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On Paper: We choose not between Marx and Adam Smith but between the DMV and the Apple store.
The National Review ^ | May 11, 2014 | Kevin D. Williamson

Posted on 05/11/2014 3:55:49 AM PDT by 2ndDivisionVet

I am preparing to renew my driver’s license, a process requiring some considerable preparation. My last trip to a driver’s-license bureau, in Norwalk, Conn., ended with my giving very serious thought to returning later in the evening and burning the place down, the process having been so backward and the people so hateful. I have in my life had a number of unpleasant encounters with government agencies — handcuffed in Texas, terrorized by Mexican federales, assets seized by the IRS, chased about by India’s immigration authorities, etc. Frankly, I’d rather be pepper-sprayed than pay another visit to the Norwalk DMV.

I do not expect the New York City version to be much better, but I’ll withhold judgment until the facts are in. But before I could even do that, there were other preparations to be made. For example, my passport, issued by the U.S. State Department, is perfectly adequate to get me through customs and immigration at any airport in U.S. territory, and is a fully functional form of identification anywhere in the country, and most of the world, except for a New York DMV office. For that, you need a couple of forms of identification, one of which must be a Social Security card. The mutation of the Social Security card from proof of enrollment in Social Security into a federal quasi-ID is itself a long and stupid story, and, if you happen to have lost yours in the course of having had a dozen home addresses in the past 20 years, rest assured that you’ll need more than a passport to get one. For that, you’ll need an original birth certificate...

(Excerpt) Read more at nationalreview.com ...


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Culture/Society; Government
KEYWORDS: bureaucrats; crybaby; economy; efficiency; postalservice

1 posted on 05/11/2014 3:55:49 AM PDT by 2ndDivisionVet
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

You can order a Texas birth certificate by mail from the State Vital Records office, Kevin. It’s not as dramatic as “having” to fly to Texas, though.


2 posted on 05/11/2014 4:05:22 AM PDT by Tax-chick (If I offended you, you needed it.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
If you think lines at the DMV is bad, just wait until ObamaCare takes full effect and private employers dump their insurance plan because the "gub'mint" now provides that.

Getting blood work or a physical done under a federal bureaucracy will make waiting in line at the DMV seem like a vacation. Think Wal-Mart shoppers in rows of metal folding chairs with their EBT cards and their hollering welfare babies who are queued up ahead of you. They don't have to pay...but you will. But first, you need to take a number and get to the back of the line.


3 posted on 05/11/2014 4:12:31 AM PDT by SamAdams76
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To: Tax-chick

How about telling them you want to vote
Democrat in all upcoming elections? Perhaps
that would “move things along” a bit faster.


4 posted on 05/11/2014 4:14:31 AM PDT by Don@VB (Power Corrupts)
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To: SamAdams76
When your HMO is run like the DMV, we're SOL.
5 posted on 05/11/2014 4:17:42 AM PDT by Servant of the Cross (the Truth will set you free)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

I’m not sure what current SS cards look like, but mine says “not to be used for identification.”


6 posted on 05/11/2014 4:18:58 AM PDT by allblues (God is neither a Republican nor a Democrat but Satan is definitely a Democrat)
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To: Don@VB

LOL! Good one.


7 posted on 05/11/2014 4:22:01 AM PDT by Tax-chick (If I offended you, you needed it.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Gotta’ be honest, I’ve been breezing thru the DMV’s here in NY for 20 years now. Go to info and get the paperwork squared away then take a number and wait for 10 or 15 min and out.


8 posted on 05/11/2014 4:32:02 AM PDT by TalBlack (Evil doesn't have a day job.)
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To: Tax-chick
You can order a Texas birth certificate by mail from the State Vital Records office...

and I recently renewed my Texas driver's license online. It was quick and easy with no lines or hassle.

9 posted on 05/11/2014 4:37:50 AM PDT by MulberryDraw (Repeal it.)
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To: MulberryDraw

That would be nice. You can’t do that in NC, but if you pick the right DMV office and the right time, it’s not bad - and the only document you need is your previous license.

I’m on my 4th teen driver at the same location, so I know all the DMV staff personally ;-).


10 posted on 05/11/2014 4:41:15 AM PDT by Tax-chick (If I offended you, you needed it.)
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To: SamAdams76
Think Wal-Mart shoppers in rows of metal folding chairs with their EBT cards and their hollering welfare babies who are queued up ahead of you.

Alright. Let the revolution commence. Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhh!

11 posted on 05/11/2014 4:45:11 AM PDT by VRW Conspirator ( 2+2 = V)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Bureaucracies are bad, but the writer makes a poor choice for complaint, when it comes to verifying legal status and ID. That’s something we need more of, not less.

Also, I’ve got driver’s licenses in both CT and NY, and the process isn’t really that onerous in either state.

The dude sounds a bit like something of a general screw-up.


12 posted on 05/11/2014 4:45:49 AM PDT by 9YearLurker
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Just move to New Hampshire - DMV like it oughta be.


13 posted on 05/11/2014 4:57:30 AM PDT by Jim Noble (When strong, avoid them. Attack their weaknesses. Emerge to their surprise.)
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To: TalBlack

When I was a kid the DMV in Maine was a place of horror. Long lines and very slow service. Now you take a number, sit in a comfy chair for a while (brief if you get the timing right) and then go to a window where a reasonably friendly and efficient person waits on you.

The downside is that there’s a TV screen in front of you playing videos about DUI and texting, only interrupted by some footage of LaHood babbling about something. That can be countered by bringing a book.


14 posted on 05/11/2014 5:00:38 AM PDT by NewHampshireDuo
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To: Jim Noble
Just move to New Hampshire - DMV like it oughta be.

Did they nuke it from orbit? ;-)

In Massachusetts, the DMV operating costs are $60 million per year. It brings in $600 million in fees and fines. It's a nice little business we have here. Wouldn't want to see anything bad happen to it.

15 posted on 05/11/2014 5:00:54 AM PDT by St_Thomas_Aquinas ( Isaiah 22:22, Matthew 16:19, Revelation 3:7)
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To: 9YearLurker

Also, I’ve got driver’s licenses in both CT and NY, and the process isn’t really that onerous in either state.

I would be really curious to know if both your licenses have the Real ID compliant gold star in the upper right corner?

I doubt that would be the case, as having more than one license is against the Real ID Act, and more than likely against state statute preceeding the Real ID Act.

My congratulations on accomplishing what government would like to make impossible.


16 posted on 05/11/2014 5:15:30 AM PDT by wita
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To: wita

No, I don’t have concurrent licenses from the two states. I’m in CT now, and yes, by taking in my passport at renewal, I was able to get the star.


17 posted on 05/11/2014 5:22:02 AM PDT by 9YearLurker
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To: allblues

I believe in 1997 Congress amended the law by which states would lose funding if they didn’t verify and collect SS#s through the driver’s license process. The justification at the time was for enforcement of child support from deadbeat dads.


18 posted on 05/11/2014 5:23:53 AM PDT by 9YearLurker
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To: Tax-chick
You can order a Texas birth certificate by mail from the State Vital Records office,

And how is that a secure piece of informantion? Like the author, I jumped through many of the same hoops when I moved to North Dakota. I got my certified copy of my Colorado BC by telephone from non English speaking Mexican contractor to whom I had to provide an extreme amount of personal information.

19 posted on 05/11/2014 5:27:16 AM PDT by Lion Den Dan
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

I can’t wait to rad the article when he actually goes to the DMV.

in Maryland, it took me four trips, 9 hours and 150 miles of driving to get a simples set of license plates. When I lived in Michigan, the same transaction was literally 10 minutes.

I complained so much, I finally got a call from the director of “Customer Service.” I let her have it and told her agency is broken.


20 posted on 05/11/2014 5:27:40 AM PDT by cyclotic (America's premier outdoor adventure association for boys-traillifeusa.com)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

One of Kevin’s best….


21 posted on 05/11/2014 5:32:22 AM PDT by C. Edmund Wright (Tokyo Rove is more than a name, it's a GREAT WEBSITE)
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To: TalBlack
Gotta’ be honest, I’ve been breezing thru the DMV’s here in NY for 20 years now.
I'm in Rochester suburb and my experiences the last 20 have all been like yours.
I'm 65+ y/o, and believe me, I remember the bad old days.
22 posted on 05/11/2014 5:36:12 AM PDT by oh8eleven (RVN '67-'68)
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To: 9YearLurker

Thanks for the reply. I’m guessing your passport was Real ID compliant having the ICAO symbol that makes it compliant with the international data base for security, and the picture on both documents will be the high resolution variety that will allow curb side recognition of you anywhere you choose to go by anyone with the appropriate devise to decode biometric data, and they won’t have to ask to see the document as it can be decoded while you are walking down the street. That is the desired result, however many states have yet to authorize the chip in the card that makes the instant scan possible.

I was struck by your comment that we need more of this.


23 posted on 05/11/2014 5:43:32 AM PDT by wita
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To: wita

We’re giving millions of illegals the vote and welfare because we don’t confirm identities. At this point I’d really rather have less of that.


24 posted on 05/11/2014 5:46:19 AM PDT by 9YearLurker
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To: oh8eleven

I well recall the 3 hour visits of old but to my ear the comedians constant DMV jokes fall flat. I guess the topic was too fun for them to let go.


25 posted on 05/11/2014 5:49:29 AM PDT by TalBlack (Evil doesn't have a day job.)
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To: TalBlack
to my ear the comedians constant DMV jokes fall flat
In fact, they ought to make a few visits to a Time Warner Cable "store" for new material. Worse than the DMV of yesteryear, by far.
26 posted on 05/11/2014 5:53:33 AM PDT by oh8eleven (RVN '67-'68)
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To: 9YearLurker

When all else fails there is always an excuse for government to bend the rules, and now we have by government mandate for a voluntary program, the Real ID Act of 2005 still being implemented after delay and delay and delay.

Without the star when the compliance rule go into effect, no entry to federal facilities, and fly only after increased scrutiny. Frankly admittance to federal buildings you paid for, should be considered unconstitutional, not a security problem, and travel restrictions another story all together, but that is Real ID in a nutshell.

Long ago the Congress wanted a National ID Card and couldn’t get it passed “the people”. Gee, wonder why? So attach some dollars, get the state government to buy in, and voila’ instant National ID Card compliant with the International Standard. Real ID is not your friend, and is only the beginning.


27 posted on 05/11/2014 5:57:21 AM PDT by wita
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To: 9YearLurker

We’re giving millions of illegals the vote and welfare because we don’t confirm identities. At this point I’d really rather have less of that.

...because some states won’t or refuse to confirm identity. It is the states that aren’t doing their job. Not all, but enough.


28 posted on 05/11/2014 6:00:31 AM PDT by wita
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To: St_Thomas_Aquinas
Did they nuke it from orbit? ;-)

No, but it is distressingly monocultural.

29 posted on 05/11/2014 6:13:39 AM PDT by Jim Noble (When strong, avoid them. Attack their weaknesses. Emerge to their surprise.)
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To: cyclotic
in Maryland, it took me four trips, 9 hours and 150 miles of driving to get a simples set of license plates

War is Peace

Freedom is Slavery

Diversity is Our Strength

30 posted on 05/11/2014 6:15:18 AM PDT by Jim Noble (When strong, avoid them. Attack their weaknesses. Emerge to their surprise.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

I realize that ripping the DMV in the most humorous manner possible is a universally satisfying experience, but I can’t say I’ve had anything resembling the author’s alleged nightmare. I lived in NYS for almost 5 decades. They made great strides in efficiency, convenience, and friendliness. (In comedy, such jokes are “evergreen,” like rubber chickens.) We moved to MA a couple of years ago, and it was a more jarring, less personal experience going to the DMV.

It’s probably not fair to compare the two offices: Worcester County, MA has a much larger population than does Tompkins County, NY. But in both cases it seems like your attitude approaching the experience makes a great deal of difference. If you go anywhere expecting a confrontation you will likely find one. I’ve never had a problem in either place. I try to be polite and friendly, and let them know I appreciate their help and expertise in shepherding me through what can be a bewildering set of regulations. The result is that I rarely leave with a bad taste in my mouth or a joke to tell about the DMV. No doubt, some of their rules are incomprehensible, but odds are the person you deal with at the counter didn’t write the rule. You can call it naive, but I find if you treat people decently they reciprocate.


31 posted on 05/11/2014 6:24:30 AM PDT by Wheelman81
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To: wita

Are you saying that anyone should be allowed to enter any part of any federal building at any time?

If so, I think you’re not grounded in reality.


32 posted on 05/11/2014 6:28:23 AM PDT by 9YearLurker
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To: Lion Den Dan
And how is that a secure piece of information?

I don't understand the question.

It's a relevant piece of information because the author implies he had no other way to get a copy of his TEXAS birth certificate than by going in person to the county in which he was born. This is not accurate.

33 posted on 05/11/2014 6:30:20 AM PDT by Tax-chick (If I offended you, you needed it.)
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To: wita

Oh, and there was no qualification as to only some passports being good or recent enough for the qualification. And I was having a new DL photo taken at the time.


34 posted on 05/11/2014 6:30:37 AM PDT by 9YearLurker
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To: SamAdams76

I’m waiting for someone to make the obvious to me connection between the mess that is Veteran’s Health Care and Obama care.


35 posted on 05/11/2014 6:31:00 AM PDT by Mercat
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To: Tax-chick

Kansas/Johnson County used to be a three hour ordeal but there were complaints and last time I had to go it was in and out in 30 minutes. I don’t remember what ID was required but I think it was just two forms and a utility bill could be one of them. I think I used my old DL and my passport. My kids all have the plastic birth cert but recently found out that they can’t use that for a passport. Have to get the certified copy. I’m actually okay with that and wish that a photo ID was required everywhere for voting.


36 posted on 05/11/2014 6:34:16 AM PDT by Mercat
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Never go on Monday morning or even worse, Tuesday after a three day weekend. Never go late in the afternoon when all the teenagers are there. Be there when they open and bring a book or kindle.


37 posted on 05/11/2014 6:35:13 AM PDT by Mercat
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To: Mercat

When it was time for my oldest daughter to go to Driver’s Ed, I realized I didn’t have birth certificates for the two who were born in San Antonio. It was pricy, like $32 each, to get them from Texas Vital Records, but it wasn’t difficult, didn’t take very long, and didn’t require a trip to Texas.

NC will require photo ID for voting in 2016. The poll workers mentioned it when I voted in the primary last week.


38 posted on 05/11/2014 6:37:28 AM PDT by Tax-chick (If I offended you, you needed it.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
My DL comes up for renewal in 5 years. I will need my Birth Certificate to prove I was born as well as my SS Card. BUT since my name has changed by marriage, I need my Marriage Certificate as proof.

I have a COLB. I had to order one a few years ago.
I do not have a marriage certificate. Will have to get one.

The SS card is another matter. I am 60. I haven't seen it in 35 years. I do remember it said something about not to be used for ID. The pisser is I never had my name changed after I got married.
I do have documents with my SSN on it which has always been accepted as proof whenever it was needed....until now.

I guess I will need to get the ball rolling when I am 62. Maybe I can get all the paper work together to prove I am who I have said I am for the last 60 years. :(

39 posted on 05/11/2014 6:40:02 AM PDT by Protect the Bill of Rights
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To: Protect the Bill of Rights

North Carolina accepted a tax return as a substitute for the Social Security card. My SS card is no good because my mother had it laminated (even though it says not to, right on it) back when it was issued in 1976.


40 posted on 05/11/2014 6:53:01 AM PDT by Tax-chick (If I offended you, you needed it.)
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To: Tax-chick

The birth ceertificate is a key document used in establishing identity. The way the author obtained his official copy and the way I obtained mine are not secure; that is just about anyone could obtain the copy and claim to be someone they are not. In my case, I made a phone call, gave my name and DOB and my mother’s maiden name. Gave a credit card number (my wife’s, not mine, and had official documents within a week in the mail.


41 posted on 05/11/2014 6:59:23 AM PDT by Lion Den Dan
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To: Lion Den Dan

I see what you mean now, and you’re right.


42 posted on 05/11/2014 7:17:23 AM PDT by Tax-chick (If I offended you, you needed it.)
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To: allblues
I’m not sure what current SS cards look like, but mine says “not to be used for identification.”

Yep - no picture. Of course, a birth certificate has the same "problem". Besides, we know from a "prominent politician" that all is bogus in the end.

43 posted on 05/11/2014 7:20:57 AM PDT by trebb (Where in the the hell has my country gone?)
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To: Wheelman81

That’s been my experience as well. Treat the counter clerk like a human being and your experience is generally pretty painless. Choosing what time you go in wisely is the other half of the equation.


44 posted on 05/11/2014 8:03:44 AM PDT by Fire_on_High (RIP City of Heroes and Paragon Studios, victim of the Obamaconomy.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
NR Is certainly hiring some awesomely nerdy dweebs these days.

Of course the Norwalk DMV is Mexican Brain Root Canal. Norwalk has devolved into a bit of a Third World Hell-Hole.

Try another office.

45 posted on 05/11/2014 12:59:32 PM PDT by Kenny Bunk (Take congress in 2014. Have a Constitutional Convention of the States. Save the Republic.)
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