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Moscow demands confirmation whether Russians were among Odessa victims
ITAR-TASS ^ | 5-3-2014 | TASS

Posted on 05/02/2014 10:41:06 PM PDT by tcrlaf

Moscow urged Kiev to give more information whether Russians were among Odessa fire victims, otherwise the report would be viewed as a new attempt to blame Russia for everything, the Russian Foreign Ministry stated.

Ukrainian media reported that 15 of the victims in Odessa were Russian citizens who allegedly had participated in protests.

"A question arises on what materials such conclusions are based. If all the victims are identified and there are confirming documents, they must be immediately made public, but not playing on feelings of relatives of the victims and trying to stir up emotions among people who are already pushed to the edge of the abyss.

"If there were no identification and no documents, then such a statement is another attempt to convince the public of some 'Russian trace' found in Odessa protest meetings.

"Such intention to blame Russia for everything at any cost, even at the cost of cruelly killed people, is prompted by the attempt to remove the responsibility from the Kiev leadership for what is happening in Ukraine," the Russian Foreign Ministry noted.


TOPICS: Government; News/Current Events; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: civilwar; odessa; putinsbuttboys; russia; russianterrorists; ukraine
Morning reactions from Russia on Yesterday's events are just now coming out.
1 posted on 05/02/2014 10:41:06 PM PDT by tcrlaf
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To: tcrlaf

F ‘em.


2 posted on 05/02/2014 10:43:00 PM PDT by vladimir998
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To: tcrlaf

RT Video of the Odessa Massacre: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ec0mgpwW6_Y&feature=youtu.be

WARNING-Very graphic. What a hell of a way to die.


3 posted on 05/02/2014 10:49:28 PM PDT by tcrlaf (Q)
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To: tcrlaf

RT: Odessa death toll now 43


4 posted on 05/02/2014 10:50:56 PM PDT by tcrlaf (Q)
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To: tcrlaf

Russia Today? Propaganda of the worst kind - including the reference to Mossad. Sure, it’s all because of the Jews, right?


5 posted on 05/02/2014 10:59:02 PM PDT by vladimir998
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To: vladimir998

If you don’t want to know how the Russians are reacting, and would rather be in the dark, you don’t have to click on the link, doncha know.


6 posted on 05/02/2014 11:00:20 PM PDT by tcrlaf (Q)
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To: tcrlaf
This business will get out of control. It will get out of control and we'll be lucky to live through it

7 posted on 05/02/2014 11:07:59 PM PDT by Bobalu (What cannot be programmed cannot be physics)
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To: tcrlaf
Around the time of the Maidan protests, when Yanukovich ruled the roost, Tim Snyder, a specialist in the history of Central and Eastern Europe, and the Holocaust, wrote the following analysis of Russia's worldview and tactics:

The protests in the Maidan, we are told again and again by Russian propaganda and by the Kremlin’s friends in Ukraine, mean the return of National Socialism to Europe. The Russian foreign minister, in Munich, lectured the Germans about their support of people who salute Hitler. The Russian media continually make the claim that the Ukrainians who protest are Nazis. Naturally, it is important to be attentive to the far right in Ukrainian politics and history. It is still a serious presence today, although less important than the far right in France, Austria, or the Netherlands. Yet it is the Ukrainian regime rather than its opponents that resorts to anti-Semitism, instructing its riot police that the opposition is led by Jews. In other words, the Ukrainian government is telling itself that its opponents are Jews and us that its opponents are Nazis.

The strange thing about the claim from Moscow is the political ideology of those who make it. The Eurasian Union is the enemy of the European Union, not just in strategy but in ideology. The European Union is based on a historical lesson: that the wars of the twentieth century were based on false and dangerous ideas, National Socialism and Stalinism, which must be rejected and indeed overcome in a system guaranteeing free markets, free movement of people, and the welfare state. Eurasianism, by contrast, is presented by its advocates as the opposite of liberal democracy.

The Eurasian ideology draws an entirely different lesson from the twentieth century. Founded around 2001 by the Russian political scientist Aleksandr Dugin, it proposes the realization of National Bolshevism. Rather than rejecting totalitarian ideologies, Eurasianism calls upon politicians of the twenty-first century to draw what is useful from both fascism and Stalinism. Dugin’s major work, The Foundations of Geopolitics, published in 1997, follows closely the ideas of Carl Schmitt, the leading Nazi political theorist. Eurasianism is not only the ideological source of the Eurasian Union, it is also the creed of a number of people in the Putin administration, and the moving force of a rather active far-right Russian youth movement. For years Dugin has openly supported the division and colonization of Ukraine.

The point man for Eurasian and Ukrainian policy in the Kremlin is Sergei Glazyev, an economist who like Dugin tends to combine radical nationalism with nostalgia for Bolshevism. He was a member of the Communist Party and a Communist deputy in the Russian parliament before cofounding a far-right party called Rodina, or Motherland. In 2005 some of its deputies signed a petition to the Russian prosecutor general asking that all Jewish organizations be banned from Russia.

Later that year Motherland was banned from taking part in further elections after complaints that its advertisements incited racial hatred. The most notorious showed dark-skinned people eating watermelon and throwing the rinds to the ground, then called for Russians to clean up their cities. Glazyev’s book Genocide: Russia and the New World Order claims that the sinister forces of the “new world order” conspired against Russia in the 1990s to bring about economic policies that amounted to “genocide.” This book was published in English by Lyndon LaRouche’s magazine Executive Intelligence Review with a preface by LaRouche. Today Executive Intelligence Review echoes Kremlin propaganda, spreading the word in English that Ukrainian protesters have carried out a Nazi coup and started a civil war.

The populist media campaign for the Eurasian Union is now in the hands of Dmitry Kiselyov, the host of the most important talk show in Russia, and since December also the director of the state-run Russian media conglomerate designed to form national public opinion. Best known for saying that gays who die in car accidents should have their hearts cut from their bodies and incinerated, Kiselyov has taken Putin’s campaign against gay rights and transformed it into a weapon against European integration. Thus when the then German foreign minister, who is gay, visited Kiev in December and met with Vitali Klitschko, the heavyweight champion and opposition politician, Kiselyov dismissed Klitschko as a gay icon. According to the Russian foreign minister, the exploitation of sexual politics is now to be an open weapon in the struggle against the “decadence” of the European Union.

Following the same strategy, Yanukovych’s government claimed, entirely falsely, that the price of closer relations with the European Union was the recognition of gay marriage in Ukraine. Kiselyov is quite open about the Russian media strategy toward the Maidan: to “apply the correct political technology,” then “bring it to the point of overheating” and bring to bear “the magnifying glass of TV and the Internet.”

Why exactly do people with such views think they can call other people fascists? And why does anyone on the Western left take them seriously? One line of reasoning seems to run like this: the Russians won World War II, and therefore can be trusted to spot Nazis. Much is wrong with this. World War II on the eastern front was fought chiefly in what was then Soviet Ukraine and Soviet Belarus, not in Soviet Russia. Five percent of Russia was occupied by the Germans; all of Ukraine was occupied by the Germans. Apart from the Jews, whose suffering was by far the worst, the main victims of Nazi policies were not Russians but Ukrainians and Belarusians. There was no Russian army fighting in World War II, but rather a Soviet Red Army. Its soldiers were disproportionately Ukrainian, since it took so many losses in Ukraine and recruited from the local population. The army group that liberated Auschwitz was called the First Ukrainian Front.

The other source of purported Eurasian moral legitimacy seems to be this: since the representatives of the Putin regime only very selectively distanced themselves from Stalinism, they are therefore reliable inheritors of Soviet history, and should be seen as the automatic opposite of Nazis, and therefore to be trusted to oppose the far right.

Again, much is wrong about this. World War II began with an alliance between Hitler and Stalin in 1939. It ended with the Soviet Union expelling surviving Jews across its own border into Poland. After the founding of the State of Israel, Stalin began associating Soviet Jews with a world capitalist conspiracy, and undertook a campaign of arrests, deportations, and murders of leading Jewish writers. When he died in 1953 he was preparing a larger campaign against Jews.

After Stalin’s death communism took on a more and more ethnic coloration, with people who wished to revive its glories claiming that its problem was that it had been spoiled by Jews. The ethnic purification of the communist legacy is precisely the logic of National Bolshevism, which is the foundational ideology of Eurasianism today. Putin himself is an admirer of the philosopher Ivan Ilin, who wanted Russia to be a nationalist dictatorship.


8 posted on 05/02/2014 11:11:58 PM PDT by Zhang Fei (Let us pray that peace be now restored to the world and that God will preserve it always.)
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To: tcrlaf
This pretty much seals the fate of the Ukrainians.

Doesn't even matter who started it anymore.

Most of those dead folks were Russians, of Russian origin (like, almost everyone in Odessa) or Russian sympathizers.

Hell, Russia DID build that themselves.

Hell's a comin'.

9 posted on 05/02/2014 11:15:01 PM PDT by Mariner (War Criminal #18)
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To: tcrlaf

Today’s lesson.

Participating in rebellions can be hazardous to your health.


10 posted on 05/02/2014 11:17:18 PM PDT by BenLurkin (This is not a statement of fact. It is either opinion or satire; or both.)
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To: tcrlaf
Before the counter attack by Ukrainians that lead to the fire and deaths, this is how it started in Odessa.

Link

Similar attacks by pro Russians have also been happening in the east.

11 posted on 05/02/2014 11:42:56 PM PDT by FreeReign
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To: BenLurkin
Today’s lesson. Participating in rebellions can be hazardous to your health.

That's assuming the folks killed in the fire were participating in the violence from earlier in the day.

Don't think we know that yet.

12 posted on 05/02/2014 11:54:13 PM PDT by FreeReign
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To: tcrlaf

Yeah. The “ Little Green Men” they’ve been infiltrating all over Ukraine. Tough shit.


13 posted on 05/02/2014 11:57:14 PM PDT by Kozak ("It may be dangerous to be America's enemy, but to be America's friend is fatal" Henry Kissingerhaha)
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To: BenLurkin

We did a rebellion then turned it into full blown revolution.

Thank God we did it.


14 posted on 05/03/2014 12:15:51 AM PDT by CorporateStepsister (I am NOT going to force a man to make my dreams come true)
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To: Kozak

“Tough Shit”

Ditto


15 posted on 05/03/2014 4:48:51 AM PDT by rbmillerjr (Russians to the Left of me, Useful Idiots to the Right...)
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To: Kozak

The truth will not be known for some time—what ever happens the events in Ukraine have entered a new phase—a bloody one. Russians are no stranger to bloody work. Let slip the dogs of war. The invasion is now days away—wait til the full force of Russia fall upon Ukraine. This could get bad really quickly. Watch as the Russians have one more card to play. They will try to move on Obama—maybe with new “facts” on corruption—to distract the USA. Then maybe China will act against Japan—all before the T-90s roll and take down Ukraine. The first attack will be Cyber—then air—then by sea. Lastly, the Russian Army backed up by armor. The bad thing to watch for—when Putin gives a speach on TV—that will signil the start of the war. Lets hope I am wrong.


16 posted on 05/03/2014 6:39:17 AM PDT by Forward the Light Brigade (Into the Jaws of H*ll)
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To: tcrlaf

“If you don’t want to know how the Russians are reacting, and would rather be in the dark, you don’t have to click on the link, doncha know.”

I did click link and discovered the Russians are reacting the same way they have reacted for 80 years:

1) they blame the “fascists” - while ignoring their own decisions and choices and actions.
2) they blame the Jews (in the form of the Mossad).
3) they lie.

Same old, same old.


17 posted on 05/03/2014 6:46:57 AM PDT by vladimir998
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To: Zhang Fei

Thank you for posting that. I wish more people would wake up and stop being so easily suckered by Russian propaganda.


18 posted on 05/03/2014 6:55:44 AM PDT by vladimir998
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To: Forward the Light Brigade
The truth will not be known for some time—what ever happens the events in Ukraine have entered a new phase—a bloody one.

New phase?

How many were killed on Maiden? 100 or more?

What about the violence directed towards pro Ukrainians in Donetsk Oblast over the last few weeks?

What about the violence that was already occurring in Odessa?

What about the Putin backed destabilization activity that was already occurring?

Why does that not count for you?

19 posted on 05/03/2014 7:57:42 AM PDT by FreeReign
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To: Forward the Light Brigade

I expect increasing provocations and sabotage culminating in a Russian invasion around May 28 the next new moon.


20 posted on 05/03/2014 9:43:29 AM PDT by Kozak ("It may be dangerous to be America's enemy, but to be America's friend is fatal" Henry Kissingerhaha)
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To: vladimir998

I’m on everyone’s side. GO, EVERYONE, GO!


21 posted on 05/03/2014 9:45:25 AM PDT by Lazamataz (Early 2009 to 7/21/2013 - RIP my little girl Cathy. You were the best cat ever. You will be missed.)
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