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No Surprise As East Ukraine Cities Vote Against Kiev
Forbes ^ | 5/12/2014 | Kenneth Rapoza

Posted on 05/12/2014 5:06:13 AM PDT by McGruff

Eastern Ukrainian cities voted to inch closer Moscow and further from Kiev on Sunday, following in the controversial wake of Crimea, a Black Sea peninsula formerly part of Ukraine.

Between 94% and 98% of eligible voters in Ukraine’s eastern provinces of Luhansk and Donetsk both voted for greater autonomy from Kiev, the head of the region’s Central Election Committee said on Monday.

(Excerpt) Read more at forbes.com ...


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; Extended News; Foreign Affairs; Government; News/Current Events; Politics/Elections; Russia
KEYWORDS: donetsk; luhansk; ukraine
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The Ukrainian authorities dismissed Sunday’s vote as a farce and the E.U. quickly said it would not recognize the region if it secedes.

At least they had an election unlike the EU puppets in Kiev.

1 posted on 05/12/2014 5:06:13 AM PDT by McGruff
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To: McGruff

The Soros/NWO stooges on FR are not gonna be happy about this....


2 posted on 05/12/2014 5:10:49 AM PDT by varmintman
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To: varmintman

But the Putin/Revived USSR stooges on FR are getting tingles up their legs, right?


3 posted on 05/12/2014 5:12:25 AM PDT by vladimir998
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To: McGruff

The EU has adopted the tried and true policy that US school districts use to pass tax hikes. If they don’t get the result they like, they just keep putting it back up for a vote every few weeks and take whatever punitive action they can against the people until they get the desired result.


4 posted on 05/12/2014 5:20:51 AM PDT by Orangedog (An optimist is someone who tells you to 'cheer up' when things are going his way)
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To: McGruff
Between 94% and 98% of eligible voters in Ukraine’s eastern provinces of Luhansk and Donetsk both voted for greater autonomy from Kiev, the head of the region’s Central Election Committee said on Monday.

These people make Democratic election fraudsters look like models of probity.

5 posted on 05/12/2014 5:22:11 AM PDT by Zhang Fei (Let us pray that peace be now restored to the world and that God will preserve it always.)
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To: McGruff

All that remains is for Russian troops to move into East and South Ukraine. If Ukraine wants to hang on to these regions, it had better be prepared to start killing a handful every single day.


6 posted on 05/12/2014 5:25:11 AM PDT by Zhang Fei (Let us pray that peace be now restored to the world and that God will preserve it always.)
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To: McGruff

The results are going to be recognized by Russia. After all, state sovereignty is the clear wish of the people of Donbass and this fully opens the door for Russia to help them. All in accordance with President Putin’s March declaration. And Russia has not had to invade Ukraine!

The Maidan regime and the West has been outmaneuvered by the rebels in Donetsk and Lugansk and the person in the catbird seat today is President Putin. He has plenty of options now going foward. He is the big winner today.


7 posted on 05/12/2014 6:37:19 AM PDT by goldstategop (In Memory Of A Dearly Beloved Friend Who Lives In My Heart Forever)
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To: McGruff

So not only do you not comprehend how a parliamentary system works, you can’t grasp that 94 and 98% are mere impossibilities in normal elections. And then you call the leadership in KIEV puppets because they wanted to go with the E.U., and didn’t think they would be puppets as long as they went with the Russian federation.

94 and 98% don’t cause you to scratch your head just a little? Seriously?

Wow.


8 posted on 05/12/2014 6:42:09 AM PDT by DoughtyOne
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To: goldstategop

Honestly, I never thought I would see the day when folks on this forum would find 94 and 98% election returns to be a big feather in a 15 year invading dictator’s cap.


9 posted on 05/12/2014 6:44:34 AM PDT by DoughtyOne
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To: DoughtyOne

Well... if you think a landslide for state sovereignty is not convincing, what would be? Whatever the actual numbers, what is clear is the pretense of a unified Ukraine is gone. Its simply a legal fiction - what Kiev and the West say of these referendums is equally true about Ukrainian statehood. It no longer exists.


10 posted on 05/12/2014 6:46:04 AM PDT by goldstategop (In Memory Of A Dearly Beloved Friend Who Lives In My Heart Forever)
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To: DoughtyOne

There is not a single Russian FSB personnel or Russian soldier in the Donbass. The only violence came from Kiev’s side and ironically enough, Kiev is now the one that has occupation troops in the Donbass, not Russia.


11 posted on 05/12/2014 6:49:07 AM PDT by goldstategop (In Memory Of A Dearly Beloved Friend Who Lives In My Heart Forever)
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To: goldstategop

Are the western tourists already flooding Crimea ;) ?


12 posted on 05/12/2014 6:51:26 AM PDT by Grzegorz 246
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To: goldstategop

Did you happen to read the report from the Russian press on the election in Crimea?

It was a total fiction. So was this.

Why are you buying into this?

This makes no statement about the Ukraine whatsoever!

It makes a statement about what lengths Putin and his puppets will go go. How can you miss this?

Do you honestly think 94 & 98% of the Ukrainians voted to leave? Really?

This is the same gag line the USSR used for 60 plus years calling their elections free and open, and declaring the party members winners by similar numbers.

These elections have been total frauds.


13 posted on 05/12/2014 6:51:58 AM PDT by DoughtyOne
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To: goldstategop

98%. Please point me to any election in your life where you have seen 98% of the people in a region vote almost exclusively one way.


14 posted on 05/12/2014 6:54:11 AM PDT by DoughtyOne
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To: goldstategop

Not buying it. You can spin this any way you like, 98% of the public never believes in the same thing. It’s just not human nature.


15 posted on 05/12/2014 6:55:27 AM PDT by DoughtyOne
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To: DoughtyOne

If its a fraud, how do you explain the high voter turnout and the long lines? Lots of things about elections can be faked but not the numbers and voter enthusiasm. And in an age when every one can upload video to YouTube, that seems scarcely believable.

The real gag line is Kiev and the West are unwilling to recognize that the Ukraine created in 1991 is now dead. Of course, they could have saved themselves the humiliation by acceding to a federal solution for the country in the first place. Whether Ukraine could still remain a unified country, no one knows.


16 posted on 05/12/2014 6:58:38 AM PDT by goldstategop (In Memory Of A Dearly Beloved Friend Who Lives In My Heart Forever)
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To: DoughtyOne
They just all want to join Russia, the land of the shirtless Christian, he will feed them all with his own tits, he will save them from nazis, fasicists, IMF, Bilderbergs, Monsanto Nazis, CFR, Rockefellers, Rothschilds and Sodomite EU. (Coming soon when several related clowns arrive)
17 posted on 05/12/2014 7:00:05 AM PDT by Grzegorz 246
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To: goldstategop

“There is not a single Russian ...... soldier in the Donbass”

There is now....

Liberal Democratic Party of Russia leader Vladimir Zhirinovsky apparently crashed the Ukrainian Border late last night in a “Tiger” SUV (Similar to a Hummer) that he had promised to donate to the rebels in Lugansk.

He showed up in Lugansk early this morning.

He has also pledged to give a Volga to whoever plants the Russian Flag atop the Rada.

I would think the Ukrainians would LOVE to get their hands on this guy.


18 posted on 05/12/2014 7:00:37 AM PDT by tcrlaf (Q)
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To: tcrlaf

OK..
Some confusion.

Apparently the truck is in Lugansk, but it cannot be confirmed that Zhirinovsky is.....


19 posted on 05/12/2014 7:03:54 AM PDT by tcrlaf (Q)
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To: DoughtyOne
Honestly, I would never believe how many on this forum have hung onto their 1990 mentality, despite the democratic progress Russia has made in the last 30 odd years.

Some just can 't adjust to reality, and sadly just don't want to. Their hate is programmed and too deep.

20 posted on 05/12/2014 7:04:25 AM PDT by duckln
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To: DoughtyOne

In America, wards in Philadelphia and Chicago - voter approval of Obama exceeded 103% in 2012.

Between 2-4% of the Donbass wants to stay in Ukraine. On the other hand, every one in certain parts of America voted for Obama and no one voted against him.

So why is that not believable? In the Donbass, some people voted for the status quo ante. That is lot more democratic than the way some people in Philadelphia and Chicago voted in the last presidential election.


21 posted on 05/12/2014 7:04:27 AM PDT by goldstategop (In Memory Of A Dearly Beloved Friend Who Lives In My Heart Forever)
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To: goldstategop

It’s a hoot to watch you guys front for the Russian Federation here. The guy invades, sends in the goon squads, and that’s okay. It’s KIEV’s fault.

Have you ever seen earthquake coverage from California?

They bring their cameras to the worst damage they can find, and blast it out over the nation. Then people from back east call their family members in a frenzy, just positive the whole state has been leveled. In truth within a block of that where that video was taken, things are just fine.

So you see some footage from a couple of election sites, and are now convinced you know what the full story was. Amazing.

Once again, I point you back to the reports in the Russian press about the Crimean election. Those were supposed to have very high voter turnout too.

Only 30% voted. Of that 30% only a little more than half voted to leave the Ukraine.

15% of the populace having expressed in the affirmative, Crimea was annexed.

Does that sound like a sound reason for Crimea to be annexed?

The Crimeans knew what Russian elections would be like. Why bother to go to the polls? It was a farce.

And now you come here to triumphantly proclaim victory at last for those poor Eastern Ukrainians.

Man, you guys have fallen and you can’t get up...


22 posted on 05/12/2014 7:07:50 AM PDT by DoughtyOne
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To: duckln

Hate?

Would this cover the free democratic leadership of Russia too, you know the guy that has been in charge for 15 years now?

Democratic progress? Wow...


23 posted on 05/12/2014 7:09:24 AM PDT by DoughtyOne
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To: goldstategop

You are referring to several precincts. You are not referring to a city-wide or region wide vote.


24 posted on 05/12/2014 7:11:22 AM PDT by DoughtyOne
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To: Grzegorz 246

I know. Shaking my head...


25 posted on 05/12/2014 7:13:36 AM PDT by DoughtyOne
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To: DoughtyOne

Election turnouts have been around 40% in mid-term years. Politicians and referenda issues are decided by less than 20% of eligible voters. In America. Let’s say you’re right, they faked the Crimean figures. But over half STILL voted to leave Ukraine.

And I’m betting its not too different in the Donbass, if the real figures are ever leaked. And I’m not aware of a place in America where low voter turnout has ever invalidated an election result.


26 posted on 05/12/2014 7:16:57 AM PDT by goldstategop (In Memory Of A Dearly Beloved Friend Who Lives In My Heart Forever)
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To: DoughtyOne

i’m 100% against you!!


27 posted on 05/12/2014 7:17:59 AM PDT by dalereed
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To: goldstategop

Okay, then you would be comfortable with 15% of Texans voting to leave the nation, and it being used to facilitate the change.

We’re not talking about a normal election here. We’re talking about a serious issue.

Are you aware that loyalists have been afraid to even leave their homes over the last few weeks?

Do you think that might have an impact on the election?


28 posted on 05/12/2014 7:20:48 AM PDT by DoughtyOne
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To: dalereed

That’s okay Dale.

If I were the only person here who opposed naked aggression against a sovereign nation, I would still stand up and be counted.


29 posted on 05/12/2014 7:21:59 AM PDT by DoughtyOne
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To: DoughtyOne

Granted. But that shows how easy its to fake the numbers. When the outcome is not even in doubt.

There is a greater chance of electoral chicanery when you know you’re going to lose. But if you’re going to win any way, padding the numbers ought to be pointless.

Let’s stipulate that clean, Western style elections are a rarity in that part of the world. After a generation, some of the habits of the Soviet period are hard to unlearn.

Human nature however, remains predictable.


30 posted on 05/12/2014 7:22:10 AM PDT by goldstategop (In Memory Of A Dearly Beloved Friend Who Lives In My Heart Forever)
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To: goldstategop

So what you’re saying is, we know the election was a farce, but we’re darn sure the Easter Ukrainians wanted to leave, so it’s okay?

I’m not stipulating to anything regarding to how elections are run in that part of the world. I don’t know and neither do you.


31 posted on 05/12/2014 7:25:09 AM PDT by DoughtyOne
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To: DoughtyOne

Thrt ain’t a soverign nation, it’s a bunch of goons supported by obama and the european socialist scum!

I’m half german and half norwegian and if any of those filthy socialist human waste tried to come to this country i’d do my best to stop them!


32 posted on 05/12/2014 7:25:25 AM PDT by dalereed
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To: goldstategop

Actually, neither the Luhansk Oblast nor the Donetsk Oblast are as large in population as the Philadelphia Oblast. Both of them together barely top Philly.


33 posted on 05/12/2014 7:27:45 AM PDT by kiryandil (turning Americans into felons, one obnoxious drunk at a time (Zero Tolerance!!!))
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To: DoughtyOne

You make a good point. If the loyalist support is as strong as you say, what in the world kept Kiev from holding its own referendum?

A vote is far more powerful than tanks and guns. In people’s minds, the former is more mightier than the sword. We live in a world where Russia and its friends trumpet democratic credentials while we are forced to denounce an election as illegitimate.

It makes us look scared of our own values. What’s more pathetic - that we’re backing an unelected junta or that we’ve livid people didn’t vote the way we would have preferred?


34 posted on 05/12/2014 7:28:30 AM PDT by goldstategop (In Memory Of A Dearly Beloved Friend Who Lives In My Heart Forever)
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To: dalereed

But of course a 15 year leader through manipulation isn’t a goon and his agitators inside the Ukraine are not goon squads.

Please, can you remind me what territory those European Socialists invaded and annexed? I seem to have missed it.

BTW: I talk to some very nice people in the Ukraine. They like doing the same sorts of things we do. Are we goons too? Just want to make sure.

They love their unified nation. They loved it before Obama was a Senator in Illinois.

Russia is an ally of China today. Does that sound like a healthy Democracy to you?


35 posted on 05/12/2014 7:30:06 AM PDT by DoughtyOne
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To: DoughtyOne

I’m saying an imperfect expression of the popular will is far better than the will imposed at the point of the gun.

Fine - don’t stipulate. But at least we do know what the Donbass thinks of Kiev.


36 posted on 05/12/2014 7:31:21 AM PDT by goldstategop (In Memory Of A Dearly Beloved Friend Who Lives In My Heart Forever)
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To: goldstategop
Let’s stipulate that clean, Western style elections are a rarity in that part of the world. After a generation, some of the habits of the Soviet period are hard to unlearn.

I just checked the Chicago Oblast, where clean, Western style elections are a rarity the norm. /s

LOL! :)

It's also larger than either the Donetsk Oblast or the Luhansk Oblast.

37 posted on 05/12/2014 7:32:35 AM PDT by kiryandil (turning Americans into felons, one obnoxious drunk at a time (Zero Tolerance!!!))
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To: DoughtyOne

“The guy invades, sends in the goon squads, and that’s okay. It’s KIEV’s fault.”

Had the Obama Administration not financially (and otherwise) backed the most violent and radical elements in Ukraine to overthrow the elected government, it would not have turned violent.

There would have been no independence vote yesterday. Crimea would still be part of Ukraine. Everything has a cause and effect.

At what point do you begin to accept the obvious??


38 posted on 05/12/2014 7:32:39 AM PDT by tcrlaf (Q)
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To: DoughtyOne

Healthier than the piece of shit we live in here!


39 posted on 05/12/2014 7:32:59 AM PDT by dalereed
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To: goldstategop

Honestly GoldenStateGOP, it’s hard to deal with people who don’t have the slightest idea how the Ukrainian government works.

It’s a parliamentary system. It doesn’t work like our system does. Quit trying to think of it in those terms.

There wasn’t a hunta. The President’s own party lost faith in him, and he resigned. That is not a hunta. It’s the way a parliamentary system works. There were to be elections on the 16th of May. Russia demanded elections be held on the 11th, and they were.

None the less, you worry about huntas, and could care less about open aggression and annexation.


40 posted on 05/12/2014 7:33:34 AM PDT by DoughtyOne
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To: goldstategop
Did I also mention that Chicago had so many extra votes for Das BlackenWhitenFuhrer in the 2012 "election" that they exported them by bus to the Milwaukee precincts to help swing Wisconsin for The One?
41 posted on 05/12/2014 7:35:02 AM PDT by kiryandil (turning Americans into felons, one obnoxious drunk at a time (Zero Tolerance!!!))
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To: kiryandil

Then perhaps you can point us to recent city-wide election results from Chicago that approach 98%. Thanking you in advance...


42 posted on 05/12/2014 7:35:18 AM PDT by DoughtyOne
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To: tcrlaf

“Had the Obama Administration”

And Monsanto Nazis.


43 posted on 05/12/2014 7:35:51 AM PDT by Grzegorz 246
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To: dalereed

Is that supposed to be some sort of rational response?

Hey folks, he’s not Dillinger. He’s Capone.


44 posted on 05/12/2014 7:36:21 AM PDT by DoughtyOne
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To: DoughtyOne

No one voted for the new regime in Kiev though.

That said, Ukraine is breaking up and blame everything on Russia is convenient.


45 posted on 05/12/2014 7:37:33 AM PDT by goldstategop (In Memory Of A Dearly Beloved Friend Who Lives In My Heart Forever)
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To: goldstategop

Yeah, we sure do. Why between 94 and 98% of them hatedd KIEV.

You actually buy into this.


46 posted on 05/12/2014 7:37:37 AM PDT by DoughtyOne
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To: tcrlaf

The President resigned. A new election was scheduled.

That’s how it works in a parliamentary system.

That’s simply a fact. It is the obvious.


47 posted on 05/12/2014 7:39:11 AM PDT by DoughtyOne
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To: DoughtyOne

Your god damn right!!!


48 posted on 05/12/2014 7:40:51 AM PDT by dalereed
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To: DoughtyOne
Then perhaps you can point us to recent city-wide election results from Chicago that approach 98%. Thanking you in advance...

You're putting words in my mouth.

Don't do that.

49 posted on 05/12/2014 7:41:03 AM PDT by kiryandil (turning Americans into felons, one obnoxious drunk at a time (Zero Tolerance!!!))
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To: goldstategop

Tens of thousands of troops on the Ukraine’s border, goon squads running around Ukrainian cities on the East craking heads with long bars, Crimea already annexed..., and you intimate people are being unreasoned because they fault Russia.


50 posted on 05/12/2014 7:41:19 AM PDT by DoughtyOne
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