I like how our author totally buried the lead, as they say, putting the 2 mom’s desire to take their kids out of the public schools until the very end of the piece.

But I must say, even leaving God and religion aside, the difference between schools that work and schools that don’t isn’t just a coat of paint on the walls.

I’ve been listening to NPR a lot, because I have a long and arduous commute now and for whatever sad reason NYC drive time radio is dead. (Who let THAT happen?) Right now, imho, Fresh Air with Terri Gross which I hear on Sirius, is the best show available.

But of course sometimes it’s just unlistenable liberal swill, like the fellow she had on the other day. I turned him off almost immediately, so I don’t know his name or the name of his book or anything.

His theory is (and he may be right in part) that criminals have some mental problems and these affect them through their whole lives. His recommendation was to put these violent people in nicer places than prisons, that a better environment could help them.

And I’m thinking, boy you are an idiot, prisons are violent places because they are filled with these violent people. And if his theory is correct, that there are physical brain issues involved there may be even less that can be done with these people that we’ve thought.

No matter where you would incarcerate these people, it would soon end up just like the prisons of today are, because the inmates themselves would make it that way.

This piece reminds me of that mind-set.

I apologize in advance if I’ve mi-represented the man’s views, but I don’t think I have. I’m sorry to say I think he had the intellectual power of the hot-chocolate drinking, plaid onesie wearing, Obama-boy.

If the people in the inner cities think people like that are ever going to change their lives, schools, or neighborhoods for the better, they should think again. Liberals are, at the very best, useless.


34 posted on 04/13/2014 7:43:40 AM PDT by jocon307
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To: wintertime
**NO** school can be religiously neutral. Such a state of philosophic neutrality can not exist in the mind of any sentient being.

When government schools are godless they are teaching godlessness. The children MUST think and reason godlessly just to cooperate in the godless classroom.

Yet,... if government schools were to teach a God-centered worldview, what specific religious worldview should be chosen?

And...Please remember that generic and lukewarm is offensive to many Christians. The Bible warns that Christ spits the lukewarm out of His mouth.

Considering that the Lordship of Jesus Christ is made reference to (“Lord” is to be found exactly once - and in that context - in a full quotation of the Constitution) by the framers, whatever the Constitution does mean, it does NOT intend the denigration of Christianity in general.
Of all the dispositions and habits which lead to political prosperity, religion and morality are indispensable supports. In vain would that man claim the tribute of patriotism, who should labor to subvert these great pillars of human happiness, these firmest props of the duties of men and citizens. The mere politician, equally with the pious man, ought to respect and to cherish them. A volume could not trace all their connections with private and public felicity. Let it simply be asked: Where is the security for property, for reputation, for life, if the sense of religious obligation desert the oaths which are the instruments of investigation in courts of justice ? And let us with caution indulge the supposition that morality can be maintained without religion. Whatever may be conceded to the influence of refined education on minds of peculiar structure, reason and experience both forbid us to expect that national morality can prevail in exclusion of religious principle.

It is substantially true that virtue or morality is a necessary spring of popular government. The rule, indeed, extends with more or less force to every species of free government. Who that is a sincere friend to it can look with indifference upon attempts to shake the foundation of the fabric?

Promote then, as an object of primary importance, institutions for the general diffusion of knowledge. In proportion as the structure of a government gives force to public opinion, it is essential that public opinion should be enlightened.


35 posted on 04/13/2014 8:05:14 AM PDT by conservatism_IS_compassion ("Liberalism” is a conspiracy against the public by wire-service journalism.)
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To: knarf
I remember battle ax Barron ... 5th grade .... not young, and heavy set

Mrs Clapper, my 8th grade Latin teacher. Dick Butkus' older, stronger, meaner sister.

BUT.... I still remember some of the Latin she taught me in 1960.

For that I say, "THANK YOU MRS. CLAPPER!"

36 posted on 04/13/2014 8:51:50 AM PDT by BwanaNdege
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To: conservatism_IS_compassion
Promote then, as an object of primary importance, institutions for the general diffusion of knowledge.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Well.....That couldn't possibly happen in socialist government schools.

Only in private schools can truth boldly be proclaimed backed by the non-lukewarm and non-generic religious teaching that support it.

Woe, to this nation that sends its children into godless schools!. And...Woe, to those parents who agree to this abomination!

37 posted on 04/13/2014 8:51:59 AM PDT by wintertime
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To: conservatism_IS_compassion
Google; --- Bartram high school Philadelphia ---

you will see plenty of articles and videos. See link about the case of a "conflict resolution specialist" getting knocked out..

Students photograph security guard after he is knocked unconscious by teen in hallway of 'out-of-control' high school
38 posted on 04/13/2014 10:52:01 AM PDT by Kid Shelleen (Beat your plowshares into swords. Let the weak say I am strong)
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To: wintertime
Only in private schools can truth boldly be proclaimed backed by the non-lukewarm and non-generic religious teaching that support it.

What specific "religious teaching" would you have the kids taught?

What is the difference between religious and Godless teaching as regards English?

How about math and science.. how does religious VS Godless teaching differ?

39 posted on 04/13/2014 12:21:02 PM PDT by humblegunner
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To: humblegunner
I don't usually respond to the points in your posts, but your questions are valid. So today I am making a rare exception.

Re: Specific religious teaching

No school can be religiously neutral. Government schools are not now and never have been. The only solution that is compatible with the First Amendment and freedom of conscience is to begin the process of privatizing all education in the nation. In a totally private system, the parents would choose an educational setting for the child that best supports their values.

Re: Godless teaching and English

I am assuming that you mean literature. There is almost no fiction written that doesn't involve the breaking or keeping of one or more of the Ten Commandments and the consequences of this action. In my Catholic school the moral conflicts found in literature were analyzed through the prism of our religious beliefs. There was no hesitation to bring into the discussion our scriptures and the writing of our church leaders. In a totally private system of education delivery, parents would choose schools that best support their values through the literature chosen and the class discussion that follows.

Re: Math and Science
Again I must refer back to the 14 years that I spent in Catholic parochial schools and universities. While for the most part, the classes were dryly fact based, when appropriate, the students were reminded that math and science were a reflection of God's glory. It was our duty before God to learn as much about mathematics and the natural world as possible, not only to enrich our lives spiritually but to use this knowledge to serve others. In a fully private system, parents would choose schools that best supported their religious and philosophic worldview.

Conclusion:
It is IMPOSSIBLE for any government school to be religiously, culturally, or politically neutral. No school can be. When government involves itself in education it violates the First Amendment and freedom of conscience rights of those who are forced to attend the non-neutral government school and those who are under police threat to fund the government's NON-neutral worldview.

Solution: Begin the process of privatizing all education.

40 posted on 04/13/2014 3:08:57 PM PDT by wintertime
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To: wintertime
No school can be religiously neutral.

Seems like you don't want them to be, so what's the problem?

The only solution

Stop. "Only" solution according only to you. Opinion.

In a totally private system, the parents would choose an educational setting

Also opinion.. conjecture as well.
What if a majority of parents figured dinosaurs roamed the Earth many millions of years ago?

There is almost no fiction written that doesn't involve the breaking or keeping of one or more of the Ten Commandments and the consequences of this action.

So what is the difference between Godless and religious teaching of the material?

In my Catholic school the moral conflicts found in literature were analyzed through the prism of our religious beliefs.

Well good for you. To me, that would seem a lot a lot like
tearing a story up and trying to fit it into your ideology piecemeal.

There was no hesitation to bring into the discussion our scriptures and the writing of our church leaders.

So you were told what to think rather than encouraged to form ideas.

the students were reminded that math and science were a reflection of God's glory

While in favor of God's glory, I'd ask if the mathematical solutions were any different with or without it.

It is IMPOSSIBLE for any government school to be religiously, culturally, or politically neutral.

You don't want neutral. You want it done YOUR WAY.

41 posted on 04/13/2014 3:37:30 PM PDT by humblegunner
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To: humblegunner

Well said


42 posted on 04/23/2014 4:01:17 PM PDT by verga (Conservative, but leaning Libertarian.)
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